17 yrs of marriage and 8 kids... I just left our home and got an apartment...

[Sluggo]

After being on this board for 5 years or so and jumping in and out throughout those years learning more and more from the experience of others... I have come to a point in my process where I left my wife and just got a 3 month lease on an apartment.  Most I ever left the house before was for 2 days at a hotel. 

I have seen the dysfunctional pattern repeat itself too many times.  Stress building up in the house, wife blowing up over something I did, me apologizing and then giving another little part of my freedom away, then wife accepting me back.  It is a death of a 1000 cuts.  It has been a pattern I cannot repeat again.  I am breaking the cycle of dysfunction by breaking the cycle.

Now pours in the relief of the peace but the sadness of this failed marriage and sadness of the loss of daily interaction with kids.  One of the last bits of realization of the damage that has been in the house is when my 5 year when watching Lion King said... ."that looks like you and Mami".  Why is that I say, "you and Mami are like Scar and Simba fighting". 

The other nail in the coffin- 2 days later- is when my wife tried lundged at me to wrestle bag from me that had the last testament and will of my father who passed away a week earlier saying I was not to take it from the house*.  When wrestling for the bag my 7 year old (on his birthday) just watched in fear.  How heartbreaking.  And then to hear my wife scream to everyone in the house saying look what you (Dad) just did.  Look how you tramitzed our son.  I didn't do anything except deny her order to not leave the papers in the house. 

I pray I have the strength and wisdom to know that if I go back home that I will just go back to that cycle.  I don't know who I am anymore.  I feel I have allowed her to put me down so long and I allowed her to dictate that I sever my relationships with my family and childhood friends that my self esteem is in the crapper. 

Not sure what is the best next decision.   Lawyer?  Establish visitation schedule with the kids via the court. etc. 

[Scopikaz]

I'm so sorry.  I don't know what to say. But it's stories like this In which I have to think God is protecting me as some of mg friends have said. I was with my girlfriend for almost two years. She left me two months ago. It's still difficult. Very. I made mistakes in the relationship. I acknowledge that. But she left almost without warning.  I've been hoping and praying she will have a change of heart.  She's like another person now. Hanging out at singles and sports bars.  Making "friends" who look bad for her. None of which look like they have morals or God in their lives.  Just so sad.  So stories like yours make me say maybe God is protecting me. I don't know

[ladylee]

Sadness and stress are difficult to juggle. Take are of your needs. Ensure your safety. I also had to leave a nine year marriage and get an apartment but I have no children and  had therapeutic guidance and legal guidance throughout it. Of course he has adult children so there were those issues but everyone was in the middle of our relationship problems and breakup and I was the bad guy because they need me to be.  Even though I have peace now, there is sadness. The stakes were high, they always are, its not an easy reset, it takes time and patience but what's the alternative, a circus?

[Euler2718]

I have seen the dysfunctional pattern repeat itself too many times.  Stress building up in the house, wife blowing up over something I did, me apologizing and then giving another little part of my freedom away, then wife accepting me back.  It is a death of a 1000 cuts. 

In the end you have given so much of yourself away. And they're exactly the same. And you wasted part of your life. I hope you run far far away. It's difficult, though.

[Panda39]

All4BVM,

I know this has all happened very quickly and you are just working your way through things emotionally here on this board, but for strategies and support for your next moves I would post on the "Legal Board".  Here is a link... .

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=10.0

Your first instincts are good talking with a lawyer is a good idea (you will want to shop around) and establishing visitation with your kids is also a good idea, it is important that they spend time with you (also often courts will go with the status quo so be sure to set up the best visitation schedule you can... .don't give too much time away to your wife)

Don't forget about self care, this is a stressful time so do the best you can to care for you.  Reach out to friends and family, I found it amazing how many people came out of the woodwork and were there for me.

Take Care,

Panda39

[Sluggo]

  So stories like yours make me say maybe God is protecting me. I don't know

Scopikaz, 

Thank you for sharing.  My wife's brother told me before I married my wife... .don't marry her.  If I understood exactly what that would have meant then, I would have made different choices.  I believe God does put people in our lives to help guide us through.   And if we don't understand those 'signs' before the decision is made, it makes our life harder.   God is still there, but there is more struggle. 

I think you might be on point thinking God is helping your through and is saving you from struggle. 

[Sluggo]

Sadness and stress are difficult to juggle. Take are of your needs. Ensure your safety. I also had to leave a nine year marriage and get an apartment but I have no children and  had therapeutic guidance and legal guidance throughout it. Of course he has adult children so there were those issues but everyone was in the middle of our relationship problems and breakup and I was the bad guy because they need me to be.  Even though I have peace now, there is sadness. The stakes were high, they always are, its not an easy reset, it takes time and patience but what's the alternative, a circus?

Lady Lee,

Wow 9 years.  Yes I wonder what my kids think.  I know my wife has told them in front of me that Daddy is leaving because he refuses to put our family first and allows his family to disrespect me.  But everything is so twisted and that is not the issue.  However my 9 year old said, why don't you just do what mami is asking you.  Then that comment gives me pause to think that am I really being obstinate or has the years of belittling, anger outbursts from her, being scared at home, etc the real reason.

Yes I still need a lot of time to reset. 

[Sluggo]

In the end you have given so much of yourself away. And they're exactly the same. And you wasted part of your life. I hope you run far far away. It's difficult, though.

Tim27818,

Yes I have given so much of myself away to please her (friendships, self respect, allowing myself to be just one more kid in the house, family contact, the ability to write a text to friends or family and not have wife 'pre read' my texts to make sure everything is fine with text)... .  And it is exactly the same but really worse as I think about it.  As there is always one more 'rule' that she wants me to follow to keep her happy. 

[Sluggo]

All4BVM,

I know this has all happened very quickly and you are just working your way through things emotionally here on this board, but for strategies and support for your next moves I would post on the "Legal Board".  Here is a link... .

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=10.0

Your first instincts are good talking with a lawyer is a good idea (you will want to shop around) and establishing visitation with your kids is also a good idea, it is important that they spend time with you (also often courts will go with the status quo so be sure to set up the best visitation schedule you can... .don't give too much time away to your wife)

Don't forget about self care, this is a stressful time so do the best you can to care for you.  Reach out to friends and family, I found it amazing how many people came out of the woodwork and were there for me.

Take Care,

Panda39

Panda39,

Thank you for the guidance.  I will jump on that board and get more guidance on this next step.  You know, I am still scared (brainwashed) to talk with my family.  Not of what they will say because even though I had carved them out of my life I know they realize why... .  but I am scared because if still feels like talking with them is doing something wrong.  That it is bad to talk with them.  My wife comments keep playing back in my ear (you are so co-dependent on them, they are not good people, they hurt your own wife, you much rather have a conversation with them than with your wife and kids, you are sick).  I just feel like I would be doing something so slimy.  I was in my mom's town over the weekend and drove past my mom's house but couldn't muster the ability to just stop and say hi. 

Also I am sure it is also that I know if I were to talk my siblings and in a weak moment did go back to live with my wife, that they would be really confused.  I don't see going back with her ... .but that is in the back of my mind.   

[Panda39]

From reading the posts of MIL's on the coping board and the experience my SO (he has an uBPDxw) had with his parents, my guess is that your family have been wanting to give you support for a long time but have felt that you weren't ready to accept it (you still sound uncomfortable about the idea).  I feel confident that if you were to reach out that your family would be there for you.

It sounds like your wife has been alienating you from your family. As a mother it makes me terribly sad to hear that you passed by your mom's house without stopping in, she surely misses you.

I know you are scared to talk with your family I was too, I stayed in a co-dependent marriage with an alcoholic 18 yearls longer than I should have because I was scared to tell the truth and even harder for me was to ask for help.  But once I did share I found that my family and friends were there for me in a big way and it was a huge relief to tell the truth of my life... .no more hiding.

My mantra when I was leaving my marriage was from a Pink song... ."Have you ever looked fear in the face and said I just don't care"... .my SO when he left his wife used Star Trek for is inspiration... .Boldly Go!

I encourage you to push through your fear and wife's negative talk and reach out to your family and friends.

Panda39

[ladylee]

YES All4BVM. The put downs wear our spirit down. It is psychic injury. We lose pieces of our soul every day. We deserve a purple heart because we are lost in an inordinary reality with our partners until we learn and find our way out.  I meditate regularly and practice Reiki to find guidance and strength and did it the entire time I lived with him to find the path forward or I would have snapped. He looked to me for sanity and strength for return from the edge and I am not a psychiatrist, it was downright scary some days. I felt like I was in the nut ward and I am not even trying to be funny here. I am still praying for his spirits release from this terrible disorder, and my restored health.

[vortex of confusion]

I am in the process of trying to separate from my husband of 17 years. This stuff isn't easy.

My first question is, "Are the kids safe with her?" I know that is a horrible question to ask but I think it is important to ask yourself that question. If you don't feel that the kids are safe, then the sooner you contact a lawyer, the better.

I want to echo what the others said and encourage you to reach out to your family. My stbx alienated me from my family and I didn't even realize it. I have made a lot of changes in my life and am now hanging out with my family more these days. It is interesting that they keep making comments like, "You seem more like yourself than you have in years." When I first went to my family about the situation a couple of years ago, I was so scared. I was afraid that they would judge me. I was afraid that I would look like a complete idiot. I was afraid of so many different things. In the end, I had nothing to fear. They were very supportive and have stayed out of the way and have let me work through things at my own pace without pressuring me to stay or go.

My family isn't perfect and has a lot of dysfunction in it but is sure helps to know that I am not alone. I have slowly been telling parts of my story to family and friends. In many cases, I am being validated because they saw some of this stuff a long time ago. Or, if they didn't see all of it, they had an inkling that something wasn't quite right.

It is so difficult to process things and figure out the best course of action when kids are involved. If I didn't have 4 kids with my spouse, I think my decisions would be so much easier. For years, I thought that sucking it up and keeping my mouth shut was the best because I wanted to give my kids an in tact home. It isn't in tact. It is broken. My kids do no respect their dad at all. He is dismissive of me and them. I thought I was crazy. As the kids get older, they notice and make comments about it. I have friends that have seen it and commented on it. It isn't just me. I am not crazy. It takes time to digest it all.

Hang in there!

[Sluggo]

From reading the posts of MIL's on the coping board and the experience my SO (he has an uBPDxw) had with his parents, my guess is that your family have been wanting to give you support for a long time but have felt that you weren't ready to accept it (you still sound uncomfortable about the idea).  I feel confident that if you were to reach out that your family would be there for you.

It sounds like your wife has been alienating you from your family. As a mother it makes me terribly sad to hear that you passed by your mom's house without stopping in, she surely misses you.

I know you are scared to talk with your family I was too, I stayed in a co-dependent marriage with an alcoholic 18 yearls longer than I should have because I was scared to tell the truth and even harder for me was to ask for help.  But once I did share I found that my family and friends were there for me in a big way and it was a huge relief to tell the truth of my life... .no more hiding. 

Panda39,

Yes when I think about that I passed my mom's house and not seeing my mom her (lives about an hour away), I can say that is crazy.  But when I feel it, I get scared.  I have drank the Kool Aid that my wife has set out for me. 

I think also I am scared is that I shared some stuff with them about 3 years ago about my relationship and all were very supportive (even one gave me a good lawyer name) then I went back to my wife.  I told my wife that 'when things were going good'.  That has been repeated to me by my wife many many times over the last 3 years - labeling my codependent, family is horrible, etc.  I also feel ashamed that I went back to her after sharing some of that stuff with my family.  I am afraid of getting them involved emotionally again.  I know it probably is my unhealthiness as they would embrace me back.  Or maybe it is the realization that if I do share it with them again... .it will be the sign that it is the end of my marriage.  Much sadness to think about that.  (but I know I can't live the other way)

My mantra when I was leaving my marriage was from a Pink song... ."Have you ever looked fear in the face and said I just don't care"... .my SO when he left his wife used Star Trek for is inspiration... .Boldly Go!

Just listened to that song for the first time.  Thanks for sharing. 

I encourage you to push through your fear and wife's negative talk and reach out to your family and friends.

Thanks for the encouragement.  You are right.  The 2 friends I have shared it with have been super supportive and have suspected all along by my actions. 

[Sluggo]

YES All4BVM. The put downs wear our spirit down. It is psychic injury. We lose pieces of our soul every day. .

ladylee,

Yes that is so true... .We lose a piece of ourselves each day.  I was told by a friend who I haven't seen in about 4 years, he said you look really worn down and beat up.  My sister (told a mutual acquaintance I know) said that 'he was so much happier before'.  My wife left for a 9 month period to go back to her home country and I did even say to my T that I feel so much better.  I felt in control as I could hangup the phone if she started with the raging or put downs. 

I guess now the work is to allow those pieces we lost to be found again. 

[Sluggo]

I am in the process of trying to separate from my husband of 17 years. This stuff isn't easy.

Vortex, 

I don't know much of your story... .When did you start this process of separation?  Where are you at now with it.  When did you finally see the pattern of abuse clear enough that you knew something had to change.  A friend of mine told me... .I will support you whatever you do - stay separated or go back to live with her - if you do go back to live with her I will know that it is not time yet.  No judgement. 

My first question is, "Are the kids safe with her?" I know that is a horrible question to ask but I think it is important to ask yourself that question. If you don't feel that the kids are safe, then the sooner you contact a lawyer, the better.

Meeting with a lawyer on Friday and hope to meet with another one also this week.  The sad reality is that if I allowed that type of control over me before (and I was a buffer for the kids), that control will be just transferred to the kids.  Two of my daughters started sleeping with her since I left.  Nothing sexual what so ever but not really sure if that is healthy.  My 16yr son has been given the 'man of the house roll it seems'.  This is just after 9 days of being gone.   

I want to echo what the others said and encourage you to reach out to your family. My stbx alienated me from my family and I didn't even realize it. I have made a lot of changes in my life and am now hanging out with my family more these days. It is interesting that they keep making comments like, "You seem more like yourself than you have in years." When I first went to my family about the situation a couple of years ago, I was so scared. I was afraid that they would judge me. I was afraid that I would look like a complete idiot. I was afraid of so many different things. In the end, I had nothing to fear. They were very supportive and have stayed out of the way and have let me work through things at my own pace without pressuring me to stay or go.

I echo all those sentiments that you say.  I was so scared. I was afraid that they would judge me. I was afraid that I would look like a complete idiot. I was afraid of so many different things.  That is exactly how I feel.  I have treated them so poorly... .especially my mom and sister.  How embarrassing. 

My family isn't perfect and has a lot of dysfunction in it but is sure helps to know that I am not alone. I have slowly been telling parts of my story to family and friends. In many cases, I am being validated because they saw some of this stuff a long time ago. Or, if they didn't see all of it, they had an inkling that something wasn't quite right.

My father just passed away a few weeks ago.  He lived with us for about 9 months.  To come to find out he had been sharing the dysfunction that had been happening in the home.  It confirmed to them that the inklings may be true. 

It is so difficult to process things and figure out the best course of action when kids are involved. If I didn't have 4 kids with my spouse, I think my decisions would be so much easier. For years, I thought that sucking it up and keeping my mouth shut was the best because I wanted to give my kids an in tact home. It isn't in tact. It is broken. My kids do no respect their dad at all. He is dismissive of me and them. I thought I was crazy. As the kids get older, they notice and make comments about it. I have friends that have seen it and commented on it. It isn't just me. I am not crazy. It takes time to digest it all.

Yes the home is broken and I am giving the kids a horrible example of what a spouse should be.  I have assumed the subservient role in our relationship for the entire time.  I have taught my kids by example how to cower to an abusive person.  I have taught so many things by staying there because I wanted an' intact home, not be divorced, not confront the issues, etc.  It has been a big price. 

[vortex of confusion]

I don't know much of your story... .When did you start this process of separation?  Where are you at now with it.  When did you finally see the pattern of abuse clear enough that you knew something had to change.  A friend of mine told me... .I will support you whatever you do - stay separated or go back to live with her - if you do go back to live with her I will know that it is not time yet.  No judgement. 

It has been a long and grueling process. I think it was in 2013 when I realized that things were really messed up. Prior to that, I would make excuses for him. I knew something wasn't right before that. For most of our marriage, I have known that something wasn't quite right. I thought that I could fix things by trying to change myself and be a better wife. It has been a roller coaster ride. Right now, we are still living in the same house. I sleep on the couch and he has the bedroom to himself. He got laid off in December. We have agreed that he will move out as soon as he gets a job.

That is a big step. For the longest time, there were a million reasons why he couldn't/wouldn't leave. At one point, I was going to move out with the kids. The kids didn't want any part of that and freaked out so I scrapped that idea and went back to trying to figure out how to navigate things.

I am really worried that he is going to deliberately delay getting a job so he can delay moving out. It is painful to be in the same house with him. There are days when he tries to act like everything is normal and pretend to be a husband. Most days, we coexist and that is it.

Meeting with a lawyer on Friday and hope to meet with another one also this week.  The sad reality is that if I allowed that type of control over me before (and I was a buffer for the kids), that control will be just transferred to the kids.  Two of my daughters started sleeping with her since I left.  Nothing sexual what so ever but not really sure if that is healthy.  My 16yr son has been given the 'man of the house roll it seems'.  This is just after 9 days of being gone. 

I recently went away for a couple of days as a sort of trial. I made sure that the kids could contact me and had a cell phone. I had a back up plan in case anything went wrong while I was away. I was even willing to come back if needed. I was surprised by the outcome. The kids said they had a great time with dad and enjoyed his company. It was heartbreaking because they said that it seemed like the minute I came home dad got on edge again. I don't know what it is about my presence that sets him off. Even though it was a bit sad, it let me know that he can be dad and that all of his BS is just that. It is BS that he pulls to get out of doing stuff when I am around.

I echo all those sentiments that you say.  I was so scared. I was afraid that they would judge me. I was afraid that I would look like a complete idiot. I was afraid of so many different things.  That is exactly how I feel.  I have treated them so poorly... .especially my mom and sister.  How embarrassing. 

I know that feeling. I have sided with my husband so many times over the years. I have made excuses for him. In the early days, everybody used to hang out at my house. Over the years, my house became off limits because nobody wanted to come over and upset anything. My family of origin is full of dysfunction. As I have detached from him and started to do my own thing and find my way again, family members are commenting that I seem more like myself than I have in years.

Yes the home is broken and I am giving the kids a horrible example of what a spouse should be.  I have assumed the subservient role in our relationship for the entire time.  I have taught my kids by example how to cower to an abusive person.  I have taught so many things by staying there because I wanted an' intact home, not be divorced, not confront the issues, etc.  It has been a big price. 

I told one of my kids the other day that I love her daddy. I don't think it is healthy for us to continue to live together because we can't seem to get along no matter what we do and that I think it is best for everybody if daddy lives somewhere else. We can see him on the weekends and still hang out with him. He just won't live with us. My kids seemed relieved that he will be moving out. The oldest keeps asking how soon it will be. She is ready for him to be gone. It makes me sad that things have gotten to this point. I had hoped that I could find a way to share the same space for the kids.