Took the big metal kitchen stool and hurled it across the room

[tristesse]

So my saga continues.

My DD who had been doing so well after our move, she had been med free, doing yoga and meditation, quit smoking , and was just doing really well, has gone so far backwards it is almost laughable. She started back on the meds, paxil, Adderall and klonopin, and is her old out of control raging, temper tantrum throwing self. I don't care what anybody has to say, I am blaming the meds, they are turning into an evil, hateful vengeful person, with no self control.

Last evening she exploded at me the moment I walked in the door from work, and she continued for 5 straight hours. She ynked the burner knobs from the stove and threw them at me, she took the big metal kitchen stool and hurled it across the room, she yanked my tablet and phone from my hand and threw them, kept unplugging and unhooking the cable from the television, and used a string of obscene derogatory language that would cause most people to blush in embarrassment. Her son got so riled up after about three hours, he began to act out, he started to throw things and yell hateful things, as well as try and hurt the dogs. It was very unpleasant.

Here is what it was all about. She said to me, " so Dad is going hunting with brother, (my  :)S ) on Saturday, his weekend off?" and I said yes. She said , so it's alright for him to make plans to do something on his weekend off, but not you? And I answered, I could if I wanted to, but I choose not to. This was the end of the world for her, I choose not to make plans involving her on her dads weekend off, but I will have lunch with her sister or her dad will hunt with her brother, and nobody plans anything with her on those weekends. I am just overwhelmingly disgusted by this tirade, my husband works a swing shift and is only home very other weekend, my DD lives in our house, she does not work or go to school, but gets mad when we plan things without her. I told her that we see her more than we see each other, she sees each parent every single day, and we don't see each other because of our work schedules, her brother and sister live in a different city, both work, one on second shift the other on night shift, and never see their dad unless it is his weekend off, nothing we can do about that. She screamed and yelled and jumped up down, cried and threw things, and quite frankly acted like spoiled jealous little brat that needed a time out. I have no idea what to do with her because she is as unreasonable as they get.

I am blaming the meds, because she had not one rage during her detox from the meds, there were no temper tantrums. She had upsets, and normal issues, she would get angry about stuff, like the rest of do sometimes, but there were no absolute out of control, wild eyed raging fits. I have no idea how, but I am going to try and make her see what I am seeing, and hopefully she will talk to her Dr. about it.

FYI, I am perfectly fine. I handled it all quite calmly. My issue is with the meds at the moment.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[mggt]

Wow so sorry to hear this sounds like you handled it well I know when my d explodes I sometimes do not handle it well .  Maybe it is the meds you would know best since she lives with you I hate hearing how it effects your gs my d also explodes around her daughter and that drives me insane because our gd is now taking on alot of her anger and yelling , for me that is the biggest issue I deal with the way she acts around her daughter .  Keep up the good work and patients patients patients   

[lbjnltx]

Sorry this has happened Tristesse!  When our improved kids take a giant leap backwards it can be so very disappointing for us and cause us to worry big time. :'(

Some medications do cause anger issues, zombie state, depression, weight gain, on and on the side affects go... .does your d go for regular follow up sessions with her pdoc?  I think it is a good idea to tell the Pdoc about the out of control behaviors she is having.  Will you be allowed to go with her to see the pdoc?

lbj

[tristesse]

Yes, she sees her pdoc on a regular basis, and she will not allow me to come. She also doesn't think the meds are a problem or that her behavior is out of control. She is still behaving like a lunatic today, and I'm so tired... .my body aches from the stress of it all.

[femom]

I wonder if the Paxil is maybe contributing to your DD's behavior.  I truly believe that many of our children with BPD also have undiagnosed atypical bipolar disorder. My D's psychiatrist explained that antidepressants can have a negative effect on someone with these diagnoses. She has been on mood stabilizers for over a year and she has made significant improvements.  It might be worth looking in to.

[lbjnltx]

If there is any way to get the information to her pdoc that would be in her favor.  Patients under medication often do not "see" the affects on themselves or how the meds may be affecting their behaviors.  Maybe an email or letter sent in confidence.  The pdoc can receive the info without replying to you.

[DisneyMom]

My DD raged so bad on Adderall it sent her to the hospital FROM RTC a couple of years ago. The first thing the psychiatrist said is "I want her off adderall immediately" He said it certainly can cause this kind of rage for those with mood disorder. A few days of detox from Addrerrall as well as an added a mood stabilizer, and she was so much better. It's hard because she has such severe ADHD, and adderral is a like a miracle drug for a few months, grades go up and she actually reads. But then the side effects kick in, and they create so many more severe problems, we learned the hard way that she just can't take stimulants.

[jellibeans]

Dear tristesse

I just wanted to say how sorry I am that you are still going through these conflicts with your daughter. Can you tell me why she started meds again? I am not sure I understand right but it sounds like she was doing good until she was put on these meds. My dd is really sensitive to med changes and we have had experience with adderall too. Sadly I don't think there is a magic drug out there to fix our kids. I think it really important to a close watch on meds. Take care

[tristesse]

Hi Jellibeans

you understand perfectly, she was doing super without the meds, There was no raging or dysregulation , but she said she was unable to function or form a clear thought, it was effort to get out of bed everyday etc. so she asked her pdoc to put her back on the meds, she actually requested the paxil and the Adderall, and they recently added the klonopin, I have no idea why.

I am going to try sending a confidential letter to her psych. we'll just have to wait and see I guess.

[marie1057]

I am thinking maybe it's the paxil too. My son threw a chair through a double pane window on paxil. He is verbally abusive off meds and violent on meds.  I hope things calm down for you. I know how difficult it can be.

[Honey B]

I agree with the people saying contact her doctor. They cannot speak to you but they can listen to what you say.

Its very difficult with an adult and I have learned to stand back and only intervene if absolutely necessary but when medication is involved people lose insight and I think it is a circumstance where I would intervene for her benefit. 

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[lbjnltx]

I agree with the people saying contact her doctor. They cannot speak to you but they can listen to what you say.

Its very difficult with an adult and I have learned to stand back and only intervene if absolutely necessary but when medication is involved people lose insight and I think it is a circumstance where I would intervene for her benefit. 

[livednlearned]

I'm so sorry, tristesse. How stressful to be the target of these rages -- 5 hours is a long time, and having it continue for days is exhausting for both of you.

My son's father is comorbid bipolar/BPD and seems to also be very sensitive to medications, especially in combination. Chantix made him suicidal, adderall made him aggressively enraged, and ambien (in combination with other meds) made him psychotic.

My son's psychiatrist talks often about how little we know about drug interactions with genetics. I agree with others to talk to your D's pdoc, and maybe ask other doctors too, until you feel your questions are answered. Some pdocs are more cautious about drug interactions with genetic tendencies, and others will listen carefully to family members. I learned, too, that within their professional community, some pdocs have reputations for being very reckless with drug combinations, while others are much more circumspect and careful.

[tristesse]

Thank you everybody for the concern and responses. I am quite alright, I usually handle things pretty well because I have learned to not let her have that control over me any longer. I have learned to not be her puppet and to not react to her angry outbursts.

While I always appreciate the concern for my well being, I am not seeking empathy, sympathy or attention, I am seeking answers or ways in which to help my DD. We all know how hard it is to handle a rage, especially a violent one, but do we understand what our child is going through? My sympathy is for my DD, she suffers on a daily basis, her mind is never quiet, and she is terribly insecure about everything. I can't imagine feeling unloved, scared, desperate, nervous, angry and a host of other emotions all at the same time almost non-stop everyday.

Learning to live a normal life is a challenge for most BPD's but add all of the other issues that accompany her DD, and I don't know how she ever gets through a day.

So please continue to give advice, and share your own experiences with me, know that I appreciate the compassion you all have, but I am just fine.

[tristesse]

It has only been a week and she is raging up a storm again, this time she pushed me, hit me in my face and the side of my head, she is way out of control, and I know it is the paxil, I am also convinced that she is bi-polar with BPD traits and that is why the paxil has this affect on her. Paxil is a drug designed for regular depression, a bi-polar has a different chemical make -up and paxil tends to manic affects on them, they either become excessively gleefully happy, or violently and aggressively angry. I was able to record snippets from the latest rage, and in playing it back it is evident that she is way out there in left field somewhere. I am working on finding a way to get it to her psych doc. She needs help and these pills are making her worse. Please pray for my family if you are the praying kind, because we need it before somebody gets hurt.

[Honey B]

I hope you can manage to contact her doctor very soon. It doesn't sound very safe for anyone and if its the effect of meds no amount of reasoning and support will help.

[livednlearned]

Please pray for my family if you are the praying kind, because we need it before somebody gets hurt.

Sending prayers your way, tristesse.

My son's father experienced dysphoria, which the psychiatrist treating him at the time (for ADHD) said is the angry, irritable version of mania.

I also think some of these bad medication combos can trigger psychosis.

[tristesse]

She is still raging... i came in from work and it was an immediate assault, she was very aggressive, pushing, screaming obscenities, swing at me, I'm sorry to say that I fought back, I hit her back and I don't feel bad. I tried suggesting to her again that it could be the paxil, and again she said the problem was me and not the meds, she said she was going to treat me exactly how I make her feel, and I make her feel hated, so she is going to treat me hatefully... .trying to stay strong but failing.

[Kwamina]

Hi tristesse

This is a very difficult situation you are in. I am sorry that your daughter is still raging. Fighting with your own daughter is not something many of us would like to do, yet to protect yourself you sometimes might need to do things you normally wouldn't.

How are things now? Most importantly, do you feel physically safe around your daughter?

We have information here about putting together a crisis safety plan that I suggest you look at:

Putting together a crisis safety plan when a family member has Borderline Personality Disorder

Based on how your daughter has been behaving the past few weeks, it unfortunately seem likely that she will exhibit more problematic behavior. I hope the material about crisis safety planning can help you be better prepared for when your daughter behaves this way. Do you feel like there are certain steps that you could incorporate in your personal crisis safety plan, things that can help protect you and manage these difficult crisis situations?

[tristesse]

Hi Kwamina

I don't know if I feel safe or not. I feel devastated and confused. Things had been going very well, and I had been doing great in my resolve to not react. I am angry that she became so physical and violent, and I am hurt. My grandson was hitting and biting as well, being mean and hateful, and that broke my heart. My DD was telling him, good for you, hit her again, she deserves it, and all I could do was ward off the blows, he is only a little boy.

As for my DD, she hurt my feelings and I am sad. I know she is sick and that her illness has her in it's grip right now, but I am human and can only take so much.

[mggt]

Dear triss, so sorry to hear this especially with your gs acting that way .  I wil continue to send you prayers and strength to deal with this it just too much   

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[tristesse]

Hi mggt.

Thank you for your concern and the prayers, both are appreciated.

she seems to have calmed again, at least for now anyway, I guess I will find out when she is up about for the day.

It is sad about my GS because he is just a child and a very confused child. He watches the raging and gets scared, and has no idea how to behave himself, plus he has aspergers, so we need to handle him carefully in these situations.

Thank you again I really do appreciate it.

[Kwamina]

Hi Kwamina

I don't know if I feel safe or not. I feel devastated and confused. Things had been going very well, and I had been doing great in my resolve to not react. I am angry that she became so physical and violent, and I am hurt. My grandson was hitting and biting as well, being mean and hateful, and that broke my heart. My DD was telling him, good for you, hit her again, she deserves it, and all I could do was ward off the blows, he is only a little boy.

As for my DD, she hurt my feelings and I am sad. I know she is sick and that her illness has her in it's grip right now, but I am human and can only take so much.

Based on all you've shared here I can understand that you are having a hard time with all of this. I've been following your story for quite a while and I know how happy you were about the improvements you had seen in your daughter's behavior. Now unfortunately her behavior has been deteriorating and is becoming increasingly problematic.

It's very sad that she also involves your grandson in this. I can imagine how scary and confusing this must be for him, yet still for you it isn't easy being attacked by both your daughter and grandson.

You mentioned your husband working a swing shift and that he is only home every other weekend. As a result of your work schedules you don't see him much which I imagine makes it extra tough for you when you are dealing with your daughter. What does your husband say about this whole situation? Does your daughter also rage like this when he is around? If I remember correctly you said in previous posts that through the years your daughter used to primarily target you, is that still the case?

[tristesse]

Kwamina,

to answer your question, yes I am still the primary target, I always have been and  probably always will be. and yes she will rage like that with my husband at home. I have asked him to not say or do anything unless I am in immediate physical danger because his  interference makes the situation far worse. Most of the time he is able to comply with that request, but her increasing disrespect for me infuriates him, and he will only tolerate so much before he steps in.

Today she is calm, yesterday she was calm, so I am hoping she's stays that way for awhile, and perhaps she will let the idea of the meds being the culprit soak in. Time will tell.

as always, thank you for caring, it is appreciated.