My mother is at risk and I am at a total loss

[Depression = 72% of members]

Rather than call myself a long-time lurker of these boards, I'll call myself a long-time learner.  I've been here silently and intermittently for a while now and am the 34 year old daughter of a BPD mom.  It is somewhat relieving to me that I don't have to go on at length to describe what that feels like because I'm not the lone ranger here and many of you are living/have lived with this strain as well. 

My mother is very, very sick.  She is a 60 year old woman diagnosed as never having aged past 16 years old mentally due to childhood trauma. She is diagnosed as Bipolar, BPD, Depression, and I am unsure of the rest.  She does not listen to her doctors and abuses her medication with her pill addiction along with other drug use.  I parented her for most of my life and she was like having a teenager that wouldn't listen that I didn't have any actual control over, and she has made horrible decisions.  In 2012 she brought my family into a horrible and heartbreaking situation where she was missing for an entire summer and there was an FBI investigation underway.  It is too long and old a story to recount but she put my life and my childrens' lives at risk.  She resurfaced across the country very traumatized (and victimized) and I helped her get back home and situated and then I had to close the door almost completely on our relationship.  I went through a year and a half of therapy and at my therapist's suggestion, I set up firm boundaries which allow my mother little to no access to my life.  She is very unhealthy and her inability to make sound decisions makes her very unsafe.

Fast forward... .this past October a man resurfaced who she dated briefly when she was 17.    He told her he's been searching for her his whole life and never married, never had kids because he wanted to be with her again, etc etc (I don't know that I believe this although it really doesn't matter whether it's true or not).  My mother announced that she was leaving and moving out of state to his home to live with him.  I'm sure it all seemed over the top romantic to her and she felt she finally had a rescuer.  She lived in low-income housing on government aid and this man owns his own home.  Everyone told her, myself included, not to give up her apartment or her assisted living benefits.  She doesn't listen and was gone within a week, abandoned her apartment and all her stuff in it.

Not even 2 months later the honeymoon's over and she tried to kill herself last Friday with an intentional drug overdose.  My whole life has been suicide attempt after suicide attempt with her.  If I've gone through this once I swear I've gone through this almost 2 dozen times.  The hospital called me and said she came off life support hostile and aggressive and made it clear that she would do this again as soon as she got the chance.  Then they sent her for a psych eval and somehow deemed she was not a threat, they didn't feel this was premeditated or that she would do it again, and they released her back to her boyfriend.  I spoke with the hospital but have not spoken with her.  The other day I received a letter that she mailed on the day of her attempt, which (summarized) said "I've been molested from 5-15 and kidnapped twice and no one in my life has ever hurt me like you.  By now I'm rotting in the ground, don't ever come visit my grave. Time to celebrate, mommy's dead!". 

She is so, so hurtful.  Despite having no contact with her I just get so distraught thinking about all of this.  She really thought she'd be dead and those were her final words to me, she is so deliberate to haunt me for the rest of my life.

Onto the actual reason I am posting.  Today I received a call from the hospital again.  She slit her wrists last night and overdosed on pills again.  She is now in the psych ward with stitches in her arms while they try to determine care for her.  I spoke with her (ex)boyfriend on the phone.  My mother is (no surprise) very lonely and depressed there, fighting with him incessantly, and has wanted to come back home but because of the way she left here she forfeited her government benefits.  I guess she was trying to get into a mental health facility here but they wouldn't take her because she is not a NY resident and her government health care will no longer cover her in NY until she can prove residency here, which she can't do because she abandoned her apartment and is no longer eligible to re-establish these benefits.  Her ex boyfriend is terrified they are going to release her to him again and said she hates it in Indiana and he is going to end up finding her dead in his home and he is concerned for his own safety.  He said she has been violent toward him as well and keeps trying to find the key to his gun safe.

To protect myself and my family, my personal policy is to do nothing.  I cannot help her, I have tried so many times to help her but her path always seeks out devastation and I will not put myself and my family at risk again.  That door is closed and I am thankful to have a safe place here to say that without fearing your judgment or what a horrible daughter I sound like.  I know I am not a horrible daughter, I am the child of a very unhealthy mother.  At the same time, something has got to be done for her.  I can see it already, the medical professionals that have her in their care are going to somehow not perceive the seriousness of what is happening here.  I cannot believe they released her less than 24 hours after her last attempt.  She is truly at rock bottom right now and she needs to be in a long term mental care facility where she can reestablish a sense of mental health and healing.  I don't want to intervene but I want her mental health evaluated and taken seriously.  I truly fear that the end is near if she does not get help.  She is dangerous to herself and others and her mental health should be taken very seriously and that doesn't seem to be happening. 

My heart is very tired.  I feel bewildered that I don't know what to do and then at a loss when I remember that there is nothing for me to do.  It doesn't make the hurt less.  I came out of her body.

 

Leda

[Leda]

Rather than call myself a long-time lurker of these boards, I'll call myself a long-time learner.  I've been here silently and intermittently for a while now and am the 34 year old daughter of a BPD mom.  It is somewhat relieving to me that I don't have to go on at length to describe what that feels like because I'm not the lone ranger here and many of you are living/have lived with this strain as well. 

My mother is very, very sick.  She is a 60 year old woman diagnosed as never having aged past 16 years old mentally due to childhood trauma. She is diagnosed as Bipolar, BPD, Depression, and I am unsure of the rest.  She does not listen to her doctors and abuses her medication with her pill addiction along with other drug use.  I parented her for most of my life and she was like having a teenager that wouldn't listen that I didn't have any actual control over, and she has made horrible decisions.  In 2012 she brought my family into a horrible and heartbreaking situation where she was missing for an entire summer and there was an FBI investigation underway.  It is too long and old a story to recount but she put my life and my childrens' lives at risk.  She resurfaced across the country very traumatized (and victimized) and I helped her get back home and situated and then I had to close the door almost completely on our relationship.  I went through a year and a half of therapy and at my therapist's suggestion, I set up firm boundaries which allow my mother little to no access to my life.  She is very unhealthy and her inability to make sound decisions makes her very unsafe.

Fast forward... .this past October a man resurfaced who she dated briefly when she was 17.    He told her he's been searching for her his whole life and never married, never had kids because he wanted to be with her again, etc etc (I don't know that I believe this although it really doesn't matter whether it's true or not).  My mother announced that she was leaving and moving out of state to his home to live with him.  I'm sure it all seemed over the top romantic to her and she felt she finally had a rescuer.  She lived in low-income housing on government aid and this man owns his own home.  Everyone told her, myself included, not to give up her apartment or her assisted living benefits.  She doesn't listen and was gone within a week, abandoned her apartment and all her stuff in it.

Not even 2 months later the honeymoon's over and she tried to kill herself last Friday with an intentional drug overdose.  My whole life has been suicide attempt after suicide attempt with her.  If I've gone through this once I swear I've gone through this almost 2 dozen times.  The hospital called me and said she came off life support hostile and aggressive and made it clear that she would do this again as soon as she got the chance.  Then they sent her for a psych eval and somehow deemed she was not a threat, they didn't feel this was premeditated or that she would do it again, and they released her back to her boyfriend.  I spoke with the hospital but have not spoken with her.  The other day I received a letter that she mailed on the day of her attempt, which (summarized) said "I've been molested from 5-15 and kidnapped twice and no one in my life has ever hurt me like you.  By now I'm rotting in the ground, don't ever come visit my grave. Time to celebrate, mommy's dead!". 

She is so, so hurtful.  Despite having no contact with her I just get so distraught thinking about all of this.  She really thought she'd be dead and those were her final words to me, she is so deliberate to haunt me for the rest of my life.

Onto the actual reason I am posting.  Today I received a call from the hospital again.  She slit her wrists last night and overdosed on pills again.  She is now in the psych ward with stitches in her arms while they try to determine care for her.  I spoke with her (ex)boyfriend on the phone.  My mother is (no surprise) very lonely and depressed there, fighting with him incessantly, and has wanted to come back home but because of the way she left here she forfeited her government benefits.  I guess she was trying to get into a mental health facility here but they wouldn't take her because she is not a NY resident and her government health care will no longer cover her in NY until she can prove residency here, which she can't do because she abandoned her apartment and is no longer eligible to re-establish these benefits.  Her ex boyfriend is terrified they are going to release her to him again and said she hates it in Indiana and he is going to end up finding her dead in his home and he is concerned for his own safety.  He said she has been violent toward him as well and keeps trying to find the key to his gun safe.

To protect myself and my family, my personal policy is to do nothing.  I cannot help her, I have tried so many times to help her but her path always seeks out devastation and I will not put myself and my family at risk again.  That door is closed and I am thankful to have a safe place here to say that without fearing your judgment or what a horrible daughter I sound like.  I know I am not a horrible daughter, I am the child of a very unhealthy mother.  At the same time, something has got to be done for her.  I can see it already, the medical professionals that have her in their care are going to somehow not perceive the seriousness of what is happening here.  I cannot believe they released her less than 24 hours after her last attempt.  She is truly at rock bottom right now and she needs to be in a long term mental care facility where she can reestablish a sense of mental health and healing.  I don't want to intervene but I want her mental health evaluated and taken seriously.  I truly fear that the end is near if she does not get help.  She is dangerous to herself and others and her mental health should be taken very seriously and that doesn't seem to be happening. 

My heart is very tired.  I feel bewildered that I don't know what to do and then at a loss when I remember that there is nothing for me to do.  It doesn't make the hurt less.  I came out of her body.

 

Leda

[ijustwantpeace]

Leda,

I know how you feel being around my BPD for 43 years has left me just wanting it to be over.  The important thing to know is that is not your fault.  Be kind to yourself, the feeling of guilt that come from having to deal with this mental illness are normal.  I too was struggling with intense feeling of guilt about never wanting to talk to my mother again.

When she is not around I feel great, but if too long of a period passes she feels the need for attention and whips up some chaos to get it.

I truly believe these people have an intense fear of abandonment and will do anything to keep that fear a bay including creating chaos to sooth their fears.  I don't believe it is intention, it is just a defense mechanism against abandonment.

If I go NC with my mom she starts up trouble somewhere else to pull me into the whole mess.  Normal people can have happy loving relationships people with BPD are incapable of such a thing.

They just want attention and make no distinction between good or bad attention so long as they get the right volume of attention.  It would be great if they did kind things to get it, but in my experience they seem to gravitate toward the dark side.

I hope you get some support for yourself in the form of a support group, priest, pastor, or counseling.  You are a good person, and you have my permission to live your life guilt free and happy.

[Leda]

ijustwantpeace, thank you for your thoughts, they mean a lot.  I am here to grow and find ways to continue to heal from her and try to do something with the inner anger I feel anytime I think about her.  My sister joined the boards here today too.  I am thankful to have found this resource and be able to take part in discussion and how we can all focus on our own health and healing after living with the trauma of a BPD relationship.

[ijustwantpeace]

ijustwantpeace, thank you for your thoughts, they mean a lot.  I am here to grow and find ways to continue to heal from her and try to do something with the inner anger I feel anytime I think about her.  My sister joined the boards here today too.  I am thankful to have found this resource and be able to take part in discussion and how we can all focus on our own health and healing after living with the trauma of a BPD relationship.

I know that inner anger that you speak of, would love it if someone had a strategy to cope with it.

There has been times I have been out in public and found myself talking to myself or yelling and screaming at the thought of dealing with another one of her episodes.  It has gotten to the point where I was living in constant dread of the next problem.  Before finding this board I was at my witts end.  She recently broke up with her finance, and I was devastated.  He was my ticket to a happy and peaceful life.  When you have suffered for as long as I have you don't even see the person as human, you just see them as a problem.

I know that she is totally unaware of her behavior and the impact it has on others, but does not put me into an instant zen type state either.

[PrettyPlease]

Hi Leda,

Welcome.  It's not a pretty situation you describe, but I think you're right that many people here will understand. Personally, I feel a strong resonance with your desire to help, and with your sense of loss at realizing there's nothing to do.

But doing 'nothing' isn't really accurate. We were trained to react. So not reacting is itself an action. When we take this action, our own attachment to the outcome is brought into clear view.

For me, the important point is that this outcome isn't under our own control. The whole situation evolved before we were born. There's a quote (author I don't know), "We are born into the second act of a tragedy in progress, and spend the rest of our lives trying to figure out what went wrong in the first act."

Are we allowed not to spend our lives this way?  Yes.  In fact it will be healthier for all involved -- even, often, the person with BPD.

A book that helped me greatly in my own worst time with this -- after my mother died three years ago, in self-destruction, with me thousands of miles away -- was "Understanding the Borderline Mother" by Lawson. If you haven't read this book, I strongly recommend it. Here's a quote from it that unlocked something important for me:

“The Queen's children must allow her the right to self-destruct while exerting their right to protect themselves.”

― Christine Ann Lawson, Understanding the Borderline Mother: Helping Her Children Transcend the Intense, Unpredictable, and Volatile Relationship

Best wishes

[Leda]

But doing 'nothing' isn't really accurate. We were trained to react. So not reacting is itself an action. When we take this action, our own attachment to the outcome is brought into clear view.

For me, the important point is that this outcome isn't under our own control. The whole situation evolved before we were born. There's a quote (author I don't know), "We are born into the second act of a tragedy in progress, and spend the rest of our lives trying to figure out what went wrong in the first act."

I can't even tell you how very much this uplifted my perspective this morning.  "Not reacting is itself an action."  Thank you for teaching me this, I need to use this as a daily mantra when I feel frustrated about her.  It also helped me realize that I'm not completely doing nothing, either.  I've spoken with her boyfriend.  I've spoken with her nurses.  I'm sharing information with other people on how they can help her (or not enable her), and I suppose that is something. 

I'm very thankful to be here on this board.  When I go NC for a long period and she doesn't contact me either or have "episodes", life is peaceful. But when everything is at the surface like this, even with continued NC I find myself unable to stop thinking about any of it.  Even without her in my life, the past becomes such a problem for me because I can't stop thinking about how very wrong everything went.  During NC, life becomes a still and placid pond and is very beautiful.  But when things like this happen it just stirs up all the muck on the bottom of the pond and all the sudden my water is clouded and filthy for days or weeks as I wait for all the memories to settle again.  I want my still waters back. 

[Notwendy]

I can relate to the emotional pull of wanting to help and yet knowing that it is better for me if I don't get too involved.

My mother is elderly and a widow. Since my father passed away, sibs and I have genuine concerns for her. However, our attempts to help have also involved us into the drama, and so, we have had to have boundaries in place for that. The drama involves being pushed to be enablers and verbal abuse. We don't want to deal with either.

This doesn't mean we are not concerned for her. We just know that helping her involves rescuing and that means the drama triangle. She has self destructive behaviors, but to try to keep them from happening would mean being with her 24/7 and trying to control her, neither of which is good for either of us.

My role in the family was to be the co-dependent caretaker. My mother can be self sufficient, but if I am in her presence, she will crawl into bed, be helpless, and want to be taken care of. This isn't necessary, but it was the case when I visited, with my own kids ( who needed to be cared for) and also my ailing father, so I stepped into the role of housekeeper, cook, errand runner, grocery shopper. I would not mind doing any of these things for a family member who needed it, or as a favor, but in this case, it is neither one.

My mother's tendency to discount my advice, paint me black while painting total strangers white and trusting them makes it even harder for me to help, and her vulnerable to being taken advantage of, which sadly happens. People have stolen family valuables from her, but she would not let me have them, and instead, would let strangers rummage through the house, "borrow" her car.

Dad, thankfully, left her plenty of money to live on. Money we would not touch except to help with her expenses, however, she refuses to let us have any access to it, even though we would be ethical with it. Yet, she will say " that nice man at the bank told me to do this with the money".

And, yes we worry about the what ifs? But we have concluded that she is ultimately in control of her life and that, we can not help her much under the current circumstance. We don't wish for anything bad to happen to her. In fact, we wish we had the kind of relationship with our elderly mother where we could help. However, we have our own responsibilities and need to respect our own selves, and so, like many choices that are not simple, or even feel good, we have chosen to not get too involved.

[PrettyPlease]

Hi Leda,

[First: Notwendy's post appeared as I was finishing drafting this one, and I agree with Notwendy fully. Good post. Mine repeats or overlaps some of the ideas, but from a slightly different angle, so I've posted anyway. Possibly something will be helpful.]

But when things like this happen... .

[snip... .]. 

I want my still waters back. 

Understood, and I'm thankful for the still times in my own life. But "life is what happens while we're making other plans" (John Lennon, I think).

That is, we learned denial, as a way to survive. We learned to put away things underneath, unless they were right in our face. And this works well in childhood, and can work in the short term in adulthood. But the things will come back. And the water will be stirred and the muck will swirl around us. And other people are stirring the muck, so we have no control over "when things like this happen".

What we do have control over are our own reactions. Even if the muck is being stirred. Even if it's swirling around us. If anything, that's the important time for us to learn: not how to put it away in a denial sense, but how to live and be at peace while it's swirling. Peaceful enough, anyway, that we can still function, and do the other things that are under our own control — like:

I've spoken with her boyfriend.  I've spoken with her nurses.  I'm sharing information with other people on how they can help her (or not enable her), and I suppose that is something. 

It's probably not only "something" —if you were denigrating your efforts by that last sentence. It may be all you can do. It may be a heroic effort. 

Perhaps you can get peace by reminding yourself that you're doing this much. Maybe it's all you can do. You have to maintain your own balance. You are given that right by your existence. As your mother is given the right to do what she needs to maintain her balance.

And when hers involves victimizing or blaming others, then those others have the right to go NC. Even if they're her own children.

I think you already know most of this, probably all. But perhaps it does good to be reminded of it once in a while. Especially when the muck is swirling. 

[ijustwantpeace]

Leda,

Thank you for posting this you have no idea how helpful it is to me.  When I am in NC everything is wonderful and peaceful too then an episode happens and it throws my whole life into a tail spin.  I gets so bad that I can not stop obsessing over the next disaster she is going to create.

Until I get my calm waters back I am going to do as others suggest and make the decision to do nothing.  When my peace is restored I will work on next steps at that time.

I and my nephew, and nice desperately need order and I know when I am like this I can do nothing useful to help.  I will wait for the calm waters.

My mom needs to be on strict schedule for when she visits the family and everyone needs to know what it is for order to prevale.

[Leda]

I am learning so much here in my interactions with all of you.  My sister just joined as well and we cannot adequately express the relief and thankfulness we feel over being here.  What a value-add to actually joining and posting vs. reading in silence like I was doing before. 

I admit that before I joined, the reality of being an adult child of a BPD mother was very bewildering and in the past I found the circumstance unsolvable.  My perspective was somewhat of it just being what it is, the memories awful and the pain palpable, but that there was nothing more I could do for myself than severely limit contact with her.  I see that by joining here and participating, I have already done something positive for myself and am taking steps toward healing.  In this post alone each of you have shared insight that is so awakening and important for me to read.  I will be buying the book Understanding the Borderline Mother and can't wait to read it. 

I mentioned earlier that I spent a year and a half in therapy, and back then I felt I did my time.  Now I realize a year and a half is not really that long considering the 30 years of abuse that came before it.  I connected with and deeply valued my therapist but I did not enjoy therapy (which is a ridiculous sentiment, it's not practiced for enjoyment).  Being in therapy made me feel like my mother since she was always in therapy.  It gave me the association of being weak and came attached to the stigma of lacking mental wellness. The constant combing through the heartache and reliving the wretched was hard work.  In one of my sessions I had my first panic attack and found myself hyperventilating into a paper bag and even the memory of that bothers me.  I'm now reevaluating this and realizing therapy must be like rebreaking a bone to set it properly.  No wonder it hurt so badly.  I see I still have a lot of work to do.  #4 in the Survivor's Guide talks about the need for re-experiencing each set of memories.  I don't think that I allowed myself to do that fully and am still reluctant to but will face it with bravery.

Thank you again for listening.  Thank you so, so much for having this safe space here for all of us. 

[ijustwantpeace]

I have had multiple panic attacks the last one was so severe I thought I was having a heart attack.  I went to my doctor and he suggested I go to a behavioral psychologist to help me get some coping strategies.  I think I am also going to be attending a support group through my church as the woman running the group is familiar with BPD.  I was kinda concerned that she would dismiss it, but she knew exactly what I was talking about.  That is a huge relief.

I am going to work on practicing mindfulness as I have noticed that when I zone out when driving or doing routine stuff my mind drifts towards thoughts of the next problem happening.  I am now going to pray more and meditate to regain control of my thoughts.

This disease is truly terrible.  I feel bad for myself, and am starting to have a degree of compassion for those suffering from this terrible illness.  It must be like a living nightmare.  The constant fear of abandonment causes them to push everyone out of their lives and they have no understanding of why.

[Woolspinner2000]

Leda,

Let me extend you an official warm welcome in being brave and posting!   It's great to have you on board with us. I am sorry for all this drama you and your family is currently having. How hard it is, and in reading your posts I can pick up the fact that you are so tired. Thank you for keeping us posted on how things are going. You've gotten some excellent responses so far with some great advice. 

Yes, T can be very challenging to be sure. I find it so myself. I have had those moments of panic too when I couldn't talk anymore due to my brain going into a fog and my T had to tell me to breathe. So scary, especially when I had no idea of what was happening. Sounds like it is similar to what happened to you.

I'm now reevaluating this and realizing therapy must be like rebreaking a bone to set it properly.  No wonder it hurt so badly.  I see I still have a lot of work to do.  #4 in the Survivor's Guide talks about the need for re-experiencing each set of memories.  I don't think that I allowed myself to do that fully and am still reluctant to but will face it with bravery.

Thank you again for listening.  Thank you so, so much for having this safe space here for all of us. 

I often tell others that I find it so strange that one has to go backward, into the memories (as is mentioned on the side) in order to be able to go forward. Unless a person has walked the steps we have and gone into T as so many of us have, they do not understand. Freedom and understanding comes. You are right that it does take bravery, and you are brave indeed to be willing to work at healing yourself, down deep in your soul.    Take it one tiny sliver of a memory at a time. They'll come on their own. You can do it. We will cheer you on and help you when you need comfort and support. 

Wools  

[Leda]

Woolspinner, thank you for the warmth.  It's great to be on board and I hope that as I work through healing and growth that I can be a part of the support network as well.  What a special group of people assembled here.

This disease is truly terrible.  I feel bad for myself, and am starting to have a degree of compassion for those suffering from this terrible illness.  It must be like a living nightmare.  The constant fear of abandonment causes them to push everyone out of their lives and they have no understanding of why.

I think you are right on here.  I feel my mother is her own worst nightmare most of the time.  It is so sad for those inflicted with this, they didn't choose this.  After learning more on these boards, I'll clarify that although I am currently in a period of NC, our relationship is better defined by limited or controlled contact.  I've set up my boundaries so that when she is showing wellness, she is allowed in on a limited level.  It's cyclical and generally will go a couple weeks of communication and then an episode will occur and lead to months of NC.  I allow her back in when she shows wellness again.  My perspective is that she is very sick and I compare it to how we would treat others in differing circumstances.  Some with Autism or Alzheimers can do things that seem mean/violent/harmful but we are able to look at those actions as symptoms of their disorder/disease and show them more patience, sympathy, and understanding.  My mother is a very sick person walking around disguised as a healthy person who is in appearance very beautiful and can be charismatic and charming.  It is easy to forget how mentally unwell she is when she is being hostile and hurtful but I do very much keep in mind that she carries the burden of a hidden illness.  So to reclarify, right now we are in NC and have been since October, but the door is not completely closed on her and when she shows wellness again I am receptive to limited and controlled contact.  My secret is that the child in me still longs for her to work through this and get better and that I can have an actual mom one day.  My nightmare is that we will be in a period of NC and she will die and then I'll live the rest of my life in the aftermath of the wreckage with no hope of us ever healing our relationship.  This almost came true this past week and when she was on life support in ICU and the nurse told me that it could go either way, I was open mouthed sobbing over it.  Right now she is in a rehabilitation center and I hope that something is done for her but we've done this so many times with the same outcome that I am doubtful.  But maybe... .

[Leda]

Her boyfriend has been in contact with my sister and me and providing some updates.  I do not know this person at all.  The last man she dated who "never married/never had kids" ended up being a convicted felon-turned fugitive on the run.  A con-man wanted for 2 rapes and attempted homicide and he (for lack of a better word) kidnapped my mother for a summer.  She went with him willingly believing a gang was coming after him and that she would be tortured for information if he left her behind.  Long and ridiculous story but in short, he had her passing counterfeit money for him across the country so that they could raise enough cash to be smuggled to Venezuela.  Thankfully they were caught and he is now in prison.  I digress, but my point is that I have no trust or faith in her choice of partners and the fact that this new guy showed up out of the blue with no family ties or confirmed history raises alarms.  It's not my first rodeo.  My read on him from our brief texts and conversations is that he is a rescuer/enabler and seems to want to do anything to keep her in his life.  After the behavior she's shown him over the 2 months they've been together, I think any healthy person would run for the hills.  I don't have any desire to be in further contact with him, he is not showing appropriate caution signs and he means nothing to me.  If anything, he is the one who put her in this situation when he showed up with his love story and took her away after my sister and I both contacted him privately to explain her mental health status and how unwell she is.  I don't wish to speak to him further.

Right now my mother is in a lock down rehabilitation center and if there is any hope of her getting somewhat better (aka not suicidal and hopefully reestablish her independence) she needs to really seize the day and take advantage of the treatment she is getting.  Today I decided to break NC and call her.  I don't know why I did that and I had no plan for the dialogue other than to show concern in my tonals and see how she was doing.  The only thing I had planned for the call was to end it with an "I love you."  I do love her and I needed her to hear that.  For her but for me also.  If something happens to her, I needed that to be the last thing I said to her.  Something for me to hold onto that I could be at peace with.

Anticlimactically, she refused my call.  It hurt my feelings.  I wish I hadn't called.

[PrettyPlease]

The only thing I had planned for the call was to end it with an "I love you."  I do love her and I needed her to hear that.  For her but for me also.  If something happens to her, I needed that to be the last thing I said to her.  Something for me to hold onto that I could be at peace with.

Anticlimactically, she refused my call.  It hurt my feelings.  I wish I hadn't called.

You seem to have a great understanding not only of your mother, but of yourself. This is wonderful, and a great accomplishment, and a great resource. And it leads to other people, like me, thinking they know what's happening in your mind, and wanting to poke around in it. Forgive me if it doesn't help; but my hope is that it will.  

What occurs to me is something I learned many years ago about the values and risks of a childhood abuse survivor confronting their perpetrator (usually a parent) after they'd grown up. BPD wasn't mentioned at the time I learned this, but I think the situation is similar.

The key point I remember is that you have no way of knowing what their reaction will be. You may get them taking some responsibility, or you may not, or they may become abusive again (or, as in your case they may refuse to even listen — which could be a form of abuse also).

Therefore, it only makes sense to do this if you've thought about all the outcomes in advance, including the worst outcome possible, and decided, on carefully weighing what you know about yourself, whether it's worth risking that worst outcome.

In your situation, your last statement says, in effect, "I wasn't prepared for this outcome". And perhaps if you'd thought it through you wouldn't have done it.

However, there's another possibility — maybe you still haven't thought it through. What I mean is: you said, "If something happens to her, I needed that to be the last thing I said to her."  That's a very strong and real need. And if something does happen to her, say, tonight, and that was your last chance — at least you made the attempt; you did what you were allowed to do by circumstances. No-one can ask more of you than that.

So... .maybe if you'd thought it through beforehand, you'd still have done it, even knowing the worst possible outcome. And then afterwards you would say, "Well, I did what I could. I had to do it, and I did it."

[Leda]

Forgive me if it doesn't help; but my hope is that it will.  

... .

Therefore, it only makes sense to do this if you've thought about all the outcomes in advance, including the worst outcome possible, and decided, on carefully weighing what you know about yourself, whether it's worth risking that worst outcome.

In your situation, your last statement says, in effect, "I wasn't prepared for this outcome". And perhaps if you'd thought it through you wouldn't have done it.

However, there's another possibility — maybe you still haven't thought it through. What I mean is: you said, "If something happens to her, I needed that to be the last thing I said to her."  That's a very strong and real need. And if something does happen to her, say, tonight, and that was your last chance — at least you made the attempt; you did what you were allowed to do by circumstances. No-one can ask more of you than that.

So... .maybe if you'd thought it through beforehand, you'd still have done it, even knowing the worst possible outcome. And then afterwards you would say, "Well, I did what I could. I had to do it, and I did it."

This was very insightful, PrettyPlease, and proved helpful to me in a couple ways.  It allowed me to reexamine what I thought may happen going into it.  I'm realizing now that it was more than: A. She takes my call   B. She doesn't.  "A" branches out to A1: She takes my call and the conversation is helpful, or A2: She takes my call and the conversation is hurtful.  And then of course, there's who it is helpful to and hurtful to since the outcome of the conversation could have very well been perceived differently by each of us. 

I'm glad I posted about the call and I'm thankful for your response.  Initially I felt just the rejection of it, but I'm looking at this differently this morning.  Maybe the call was helpful to both of us.  She knows I reached out and that gesture may be comforting to her.  She may not be ready to respond and was likely caught very off guard to hear from me since we have been in NC.  If she responded cruelly that would have been much more bothersome to me than her silent rejection.  And lastly, as you pointed out, I made an attempt and I have that now.  If something happens to her, I will know that I did that.  Today I am revising my take on the call to say "I'm glad I called."   


I've been trying to work on Remembering.  There are things stepping forward that I haven't evaluated in a long time and they are very disturbing.  Yesterday I felt very angry over something that happened when I was in 7th grade and my sister was in 8th grade.  A group of girls didn't like my sister and followed us after school one day.  There was confrontation and my sister got punched in the face.  The fight was one sided and although the image of my big sister being hit still evokes so much sadness, she stood there bravely and took her punches and it was all over very quickly.  No one bled, nothing escalated.  When we told our mom what happened she went into overblown mother bear mode... .

What the rest of us as parents may do in a situation like this is call the police, the school, perhaps the other parents.  What my mother did was create her own small army. 

We have cousins that were similar in age to us and went to a different school, and they were both perceived as tough girls at the time.  My mother enlisted them to fight my sister's primary attacker.  Our cousins are biracial, and my mom was so thrilled to be sending "big black girls" after the girl who punched my sister.  That alone bothers me so deeply now, that my mother exploited their race in this way.  They were adolescents who needed a lot of direction at that time and here is an adult in their lives signing them up for a bloodbath.  The next week she brought our cousins to the school and what happened that day was nothing, NOTHING like what happened to my sister.  This girl, this 8th grade child who punched my sister, was on the ground being kicked in the back and in the ribs.  One had her by the hair and was grating her face over and over against the pavement and I remember to this day the girl's open mouth and closed eyes while they were grinding her face on the cement.  Her face was completely wrought with pain and fear. 

Before the fight I recall being anxious and excited (I am embarrassed to say that now but as a 12 year old who's mother was reenforcing these emotions, that's how I felt).  During the fight I was horrified, it got way, way out of control and all I felt was empathy and fear for the child on the ground.  This was not an eye for an eye, this child was severely beaten.  I felt deep shame that my family was doing this. 

As a mom of elementary school children now, I just cannot believe that this happened.  I can't believe she did that.  That child who was beaten could have suffered life long injuries had a kick landed differently, etc.  My cousins who were just children at the time could have had to face serious consequences (they are both thriving now by the way).  How dangerous a mother we had.

[PrettyPlease]

Wow, Leda. What a memory to have.

How dangerous a mother we had.

Yes.

You say you're "trying to work on Remembering". Are you still working with the T? 

If not,—and I know things are moving fast with your mother at the moment, so maybe this isn't the time—, but when appropriate it might be good to have someone who can listen and give support in real time, if you've got more difficult memories that are likely to come up.

Posting here is good, but depending on how much you think is still to come... .it might get overwhelming. Especially given the ongoing crisis with your mother, which must be remarkably stressful.

[Rock Chick]

My mother is very, very sick.  She is a 60 year old woman diagnosed as never having aged past 16 years old mentally due to childhood trauma. She is diagnosed as Bipolar, BPD, Depression, and I am unsure of the rest.  She does not listen to her doctors and abuses her medication with her pill addiction along with other drug use.  I parented her for most of my life and she was like having a teenager that wouldn't listen that I didn't have any actual control over, and she has made horrible decisions.  \

Leda thank you soo much for posting. Its nice to be to read a post from someone who has a mother who is BPD and the mother is over the age of 40. A lot of articles, books, online stuff etc Ive read and watched etc says that BPD goes away after 30s or that most everything does by 30s or early 40s. The BPD in my life is 52 and she is worse and worse with time (esp last 3 yrs) now than she has ever been in her life or at least worst been since early 20s. She too is very sick and I think she too stopped aging mentally due to childhood trauma around same time if not a tad sooner than sounds like your mom did. She too has been diagnosed with Bipolar via mainly a blood test although i hear you cant really tell by that if someone is bipolar but whatever. She has depression and is diabetic and supposingly has petite mal. She as well doesn't listen to her doctors much if at all. She has a history of drug abuse but seems to be better with that. My boyfriend and i too have had to become the parent like a role reversal or like becoming parentified by our BPD individual. Keep strong Leda and take care of you and your family 1st. U rock!

[Notwendy]

Leda,

I have had similar experiences where a memory has returned, sometimes triggered by an event in the family, or my own experience as a mother, recalling something my mother did and being surprised that this happened when I was a child. As children, we don't know what "normal" is, but if we become parents, we realize that it isn't "normal" parenting.

One of my siblings can recall a childhood memory in great detail, while I have no recollection of it at all. It is the strangest thing. We were both there at the same time, and yet I can't remember it.

This is my take on having a BPD parent. I don't think we need therapy all the time. But perhaps during some stressful times, we could benefit from that support- just like anyone would, but a parent with BPD could be more complicated. I think we have all seen that "list" of life stresses- not all of them bad, but that list of changes- birth of a child, moving, and an ailing elderly parent is one of them. These are normal life events for many people, but someone with BPD will not respond to them in an emotionally healthy way. Even people who don't have a mental issue could need support during these times.

My mother is older than yours, and so, I can look back on these life events and see where, while she always had BPD, the dysfunction came into play more or less at different times. We moved when I was a teen, and I was the one who looked for places to live. Dad had taken us to see many places and she didn't like them, so I took on the house hunting as well. This seemed normal to me, but looking back- an adult task for a teen. But moving is a stressor and I don't recall how my mother handled it.

One of the toughest events was my father's illness and death. This is tough for any family. Some of my friends had elderly parents and had lost parents by this time, so I had a model of "normal" if there is such a thing. One of my close friends advised me about some of the things she did to help her mother at the time as well as make arrangements for her mother after her father died. I didn't know about BPD or the family dynamics at the time, and I naively went to my parents to implement some of my friend's suggestions, and they backfired. Most women would be upset at this time, but my mother had just gone bonkers. Makes sense considering the stress, but it was also stressful for me to go through losing my dad. This is also when some of the memories of my childhood came back, because I had not registered my mother's behavior as "not normal" when I was a kid, but as an adult, it was obvious that it was not.

I sought out T at the time, for me, to deal with my feelings. It is pretty tough to lose a parent, and with BPD it was a difficult time. Since many of us don't have emotionally supportive families, we sometimes need to find this support elsewhere. But just because we seek out a T for a certain situation doesn't mean we need it all the time.