If you'd known ahead of time what you're getting into...

[Cat Familiar]

On the good days, I would say a hearty YES! On the bad days, I think I must have been crazy to link myself to him. I'm in it for the long haul, however.

[ColdEthyl]

Same as you, Cat

[Notwendy]

Like all things, there are good parts and not so good parts. I think the Universe chooses what lessons we need to know. If we knew then what we know now, there'd be another one to learn. 

[JohnLove]

If her diagnosis was disclosed to me at the start then maybe that would have been a conscious decision to make. It wasn't.

[Hope26]

Excellent question, and I think my answer would also be the same as Cat's.  When I read accounts here of people who are just in the early dating stages, yet still on the 'staying' board, I do feel like warning them to reconsider.  The whole thing is that many or most of us didn't know 'ahead of time', or prior to marriage.  As John said, the diagnosis may not have been disclosed, or there may not have ever been one, and the behavior certainly may have been masked until things got more permanent with the relationship.

[teapay]

If I knew ahead of time, no chance I would have married and bring kids into this. But like so many others it was camouflaged and emerged later.  Although when I think BPD, I think classic, all 9 traits, relatively low functioning.

[JohnLove]

Mine has all 9 traits as well... .and if they discover a 10th... .she'll have that too.  

[Jaded11]

I voted "maybe", because who knows, really? We're attracted to anyone for reasons which may be beyond our understanding... .

Even before his diagnosis was apparent/ real, there had been some major red flags (such as a full-on paranoid jealousy episode on our 1st holidays together, where he was CONVINCED that I had an interest in our trainer out of nowhere -we were taking an extreme sports course-, or strange behaviours during a home party etc etc). These major red flags I noticed, they scared me, and I chose to ignore and move forward with him. I am a psychologist, so from the beginning perhaps I was a bit more apt to read behind the lines. But since I did ignore the early signs, it probably means that I was (and still am, despite the on/off of him and the whole relationship... ) too attracted and drawn to him NOT to proceed with him... .

[sweetheart]

NO 

[yeeter]

No.

But Im not really the same person now as I was then, so not sure its a very useful question.  Its like asking:  'Would you knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship?"

I guess in that way its useful, anyone that answers yes to it should be a big red flag and ask yourself WHY.  What is it about your own insecurities that you would knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship.

[Notwendy]

What I do know is that, not knowing about myself and how my FOO influenced the way I behaved in a relationship, is that, if not this one, I think I would be having similar issues in any relationship.

If I did know then what I know now, then my decisions would not be about this relationship, but about me. I think I would have pursued all the information I know now.

What I do wish, if I had a wish, was that I understood how things were from the pwBPD's point of view. Then I would not have taken much of it personally.

However, we only know what we know at the time and we are all learning. 

[Suspicious1]

My first response is "I wouldn't have missed it for the world". Those ultra-high highs? That feeling of being so damn alive?

What I wouldn't have done is to go back after the first discard. The first bit was brilliant, but if I'd known what I know now, I wouldn't have engaged in any recycles. I'd have taken the good stuff, and left with myself intact. But then that wiser version of me wouldn't have thought I could get all the good stuff back if I just somehow found the right formula.

[HopefulDad]

Where's the "Aww, hell naw!" option?

[Jaded11]

I guess in that way its useful, anyone that answers yes to it should be a big red flag and ask yourself WHY.  What is it about your own insecurities that you would knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship.

Yeeter, here I may disagree a bit, in the sense that we for ALL of us, regardless of BPD, nons, other disorders, you name it- the biggest arena of learning ourselves IS through relationships. When getting closer with someone, we get to deeply feel our fears and insecurities, learn what makes us tick and what not, etc. So in the same way, I suppose all of us here are receiving things from our dysfunctional relationships. Learning lessons, and receiving "gifts". Otherwise we wouldn't stick around, would we?

[waverider]

No.

But Im not really the same person now as I was then, so not sure its a very useful question.  Its like asking:  'Would you knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship?"

I guess in that way its useful, anyone that answers yes to it should be a big red flag and ask yourself WHY.  What is it about your own insecurities that you would knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship.

Ditto, I am fitter for climbing the BPD mountain, but if I knew how big that mountain was going to be I would never have started. Only those who have a thing about climbing mountains (rescuers), would even volunteer for it.

So I could say I am glad I did, but wouldn't choose to do so.

[yeeter]

I guess in that way its useful, anyone that answers yes to it should be a big red flag and ask yourself WHY.  What is it about your own insecurities that you would knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship.

Yeeter, here I may disagree a bit, in the sense that we for ALL of us, regardless of BPD, nons, other disorders, you name it- the biggest arena of learning ourselves IS through relationships. When getting closer with someone, we get to deeply feel our fears and insecurities, learn what makes us tick and what not, etc. So in the same way, I suppose all of us here are receiving things from our dysfunctional relationships. Learning lessons, and receiving "gifts". Otherwise we wouldn't stick around, would we?

We probably arent that far apart in the thinking, so dont worry about disagreement.  Its good to talk these things through.

Indeed we learn about ourselves through living, and interacting with others. But, (just my opinion), some of these learnings are more valuable than others.  Its pretty well documented here, that we start, or stay in these relationships because of our own shortcomings/insecurities/dependencies.  So did we need the lesson?  Yes, I guess so.  But, would I ever start down that path again?  No.  Because now I know more about the pain and suffering it entails, and the lost time/effort. This is what I mean by me being a different person.  I dont have the same codependencies/dysfunction that I did then.  I am stronger in this way.

Instead I would choose to grow close and bond with someone with more capacity to do so in a constructive/healthy way.

I think its what Wave is saying (hi Wave!   ).  Not a mountain he would choose to climb again.  But a life lesson/learning that we have benefited from.

(life is a series of lessons.  If you dont learn that particular lesson the first time, dont worry, you will get that lesson again... .)

[toddinrochester]

No.

[CrazyChuck]

It is kind of like a drug. The first six months I thought I found the most perfect woman in the world. I was happier than I had been in a long time. I couldn't wait to marry her. And then it started to change. And then I thought something was wrong with me. For the first time I went to a T to find out what was wrong with me. If I could just get back to the life I had during the first six months. If I could laugh again without fear of being called an a**hole. Just thinking about the first six months makes me happy.

[ColdEthyl]

No.

But Im not really the same person now as I was then, so not sure its a very useful question.  Its like asking:  'Would you knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship?"

I guess in that way its useful, anyone that answers yes to it should be a big red flag and ask yourself WHY.  What is it about your own insecurities that you would knowingly enter into a dysfunctional relationship.

Ditto, I am fitter for climbing the BPD mountain, but if I knew how big that mountain was going to be I would never have started. Only those who have a thing about climbing mountains (rescuers), would even volunteer for it.

So I could say I am glad I did, but wouldn't choose to do so.

Yeeeeep... .mountain climber right here.

[starfish4455]

I was actually asked this by my partner wBPD a few weeks ago. I suspect they knew things weren't going well, or that it was one of those doubt-inciting questions that are intended to elicit guilt from me.

I can't remember my answer, I think I dodged it. Maybe I said yes to get past it?

Like someone else said, there is no way to make this choice. There was a lot of life that happened that was still important. You can't turn back time or move backward. So I can see why some folks find this question not productive.

That said, I'm struck by how many definitive no's there are, and I myself voted no in the poll. I feel like this is one more indicator to find peace.

[waverider]

In a way i am living lif ea little harder now almost as if to make for what felt like lost years. The times when things were put off, cancelled due to dramas both real and imagine. I was stuck in 'gonna' mode, everything always seemed to be on hold. can't get those years back

[yeeter]

In a way i am living lif ea little harder now almost as if to make for what felt like lost years. The times when things were put off, cancelled due to dramas both real and imagine. I was stuck in 'gonna' mode, everything always seemed to be on hold. can't get those years back

Yes, similar for me.  I am more determined to live a satisfying life. To enjoy each and every minute with my children.  To make time for my own health, friends, and hobbies

Much less time for relationship drama (that is what detachment has done, I quit owning or feeling responsible for her issues). 

And I quit throwing things into that black hole.  The best analogy here.

The sacrifice has been, in giving up the notion of a healthy relationship. So in many ways it's like being single (in that my partner cannot be counted on for support). It took some time for me to accept this as the reality of the situation, and even own the upfront choices I made that got me here (I chose to climb the mountain).  Live and learn, and some life choices are harder to recover from than others

[KateCat]

No, and I am genuinely surprised at how many of my age-cohorts are somehow finding the courage to leave marriages/relationships that are almost four decades in duration. (Kudos especially to the guys. I can't imagine the degree of difficulty they are facing.)

Is it on this thread--maybe elsewhere--that waverider compares navigating these most difficult relationships as being more like climbing a mountain range than climbing a mountain?

Sometimes there is life left in us even after we've climbed the entire range.  

[ColdEthyl]

I'm surprised at how many "No" answers there are. A little saddened by that  

[waverider]

I'm surprised at how many "No" answers there are. A little saddened by that  

The sad thing is many of those no answers would have previously been yes. It is only after you really become centered that you have the clarity to admit it, and realize that a yes was more dutiful and wishful thinking.

Even those who have reached a place they could call success they would not have chosen to have wasted potentially a large slab of their life getting there. It is not just the difficulty it is the years you can't get back. Sometimes it not until things get better that you can realize just how much you missed out on. Resentment has a potential to creep back in.

For many They are left with memories of protecting their kids, and often guilt over failing, rather than happy memories of family times. Even if times are good now, how could you choose to do that again?

Abuse leaves a legacy than can't just be swept under the carpet.

[formflier]

 

I'm a yes vote... .zero doubts.

If there was no r/s with my pwBPD... .no children.  It's all wrapped up together.  I can't pull it apart.

Plus for me the BPD things was in simmer until around year 15 of a 20 year marriage.  I had a long good period.

I'm also firmly in Notwendy's camp that you get the spouse you need.  I come at it from a Christian point of view that says God put your spouse in your life to complete you (paraphrasing here).

Considering starting a new thread around what Waverider was talking about... .the putting things on hold... .all those fish that didn't get caught. 

FF

[Samuel S.]

If I could see into the future from the past, I emphatically would not be here whatsoever! My BPDw admitted to me way back, when that she had been pretending all of her life in order to please everyone and very little for herself. This was way before she met me. Then, she met me. She continued being really nice. Then, her "medium-counselor" said that she needs to be pleasing herself much more so. Well, just like a little kid who puts her hand into the cookie jar for the first time, she just kept on taking and taking, to the extent that she has gone to the other extreme, which she freely admits, and she said nobody is going to stop her from doing so. While I respect her need to further her mind and to work, we are married. While she does cook meals, otherwise, her life is soley for working and school. Even about a year ago, when it was our anniversary, we talked about going out to dinner to celebrate. She vacilated back and forth. I even suggested so that she could continue her studies, that I would go out and get the dinner in order to bring it to our house. Then, we could eat here. She said no, and she said that she wanted to go out to dinner "to get it over with". Needless to say, such disregard for our marriage and not having quality time together and her verbal abuse have torn me down emotionally. So, I definitely would have told myself, if I could go back to the past, to run away.

[init]

Like many here it's a no... .at the time it started it seemed perfect to me.

Some 20 yrs later the mask is flapping wide open... .she Still tries to so nice to visitors and her friends... .we in the family are acutely aware of the reality.

[Cat Familiar]

I voted "maybe" with certain conditions. If I had met him when in college, my answer would have been a "no." At that age, there are more options than later in life.

It's all hypothetical anyway but I posed the question in order to get people thinking about their level of satisfaction in their relationship.

With my first BPD husband, I can unequivocally say "Hell No!" I did learn a lot through that relationship and had some incredible experiences, but all in all, it was torturous.

In this relationship, I haven't lost myself the way I did in my first marriage. Much like Formflier's experience, the onset of the BPD symptoms came years afterwards and I had a few idyllic years at the beginning of the marriage. This husband, despite his issues, is a genuinely nice human being, unlike my first husband whose narcissism compounded the BPD damage.

[ColdEthyl]

Waverider said:

Even those who have reached a place they could call success they would not have chosen to have wasted potentially a large slab of their life getting there. It is not just the difficulty it is the years you can't get back. Sometimes it not until things get better that you can realize just how much you missed out on. Resentment has a potential to creep back in.

Perhaps that's one of the reasons I am a yes. I found out about BPD, researched it, and started using the tools only about 2 years into our relationship. Until that point, a few things seeped here and there but that's about it. I'm sure the other reason is being a caregiver, and this is like a 'no mountain too high to climb' sort of scenario.

He's self-aware, he's trying and gets better all of the time. We definitely have a lot more good days than bad ones. We talk to each other, we listen and we work on ourselves. I'd say in any marriage that's a success.


FF said:

I'm also firmly in Notwendy's camp that you get the spouse you need.

I can see that. I almost need the challenge to stay interested.

Cat said:

This husband, despite his issues, is a genuinely nice human being

With my ex-husband, I always saw the potential... .not what was. I wasted 14 years with someone who had no interest in becoming a better person. He said he did... we would separate... he'd do some things... .we try again and within 2 months it was back to the same crap. With this marriage, I not only do I love him, I like him. I like who he is. We have a lot in common and we enjoy our life together just about every day.