BPD mother causing trouble in my marriage

[koseligb]

Hey everyone. I found this site after doing some Google searches for dealing with mother/mother in law with borderline personality disorder. Last spring I finally, after 30 years, came to the realization that her behavior was NOT normal. There is usually a conflict every time my husband and I spend time with my parents (usually extended periods of time around the holidays). It's wearing on both of us, but especially him, since he feels like he has been the primary target of the unpredictable behaviors.

We're now in marriage counseling together, since he's not sure he can continue our marriage - we aren't sure what to do anymore, and he doesn't want to see my relationship with my parents completely dissolve over him. (It tears me apart because I don't really agree with him there - I'd rather hold onto the healthy relationships in my life... .). We are working through some other items too, but that is one of the biggest stress factors in our marriage.

Anyways - lots of info for an introduction. Hoping to find some answers and guidance here through reading some of the threads and going through the lessons.

[foggydew]

My mother came to live with us after my father's death, and proceeded to try and eliminate my then boyfriend from my life (we married later). I had to move her out and keep the relationships separate - it was often hard work, as I am an only child. We seldom spent time all together, as there was always a problem after a short time. But I chose my husband over my mother, though I did not neglect her.

[Notwendy]

It took me a long time to discover the cause of my BPD mother's behavior, because, in my FOO, we were supposed to not say anything about her or suggest there was anything not normal about her. I knew, as a teen, that her behaviors were off, but so much of them were passed as normal. But it is good that you know now and have some information to start working on.

It is good that you are in MC. I would say that it is not unusual for children growing up in dysfunctional families to have some relationship issues. It would make sense considering what our role models and examples of marriage were. We can unlearn them though, and learn emotionally healthier ways to relate to others. Counseling can help us do this. How we learn them is this: we learn to walk on eggshells, or be co-dependent, or be enmeshed as a way to function in our families. This is necessary in the context of them- it is how we adapt. But when we take these behaviors into marriages with other people-it isn't a healthy way to relate. Here is something even more interesting: we often pick partners with some matching issues- not the same as our mothers, but with some traits that we use our coping skills with.

Are you in personal T? One suggestion is to not just focus on your mother, but how growing up with her affected you. You don't have BPD, in fact, you could have a lot of resilience and strong points from growing up in your FOO, but you may have learned some coping behaviors that don't work as well for you with other people.

You may have to put some distance between you and your mother for the sake of your marriage. This is sad, but unfortunately, some people with BPD triangulate, split people black and force divisions. I think for your H's sake, he needs this to be your decision. I can understand how he doesn't want to be the one to come between you and your mother. This is an important relationship and I can see how someone would feel uncomfortable interfering with this. Also, your relationship with your mother is not his responsibility. It is yours to work out.

Distance doesn't necessarily mean not seeing or talking to her. That is an option that some people take, but other ones are to develop boundaries. Many of us growing up with mothers with BPD have poor boundaries and it is a behavior we can learn. Another is to have less contact with her. It is also OK for you to visit her on your own and not subject your H to her behaviors.

The other side of your interactions with her are yours- and your behavior is the part that you have control of- to learn new patterns. Often our behavior is connected to our mothers when there is conflict. It may not even be something we are aware of as it is a pattern we learned growing up. One common pattern is the drama triangle ( read about it) where various members take on different roles. It is likely the two of you "trigger" each other. Your H may not like being around your mother, but in addition, he may not like being around you when you are with your mother because of the patterns between you.

The good news is that, with some work ( and help from a T) you can work on this, take care of the role of you and your mother while continuing MC with your H. He may also have issues from his FOO, but those are his responsibility. Doing the personal work to deal with your mother better can have benefits for you and all your relationships.

[koseligb]

Thank you Notwendy! I did see a personal T just under a year ago to learn how to better communicate with my mom (I went after one particularly ridiculous incident helped me finally could see through the fog and understand her behavior was not normal), and my T was actually the one who recognized the traits after I described my experiences - I had never heard of BPD before. (I had heard of NPD and we thought it was maybe that - but as soon as I started learning more about BPD, I had that huge sense of relief/validation that I wasn't going crazy, like it sounds like so many others have here, because so much fit).

I'm not currently seeing a therapist on my own, though I'm considering going back again. My memories of childhood are pretty foggy, but I feel that it took me a long time to really become self-aware, and there was definitely some splitting taking place in our household between my sister and I (she was the golden child, though in adulthood it goes back and forth now). H has helped me tremendously - my mom was extremely critical of others (particularly other women) when we were growing up and it took me a long time (with H's help) to train that behavior out of me. So, I'm thinking there are probably behavior patterns that I'm not even seeing yet as a result of observing her behaviors as a kid.

We're going to have to draw some clear boundaries for sure. We've already implemented a time limit on how long we spend at their house over holidays, though we may be shortening it to staying no more than 2 nights based on how last Christmas went. H has been cornered multiple times by my parents (usually my dad acting on behalf of my mom - he is her enabler) to be berated for how they perceive he's acting towards them, and we've previously decided that any time that happens, we will leave immediately. We've also told my parents that if they want to discuss something with one of us in a situation where they want to "corner" us, we both need to be there together, not separated. We're also considering gently asking them to step into a session with us too... .it's a long shot, but I feel like having a third party mediating a conversation would be so helpful.

Either way - I think you're right about seeing a personal T again in addition to MC.

[Notwendy]

IMHO, I would not have your parents step into a session with your and your H. This isn't a professional opinion but just my own from my situation. Although it appeared to me growing up that my mother was the problem, my father was just as enmeshed. They were a pair.

Families like this have poor boundaries. IMHO, I think the boundary between (you and your H) and ( your parents)  is the one to set, not to invite them into T. Talking is not likely to change them. They have been doing what they have been doing for years, it works for them.

Boundaries are not for keeping them out of your life unless you choose to do so, but for protecting what is important to you. Now, they may not like new boundaries and may react to them, but you still have the right to have them. For one, it is inappropriate of them to treat your H like that. How he relates to you is the business between the two of you, not them.

Boundaries can help you have them in your life without infringing on your marriage. They won't stop doing what they are doing. One way we have coped with visits is to stay at a hotel. It is more expensive but it gives us privacy and we get to see them with less conflict. Shorter visits help too. My mother does not respect boundaries. When she visits, she snoops all over the house. We can't follow her around. She is sneaky. She will say she is going to the bathroom, goes to the bathroom, then slips out to another room to rummage through drawers.

No amount of therapy will change this. We could talk to her for eternity. Instead, when she comes over, we lock things up- tax forms, bank statement, bills- things we want to keep private. If she snoops through clothing, or the shampoo in the bathroom, well she isn't going to find much.

In a way, we "mom-proofed" the house much like you do this with a small child. A small child doesn't listen to an explanation. You just have to keep locks on things you want the child to keep out of ,while still caring about the child. In a similar way, I have "mom-proofed" the relationships that matter to me. You can "Mom- ( parent) proof" your marriage.

[koseligb]

Families like this have poor boundaries. IMHO, I think the boundary between (you and your H) and ( your parents)  is the one to set, not to invite them into T. Talking is not likely to change them. They have been doing what they have been doing for years, it works for them.

Boundaries are not for keeping them out of your life unless you choose to do so, but for protecting what is important to you. Now, they may not like new boundaries and may react to them, but you still have the right to have them. For one, it is inappropriate of them to treat your H like that. How he relates to you is the business between the two of you, not them.

Thank you. Sometimes it's just so tempting to just say something when the opportunity presents itself - example (have to provide a little backstory), we used to use a "family tracking" app (H and I started using it for when I would go out running by myself) that my parents and his parents used to be part of the whole "location sharing" circle. We eventually realized that (a) it wasn't necessary for my safety when running and (b) it wasn't healthy for any of us, so H and I uninstalled the app. I got a message from my mom wondering why I wasn't on there anymore - I just told her we felt it wasn't healthy for H or I to know where we were 24/7 - she said she was just hoping it wasn't something she or my dad had done. I wanted to use that opportunity to say - well, you and dad have done enough already to hurt my relationship with H.

[Notwendy]

That kind of statement could be an invitation to a productive discussion if the person making it is emotionally healthy. However with someone with BPD it is an invitation to the drama triangle.

This is how it tends to go. Mom is a bit miffed that you took off the app, but she isn't going to say this directly, so she says it indirectly " I hope it isn't something I did". When someone with BPD is having some bad feelings, they can't manage them themselves so they seek out someone to manage them for them. To admit to this fear/feeling is too much, so they tend to do it indirectly.


She either needs you to manage the feelings in one of two ways: one is reassurance that she didn't do anything wrong, to absolve her of any possible shame ( as being wrong triggers shame). The other way is to blame you and project on you. This is done by you ( thinking this is an opportunity) open the door to - "well mom, it has something to do with you." This will trigger her into anger and she will blame you/blow up at you. This gets rid of the bad feelings. It also does something else for them. Anger has an invigorating aspect to it. The brain releases all kinds of chemicals. People can actually crave this anger to reset the bad feelings.

You have some choices. Lie and absolve her, which is dishonest and co-dependent, so it feels really icky to do this. Be honest and fall into that pattern that is so familiar but then you feel all covered with her emotions while she feels fine, or just not engage in this at all. I choose the latter.

When you can see your own role in this familiar pattern, then, you are able to step out of it.

[Notwendy]

Once you start watching this, it gets more apparent. My mother will do things behind my back and then, if she gets worried I might find out, she finds some way to tell me in a cloaked, indirect fashion. One thing I do know is that she sends one of my siblings money. Yet she worries that I might get angry ( because she preferentially sends this sibling money over the other sibs) because, she doesn't want me to be angry. She is concerned about how I might react, so when she calls me up to tell me this, she calls me up for another reason, and then says it quickly as if I might not hear it, This way, she says it but when I am distracted.

Now the honest truth is that, it is her money, and how she spends her money is none of my business. But a while back I got a phone call about something else, a movie or something, and the conversation went like this: "Then, you wouldn't believe what happened, the main character said this and then and oh I just sent X some money and then the leading lady screamed and the bad guy got her. "

So, my response was to think to myself "huh?- what did she say?" But then I caught myself before, I might have asked or said something which could have triggered her into some anger spew on the phone. This one, I learned to let go of. It isn't my place to manage her feelings.

If it was something important to me, I would have found some way to discuss it, maybe not then, but I think we need to learn to pick our battles, and when baited, let go of the bait.