His birthday..

[klacey3]

So my undiagnosed BPD ex's birthday is today. We broke up officially about 2 months ago but he just keeps messaging. I unfortunately broke no contact about a week ago in response to an email.

Last night we had an email argument as he kept trying to convince me to see him for his birthday. He said he would punish himself if i didnt see him. He started saying how sick I was to ruin his Birthday. I wished him happy birthday and told him i wouldnt see him and not to blame me. This morning he said he would be near my area in an hour. I didnt reply and then an hour later he said he is going to go out with some mates as he shouldnt have to ruin his birthday to put a smile on my face. He keeps sending me messages on how sick I am for blanking him on his birthday and not seeing him and asking me to meet him. I just responded "happy birthday"

I just dont know what to do or say anymore! Im worried he is going to turn up at my house and i will have to be nice to him just because its his birthday

[Mutt]

I wished him happy birthday and told him i wouldnt see him and not to blame me. This morning he said he would be near my area in an hour. I didnt reply and then an hour later he said he is going to go out with some mates as he shouldnt have to ruin his birthday to put a smile on my face.He keeps sending me messages on how sick I am for blanking him on his birthday and not seeing him and asking me to meet him. I just responded "happy birthday"

I just dont know what to do or say anymore! Im worried he is going to turn up at my house and i will have to be nice to him just because its his birthday

Hi klacey3,

I can see how distressing this would feel  He feels rejected and he's rejecting you in the highlighted part. I can see how that would be worrying that he may show up at your house.

Say and do nothing. Silence speaks louder than words. Do you have other plans today?

How did the email argument feel? Did you feel like you were on an emotional rollercoaster?

[klacey3]

I wished him happy birthday and told him i wouldnt see him and not to blame me. This morning he said he would be near my area in an hour. I didnt reply and then an hour later he said he is going to go out with some mates as he shouldnt have to ruin his birthday to put a smile on my face. He keeps sending me messages on how sick I am for blanking him on his birthday and not seeing him and asking me to meet him. I just responded "happy birthday"

I just dont know what to do or say anymore! Im worried he is going to turn up at my house and i will have to be nice to him just because its his birthday

Hi klacey,

I can see how distressing this would feel  He feels rejected and he's rejecting you in the highlighted part. I can see how that would be worrying that he may show up at your house.

Say and do nothing. Do you have other plans today?

How did the email argument feel? Did you feel like you were on an emotional rollercoaster?

Awful... he kept telling me he wanted to see me and i said i wouldnt. He said he would punish himself foe losing me by sitting in a a fast food restaurant miserable and send me the pictures.i encouraged him to see some friends he said no. He said today he isnt gonna make me happy by being miserable so he is gonna see his friends.

All in the same email was "my ex didnt talk to me like you do. My family always preferred her. Stop talking about your dad (who is very very ill) if your not gonna be with me. If you dont see me tomorrow on my birthday you really are sick. I dont believe anyone could be that sick.

[Mutt]

All in the same email was "my ex didnt talk to me like you do. My family always preferred her. Stop talking about your dad (who is very very ill) if your not gonna be with me. If you dont see me tomorrow on my birthday you really are sick. I dont believe anyone could be that sick.

Hi klacey3,

I'm sorry to hear that. He sounds like he is emotionally dysregulated. I can understand how awful that feels. I can tell when my ex is emotionally dysregulated in emails and I wait and respond the following day or sometimes in a few days. Sometimes I will validate and I can communicate with her and sometimes validation doesn't work. If the tools don't work, there's nothing that I can do.

Everyone that suffers from BPD is a different person, have different traits, characteristics and severity along a continuum. I know when my ex is dysegulated with how manic her messages are and she calls me crazy, I see that your ex called you sick, I think it's projecting with how they feel.

No contact is not a fast and dirty rule, it helps us with detaching until we get emotionally healthier. It took me a long time to not get perturbed when my ex is emotionally dysregulated in emails and I had to detach to get there. I hope your not hard on yourself about breaking no contact, we can heal and not feel awful from our exe's behaviors. It sounds like he's really having a tantrum in the email, he's dysregulated and we can't say anything to our ex partners. It's best to leave him alone.

[klacey3]

All in the same email was "my ex didnt talk to me like you do. My family always preferred her. Stop talking about your dad (who is very very ill) if your not gonna be with me. If you dont see me tomorrow on my birthday you really are sick. I dont believe anyone could be that sick.

Hi klacey3,

I'm sorry to hear that. He sounds like he is emotionally dysregulated. I can understand how awful that feels. I can tell when my ex is emotionally dysregulated in emails and I wait and respond the following day or sometimes in a few days. Sometimes I will validate and I can communicate with her and sometimes validation doesn't work. If the tools don't work, there's nothing that I can do.

Everyone that suffers from BPD is a different person, have different traits, characteristics and severity along a continuum. I know when my ex is dysegulated with how manic her messages are and she calls me crazy, I see that your ex called you sick, I think it's projecting with how they feel.

No contact is not a fast and dirty rule, it helps us with detaching until we get emotionally healthier. It took me a long time to not get perturbed when my ex is emotionally dysregulated in emails and I had to detach to get there. I hope your not hard on yourself about breaking no contact, we can heal and not feel awful from our exe's behaviors. It sounds like he's really having a tantrum in the email, he's dysregulated and we can't say anything to our ex partners. It's best to leave him alone.

This is what he keeps doing. For the last 6 months of our relationship is was all nonsense. He would be nice then be horrible then accuse me and insult me and then be nice like nothing happened. He never used to be like this... he ignores what I say and then tells me im horrible when I confront him on something he contradicts himself and says something hurtful while telling me how sick/horrible i am while saying how much he either loves me or asking me to meet.

I feel soo guilty today. I almost want to see him for an hour or so as a birthday treat to make him feel better :-(

[Mutt]

Hi klacey3,

He never used to be like this...

I have been with my boyfriend about a year now (for the last few months it has been very rocky)

I understand. BPD is a spectrum disorder and it may take weeks, months or sometimes years until the behaviors emerge. You were with him for around a year and he was a very different person than you knew? A pwBPD have chaotic and unstable inter-personal relationships and the disorder is triggered by intimacy, the person that you see now is who he is.

I can understand feeling guilt on his birthday, it's up to your ex to sooth is own feelings, we're not responsible for someone else's feelings. It will also re-enforce his behaviors and he'll know how to illicit a response from you if he keeps trying.

Have you accepted that he is mentally ill?

[klacey3]

Hi klacey3,

He never used to be like this...

I have been with my boyfriend about a year now (for the last few months it has been very rocky)

I understand. BPD is a spectrum disorder and it may take weeks, months or sometimes years until the behaviors emerge. You were with him for around a year and he was a very different person than you knew? A pwBPD have chaotic and unstable inter-personal relationships and the disorder is triggered by intimacy, the person that you see now is who he is.

I can understand feeling guilt on his birthday, it's up to your ex to sooth is own feelings, we're not responsible for someone else's feelings. It will also re-enforce his behaviors and he'll know how to illicit a response from you if he keeps trying.

Have you accepted that he is mentally ill?

Why do the behaviours emerge at different times? I feel quite bad in a way. When we broke up after 7 months (I found out he had been on a dating site while i was on and saw a conversation between him and a female telling her he doesnt like thinking about her with anyone else and finds her really attractive). He begged me back and I took him back. Since then he wasnt the same. He actually used a dating site and meeting his ex as threats/manipulation to get me to do or not do something. For months I would end up telling him it over nearly every week, I feel like I made him so much worse by telling him it was over and just going back all of the time. Though I see that I tried putting boundaries in place since that incident and didnt make as much effort to be meeting his needs especially as he didnt respect my boundaries and meet my needs.

I havent fully accepted he is mentally ill because he doesnt have a diagnosis and he has never been admitted to hospital as far as i Know. Which puts doubt in my mind.

[SummerStorm]

Hi klacey3,

For me, the hardest thing to get used to is that my former friend BPD "never used to be like this" but that she IS like this, and there's nothing I can do about it.  The girl I enjoyed talking to and with whom I fell in love doesn't exist.  If I could rewind the 9 months I knew her and then fast forward them, it would be scary and sad, to see her decline and how it happened.  My earliest memory is of a funny girl who was scared to talk to me at work.  My last memory is of her sitting in the behavioral care unit, hair unkempt, wearing sweats, showing me the bruise on her arm from the IV, and then telling me to leave when she didn't like what I had to say.  One is the girl she could be without BPD; the other is the girl she is.

I read papers she wrote for a philosophy class and think, "Wow.  She is brilliant." It's so sad that her emotions don't match her intellect.

Like Mutt wrote, it can sometimes take years for symptoms to show up.  She has friends who are distant but probably just see her as a bit unreliable and flighty.  This is because they don't see her often.  But I knew her, saw her almost every day, and was intimate with her.  And that's when it all fell apart.

It's not your job to soothe him and placate him on his birthday.  Just think of it as another day on the calendar.

[Mutt]

I havent fully accepted he is mentally ill because he doesnt have a diagnosis and he has never been admitted to hospital as far as i Know. Which puts doubt in my mind.

I get it. My ex is undiagnosed too. What we can look at are behaviors. traits and borderline type personalities. A person that changes reality often is a sign of mental illness.

[SummerStorm]

Why do the behaviours emerge at different times? I feel quite bad in a way. When we broke up after 7 months (I found out he had been on a dating site while i was on and saw a conversation between him and a female telling her he doesnt like thinking about her with anyone else and finds her really attractive). He begged me back and I took him back. Since then he wasnt the same. He actually used a dating site and meeting his ex as threats/manipulation to get me to do or not do something. For months I would end up telling him it over nearly every week, I feel like I made him so much worse by telling him it was over and just going back all of the time. Though I see that I tried putting boundaries in place since that incident and didnt make as much effort to be meeting his needs especially as he didnt respect my boundaries and meet my needs.

I havent fully accepted he is mentally ill because he doesnt have a diagnosis and he has never been admitted to hospital as far as i Know. Which puts doubt in my mind.

Either way, his behaviors are unpredictable and hurtful, and that's never good.

As Mutt wrote, intimacy is a trigger.  For some people, spending too much time together could trigger it.  For others, moving in together could trigger it.  For other, it could be an engagement, marriage, or having kids.

My former friend's fear of engulfment (intimacy) emerged when we looked at a house together.  She told me she wanted to be with me and that she saw us getting married.  Those thoughts were fine.  But when it came time to look at places and talk to a Realtor, that was way too much.

Her fear of engulfment with her boyfriend kicked in a bit before she moved in with him (she started idealizing me that day), but she also had nowhere else to live, so she went into survival mode.  Food, water, shelter: all basic needs.  They were living with his cousin and her kid, and she wasn't helping pay rent, so it wasn't like she was really living there, in her mind.  Plus, some of her stuff was still at her apartment, and that was still technically her address.  His work schedule also meant he wasn't around much.

She once said to me that she needed to figure out what a future with me meant vs. a future with him.  I meant love, stability, responsibility, a career, maybe a kid or two, a dog, a cat, and a home in the suburbs.  He meant love, stability, partying, a job, and renting an apartment.  So, she picked him.  I'm not saying I'm a better or worse match.  I triggered engulfment fears and he didn't.

[klacey3]

Why do the behaviours emerge at different times? I feel quite bad in a way. When we broke up after 7 months (I found out he had been on a dating site while i was on and saw a conversation between him and a female telling her he doesnt like thinking about her with anyone else and finds her really attractive). He begged me back and I took him back. Since then he wasnt the same. He actually used a dating site and meeting his ex as threats/manipulation to get me to do or not do something. For months I would end up telling him it over nearly every week, I feel like I made him so much worse by telling him it was over and just going back all of the time. Though I see that I tried putting boundaries in place since that incident and didnt make as much effort to be meeting his needs especially as he didnt respect my boundaries and meet my needs.

I havent fully accepted he is mentally ill because he doesnt have a diagnosis and he has never been admitted to hospital as far as i Know. Which puts doubt in my mind.

Either way, his behaviors are unpredictable and hurtful, and that's never good.

As Mutt wrote, intimacy is a trigger.  For some people, spending too much time together could trigger it.  For others, moving in together could trigger it.  For other, it could be an engagement, marriage, or having kids.

My former friend's fear of engulfment (intimacy) emerged when we looked at a house together.  She told me she wanted to be with me and that she saw us getting married.  Those thoughts were fine.  But when it came time to look at places and talk to a Realtor, that was way too much.

Her fear of engulfment with her boyfriend kicked in a bit before she moved in with him (she started idealizing me that day), but she also had nowhere else to live, so she went into survival mode.  Food, water, shelter: all basic needs.  They were living with his cousin and her kid, and she wasn't helping pay rent, so it wasn't like she was really living there, in her mind.  Plus, some of her stuff was still at her apartment, and that was still technically her address.  His work schedule also meant he wasn't around much.

She once said to me that she needed to figure out what a future with me meant vs. a future with him.  I meant love, stability, responsibility, a career, maybe a kid or two, a dog, a cat, and a home in the suburbs.  He meant love, stability, partying, a job, and renting an apartment.  So, she picked him.  I'm not saying I'm a better or worse match.  I triggered engulfment fears and he didn't.

Im confused :-/ I thought red flags can be seen from very early on? Or is that the BPD becomes full blown with all the symptoms - push/pull, blacmail, verbal emotional abuse, gaslighting, cheating, manipulation come in only after a trigger and then they never go back to who they were?

[valet]

Why do the behaviours emerge at different times? I feel quite bad in a way. When we broke up after 7 months (I found out he had been on a dating site while i was on and saw a conversation between him and a female telling her he doesnt like thinking about her with anyone else and finds her really attractive). He begged me back and I took him back. Since then he wasnt the same. He actually used a dating site and meeting his ex as threats/manipulation to get me to do or not do something. For months I would end up telling him it over nearly every week, I feel like I made him so much worse by telling him it was over and just going back all of the time. Though I see that I tried putting boundaries in place since that incident and didnt make as much effort to be meeting his needs especially as he didnt respect my boundaries and meet my needs.

I havent fully accepted he is mentally ill because he doesnt have a diagnosis and he has never been admitted to hospital as far as i Know. Which puts doubt in my mind.

Either way, his behaviors are unpredictable and hurtful, and that's never good.

As Mutt wrote, intimacy is a trigger.  For some people, spending too much time together could trigger it.  For others, moving in together could trigger it.  For other, it could be an engagement, marriage, or having kids.

My former friend's fear of engulfment (intimacy) emerged when we looked at a house together.  She told me she wanted to be with me and that she saw us getting married.  Those thoughts were fine.  But when it came time to look at places and talk to a Realtor, that was way too much.

Her fear of engulfment with her boyfriend kicked in a bit before she moved in with him (she started idealizing me that day), but she also had nowhere else to live, so she went into survival mode.  Food, water, shelter: all basic needs.  They were living with his cousin and her kid, and she wasn't helping pay rent, so it wasn't like she was really living there, in her mind.  Plus, some of her stuff was still at her apartment, and that was still technically her address.  His work schedule also meant he wasn't around much.

She once said to me that she needed to figure out what a future with me meant vs. a future with him.  I meant love, stability, responsibility, a career, maybe a kid or two, a dog, a cat, and a home in the suburbs.  He meant love, stability, partying, a job, and renting an apartment.  So, she picked him.  I'm not saying I'm a better or worse match.  I triggered engulfment fears and he didn't.

Im confused :-/ I thought red flags can be seen from very early on? Or is that the BPD becomes full blown with all the symptoms - push/pull, blacmail, verbal emotional abuse, gaslighting, cheating, manipulation come in only after a trigger and then they never go back to who they were?

The red flags are often not those major acting out behaviors. This is not to say that those major ones aren't included. They are.

There are subtler things. It might be as simple as something seeming 'off' about a person. I believe that we can sense the idealization to a degree, and we know when someone is mirroring us just a little too much.

Noticing these smaller traits helps us to steer ourselves away from relatioships people that might display the bigger ones.

[SummerStorm]

Klacey3,

are basically cracks in the armor.  A pwBPD isn't going to come right out and start raging at a potential partner five minutes into the first date.  To secure an attachment, pwBPD first mirror and idealize their partner.  However, they quickly feel like they are being consumed by their partner and that they aren't their own person.  :)epending on the situation, this alone could trigger engulfment fears.

A core symptom of BPD is fear of abandonment.  A statement that could be considered a   related to this fear is, "Everyone always leaves me." We try to alleviate this fear by saying, "I will never leave you."

To me, a   is more a feeling that something isn't right or doesn't sound right, rather than a symptom of BPD shining through.  Sometimes, it might be minor (Texting "I miss you" when you've been apart for less than an hour), a bit uncomfortable (professing love and/or having sex on the first or second date), or major (a history of cutting, wanting to move in after a few weeks, tales about abusive exes).

And we always have to remember that we also play a role.  Mine got angry when I enforced boundaries because it went against her "I do what I want and I get what I want" attitude.  Her boyfriend doesn't enforce boundaries.  I triggered engulfment fears because I wrote long, romantic e-mails, took her to look at a house with me, and sent her a list of job openings.  This went against her "I refuse to adult" attitude.

[klacey3]

Klacey3,

are basically cracks in the armor.  A pwBPD isn't going to come right out and start raging at a potential partner five minutes into the first date.  To secure an attachment, pwBPD first mirror and idealize their partner.  However, they quickly feel like they are being consumed by their partner and that they aren't their own person.  :)epending on the situation, this alone could trigger engulfment fears.

A core symptom of BPD is fear of abandonment.  A statement that could be considered a   related to this fear is, "Everyone always leaves me." We try to alleviate this fear by saying, "I will never leave you."

To me, a   is more a feeling that something isn't right or doesn't sound right, rather than a symptom of BPD shining through.  Sometimes, it might be minor (Texting "I miss you" when you've been apart for less than an hour), a bit uncomfortable (professing love and/or having sex on the first or second date), or major (a history of cutting, wanting to move in after a few weeks, tales about abusive exes).

And we always have to remember that we also play a role.  Mine got angry when I enforced boundaries because it went against her "I do what I want and I get what I want" attitude.  Her boyfriend doesn't enforce boundaries.  I triggered engulfment fears because I wrote long, romantic e-mails, took her to look at a house with me, and sent her a list of job openings.  This went against her "I refuse to adult" attitude.

If they dont rage infront of new people and idealise to secure attachment does that mean they are concious and aware of what they are doing and can control their actions?

My ex idealised me for first 8 months then when I tried to put in boundaries and get my needs met he started manipulating, verbal abuse and gaslighting. 'Splitting me black' now he keeps on swapping and changing between idealising me and hating me (within the same day) and that went on for months. Is this typical pd behaviour? How come BPD behaviour only comes out at a certain time to certain people? Does his disordered thinking create chaos in other areas of their lives?

[klacey3]

Klacey3,

are basically cracks in the armor.  A pwBPD isn't going to come right out and start raging at a potential partner five minutes into the first date.  To secure an attachment, pwBPD first mirror and idealize their partner.  However, they quickly feel like they are being consumed by their partner and that they aren't their own person.  :)epending on the situation, this alone could trigger engulfment fears.

A core symptom of BPD is fear of abandonment.  A statement that could be considered a   related to this fear is, "Everyone always leaves me." We try to alleviate this fear by saying, "I will never leave you."

To me, a   is more a feeling that something isn't right or doesn't sound right, rather than a symptom of BPD shining through.  Sometimes, it might be minor (Texting "I miss you" when you've been apart for less than an hour), a bit uncomfortable (professing love and/or having sex on the first or second date), or major (a history of cutting, wanting to move in after a few weeks, tales about abusive exes).

And we always have to remember that we also play a role.  Mine got angry when I enforced boundaries because it went against her "I do what I want and I get what I want" attitude.  Her boyfriend doesn't enforce boundaries.  I triggered engulfment fears because I wrote long, romantic e-mails, took her to look at a house with me, and sent her a list of job openings.  This went against her "I refuse to adult" attitude.

If they dont rage infront of new people and idealise to secure attachment does that mean they are concious and aware of what they are doing and can control their actions?

My ex idealised me for first 8 months then when I tried to put in boundaries and get my needs met he started manipulating, verbal abuse and gaslighting. 'Splitting me black' now he keeps on swapping and changing between idealising me and hating me (within the same day) and that went on for months. Is this typical pd behaviour? How come BPD behaviour only comes out at a certain time to certain people? Does his disordered thinking create chaos in other areas of their lives? Why did his disordered irrational thinking not show for the first 8 months?