Is it possible to have borderline characteristics without having BPD?

[sweet tooth]

I'm new to this and trying to figure everything out as best I can. Is it possible to have some characteristics of the disorder without having BPD? I know it's possible to be narcissistic without having NPD and paranoid without having PPD. Is it similar with borderline?

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[formflier]

 

Yes... .

In fact... many will say focus on the behavior... .don't focus on the diagnosis.

The tools that are taught on here... .are to respond to behaviors.

Let doctors and therapists figure out how to respond to a diagnosis... .or make a diagnosis.

Great question... .

FF

[unicorn2014]

I'm new to this and trying to figure everything out as best I can. Is it possible to have some characteristics of the disorder without having BPD? I know it's possible to be narcissistic without having NPD and paranoid without having PPD. Is it similar with borderline?

Absolutely, you can have traits without having the disorder, you can have a nonspecific personality disorder which may include traits of BPD and traits of npd. It takes about 7 years of therapy to treat a personality disorder regardless of the name of it.

[ColdEthyl]

I have found a lot of my own behaviors are very close to BPD IE I do jump to the worst conclusions, I think everyone around me is secretly judging me, I "knee jerk" reactions sometimes when I feel like I'm being attacked even if it's not the case... .but nowhere near my husband's mood swings, black/white thinking, etc etc

I asked this question when I first got on here... .I'm not sure if we just sort of 'rub off' on each other, or if I am just now really seeing myself for the first time because of dealing with his BPD. I'm not acting any different than I did before I met him... .but now I'm trying to retrain my brain. It's tough.

[maxsterling]

I see it as a spectrum disorder or a situational disorder.  In other words, many of the BPD behaviors we all have to some extent, and they show when we are stressed.  My thoughts are that many BPD behaviors are similar to early childhood behaviors. We all still have them, but most of us have learned better skills as we became adults.

That said - my mother would probably not meet the criteria for being diagnosed BPD.  But she has exhibited many BPD behaviors over the years - just not on a chronic scale.  Interestingly, some specifics and mannerisms of my wife's behaviors are eerily similar to those of my mom. 

[waverider]

A key factor in determining whether it is a Disorder or not is whether the traits are severe enough to be negatively affecting your functionality in life and ability to interact with others in a healthy way.

We all get a little out of whack at times, the difference with a pwBPD is they are out of whack nearly all the time, even when it is not showing, their emotional processing is stuck in an "off center" mode. Whereas for most people we steer off course once in a while due to emotional overloads, but we naturally pull back to a more stable state when a crisis passes. We can regulate back to center.

Being centered is an alien feeling to a pwBPD, hence the word recovery is misleading, and why it is so difficult as you are expecting someone who is resistant to change to be something they have never been.

Just as you have no idea how their mind works, they have no idea how yours works.

[goateeki]

A key factor in determining whether it is a Disorder or not is whether the traits are severe enough to be negatively affecting your functionality in life and ability to interact with others in a healthy way.

We all get a little out of whack at times, the difference with a pwBPD is they are out of whack nearly all the time, even when it is not showing, their emotional processing is stuck in an "off center" mode. Whereas for most people we steer off course once in a while due to emotional overloads, but we naturally pull back to a more stable state when a crisis passes. We can regulate back to center.

Being centered is an alien feeling to a pwBPD, hence the word recovery is misleading, and why it is so difficult as you are expecting someone who is resistant to change to be something they have never been.

Just as you have no idea how their mind works, they have no idea how yours works.

This entire post is accurate and insightful.  I agree with it.  My ex wife had a pretty horrible upbringing and early adult life and is diagnosed with BPD and complex PTSD.  My own T has said to me many times that there really is not a way that a reasoning non can understand what it is like inside the head of a pwBPD, because when it comes to emotional functioning their premise (how they read situations, what they believe the situations mean) is almost always wrong and built to elicit the most negative emotional response it can.  He described it as an emotional bias toward controversy, abandonment, shaming and devaluing, and the bias feeds into their perceptions of "facts." 

A perfect example of this was me congratulating my wife on one of her many attempts to lose weight, after she had actually lost some weight. Her response was to tell me that I thought that she was fat before the weight loss (though I had not communicated anything like this through words or behavior) and that I was interested in her only because she had lost some weight, and had "ignored" her prior to her weight loss.  This also conflicted with reality, as my behavior had not changed a bit -- I spoke to her as much, was just as interested in her and sought her company just as much as I always had.  It was as if what I'd said -- what any healthy individual would regard as positive reinforcement of something good they'd done -- was to her a kind of inadvertent betrayal of my own secret, negative view her. 

Ironically, if I had said nothing, I am confident that she would at some point have accused me of ignoring her weight loss success.  That's not conjecture, either.  There were numerous examples of this during our 19 year relationship. 

These people are utterly crazy making. 

[waverider]

goateeki this is likely her projecting her self doubt and attempting to elicit soothing reassurances from you. You think I'm worthless= I think I'm worthless, I need you to reassure me I am as I dont trust my own opinion that I am not... In reality she views your opinion more than hers... .>> It can actually be a compliment, albeit it delivered in a negative way... .naturally we read this all wrong and give the wrong reaction and it all goes pear shaped. It is a good example of the difficulties in communication between two completely different thought processes

[ColdEthyl]

goateeki this is likely her projecting her self doubt and attempting to elicit soothing reassurances from you. You think I'm worthless= I think I'm worthless, I need you to reassure me I am as I dont trust my own opinion that I am not... In reality she views your opinion more than hers... .>> It can actually be a compliment, albeit it delivered in a negative way... .naturally we read this all wrong and give the wrong reaction and it all goes pear shaped. It is a good example of the difficulties in communication between two completely different thought processes

Wow... .I just used this as an example today. I had told someone that I now understand when my husband says that he's useless, I deserve better, if I was smart I would dump him, etc he's really saying "I love you and I need to hear that you love me, too."

[teapay]

Yes, it very possible to only have several  BPD traits and not have BPD.  DSM outlines nine traits associated with BPD and someone needs to have at least 5 traits to meet BPD criteria.  People who recover or remit from BPD can still have some BPD traits and not be considered as having BPD.  I think nons can fairly easily dx BPD in their partner.  You really don't need to be a professional.  Go through the DSM criteria fast.  If you can easily check off yes for 7 or 9 of them for a partner then they probably have classic BPD.  If you're not sure and bounce around on a bunch of them, the partner might just have some BPD traits or express BPD intermittently or might have another condition with similar overlapping traits.  Not knowing anything about BPD, when I first saw the DSM criteria, it took me about 30 seconds to easily check my wife as yes for all of them.  Still most BPD traits, regardless of whether they meet the minimal criteria, can make relationships difficult. 

[goateeki]

goateeki this is likely her projecting her self doubt and attempting to elicit soothing reassurances from you. You think I'm worthless= I think I'm worthless, I need you to reassure me I am as I dont trust my own opinion that I am not... In reality she views your opinion more than hers... .>> It can actually be a compliment, albeit it delivered in a negative way... .naturally we read this all wrong and give the wrong reaction and it all goes pear shaped. It is a good example of the difficulties in communication between two completely different thought processes

Thanks.  You're probably right, and this is why I divorced her, to put it bluntly.  I can't live with someone who operates in a different universe where up is down.  With every other person in the world, a statement like "You think I used to be fat" in response to "You look great" would cause you or I or anyone to think "This person is ungrateful and a little crazy" and we would avoid them, right? So why do we accept, and twist ourselves into knots, to explain and understand that behavior in someone who is allegedly our closest, most intimate, and best friend?  The whole thing has such a hugely flawed premise.

[waverider]

So why do we accept, and twist ourselves into knots, to explain and understand that behavior in someone who is allegedly our closest, most intimate, and best friend?  The whole thing has such a hugely flawed premise.

I got past twisting myself in knots trying to analyse and understand everything that sounds crazy, I stated my view and if it gets twisted, my response is a simple "ok". I have said my truth it is her choice whether to buy it or not. Its not my problem.

Often the twisted response is just a knee jerk reaction and if you dont counter it, then it gets dropped and some of your reality is allowed to seep in. If you try to sell something then it is treated with suspicion almost out of principle.

[ColdEthyl]

@goateeki Once I accepted communication was just flat out different, it was like a weight was lifted off of my shoulders. YOU cannot control how THEY interpret something. It can't be done. Trying to so is the equivalent to banging your head into a wall and expecting it to move.

I'm working on the knee-jerk reaction of trying to explain myself and getting offended when he says something that sounds like an accusation. What I have realized is when he spits that accusation out, it's a thought that has been plaguing him for 1-2 days, sometimes more. That's 1-2 days of in their head arguing against the thought... .and the thought arguing back. That's why it comes out the way it does. It's a storm that's been building up, but us as nons couldn't see the clouds.