Despatching my old flame...

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Dear All,

At the beginning of September, I posted that I'd bumped into an old flame:

My emotions are shot. Just as I am managing to move on from my BPDxbf, I bumped into an old flame. It wasn't a healthy relationship by any stretch of the imagination, but I am feeling quite vulnerable recently. I spent an hour on the phone last night telling him why I don't want us to become emotionally involved again to protestations that it's different circumstances now and I'm just not giving it a chance and am thus avoiding intimacy again in what he sees to be my usual push-pull way.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=282777.msg12670298#msg12670298

It's a long story, but I did meet him for coffee during a particularly vulnerable phase:

Ten days ago, I met my old flame for coffee during a period of neediness. I enjoyed his company. I felt comfortable and content as normal whilst we were in the pub. But, uncomfortable with him once we left the pub. The following day, I got really anxious, remembering why I'd said I wouldn't get back with him and spoke to him on the phone and told him I'd been too unhappy first time around to think we could continue a relationship now. We ended up arguing. I sent him an email saying it was over.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=282997.msg12672622#msg12672622

I haven't seen him since, though we have talked on the telephone in the last couple of weeks. What I really need to do is keep away from this man because he is going to cause me nothing but heartache. He can be loving and that's where the temptation lies, but I want a loving relationship with someone who finds me sexually attractive and sees a romantic future for us and who wants marriage and to be a step-parent and is willing to take on a child who may have asperger syndrome. If I reconnect with my old flame, I am blocking all those possibilities.

I need to muster up all the strength I can find. My resolve is flagging. I would appreciate any encouragement you can give me.

Thanks

Lifewriter x

[Lifewriter16]

Dear All,

At the beginning of September, I posted that I'd bumped into an old flame:

My emotions are shot. Just as I am managing to move on from my BPDxbf, I bumped into an old flame. It wasn't a healthy relationship by any stretch of the imagination, but I am feeling quite vulnerable recently. I spent an hour on the phone last night telling him why I don't want us to become emotionally involved again to protestations that it's different circumstances now and I'm just not giving it a chance and am thus avoiding intimacy again in what he sees to be my usual push-pull way.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=282777.msg12670298#msg12670298

It's a long story, but I did meet him for coffee during a particularly vulnerable phase:

Ten days ago, I met my old flame for coffee during a period of neediness. I enjoyed his company. I felt comfortable and content as normal whilst we were in the pub. But, uncomfortable with him once we left the pub. The following day, I got really anxious, remembering why I'd said I wouldn't get back with him and spoke to him on the phone and told him I'd been too unhappy first time around to think we could continue a relationship now. We ended up arguing. I sent him an email saying it was over.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=282997.msg12672622#msg12672622

I haven't seen him since, though we have talked on the telephone in the last couple of weeks. What I really need to do is keep away from this man because he is going to cause me nothing but heartache. He can be loving and that's where the temptation lies, but I want a loving relationship with someone who finds me sexually attractive and sees a romantic future for us and who wants marriage and to be a step-parent and is willing to take on a child who may have asperger syndrome. If I reconnect with my old flame, I am blocking all those possibilities.

I need to muster up all the strength I can find. My resolve is flagging. I would appreciate any encouragement you can give me.

Thanks

Lifewriter x

[myself]

Do what you know and feel is best for yourself.

Is that going backward, or moving forward?

If you're really letting go, keep focusing on that.

[Mutt]

I haven't seen him since, though we have talked on the telephone in the last couple of weeks. What I really need to do is keep away from this man because he is going to cause me nothing but heartache. He can be loving and that's where the temptation lies, but I want a loving relationship with someone who finds me sexually attractive and sees a romantic future for us and who wants marriage and to be a step-parent and is willing to take on a child who may have asperger syndrome. If I reconnect with my old flame, I am blocking all those possibilities.

Hi Lifewriter16,

What was your conversation in the pub? Why was he upset in the phone call?

Do you trust him? Does he give you a shoulder to lean on? It sounds like you don't want a romantic relationship, do you think that he could be a friend that you can talk to?

[Lifewriter16]

Myself - What is best for me? Surely someone who wants to be with me because he finds me sexually and emotionally attractive, so I should move on. However, I am constantly reminded of that sense of connection I felt with this man. That draws me back. It happened unexpectedly in a pub. It was like I 'knew' who he really was, and for the first time in my entire life, my sense of separateness/loneliness dissipated. However, in the real world, he's elusive and unavailable. I wish I'd never felt that sense of connection. I wish I could axe it from my memory, because it instills doubt in me when in so many other ways, he's unsuitable.


Mutt - The conversation in the pub was rather sparse, as it always is. We tend to just enjoy being together. It's an other-worldly connection with affection thrown in.

As far as I can remember, he is frustrated with me that I don't talk about important issues when we are together. He wants us to talk face-to-face. He is fed up of having so many 'processing' issues conversations. He doesn't want to find out what I feel later, he wants to know at the time I feel it. He wants us to take things as they come and he says I make too many assumptions.

I can't decide whether I trust him or not. My family and friends are dead-set against him which gives me doubts. I certainly don't trust him to keep his hands to himself. I daren't be anywhere private with him, even to talk. I don't think much talking would take place. His idea of going with the flow would definitely include the bedroom. I think we need to resolve things first.

The main reason I don't want a romantic relationship with him is because he has always said he doesn't think of me in 'those' terms. He is attracted to my personality and the eye contact, he says, but not to me in a sexual way. I feel humiliated and robbed of my sexual attractiveness. I really don't understand how he can say he doesn't think of me in 'those' terms and be so pushy about getting 'snuggles' (affection in bed which generally means sex, which he considers to be a happy extra). He has really confused me.

He's been a friend in the past. I've talked to him about a couple of things that my BPDxbf did that seriously concerned me (but that didn't stop my old flame from putting his hand down my jeans uninvited). I can't see him being a proper friend until he has another sexual outlet because he can't stop touching me. Until then, all he seems capable of thinking of is physical satisfaction. He's also said there's not enough between us to carry off being 'just friends'. I think he's seriously contradicted himself and he's left me really confused. I hate feeling so conflicted. He doesn't seem safe to love yet clearly we do love each other on some level. I am currently avoiding that level like the plague. What I am asking myself is this: Am I right to be avoiding it?

Lifewriter

[cloudten]

I have a "friend" that I am trying to keep in "friend zone" as well. It is hard- and I think sometimes its impossible.  Honestly, I got into trouble with a guy exactly like this who listened to my problems as a friend, then tried to rape me after being very vulnerable and open with him. I am currently being very leary of anyone who wants to be my therapist and wants me to be more open. Being open creates closeness, and right now the only people I should be close with are my family and female best friends. Everyone else is in that "doesn't need to know" zone for now.  When it's the right guy at the right time and I feel safe, then I will open up. But right now I know I am far to vulnerable.

Guys compartmentalize... .so your "problems" regarding your exBPD and your relationship with this guy (sex) are two totally different and separate things. To you- it's not separate... .you had experiences you can't (and shouldn't) forget for your own safety.

It doesn't sound like this guy is respecting you.

Please be very careful!

[Mutt]

Lifewriter16,

I agree with cloudten, he doesn't respect you and I think that you're right with avoiding it. You have good judgement.

It sounds like you don't trust your family and friends judgement because they said they're dead set against it. How are they to talk to when you need somebody to confide in?

When you say vulnerability, what do you mean? Are you worried about not finding another man? I think that you're looking for a reciprocal relationship with someone that you can trust, respects your boundaries, and appreciates you for who you are.

[cloudten]

Agreeing with Mutt, something my T asks me almost every session:

What do you want in a relationship? What are the traits you want in that person?

Start defining what you want in a relationship and don't waiver from those points. (Whether you are ready for a relationship or not- these things are good to know)

My personal list includes predictability (in good ways), dependability, respect, thoughtfulness, honesty, integrity, fidelity, etc.  I even have less "serious" characteristics but ones that are important for me - for example: he must be able to organize fun activities for us (I am not a good activity director and am simply not one to organize events... .so I am looking for someone to fill in the gap for me... .).

Maybe you should spend some time thinking about the qualities of a person that you would want to be in a relationship with. Don't settle for less than what is on your list.

[OnceConfused]

May I post the 2 wonderful quotes from the 13th century Persian Poet, RUMI

Lovers don't finally meet somewhere. They're in each other all along.

Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.

One day you will find that loving person who is in you all these years. Just be who you are. Those who seem be in conflict with you, they are not the lovers for you.

[Lifewriter16]

Cloudten - Thank you for sharing your experience. It's not easy to talk about these things. Occasionally, my old flame simply gives me the creeps. There's something about the way he touches me that feels creepy rather than intimate. I can't put my finger on it. Yet he can be very loving. The conflict within my emotions is really unnerving me and making this so much more difficult.

I have sat and thought about what I want in a man. I know I want something more than I am being offered... .but I feel trapped and need to find my way out of the contradictions that are keeping my stuck. Surely, if I could walk away from my BPDxbf, I can walk away from this man too. Why am I finding it so hard? Because, he doesn't listen when I tell him it's over, he talks me round in circles until I'm confused and think it's all my fault and all my issues. And he could re-appear any time and I'll have to deal with it. I daren't meet him to tell him it's over (because he doesn't respect my boundaries) though I do think I owe him an explanation. He doesn't listen if I text or email or use the phone. He's like an ominous presence. He freaks me out and draws me in at the same time. I'm in a bad way with this one.

Mutt - My concern with my family and friends, is that their opinion is based upon what I said about him and I think what I said was biased. Having said that, they saw me crying over him, so they've drawn their own conclusions that he's bad for me. As to confiding, I don't feel I can waiver with them since they are so clear about what they think is right, but sometimes that's very helpful.

It's the conflicting images of him that really unsettle me. That he can be so tender on one occasion and so d*mned creepy and inappropriate at another time, so intensely loving and so denigrating at another, confuses me. It messes with my head, with my sense of reality.

When I talk of my recent vulnerability, I'm really meaning that I have been depressed and needy after the breakup with my BPDxbf. I'd thought that relationship was for keeps but I have realised that I contributed a great deal to its downfall. I have a pattern of looking to men to make things better. I'm still in the process of breaking that pattern. When I feel really down, I act out in ways that I can later regret. I'm trying to stop doing that. Having said that, I am worried that I'll not be able to make a relationship work even if I do meet someone new. The more I see my patterns and my push-pull behaviour, my separation anxiety and generally poor state of mind, the more hopeless I can feel. Watching my own patterns leaves me concerned that I'll wreck every relationship I get my hands on. That makes me wonder whether I wrecked the relationship with my old flame, it plants seeds of doubt in my mind which he waters. I have to try really hard to keep a grip on reality and all the factors I need to take into account. Perhaps it's because I just can't accept the grey areas. I need him to be either black or white but he isn't (it's an aspie trait as well as a BPD trait). I need to shake the memory of the good times out of my head somehow, because it's destabilising me.

OnceConfused - Good quotes. There is too much conflict in this particular 'relationship' (if it can be called that).

Lifewriter x

[Mutt]

As to confiding, I don't feel I can waiver with them since they are so clear about what they think is right, but sometimes that's very helpful.

Lifewriter16,

They have they're own perspective and you have you're own. Some people don't realize that we all have different points of views and it doesn't mean that one is right or wrong but that we respect that we all see things differently.

I think that would feel invalidating if somebody thinks that they're opinion is right often?

Maybe find a a best friend that's supportive, listens, isn't biased, validates, guides and respects your perspective.

It's the conflicting images of him that really unsettle me. That he can be so tender on one occasion and so d*mned creepy and inappropriate at another time, so intensely loving and so denigrating at another, confuses me. It messes with my head, with my sense of reality.

I can see how he would be confusing. Is he listening to you about why you have push /pull behavior, does he understand? I think that's being pushy that he wants to know what you feel at the moment, he says that he doesn't want a r/s with you but he's touching you.

I agree with cloudten and compartmentalization and I would like to add I think that he's objectifying you. I think he displays toxic behaviors, and I can see how that would mess with your sense of reality. Your intuition is warning you, my advice is listen to your intuition, you display good jugement, trust yourself.

Having said that, I am worried that I'll not be able to make a relationship work even if I do meet someone new. The more I see my patterns and my push-pull behavior, my separation anxiety and generally poor state of mind, the more hopeless I can feel.

Dont be hard on yourself. A relationship takes two people. cloudten gave you good advice with finding someone with qualities that you want with a partner and don't settle for less. If you find somebody that respects you and is understanding, you can work on your stuff while you're in a new relationship? If you trust that person and they are understanding, talk about push / pull and separation anxiety, you can work with it together.

I can see how black and white thinking or cognitive distortions would cause emotional distress. My advice is write things down if you're thinking in black and white and write the opposite side down,  you can see the logic.

I need to shake the memory of the good times

Write down the bad times. See if that makes you feel better by seeing both.

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Mutt,

It's my birthday in a fortnight. If I was a gambling woman, I'd put money on my ex flame turning up outside my house. He turned up with a present last year, even though we'd been split up for 6 months. I've been avoiding him successfully for the last few days, but I suspect he's only going to let me do that for a while. He's going to re-appear at some time and I'm going to have to deal with it. It feels so hard-hearted to just turn him away, but I don't see what else I can do except pretend that I'm out or simply BE out. I don't trust him enough to let him in the house to talk. He isn't contacting me at the moment, but he has no sense of the passage of time. It doesn't register that he hasn't seen me for months, he always acts as if we only saw each other last week. He just picks up where he thinks we ought to be with no reference to me, hugging and trying to kiss me and hold my hand. I'm going to have to be a callous b*tch or he'll walk all over me or worse. I hate this boundaries thing. Both him and my mother are COMPLETELY OBLIVIOUS to any attempt I make to set boundaries. No matter what I say or how often I say it, they both pay no attention to anything I say to them. It is so frustrating. I try to be nice and not hurt their feelings, but it has no effect. I don't want to be pushed into being someone I'm not just because they are boundary busters, but I see no choice. I just want to be nice and be treated with respect because I'm basically a nice person who wants everyone to get on with everyone else.

I'm going to have to wake up to reality. I think that's sad.

Lifewriter x

[Panda39]

Hi Mutt,

It's my birthday in a fortnight. If I was a gambling woman, I'd put money on my ex flame turning up outside my house. He turned up with a present last year, even though we'd been split up for 6 months. I've been avoiding him successfully for the last few days, but I suspect he's only going to let me do that for a while. He's going to re-appear at some time and I'm going to have to deal with it. It feels so hard-hearted to just turn him away, but I don't see what else I can do except pretend that I'm out or simply BE out. I don't trust him enough to let him in the house to talk. He isn't contacting me at the moment, but he has no sense of the passage of time. It doesn't register that he hasn't seen me for months, he always acts as if we only saw each other last week. He just picks up where he thinks we ought to be with no reference to me, hugging and trying to kiss me and hold my hand. I'm going to have to be a callous b*tch or he'll walk all over me or worse. I hate this boundaries thing. Both him and my mother are COMPLETELY OBLIVIOUS to any attempt I make to set boundaries. No matter what I say or how often I say it, they both pay no attention to anything I say to them. It is so frustrating. I try to be nice and not hurt their feelings, but it has no effect. I don't want to be pushed into being someone I'm not just because they are boundary busters, but I see no choice. I just want to be nice and be treated with respect because I'm basically a nice person who wants everyone to get on with everyone else.

I'm going to have to wake up to reality. I think that's sad.

Lifewriter x

Hi Lifewriter16,

This sounds to me like it is all about boundaries and your uncomfortableness around this man is because you have weak boundaries and he is boundary busting. 

It took me a long time to learn this and my own journey to figure it out but it is okay to sometimes hurt someone else's feelings.  I'm not saying go out there and not consider other people's feelings and be a complete B but sometimes you have to put yourself first.  If someone can't respect that then are they someone you want to be around? Is that person someone that cares about you in a healthy way?

The physical stuff is making you uncomfortable.  How about you tell him that?  That you want to be just friends and the touching and kissing is not comfortable for you. That may hurt his feelings but what about yours? Why are your feelings not just as important as his? 


You probably have seen these before but I thought I'd share these just as a refresher 

https://bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a120.htm

https://bpdfamily.com/content/values-and-boundaries

And as far as your birthday goes... .how about you just not be home.  Go out with friends for the evening and enjoy yourself.

Panda39

[Mutt]

It took me a long time to learn this and my own journey to figure it out but it is okay to sometimes hurt someone else's feelings.  I'm not saying go out there and not consider other people's feelings and be a complete B but sometimes you have to put yourself first.  If someone can't respect that then are they someone you want to be around? Is that person someone that cares about you in a healthy way?

Lifewriter16,

I share similar sentiments with Panda39. You are a nice person that deserves to be treated kindly and with respect,  I would worry that people wouldn't like me if I didn't comply with how they thought and how they felt.

Nothing changes without change. I completely understand how hard it is to make  changes and how uncomfortable it feels like Panda39 said. It takes practice, but you will find it eventually becomes second thought.

I would like to add that I found a wonderful thing happened when I implemented boundaries, I started to make new friends that respect me and treat me nicely.

Your thoughts and feelings are important and just as valid as anybody else's You will find a man that will respect you.

[cloudten]

When I talk of my recent vulnerability, I'm really meaning that I have been depressed and needy after the breakup with my BPDxbf. I'd thought that relationship was for keeps but I have realised that I contributed a great deal to its downfall. I have a pattern of looking to men to make things better. I'm still in the process of breaking that pattern. When I feel really down, I act out in ways that I can later regret. I'm trying to stop doing that. Having said that, I am worried that I'll not be able to make a relationship work even if I do meet someone new. ... .I need to shake the memory of the good times out of my head somehow, because it's destabilising me.

I can relate entirely to this.

First of all... .you couldn't have changed the outcome of the relationship with the BPD. I have come to believe these relationships are pretty much doomed from the beginning. Believing that you could have done something differently for a positive outcome derives from your guilt over the relationship and will absolutely keep you stuck.  You are pretty much powerless over the outcome of the BPD relationship.  The more I have learned that this is true and given into the fact that it couldn't and wouldn't have ended any differently if I had behaved differently or said different things, the easier it has been to heal and begin stabilizing myself again. 

Secondly... .I am right with you when you say that you are down you do things you regret later. I am right there... .honestly.  I do look to men to confide in and help me fix me. But I am trying to do things differently this time. Although I do have some male friends, I realize that I really need to be developing my female friendships much more. I am making an active effort to do so.  I am beginning to see that my BPDx was right about one thing: men always have ulterior motives than friendship. I think part of the "regret later" stuff is that it's post-traumatic stress. It's acting out... .acting out to counter the pain. Acting out to feel alive again.  I don't know how to fix this in myself, honestly... .but I at the moment I am avoiding uncomfortable situations with men. I am avoiding one-on-one situations with men. I have a guy friend who wants to come see my house... .but I have been refusing because I will feel trapped.

It's so hard to change these things within me- because it is how I have always done things. But if I always do what I have always done, I'll always get what I have always gotten. I don't want another abusive relationship. I don't want another guy that cheats on me and lies to me. I would rather be alone that live through all of that again.

Your old flame sounds very creepy.  Go with your gut.  You have been through so much. You have to be living in such a way that is safe and healthy.  He sounds very creepy. Make yourself and the things you truly want for yourself a priority.

[cloudten]

One more thought... .

Your mother and your old flame don't sound that far off from having PD of their own... .frankly. Everything you have said about the old flame sounds like my BPDx... .maybe you haven't gotten far enough along to have him rage in your face.

Are you trying to find a relationship with someone like your mother or father?

Just food for thought- you don't have to answer. But i have really started to think more about my mom and what her issues are (she is crazy... .but I'm not sure about BPD... .but maybe she has NPD).  I am trying to figure out why I choose these relationships... .maybe its because it's all that I know.   

[Lifewriter16]

Cloudten - perhaps the issue is partly that I don't know what I'm dealing with and it would be much easier if my old flame did rage in my face. He once said that he thinks he dissociates and I think he could do. One time, when we were emailing, his reply was so uncharacteristic of him that I thought someone else had replied to me.

Panda & Mutt - I suspect that boundaries are a big issue here. Yet, I think I am clear when I express them. I obviously need help in learning how to formulate and express them effectively or I've just got two boundary busters on my hands and I need to determine how to deal with that.


I think my mother is on the autistic spectrum because she has no sense of what is socially appropriate and she is clearly completely oblivious even to the possibility that I might have issue with her behaviour. She does the same things over and over again in spite of my telling her what the repercussions will be if she does it again. She just doesn't seem to learn and she takes things to ridiculous extremes. It feels like she's making a point. My eldest daughter has slept over at my mum's house lots of times. My youngest daughter has never slept over at her house despite her now being 8 years old. Three years ago, I told my mum that my eldest daughter wasn't allowed to sleep over again UNTIL she'd started having my youngest daughter to sleep over because my youngest was old enough to suspect favouritism. The outcome: neither of them have slept over since. I don't know if she's not understood what I was saying or had willfully misunderstood me to gain control or is trying to punish me or is just a complete idiot. It is like banging my head against a brick wall. I tell her plainly and repeatedly. I don't know how I could be plainer. Quite frankly, I'm sick to death of her and can't wait until she dies.

I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall with my old flame too, but he can read emotions in others, so he's unlikely to be on the spectrum. Indeed, I'd say he's emotionally clever (though not wise). He runs rings around me and finds it funny that I get confused and upset. If anything, I think he's got a dose of narcissism because he has said to me that he only goes for women who are exceptionally attractive because they've got to make him look good because that's how he gets his self-confidence. I'm just a blip in his usual selection process. I got in the back door when I would never have made it through the front door because I'm just not that attractive.


Cloudten - The irony is, that I'm actively looking for something different. I keep thinking I've found someone different and they turn out to be exactly the same or worse. When I met my ex-husband, he used to send me all sorts of cards and he'd make jigsaws and buy gifts - all saying he loved me. I thought I'd met a man who wore his heart on his sleeve. I thought all my birthdays had come at once. Turns out he's more emotionally unexpressive than most. The attention stopped when he moved in and I can't even remember him ever telling me he loves me. I was conned! I'm always getting conned. What's wrong with me that I can't spot a ruse, an act or a con-artist a mile away?

Thanks to you all... .

Love Lifewriter x

[Mutt]

Lifewriter16,

I don't know if she's not understood what I was saying or had willfully misunderstood me to gain control or is trying to punish me or is just a complete idiot.

Do you feel like your mom may feel guilt for playing favoritism and is projecting her feelings? I think that it's sad for your daughters that she won't settle her difference and that way it affects her daughter and grand-daughters because she has hurt feelings.

If anything, I think he's got a dose of narcissism because he has said to me that he only goes for women who are exceptionally attractive because they've got to make him look good because that's how he gets his self-confidence.

It sounds like he's insecure, has low self esteem and it's about his ego. You know that he's going to cause you some heartache, it sounds like you need self protection if he's not respecting your boundaries. Have you thought about NC?

What I really need to do is keep away from this man because he is going to cause me nothing but heartache.

I think that you know your answer and that you may need a little friendly push in the right direction.

[Panda39]

Panda & Mutt - I suspect that boundaries are a big issue here. Yet, I think I am clear when I express them.

It's not just expressing the boundary it is standing firm with that boundary.

For example: You can tell the old flame that his physical contact makes you uncomfortable in a million different ways each more elloquent than the next, but if you let him continue to make his overtures without enforcing that boundary then there is in fact no boundary.

Panda39

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Panda,

This might be obvious, but:

How might I do that (assuming that asking him to leave or walking out is the final enforcement)? What graduated responses could I make so that I'm not overreacting?

Lifewriter x

[cloudten]

Reading an article in a magazine about following your gut instinct at the moment and thought of you... .

#4

"When a man feels too close. As a sex crimes prosecutor, i often heard victims describe how their stomachs knotted or they got chills because they were being followed on the street or stepped into an elevator with someone creepy. I also heard a lot of 'he was too close.' He didn't get boundaries. A gut reaction is very physical - act on it. Get off the stopp where you are about to enter and walk back to the deli on the corner... .women always told me "i didn't want him to think i was impolite." But there's a saying in my field: better rude than raped."

I truly hope you follow your gut. I am scared for you. Be careful.

[Mutt]

Lifewriter16,

That's a good question. We're all family here we're here to support each other.

You've clearly expressed your boundaries and if we look at his past behaviors and actions, he doesn't respect your boundaries. You can ask him to leave, but you have to enforce that boundary if his behavior is not acceptable.

I don't think that taking care of yourself is over-reacting, our boundaries are self-love, boundaries protect us and take care of us.

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Cloudten,

I've just been having a great conversation with Creativum about BPD/NPD. It was just what I needed to hear. Our chaps sound so similar and she says her ex is a rapist!

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=285420.msg12690665#msg12690665

I'm staying away. I've made my mind up.

Thanks ever so for going the difficult journey of decision making with me. Now, I just need to implement and stay strong.

Love Lifewriter xx

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Mutt,

I think my birthday will be the next time he tries to make contact. I just need to decide whether I need to re-iterate that it's over or not. I think it's better to have no contact with him at all since he can't be trusted. I think I need to either go out on my birthday or arrange for my ex-husband to be here with me so I have an excuse to not meet him and for him to not be let in the house.

Given I have trouble with this, do you think the odd lie would go amiss?

Any other suggestions?

Lifewriter x

[Mutt]

Hi Lifewriter16

Boundaries are not meant to be tall fences but sometimes we need to self-protect, boundaries are meant to be soft and malleable and not rigid.

I think you can do either or both, send him a nice goodbye, go no contact or no contact. I wouldn't worry about white lies if you're not planning on talking with him. Be prepared for a little backlash. I think that's a good idea going out with friends or hanging out with your ex-h on your birthday  

[C.Stein]

When I met my ex-husband, he used to send me all sorts of cards and he'd make jigsaws and buy gifts - all saying he loved me. I thought I'd met a man who wore his heart on his sleeve. I thought all my birthdays had come at once. Turns out he's more emotionally unexpressive than most. The attention stopped when he moved in and I can't even remember him ever telling me he loves me. I was conned! I'm always getting conned.

It is to be expected during the "honeymoon" stage of a relationship there be many romantic gestures.  I think it is only natural that these gestures subside over time.  I wouldn't necessarily feel conned by the lack of romantic gestures once the relationship settled down, but I do understand why you would.  Everyone likes that type of attention.  I showered my ex with it as well when we first me and I am fairly certain she feels the same as you did because it did lessen over time.  When the almost daily romantic gestures died down she missed it.  She missed the idealisation/honeymoon stage of the relationship.