What is closure? When we seek it, what are we wanting?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hey everyone,

I wanted to start a thread about closure.

Maybe for those who have been NC for a while can swap stories and those who are just starting NC can share their concerns. I've been reading a lot of threads regarding closure and the usual lack thereof. I thought it might be nice to discuss the actual nature of closure and how it can pertain to those in NC or have moved on, since it is a natural desire to have for many. What I have realized from my own experience is that in the case of a relationship with a BPDex, closure is something that you have to find and think about. It's not necessarily something that you can get verbally from your BPDex. This is just my opinion, and I understand the strong desire to have some verbal exchange in which you hear the words "I'm sorry" or "I know you did a lot." Some sort of acknowledgement. I don't think that is something that is common at the end of relationship with a pwBPD. In light of this thought, I wanted to lay out some ideas that may help us find closure, or whatever variation of closure there is.

Personally, I feel lucky because I think (think being a key word) I had closure. I'm seven months out now, and I really look at the past relationship with clinical curiosity. Emotions are detached, with perhaps some specific happy ones picked out. I believe there is one main reason why I have closure. This is because of the steady decline in the relationship over time as it neared the end, and the implications of what was happening. This is something that I think many have perhaps experienced. Whether the relationship is in a perpetual cycle or if it visibly deteriorates, one source of closure that we can hope to find is actually in the "data" of the relationship. It's probably easier with time to look back on things and piece together the data logically. I can try to explain where I found my closure by talking about my own experience.

In my case, I experienced a steady decline in our relationship over the last year. Fights became more common and I surrendered more and more of myself in order to prevent them. Essentially, things came to a point where I didn't know what was left "to give". And yet, the pressure continued. It became nearly impossible to be perfect. Yes, there were good moments, but when I remember the ratio of good to bad it was a pretty bad score. And besides, the good moments we did have were centred around what my ex liked. I enjoy hockey. Never once did we go to watch a hockey game. It was mentioned in passing, but never followed up on. My ex enjoyed long walks through the city. I learned that I enjoyed them too, so we would do that on occasion. Of course, throughout all of this there was the constant fear of a fight. My point is that as the year progressed, I lost more of myself until I was just a shell of my former self. When there was nothing left to give and the pressure continued, I finally broke.

This is where the closure comes in. A relationship is about two people, and I think in a good relationship each person enjoys the others personality, activities, successes, helps during failures, and we both make compromises. But the core is that you simply like the other person for who they are. Trying to mold someone and change who they fundamentally are is going against the point of the relationship. Yes, some little things can be changed and compromised on. Maybe it's important that you talk on the phone for a bit when you don't see each other. Fine. Maybe you like that one sports team and it's important for you to follow them. Fine. Maybe you just don't like it when they leave the cap off the toothpaste. Fine. But in the grand scheme, you simply like the other person and they like you for who you are. Because you know what? They like you *because* of your passion for that sports team. They like you *because* you value speaking with them and sharing stories. They like you because, well, it's cute that you left the cap off. And it's meaningful that you try to remember to put it back on. They don't like you because you follow their rules.

What I experienced was becoming a robot. I was no longer myself and my ex did not want me to be myself. In reality, the relationship had ended months ago. Realizing that my ex liked me because of who she made me led me to accept that we were no longer in a relationship. It was a lifestyle. It was, in a sense, a habit. Oddly enough, there was security in that habit, because I knew the sadness would continue. Strange to think that I latched on to that lifestyle, but it was not a relationship.

Maybe the best closure that we can find is in realizing that most likely a pwBPD is in a relationship with you not for who you are but for themselves. The moment you start changing to avoid a fight or to please them is the moment the relationship ends. The rest may just be a lifestyle. I realize that this is a pretty strong condemnation of relationships between a pwBPD and a nonBPD. I am not trying to negate that there are good moments and there is a genuine attraction. I'm not trying to say that pwBPD do not have feelings and that the relationship is a hollow shell. The point is to look for closure by realizing that by the time things end it is possible that we were no longer in a relationship for a while. The final parting is kicking a bad habit.

As for a verbal exchange, I had the chance to have it. I did the breaking up. Not all of us have had that opportunity, so I mention it briefly here. 2.5 years ended in fifteen minutes. I forget the exact exchange, but I think my ex asked me why. I replied something to the effect of "it's me". Because I guess it was. I had lost myself and needed to find myself. That was an impossible task in the relationship. There was no long conversation about how my ex hurt me. No mention of BPD. Things just "did not work out". So even though I had the chance to speak with her one last time, there was nothing to say besides, essentially, "it's over".

The interesting thing is that about a week prior to the actual breakup I had tried to break up with my ex. "Tried". My ex, in sensing that I was serious, because a day-long plea that things would change, don't go, it will be better. I sat on the couch for several hours. We talked. I tried to explain how incongruent we were. She disagreed, asking me to give it another chance. How many times had we been down that road? The sun went down. I finally cracked and said ok. There was no way to communicate that there were simply fundamental issues that could not be changed without addressing the undiagnosed BPD. There was no closure in that. There could not be. It was a logical loop, a trap. I could not win. In a world where logic is circular, it is impossible to come to a conclusion. I felt the same way about finding closure in talking with my ex. I think that for those of us who long for some expression of appreciation or apology, and pinning our hopes of finding closure on that, that we simply may not be able to attain it. That in it of itself is a sad realization. We want to talk about why things did not work out and both agree that we should go our separate ways. I tried, and it did not happen.

During the final breakup, I do remember how her face changed and her expression became almost neutral. I saw the acceptance of the finality of what was happening and I remember it saddened me. It was over. It was truly over. But my point is that it was over a long time before that day, and when I realized that later on, that was my closure.

We went NC immediately. I am lucky in that. If you are trying to go NC, I think you may want to consider that there is possibly no verbal exchange that can lead to closure. Rather, look back on the data of the relationship. When you lost who you are, then I think the relationship ended. I know I wrote a lot here, and in my rambling I am trying to communicate some message of finding closure for those who don't have it. Any other ideas or approaches can be discussed here, because we are all unique and our relationships are/have been unique. And we all deserve peace and happiness in our lives.

[sas1729]

Hey everyone,

I wanted to start a thread about closure.

Maybe for those who have been NC for a while can swap stories and those who are just starting NC can share their concerns. I've been reading a lot of threads regarding closure and the usual lack thereof. I thought it might be nice to discuss the actual nature of closure and how it can pertain to those in NC or have moved on, since it is a natural desire to have for many. What I have realized from my own experience is that in the case of a relationship with a BPDex, closure is something that you have to find and think about. It's not necessarily something that you can get verbally from your BPDex. This is just my opinion, and I understand the strong desire to have some verbal exchange in which you hear the words "I'm sorry" or "I know you did a lot." Some sort of acknowledgement. I don't think that is something that is common at the end of relationship with a pwBPD. In light of this thought, I wanted to lay out some ideas that may help us find closure, or whatever variation of closure there is.

Personally, I feel lucky because I think (think being a key word) I had closure. I'm seven months out now, and I really look at the past relationship with clinical curiosity. Emotions are detached, with perhaps some specific happy ones picked out. I believe there is one main reason why I have closure. This is because of the steady decline in the relationship over time as it neared the end, and the implications of what was happening. This is something that I think many have perhaps experienced. Whether the relationship is in a perpetual cycle or if it visibly deteriorates, one source of closure that we can hope to find is actually in the "data" of the relationship. It's probably easier with time to look back on things and piece together the data logically. I can try to explain where I found my closure by talking about my own experience.

In my case, I experienced a steady decline in our relationship over the last year. Fights became more common and I surrendered more and more of myself in order to prevent them. Essentially, things came to a point where I didn't know what was left "to give". And yet, the pressure continued. It became nearly impossible to be perfect. Yes, there were good moments, but when I remember the ratio of good to bad it was a pretty bad score. And besides, the good moments we did have were centred around what my ex liked. I enjoy hockey. Never once did we go to watch a hockey game. It was mentioned in passing, but never followed up on. My ex enjoyed long walks through the city. I learned that I enjoyed them too, so we would do that on occasion. Of course, throughout all of this there was the constant fear of a fight. My point is that as the year progressed, I lost more of myself until I was just a shell of my former self. When there was nothing left to give and the pressure continued, I finally broke.

This is where the closure comes in. A relationship is about two people, and I think in a good relationship each person enjoys the others personality, activities, successes, helps during failures, and we both make compromises. But the core is that you simply like the other person for who they are. Trying to mold someone and change who they fundamentally are is going against the point of the relationship. Yes, some little things can be changed and compromised on. Maybe it's important that you talk on the phone for a bit when you don't see each other. Fine. Maybe you like that one sports team and it's important for you to follow them. Fine. Maybe you just don't like it when they leave the cap off the toothpaste. Fine. But in the grand scheme, you simply like the other person and they like you for who you are. Because you know what? They like you *because* of your passion for that sports team. They like you *because* you value speaking with them and sharing stories. They like you because, well, it's cute that you left the cap off. And it's meaningful that you try to remember to put it back on. They don't like you because you follow their rules.

What I experienced was becoming a robot. I was no longer myself and my ex did not want me to be myself. In reality, the relationship had ended months ago. Realizing that my ex liked me because of who she made me led me to accept that we were no longer in a relationship. It was a lifestyle. It was, in a sense, a habit. Oddly enough, there was security in that habit, because I knew the sadness would continue. Strange to think that I latched on to that lifestyle, but it was not a relationship.

Maybe the best closure that we can find is in realizing that most likely a pwBPD is in a relationship with you not for who you are but for themselves. The moment you start changing to avoid a fight or to please them is the moment the relationship ends. The rest may just be a lifestyle. I realize that this is a pretty strong condemnation of relationships between a pwBPD and a nonBPD. I am not trying to negate that there are good moments and there is a genuine attraction. I'm not trying to say that pwBPD do not have feelings and that the relationship is a hollow shell. The point is to look for closure by realizing that by the time things end it is possible that we were no longer in a relationship for a while. The final parting is kicking a bad habit.

As for a verbal exchange, I had the chance to have it. I did the breaking up. Not all of us have had that opportunity, so I mention it briefly here. 2.5 years ended in fifteen minutes. I forget the exact exchange, but I think my ex asked me why. I replied something to the effect of "it's me". Because I guess it was. I had lost myself and needed to find myself. That was an impossible task in the relationship. There was no long conversation about how my ex hurt me. No mention of BPD. Things just "did not work out". So even though I had the chance to speak with her one last time, there was nothing to say besides, essentially, "it's over".

The interesting thing is that about a week prior to the actual breakup I had tried to break up with my ex. "Tried". My ex, in sensing that I was serious, because a day-long plea that things would change, don't go, it will be better. I sat on the couch for several hours. We talked. I tried to explain how incongruent we were. She disagreed, asking me to give it another chance. How many times had we been down that road? The sun went down. I finally cracked and said ok. There was no way to communicate that there were simply fundamental issues that could not be changed without addressing the undiagnosed BPD. There was no closure in that. There could not be. It was a logical loop, a trap. I could not win. In a world where logic is circular, it is impossible to come to a conclusion. I felt the same way about finding closure in talking with my ex. I think that for those of us who long for some expression of appreciation or apology, and pinning our hopes of finding closure on that, that we simply may not be able to attain it. That in it of itself is a sad realization. We want to talk about why things did not work out and both agree that we should go our separate ways. I tried, and it did not happen.

During the final breakup, I do remember how her face changed and her expression became almost neutral. I saw the acceptance of the finality of what was happening and I remember it saddened me. It was over. It was truly over. But my point is that it was over a long time before that day, and when I realized that later on, that was my closure.

We went NC immediately. I am lucky in that. If you are trying to go NC, I think you may want to consider that there is possibly no verbal exchange that can lead to closure. Rather, look back on the data of the relationship. When you lost who you are, then I think the relationship ended. I know I wrote a lot here, and in my rambling I am trying to communicate some message of finding closure for those who don't have it. Any other ideas or approaches can be discussed here, because we are all unique and our relationships are/have been unique. And we all deserve peace and happiness in our lives.

[joeramabeme]

sas1729, good thread.

My knee jerk reaction to this question is that closure is getting validation of all the times we thought we saw crazy but were told that it wasn't so and that instead we were crazy.  Those of us who allowed ourselves to believe that line of thinking and changed our behaviors to match the requests of the pwBPD are left with a sense of deeply unfinished business.

In my case, I still find myself doing things around the house the way that my pwBPD wanted and imagining that she would be pleased when she sees what I have done.  The fact is, she couldn't see it many times and even if she could would probably deny having asked me to do it in a different way and then find something else that I was doing wrong and then ignore me as if I wasn't important.  LOL!  And then follow that up with a conversation about how I am insensitive to her.

That type of craziness, once allowed to take root, does not go away so easy.  Which is why I say the following; NC does not equal Closure.  NC equals an opportunity to begin the healing process by not having the wound constantly re-injured. 


My relationship also had a steady decline.  Closure (up to this point) for me has been living with her while we are midst of divorce.  Having conversations that make no sense, getting upset and then realizing that we are not getting back together so being more independent in my responses and how I hold her words internally.

I was shattered when she said she was going to divorce.  Recently the thought came to me; she is acting exactly how she has always acted.  This is just the final scene of the play.  Unilateral, totally unreasonable, applying nonsensical processes to addressing her feelings, making decisions completely independent of me and acting as if her feelings are gospel and completely unwilling to back off of her position. 

That may not sound like much closure, but it has hit me as such recently.  The recognition of this felt to me like this embodies all the reasons why I was so frustrated with this marriage to begin with, why should I be anymore surprised now than before and why would I think I could change it anymore than I had been able to previously.

[LimboFL]

This is a very good thread!

I think that it has already been said, that the only way to get closure is to find it ourselves.

While I still love and miss my ex deeply, she crossed a boundary that I couldn't accept and there is no turning back. When I immediately moved out, after discovering the boundary cross, I spent several months missing her and lamenting the loss of the relationship. Lamenting is a soft word for immense suffering. There was very limited communication in between that time and a very brief recycle that was born of an emergency that I could not ignore. I caught her in a set of new lies and left her, asking her never to contact me again.

6 Months go by and I get a missed call from her. I was unbelievably surprised. Drunk one night, I dialed her number but hung up after the first few rings, realizing what I was doing. She called back several days later and left a very sweet message, with an I love you, hope all is well with you and your son. Etc.

I labored for several days (and posted here) and finally decided to send her an email telling her how I would never understand why, that I thought we were going to end our lives together, that I loved her then, now and always and that she would always occupy a piece of my heart but that I went through a tremendous amount of pain to get to the point I am at, and that any further communication with her would simply cause to much damage and reverse my progress. I also addressed a matter that (a lost pet that I didn't get to say goodbye to whom I loved very much) and that was that.

If you had asked me if I wanted to close with love, a month earlier, I would have scoffed but ultimately this is how I found closure. After two very abrupt and difficult escapes, there was a great deal of guilt etc. By closing the door (not easy at all) on her with love and addressing the one issue that weighed heavily on me, I achieved my own closure. The last thought in her mind, no matter how convoluted it might be at times, was one where I got to remind her of the pain that her very poor decision inflicted on me, how ultimately she lost someone who truly loved her but that was strong enough not to allow her to do it to me again. Most importantly though is that I didn't attack or blame or single out anything. Everything was in broad terms.

I was with her for 4 years total. It was a crushing loss but for as much as I miss her, I realize what kind of life that I would have had to endure living under those high tension conditions. I still have to deal with my own flaws but I have no one judging me and I am not charging around trying to make someone else happy. It's all me and it is the first time in 24 years. I met my exBPDgf, several months after a divorce from my non (although she has her issues too, as we all do) ex wife, which last almost 20 years. That break up was less painful.

Timing will likely play a significant role in how you find your own closure. Anyone expecting to get it from their exBPD's will always be dissapointed. Not necessarily because the result is always the same. The posts vary on the family, regarding fresh contacts with ex's. Some are mundane, some are cold and some are very sweet with apologies. The mundane would hurt me, as would the cold and very sweet (which is what I went through) if I had allowed the communication to move forward would have simply caused me to wonder/ask why? "why did you do it? why did you blow what we had?" and I wouldn't have gotten the answers I want. Maybe she was trying to hook me again, I don't know and I don't want to know. The less we all know the better. Curiosity killed the cat!

WE have to find our own closure and tailor it in exactly the way we need it. I needed the last things I ever said to her, to be about my love for her and the pain I felt for not having been able to say goodbye to an animal that was her constant companion for 16 years. It send me flying back to the horrible pain that I felt before, missing her, wanting to be with her (despite knowing better) and the barrage of tears, but it was worth it.

That was my closure.

[valet]

I think that closure is seeing things for what the truly are and not being in any kind of denial of the facts.

You are together or you aren't. You love each other or you don't.

It is a complicated process to sort through, and it takes time, but the essence of 'closure' is self-validation of truth.

[SummerStorm]

I think closure means something different to everyone.  For me, it was a process.  Closure on any chance of having an actual relationship with my former friend BPD came when I visited her in the hospital, asked her if she wanted me to let go of those thoughts, and she said yes.  We ended that visit with a big hug and an exchange of "I love you."  That was the last time I saw her in person.  

Closure on our friendship was a longer process and was a lot harder.  I could sense that things were off when she got out of the hospital.  I knew that she was feeling shame over cheating on her boyfriend with me and that she blamed me for everything (BPD thinking at its finest).  I tried hard to be her friend, but she pulled away from me.  She barely replied to my texts, and she stopped updating me on how she was doing.  Eventually, one day, she got angry at something I texted her and told me to stay out of her life.  She had borrowed several things from me, and I told her that it would give me closure if she sent them to me.  I heard nothing back.  For three weeks, I texted her boyfriend and told him to keep asking her to send my things.  Eventually, he stopped replying, and I found out that they are more in love than ever and moving soon.  At that point, I gave up on ever getting closure.

But two weeks later, out of the clear blue, I got a card from her in the mail.  She thanked me for my friendship and apologized for not being the friend I thought she was.  She also said that she is committed to getting treatment and that she is moving closer to her mom and step dad (Her BPD behaviors got worse after her mom moved away a few years ago, and visiting her parents was hard on her because she would have to leave them).  She also mentioned that her boyfriend is moving with her.  Most importantly, she told me that I was a major factor in her deciding to become a better person and getting treatment, which is huge.  Finally, she ended by saying that she doesn't want me to contact her or her boyfriend, as that is what is best for her.  She signed it "Love always," which I thought was very sweet.  There are a lot of threads on here about whether pwBPD can love, and I am on the side that says they can.  I don't think she ever really loved me in the romantic sense, like she thought she did for a while, but she does love me as a person and as a former friend.

My next round of closure came when I took a chance and texted her.  I thanked her for the card and said that it gave me closure.  She replied and told me that the stuff she borrowed was also in the mail.  I also told her that I bought a house, and she said that is awesome.  Finally, I told her that I was going to give one of the paintings she gave me to a student she was close to, and she told me to give the student a hug for her.  I sent her two more texts, but she didn't reply, and I'm ok with that.  

My final round of closure came when I came home and discovered that the teaching position she was hoping would open up was posted today.  I didn't want someone else who doesn't know she's moving to text her and tell her to apply, so I sent her a long final text, telling her about the position and thanking her for the positive things she brought to my life.  I also told her that I know she will likely never contact me again, and I wished her the best in the future and safe travels.  I ended it with "Bye."  Twice, I expressed that I didn't want her to reply to me at all, as that would just open things up between us.  That also helped me with closure.  I don't have to worry about whether she read it or not, and I don't have to stress about not getting reply.  Minutes after I sent that text, I went out to get the mail, and saw that the things she borrowed from me had arrived.

I'm not going to lie.  I wish we could still have a friendship.  However, it would only end up hurting me more because she's soon going to be 3,000 miles away, and I can't see her ever moving back here.  In the end, everything that happened was for the best, even if it wasn't what I wanted to happen or thought would happen.    

[rotiroti]

Great write-up sas1729, always a pleasure to read your posts. I can really relate because I also did the breaking-up. Almost 9 years imploding within minutes.


I'll keep my response short because you already said so many thing I agree with.

The moment you start changing to avoid a fight or to please them is the moment the relationship ends.

This is a great observation. When you see on the staying board, the 'success' relationships are the ones with strong boundaries. Usually couples that can utilize the 'SET' technique outlined by SWoE

[joeramabeme]

The moment you start changing to avoid a fight or to please them is the moment the relationship ends.

[/quote]
I have to admit that reading this prompted two immediate responses from me; agreement and anger.  Why is this true? 

My gut thought and observation of my wife is that her perpetual immature behavior was like a child testing their parents.  On the one hand, they want to be difficult to push you intentionally and on the other, what they really want is for you to set boundaries for them. 

When I set boundaries I received mixed reactions.  Sometimes there would be a little more fight but if I stayed firm she would sometimes cede control.  At other times it was like scolding a child who had the intellect and rationale of an adult.  She knew my weakest spots and would play them so cunningly.  Conversations and arguments would get flipped on their head.  What started off as she threw something at me and needed to apologize turned into why don't I get a better job.  Can't even remember how she did it.  I would follow along like a dummy.  I was so easily manipulated into the deception.

As time went on, I got better at catching on and when I would call out the deception she would literally walk away from me.  I even got good at saying things like; we can talk about that later but for now we are talking about why you threw that at me.  Even then; no apologies, no acknowledgement, no nothing. 

I felt other-worldly.  Did I just tell her how i feel and set my boundaries or did I get run over by a truck?

I had too much low self esteem in certain areas.  She knew it and worked it hard and well.  In retrospect, I wished I had stuck to my guns but the points she made about me were all too real and I too defensive.  She hit me in the soft fleshy areas of my being.

Part of my closure is being able to look back and say; I made a mistake in not valuing me enough.  And now I will put the bat of of self-infliction down and admit that I probably could not have gotten to this understanding without having gone through the rest of it.

What is that saying about youth is wasted on the young?

[sas1729]

Thank you everyone for your replies. It's nice to read about how others experienced closure. I think I made my sense of closure sound too manufactured. In truth, I can see why it would come across that way, and perhaps there is a bit of manufacturing going on. But I also agree that sometimes we learn the hard way. It's just that in this case, it was stupidly hard.

This forum really makes me revisit feelings from the past. I have said numerous times that I look at the past relationship with "clinical curiosity". Maybe I don't. It was an all-consuming period of my life for 2.5 years. It was the sole focus of my life. It was my life.

I'm very happy that we have this forum. I know that we derive different things from it, but it's nice to know that there are others who can understand.

Thanks.

[McKenzie]

This is such an important thread.

Like it has already been said, we want the kind of disclosure that would heal the wounds of the crazy love and all the injustice that came with it. It's also different to everyone, and I think the difference lies in how we got in the relationship in the first place and why did we stay long enough to suffer damage. Why did we ignore the red flags, why we were so insanely patient with their behavior, why we were okay with them instead of saying "good riddance" and leaving by the time tour partners stopped behaving like mature adults. In that sense closure is a process of getting to know this side of oneself and learning how to be better and most importantly love oneself. It's a process of changing into a person with more self-respect and better sense of self-worth.

My closure is also a process very much like this. When me and my exBPDbf broke up, he really wanted us to stay friends because I was "the best gf he had ever had" and during the emotional turmoil of b/u, I wanted that too. During the past year I've learned that I have so many wise and supportive friends already and I don't deserve anyone as fickle and insensitive as him. I deserve better because I aim to be as wise and supportive a person as my close friends are to me. While I better myself, he refuses to improve himself and therefore he will never, ever have me or anyone like me by his side ever again.

I suppose I will always have a thing for men who make me chase them, but with this experience I now know when to stop and have a careful second thought. I hope so, at least. Anyway, that's my closure.

[Lost Out]

The only closure is with yourself. How can there be closure with someone who has very little empathy for you and blames you for everything, including her rages. This leaves us with incredible scars and healing to do. It is a relationship based on their needs and wants, we become secondary. Trips, jewelry, financial help, it was never enough, and will never be enough. It is amazing, I am a person that is always grateful for what I have, and because of that I have always seemed to get a lot in life. It's not getting what I want, it's wanting what I get. and I choose a BPD partner, 3 of them actually. They always hated my attitude, told me I was crazy, had no idea about romance and life. I was just happy with them too, always felt honored to have them in my life. And they always told me I was crazy for doing so. They just hated my sense of contentment. And so the struggle ensued... .So no, there is no closure with them, it is impossible, because then there would have to be an admitting of their role, and god forbid that happen.

[Sunfl0wer]

The moment you start changing to avoid a fight or to please them is the moment the relationship ends. The rest may just be a lifestyle.

Thank you for putting in words so nicely... .so many things I have thought... .this thread is very helpful.

So much of this rings true with me.

I felt cornered to set a boundary regarding a safety issue... .  Knowing he could not live with it.  Knowing that I could not live without it.  I knew that the result would likely end us just naturally.  Without me "over" compromising... .meaning, adjusting my thinking to align with his... .we were at a stalemate.  He tested this boundary in every imaginable way.  I was unmoved.  I would not compromise my safety.  I could not be with someone willing to compromise my safety in such a way.

I know it would have been simple for me to "pretend" that I was ok with what he wanted, and just "give in" for the sake of peace, some may say.  However, if I continued to do this... .continued on... .I was slowly losing myself... .therefore I was not in a r/s with him anymore anyway... .as I would no longer be me.

Someone else said it too... .

Knowing about FOG and all the dysfunctional distorted dynamics and having the opportunity to live with him while being armed with this knowledge... .allowed me to process my surroundings as an observer vs participant.  This was a huge help to my understanding.

[SummerStorm]

As Lost Out mentioned, unless your exBPD has gone through therapy and has recovered when he/she gives you closure, you can't really expect to get closure in the way you truly want it. 

If I saw my former friend BPD tomorrow and recited a list of how she's hurt me, she would just look at me blankly, give me a half-assed apology, and then say, "Yeah, well I hurt all the time."  No matter what, it will also come back to the pwBPD. 

The closure I got was as good as it's ever going to be from her, until she actually gets treatment and starts the road to recovery.  Having said that, as optimistic as I'm trying to be, she has a long road to recovery.  Before she even starts treatment, she is moving across the country with the guy she's been dating for six months.  The first time her engulfment fear showed up in full force was when she moved in with him three months ago, so I can't even imagine what a cross country move will do. 

Everything with a pwBPD is going to be 50%, at best.  Here are a few examples of that:

1. She apologized for not being a good friend.  Never apologized for the awful names she called me, for the lies she told me, or the many promises she broke.

2. Only ever acknowledged closure on our friendship.  Basically seemed to forget that we had a sexual relationship and that she told me I was the one she's been waiting for her whole life. 

3. Thanked me for my friendship but still sees me as the "bad person" who almost made her lose "everything" (her boyfriend) and has never taken responsibility for being the one who came on to me. 

4. Told me I'm a major factor in her decision to get help, but that I'm not allowed to contact her because it's best for everyone, "especially" her.  Yes, it is best, but the "especially" her part really annoyed me.  Everything is always about her. 

5. Finally acted like an adult and sent back things she borrowed from me but waited six weeks to do so and did it right after she decided to move across the country with her boyfriend, so she could mention that to me in her letter.

At the end of the day, BPD is always going to be the ringmaster in a pwBPD's mind.  Everything he/she does will be influenced by the BPD.