Things that make you question yourself...

[Ceruleanblue]

I made a concession, and went back to "our" bedroom for two nights. BPDh knew this was a big deal, me doing this. I thought it meant a lot to him, but maybe not. Not enough that he'd want to make sure I'd keep sleeping there. I keep doing things, thinking he'll catch on, but he never does. Maybe that makes ME crazy. I should know better.

Tonight, we were doing a question thing online that his T recommended, and an atrocious smell started coming from the other room. I asked him if just this once, he could go scoop the kitty litter from kitties recent litter visit. I changed both litter boxes earlier today, and I always change them. Always. I've never asked him to do it, nor has he volunteered. Guess what? He said "NO". I asked him again, and asked why, and he just said because he doesn't want to and he just won't.

I went with him today to a far away family reunion of his, one he knew I didn't want to attend. We cooked dinner, and he did NO cleanup. I didn't even get into it over this, but when he started nodding off, and headed to "my" new bedroom. He asked me where I was going and why. I told him because I do things for him all the time, even things I don't want to do, yet he refuses to do anything he doesn't want(as in the kitty litter). Also, I asked him if he could take a personal day tomorrow, and I got an immediate "no". A not super close friend of his called last Monday asking him to go golfing, and he takes a last minute personal day(three hours up north, no less, where he's been saying WE can't afford to go, but he goes with his friend?), and this "friend" canceled and he ended up golfing with total strangers.

He's completely narcissistic, and selfish. Oh, and on that question thing we were doing, so many of the questions that he had to list "nice things" about me, it was often physical things. I'd liked to be appreciated for how hard I try, my good character, my kindness, or my big heart, NOT MY *ss!

I'm questioning why I bothered to go back to the bedroom for those two nights. I guess I thought it might improve things, but he seems to have no motivation to act better consistently. Most men are smart enough to protect their sex supply, not him. Most men realize the "happy wife, happy life" concept that other men have told him about. He just does not get the connection, that that is true, and that relationships can't be all about one person.

I know he's trying, but there is just such an enormous whole in his psyche or something. He just can't seem to reciprocate, or ever be capable of doing anything HE doesn't want. He just feels the world has to revolve around him, him, him. How does anyone become this way? It's so incredibly frustrating.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Daniell85]

I kind of wonder what he would do if you suddenly quit trying to get him to do things, and just sort of went about your business.

I just feel he is playing a game of power and control with you. You are right in there tugging at him, and he is lazily tugging in the other direction like he just doesn't think there is anything you can do to that is going make him feel like he is missing out.

It's easy to say this and very hard to do. Walk away from him and his game. Stay in your home. Have one set of keys for your car. Take him off the insurance for it. Make sure it's registered in your name. Do your own laundry. Fix your own meals. Live in your own room. Go visit your son and let him know mom is there for him.

Drop all of your support of this man while he is playing this game with you. Harsh, yes, but he is harsh with you. You can detach firmly with kindness. When he is ready to negotiate fairly, give some of what you took away back. When he starts playing the game again, take it all a step back.

Do you really want to live your life in this relentless power struggle that he seems to be winning at your expense?

Maybe I have bad advice, but darn, it's so hard not to encourage you to be FOR YOURSELF after the great effort you have been making for this person who acts like you are to be subject to him, like a slave, or a cow, or whatever.

Sorry if I offend. 

[sempervivum]

Such kind of behavior was the most difficult for me to understand, but it seems I have to deal with it. Plainly said, I often wonder how can he be so "stupid" to undermine himself - do me harm and expect me to accept it with a smile.

So, I often have to repeat to myself "You married an emotional child, who is, by the way, a man in many ways, but in this one not. Remember that, remember that, remember that... ." It´so hard.

God knows I never wanted to be my husband´s mum or teacher, but in this aspect I have to treat him like a spoiled child, since, when you let a spoiled child get what he wants, you suffer more later. I am a teacher by profession, so maybe this is some 5 % easier for me to do, but anyway still uneasy.

Sometimes I feel so proud of myself for being able to break some patterns and set some boundaries and then come relapses and then we go again. The most difficult breaking was what I call "I don´t need you." It´s not that I don´t need him at all, it is more that I simply cut off when he wants to control things that need not be controlled. I know he is not satisfied, but he never started talking about that and I don´t want to dig.

I used to think before that everything can be cleared with a good conversation then I learned that there are times when it´s best to shut up and just live.

I don´know if I helped, just sharing my experience. 

[sweetheart]

I kind of wonder what he would do if you suddenly quit trying to get him to do things, and just sort of went about your business.

I just feel he is playing a game of power and control with you. You are right in there tugging at him, and he is lazily tugging in the other direction like he just doesn't think there is anything you can do to that is going make him feel like he is missing out.

It's easy to say this and very hard to do. Walk away from him and his game. Stay in your home. Have one set of keys for your car. Take him off the insurance for it. Make sure it's registered in your name. Do your own laundry. Fix your own meals. Live in your own room. Go visit your son and let him know mom is there for him.

Drop all of your support of this man while he is playing this game with you. Harsh, yes, but he is harsh with you. You can detach firmly with kindness. When he is ready to negotiate fairly, give some of what you took away back. When he starts playing the game again, take it all a step back.

Do you really want to live your life in this relentless power struggle that he seems to be winning at your expense?

Maybe I have bad advice, but darn, it's so hard not to encourage you to be FOR YOURSELF after the great effort you have been making for this person who acts like you are to be subject to him, like a slave, or a cow, or whatever.

Sorry if I offend. 

This and this again... .this is great advice and insight

If you haven't read Stop Caretaking the BPD/NPD... .have a read, and if you have read it again.

[Ceruleanblue]

Thanks for the advice, I don't think it's mean at all. I actually do feel like he views me as an object! Like I'm just there for sex or companionship as HE wants it, and the rest of the time, he'd like me to just go away. The man seriously spent three years telling me he didn't care about my feeling, and to keep my opinions to myself. Who says that to their partner? That seriously question if he could be antisocial. I mean, he lacks all empathy for me as a human. He wants, wants, wants, but he only gives in one area, and it's not the one that matters to ME, and he's very well aware of that.

The car is already in only my name. I was seeing the way the wind was blowing, so made sure of that. I'm now back in the spare bedroom, and I call it mine, which offends him. Too bad. I'm not asking for equality, not even close. I'll keep happily giving my 90%, but I'm not even getting my 10%! I feel like I'm being smothered.

I might be caretaking him, and will definitely have to read that book. I have boundaries, but I feel that all he does is rail against them. It IS a constant power struggle, except I gladly let him have most of the power. I don't care if he makes most decisions, but I sure do want and need more connection.

I do a lot of things on my own. I've been building a life without him. I spend evenings in my room. I'm not sure he cares until he wants me to come take part in something, and by then I'm less than happy to run when he snaps his fingers. Oh, and he's NOT GRATEFUL when I do cave in and do whatever it is he's asked of me. THAT is the hardest part to take. I make compromises and concessions All. The. Time. and he doesn't seem to appreciate it. It's just expected. Yet he won't do a dang thing for me.

We have MC tonight, and he has DBT today also. I think I may make myself scarce, so I don't have to see him, then just show up at MC, and try to address some of this. Our first attempt at MC, that T had one session with us, he didn't want to see "us" anymore, and just wanted to see me. I later asked him why, and he said he thought he could help me, but BPDh had zero respect for me, and was clearly checked out. In fact BPDh left me shortly after that.

I feel any forward progress we've made, or BPDh has made is being sabotaged by HIM, in this huge power struggle. If I want or need something, he feels powerful by withholding? I'd bet my last dollar that is it... .

[vortex of confusion]

The man seriously spent three years telling me he didn't care about my feeling, and to keep my opinions to myself. Who says that to their partner?

When did he stop saying it with words? He is still saying this with his actions. Do you have a reason to think that this might change?

I've been building a life without him. I spend evenings in my room. I'm not sure he cares until he wants me to come take part in something, and by then I'm less than happy to run when he snaps his fingers. Oh, and he's NOT GRATEFUL when I do cave in and do whatever it is he's asked of me. THAT is the hardest part to take. I make compromises and concessions All. The. Time. and he doesn't seem to appreciate it. It's just expected. Yet he won't do a dang thing for me.

If you are doing things with the hopes that he will be grateful or appreciative, then you are setting yourself up for disappointment every time you compromise or make a concession. That was a difficult pill for me to swallow. I have done all sorts of things over the years and I was continually upset and disappointed because he didn't seem to notice. I stopped doing as much. I have stopped making so many concessions. If he hasn't done a dang thing for you up to this point, what leads you to think that it might change? What are you getting out of staying upset by this?

I know how it feels to be asked these questions. I know how it feels when I try to vent about some of my husband's behaviors only to be told, "Why are you so upset, you know that this is how he is?" It makes me so mad to be reminded of that. It makes me so mad at myself because I know that he is the way he is yet I can't seem to accept it at times. Sure, my husband is doing great and has been really wonderful in a lot of areas lately. That doesn't change the fact that I still feel a lot of hurt and resentment over all that I have given him over the years.

I feel any forward progress we've made, or BPDh has made is being sabotaged by HIM, in this huge power struggle. If I want or need something, he feels powerful by withholding? I'd bet my last dollar that is it... .

Is it a power struggle or is he just that friggin' self absorbed?

[formflier]

 

Ceruleanblue,

I'm a bit confused why you are in a separate bedroom.  Is where you sleep a bargaining chip... .?  Or... are you enforcing a boundary?

I'm coming at this from a guys perspective.  I'm coming at this from a perspective of a guy whose wife has decided... for reasons I still can't explain... .to sleep other places in the house (this has been over for a while).

It would make sense to me (and maybe your hubby) if you slept over there because he was waking your up and yelling at you in the middle of the night.  Or... maybe if he liked to dutch oven you... .and you hated it...   (how many people know that move?    )

But... .I think most guys if they refused to clean cat litter... .and had their wife go sleep in another room... even if she told him it was because of cat litter... I don't think it would make sense (connect).  Very likely they would shrug and move along... or "fight back" somehow against what they perceive as unreasonableness.

Again... .I'm trying to draw out how this might seem from his perspective.

Cat litter:  Why not get rid of cat?  (full disclosure... .we have a cat... and I take my turn or help out cleaning as needed or when people are gone)

But... if I perceived I was getting "stuck" with a cat I didn't want... .I most likely wouldn't help.

Power struggle:  I see this... .each of you (to me) seems to be trying to control things that aren't yours.

Thoughts?

What is the purpose of sleeping in another room?


FF

[vortex of confusion]

What is the purpose of sleeping in another room?

This is an excellent question from FF!

I will be totally honest and admit that there was a time when I chose not to sleep in the same room as my husband in hopes that he would change his behavior, chase me, or do something different to let me know that he cared and wanted me. It was a bad move on my part as it made things worse. I was creating more push/pull with the whole sleeping thing.

Now, I don't sleep in in the same room as him a lot of the time. When I choose to do it now, it has to do with ME. I have told him that. I have told him that sometimes I just need some space. My choice to sleep on the couch or not has absolutely nothing to do with him any more. There are times when I sleep in the same bed as him and see him sleeping and it brings back all sorts of feelings of hurt. It doesn't always do that but sometimes it does. I have to be in a good place mentally to share the bed with him. Choosing not to sleep with him is a boundary that I used to protect my feelings. Sometimes, it is about me wanting to avoid feeling all of the stuff that comes up when I am laying there next to him watching him sleep and listening to him breathe. It reminds me of all of the hope that I used to have for us. It reminds of all of the nights that we used to spend talking late into the night laughing and being intimate. Being able to make the choice to sleep somewhere else without thinking about what my husband is or isn't doing has been really empowering for me.

[Hope26]

CeruleanBlue, I just have to jump in here and say that I get everything you're trying to say; it seems to me from all the behavior you described, you summed it up in a nutshell when you said 'he's completely narcissistic, and selfish'.  You have said that you don't feel he gives even 10% to your relationship, but just takes.  Don't we all need more than this to sustain any relationship, with a pwBPD (and in your case maybe NPD), or anyone else?  My first husband was selfish like that, which ultimately brought down our marriage.  My present husband, while very likely BPD, is much more of a giver and that is why I am on the 'staying' board here.  You are dealing with more than one issue here, it seems to me, and I just want to say that you very much have my sympathy, whatever you decide to do!

[Cat Familiar]

Ceruleanblue,

From what you've shared, it seems you're just running on fumes of hope. Can you share anything positive your husband contributes to your life?

As far as the cat, formflier, I take exception with your suggestion of getting rid of the cat. Sometimes animals are the only positive loving beings some of us have when we're in relationship with people with personality disorders!

Cat (biased for sure)

[formflier]

As far as the cat, formflier, I take exception with your suggestion of getting rid of the cat. Sometimes animals are the only positive loving beings some of us have when we're in relationship with people with personality disorders!

I figured someone would hammer me for that!   

I love cats... .we have one... used to have more. 

But... the basis of my suggestion is that if he likes and wants a cat... .then he should take care of it.

If she is the one that wants it... .then she takes care of it.

Unfortunately... .my wife has taken in many things over the years... .not cared for the properly... .and... disaster.  I stay aloof from this... and participate in the animals I (we) agree on... and leave her to deal with the rest.

It's sad... .but... .the conflict from me trying to convince her to treat them properly... .was horrible.  It's on her to have a conscience... .or not about how it goes down.

FF

[MaybeSo]

He asked me where I was going and why. I told him because I do things for him all the time, even things I don't want to do, yet he refuses to do anything he doesn't want(as in the kitty litter).

This sounds like he asked why you were going to go sleep in a separate bedroom... .and you told him directly that you were choosing to sleep elsewhere because you had gone out of your way to accommodate him a lot ... .and he never does the same for you in return.  Unless I am misunderstanding this, your choice to sleep elsewhere was a direct response to a sense of building resentment about how much you do for him with little in return.

I am wondering, can you stop going out of your way to accommodate him so readily?  It will help lessen the sense of anger and resentment that is building all the time.  

My choice to sleep on the couch or not has absolutely nothing to do with him any more.

again... .It seems like it has a lot to do with feeling resentment toward him.

What if he did something selfish per the norm... .and in response (either in your head or otherwise) you didn't have a laundry list of things you have recently done to bend over backwards to accommodate him.  What would that feel like? Would there be less resentment?

What if you ceased working so so so hard to accommodate the selfish one, and only did things YOU chose to do for your own reasons, and only with FULL awareness that he is not a person that typically responds in a reciprocal manner?   and with full awareness that he is not likely to change and turn into a less selfish person... .

Based on how things really are (not how you wish they were)... .what would it be like to stop being so accommodating to a person you see as being so selfish?  If he is narcissistic, bending over backwards is not going to change his way of being.

[formflier]

[  If he is narcissistic, bending over backwards is not going to change his way of being.

In fact... .doesn't it usually "feed" the sense of entitlement.  So... you believe the world revolves around you... .your SO acts as if the world revolves around you... .so... .why challenge that in your mind... ?

FF

[Ceruleanblue]

Oh, I did not go back to the bedroom just because he refused to scoop the cat litter(for the first time ever, I might add). He refused, I did it. I went back to what I now consider "my room" because of all his behaviors that weekend. I feel he totally disregards my feelings and he outright disrespects me.

I've had this cat for 11 years, my husband for 4. Guess which one would go first? I pretty much gave up my son to protect him, and he's now living with my folks. I draw the line at my cat! I tend him, I just asked for BPDh to do it once, but I should have known better.

Right now I'm struggling to see anything good in our relationship. Three weeks ago, I thought all was fine for the most part, but then he blew me out of the water in MC by revealing what he really thought of our marriage.

He's super narcissistic, and it's tiring, but what really bothers me is how he's mean. I can put up with the "all about him" show, much easier than I can the blame, disconnectedness, and the negativity.

[formflier]

Three weeks ago, I thought all was fine for the most part, but then he blew me out of the water in MC by revealing what he really thought of our marriage.

Hmmm... I'm not following this.

So... in your experience... .the way that you perceived life... .your marriage was much better.  I remember that.  I remember you saying things are better and the shock of what he said.

Here is my take.  You handed over power of how to "perceive"  your marriage to a disordered person.

Remember... .live your life... .feel your feelings.  If you believe the sky is blue... and your husband swears in MC that it's orange... .don't take it personally... .  Believe yourself.

By the same token... .if you have concerns... .and your husband says life is great.  Believe yourself... listen to your gut.

He has negative feelings about your marriage... .let him keep those feelings.  The way I see it... you grabbed those feelings... owned them... .and ran with them.

Are you following my thinking... observations?

FF

[MaybeSo]

[  If he is narcissistic, bending over backwards is not going to change his way of being.

In fact... .doesn't it usually "feed" the sense of entitlement.  So... you believe the world revolves around you... .your SO acts as if the world revolves around you... .so... .why challenge that in your mind... ?

Exactly.

Further, I have to wonder if your H knows what gets your goat and that you are sensitive to this kind of thing and might intentionally do things at times just to get you upset ... .

... .and that you work hard in an effort to try to please and be appeasing... .which he will likely take full advantage of, too.

It is imperative that you hang on to yourself and not hook into his stuff and his perceptions easily.  He may have just said that (critical about marriage) because he knows it would throw you into a tail spin, and b/c he doesn't like being evaluated.   you have to get to where you can hear his perceptions, but hang onto to yourself at the same time... .b/c if you fail to do that with a disordered person you will feel like your mind and heart are in a blender constantly.  And don't put it past a narcissistic personality to toy with and exploit your weaknesses!  Seriously.  You have to stay in integrity but have very firm boundaries that are not easily penetrated or toyed with.   

[Ceruleanblue]

FF:

I totally follow your thinking. I don't agree with his perception of our marriage(well, right now I do... .), but I was/am hurt that he'd been saying one thing to me: that things were going great, only to spring it on me in MC that he felt they were not. Or he focused solely on what he perceived to be negative.

I'm trying to not own his reality, but I'm just hurt that he gave me a false sense of security, I guess. I've had so little, and it felt so good, for once. I thought we were in agreement that things were so much better, only to find out he'd been lying?

I think you are all right, and I just have to learn to not be hurt by his perceptions. And I think MaybeSo is right, that he could possibly be doing it to toy with me. He criticizes, I try harder, or give him his way to show him I'm "compromising", which I always do. It's ironic because I compromise, but he won't. I really try hard, he barely tries.

He says "it shouldn't be this much work", but I'm the one doing all the heavy lifting.

Starting today/tonight, and into tomorrow, I'm going to only give MY perception weight, and just leave his laying there. He's welcome to them, but I'm not going to get hurt or indignant over his skewed reality. Just tonight he was going off again, about how he is upset that I feel he has BPD. He then suggested it is ME who has it. I need to let that lie to, right? He's saying this to provoke me? I feel he has all traits except one, and he is high functioning at work, and less so at home. Why does he care if I think he has it? His psychiatrist told him he has traits of it, put him on meds for it, and recommended DBT for him! But he's mad at ME?

I also think that you are correct about me making the narcissism worse, or at least feeding into it by giving him his own way so often. He's always going to be narcissistic, I'm sure, but I've probably contributed to it getting worse by hating to say no, or doing so to avoid conflict or resentment on his part. I'm going to start saying no based off what I want to do. From now on I'm only going to do things if I feel like it, and expect nothing in return, because he just doesn't comprehend reciprocation.

[sempervivum]

From my experience doing things on your own functions only then when you reached the "I really don´t care." stage. There were times when I did things on my own with purpose only to teach my h a lesson and you may all guess this failed.

In my opinion you can reach this stage when you had enough and when you have nothing to lose, when you realize that your partner did bad things to you and there is nothing that prevents you to be resolute, strict and angry - and show these feelings. I want to point out I am not talking about any kind of revenge or throwing it back to him.

It´s just being firm. Personally I´d like to be on these wavelengths more often, because this happens from time to time. On the other hand, if it were all the time, it would be very stressful to endure.

When I find myself in such angry state of mind, then my husband suddenly "sees" me and my needs. So, he is capable for empathy and that is one plus.

[Ceruleanblue]

Yeah, sadly, I don't think my BPDh is capable of any empathy. He has great empathy for himself and his kids, but none for me, and none for anyone else that I can see either. It's almost like he sees his kids as extensions of himself. All sorts of unhealthy enmeshment and that whole drama triangle going on there.

MaybeSo: I totally think he knows what gets my goat: there are about five phrases he says that I've asked him not to say when he's mad. "Here you go again"(when it's actually him dysregulating), "I'm sick of your games", "I'm so sick of your sh*t", "You are so childish", "It shouldn't have to be this hard"... .all said with sarcasm and he also mocks and belittles me. The  hateful sarcasm is the worst. He knows that I find these things damaging, and counter productive to our marriage, so he is now saying them more and more. It's a power struggle? Or him out to show me he's in control?

All I know is that I'm sick of his negativity, and bullying. Heck, every time he dysregulates or gets moody, I don't say "here we go again", even though you can bet I'm thinking it!

[formflier]

I'm trying to not own his reality, but I'm just hurt that he gave me a false sense of security, I guess. I've had so little, and it felt so good, for once. 

Ceruleanblue,

 

I think you are "getting it... "... .keep working... .your "muscle memory"... or more properly said... .your "emotional memories" of how you go about getting your emotional needs met... .are hard to change. 

But... you can do it.

Please look at the quote... .

Who gave you a sense of security? 

Look to yourself for security... if he gives it... enjoy it... .if he is having a bad day and takes it away... .remember the good times... .and stick to your boundaries... .

Remember... .when he "releases" his pressure... has a dysreg... .it's over... .  He gets back down to around baseline again.

It's not forever...

FF

[sempervivum]

... .I don't think my BPDh is capable of any empathy.

... .The  hateful sarcasm is the worst. He knows that I find these things damaging, and counter productive to our marriage, so he is now saying them more and more. It's a power struggle? Or him out to show me he's in control?

All I know is that I'm sick of his negativity, and bullying. Heck, every time he dysregulates or gets moody, I don't say "here we go again", even though you can bet I'm thinking it!

The amount of empathy in my h is not big, but it was a bliss to discover any. It broke a piece of his shield of egoism.

I think we don´t stay in our relationships/marriages out of hope for things to change. If we do stay, than it is up to us to roll up the sleeves and make some changes. As long as he sees he is hurting you verbally, he is OK.

Example: I can still get hurt, but I have some immunity and when all the symptoms of his egoistic dance appear, then I retreat.

BPs have their pattern, we know it and when we see that what we do is useless, we try something else.

Think and act in your favour, you are important  - that´s the mantra I repeat to myself in moments of provocation.

[Ceruleanblue]

Yeah, maybe if he says his "mean phrases" as much as he wants, maybe, just maybe he'd stop? What do I do, just not react, or just walk away. I think I've already tried that, but I can try it again. At this point, he seems to say it knowing I'll be hurt. That seems to be his end goal.

And YES, he does cycle, and I guess I just need to learn to beat a more hasty retreat. Do I offer some explanation, or just walk away? He does that to me, if he doesn't like any little thing he hears(he seems to think I should always comply or agree with him), then he stomps off. I find this highly disrespectful, not to mention irritating. He did it last night, and things weren't heated, we were just talking. I just don't want to start doing to him the irritating things he does to me?

[sempervivum]

Yes, things stay challenging and painful. Our partners are limited in their emotional reactions and functions, but even they have some ability to observe when things have come to the verge.

Simply said: walking on eggshells doesn´t bring any good and I realized I cannot do it any more. I could not imagine living on like that. 

My reactions to his verbal abuse were not reciprocal, they were in form of truth and directness. Such things do not change a BP, they shake him a little and make him redirect his actions. My primary concern was to make sure he does not redirect to children, and if he does, to prepare and educate them.

So, when he tried to belittle me again I simply reacted as "I don´t want to talk about it or I don´t want to listen to this... / If it is so, why are you still with me?"

Maybe a cruel concept, but I thought there is no use of two deeply unhappy people, because he is unhappy anyway. (Or maybe he IS happy that way, who knows?)

I think nons have reasons to be unhappy forever for not having a normal marriage or relationship, that´s our curse, but we have full right to be frank with our partners and be what we are, not only their support. Their being BPs should not prevent us from us being what we are, again, with respect.

When I frist read about "I statements", I was worried how to apply this, but with repeated use it became more and more natural. 

[sweetheart]

Yeah, maybe if he says his "mean phrases" as much as he wants, maybe, just maybe he'd stop? What do I do, just not react, or just walk away. I think I've already tried that, but I can try it again. At this point, he seems to say it knowing I'll be hurt. That seems to be his end goal.

And YES, he does cycle, and I guess I just need to learn to beat a more hasty retreat. Do I offer some explanation, or just walk away? He does that to me, if he doesn't like any little thing he hears(he seems to think I should always comply or agree with him), then he stomps off. I find this highly disrespectful, not to mention irritating. He did it last night, and things weren't heated, we were just talking. I just don't want to start doing to him the irritating things he does to me?

CB you show some great insight into your husbands behaviour here, and you mention strategys that most definitely work to prevent things escalating between you, so ... .

- beating a hasty retreat/taking a 'time out'

- noticing his cycles and potential triggers

- just not reacting, walking away

- trying all these things every single time

- noticing when you feel irritated, angry, disrespected or upset (emotionally triggered), time to make a polite excuse to leave

- saying as sempervivum says 'I don't want to talk about this right now/I've just remembered something I've got to do.'

- having a Safety Plan 

-   

It can take, or so I've read 66  repetitions of the same behaviour to elicit a change, so nothing is going to happen overnight.

Remember being consistent and steadfast is the key. Finding a small range of strategies that work for you can really help. My favourite and my saviour was not to JADE. I used to say it over and over in my head as my h was speaking at me, or as I was walking away.

Over time these things can reduce conflict. It did for me.

[Hope26]

CB, these last two posts from Sempervivum and Sweetheart were particularly on target.  I could particularly relate to what Sweetheart said...

Quote: ."My favourite and my saviour was not to JADE. I used to say it over and over in my head as my h was speaking at me, or as I was walking away. Over time these things can reduce conflict. It did for me."

This worked for me, too, for stopping the raging.  I didn't walk away, I simply stopped replying.  Not JADEing (justifying, arguing, defending, explaining) was so much easier on my psyche as well.  Ultimately my not responding seemed to have a boomerang effect as though his words bounced back to him when there was no reply.  He'd realize sometimes how bad his behavior had been, and occasionally even apologize, or at least acknowledge the behavior.  He is still very moody and frequently ill-tempered, but the rages and verbal abuse have almost stopped.

[MaybeSo]

bingo. depending on or looking for a sense of security or safety from a disordered person will always lead to suffering.

establish it in yourself. solidly. if he takes his away you are not floored or capsized. this is critical.

David Schnarch phd would argue to never depend on a psrtnership for a core sense of security because even non disordered people can and do behave poorly at times, people can and do mess around with their partners... .you must have a strong self structure to survive intimacy intact.