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Author Topic: "Do you feel loved"? She asked  (Read 522 times)
joshbjoshb
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« on: March 13, 2016, 01:39:16 PM »

We had to go somewhere with the children. As usual, she is blaming, screaming, part of me and part of the children. Then in the car she says "I feel bad for you, you can't even look at me and say that I am beautiful because I am driving you crazy".

I responded that yes, when I am being yelled at I am not really in the mood of complimenting her.

Then she was like - do you feel loved?

I said no.

She mumbled something (maybe that she feels bad for me) and that was the end of that conversation.

Those BPD people are really funny. Obviously she doesn't take any of it to heart, it's almost like a fleeing data point for her, a little ray of light that made her think that maybe what she is doing is not really a good idea, then back to her "normal" self.

I used to feel horrible for not feeling loved. But today I understand that my emotional needs are not going to be fulfilled by her - so I might as well figure them out myself. To me, her love is as high or low as her feelings - and it's nothing about me. She can't care less if I was a piece of wood or a different person - as long as I fulfill her needs or fit with her current narrative, I am good. If not - I am horrible. It's not about me - it's only about her.

Anyways, just wanted to share
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sweetheart
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« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2016, 05:43:57 AM »

Hello joshbjoshb   

I hear you, and feeling unloved and uncared for can be very tough to bear.

I wonder though if perhaps your w is trying to let you know in her own way that she does understand how difficult things can be. That she realises sometimes, maybe a lot of times she makes situations tougher because of her illness and that deep down inside she really doesn't feel worthy of being loved.

pwBPD can be self aware, it's the carrying through into positively driven actions that's the tricky bit.

In looking at ways of always continuing to see if things can be improved, how could you have validated your w's initial comment? What might that sound like?

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waverider
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« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2016, 08:47:12 AM »

Could be projection. In the sense it is not about whether you feel loved or not, more about whether she believes she is capable of it or not. She is trying to transfer that opinion on to you rather than having it of herself. Similar to her feeling like a failure so she tries to make it out that it is your opinion she is a failure.

Her feeling of being unable to love someone may in itself be a projection of inability to love herself or indeed be lovable.

This can come full circle by extrapolating to you dont feel loved, so how can you love her back, validating her original self doubt.

Thrown in for good measure, why should I love someone else when no one loves me?
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zodi 2010

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« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2016, 10:55:50 PM »

My pwBPD often says she doesn't feel loved and that's all she really wants... .to feel loved.  She also says love doesn't last.  If she isn't thinking about me and I'm not physically present then she can't love me because I basically don't exist.  Showing love and feeling loved are very complicated for my pwBPD.
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waverider
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« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2016, 12:10:22 AM »

My pwBPD often says she doesn't feel loved and that's all she really wants... .to feel loved.  She also says love doesn't last.  If she isn't thinking about me and I'm not physically present then she can't love me because I basically don't exist.  Showing love and feeling loved are very complicated for my pwBPD.

More on this

HERE
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zodi 2010

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« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2016, 09:27:04 AM »

So are you saying this is a developmental issue and not just her view?  She says she can't feel the love... .warm fuzzies.  She also says when I touch her sexually at all it drives her warm fuzzies away and it becomes physical sensations with nothing positive emotionally, however, she does start to feel negative emotions.
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waverider
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« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2016, 04:52:08 PM »

So are you saying this is a developmental issue and not just her view?  She says she can't feel the love... .warm fuzzies.  She also says when I touch her sexually at all it drives her warm fuzzies away and it becomes physical sensations with nothing positive emotionally, however, she does start to feel negative emotions.

For some pwBPD the physical is not an extension of the emotional, rather it is a replacement. Often pwBPD will use sexuality without emotion almost as a tool. As a result they can interpret sexual advances from others in much the same way.

This may be a consequence of early history. It could also be the source of negative associations.

This is not the same for all but it can happen.
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zodi 2010

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« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2016, 04:57:56 PM »

So you think she may see my sexual advances as a tool?  She has blatantly told me u just want to f@#$ me.  This is after doing nice things for her or cuddling her.  She says I have my own agenda and my agenda is always to get sex.  She says that is my only motivation for doing anything.
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waverider
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« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2016, 05:05:34 PM »

So you think she may see my sexual advances as a tool?  She has blatantly told me u just want to f@#$ me.  This is after doing nice things for her or cuddling her.  She says I have my own agenda and my agenda is always to get sex.  She says that is my only motivation for doing anything.

Maybe, there certainly seems like some kind of deep seated association with it. It would probably take intense therapy to work out if there is a link buried somewhere in her past. Its not necessarily a reflection on you.
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waverider
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« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2016, 05:11:22 PM »

Is she, or has she ever been, sexual, is it a matter of splitting the emotional from the physical, rather than finding it unpleasant?

The former could represent approach to sex, and the latter may be due to a bad experience or upbringing.
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zodi 2010

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« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2016, 06:02:49 PM »

She struggles to be sexual.  She tries and feels like she does it wrong.  Being sexual together has created a lot of tears and negative emotions which have lead to cutting incidents.  She has stated she wants to feel loved during and after sex but can only remember feeling those positive emotions once in her life maybe twice.  She hates foreplay and just wants sex.  Says she hates feeling aroused.  She does have abuse in her background.  For most of her adult life she isolated herself from any type of relationship outside immediate family.  Not sure how to help her overcome her negative response to intimate touching.

Not sure what you mean by approach to sex... .
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waverider
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« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2016, 08:02:41 PM »

She struggles to be sexual.  She tries and feels like she does it wrong.  Being sexual together has created a lot of tears and negative emotions which have lead to cutting incidents.  She has stated she wants to feel loved during and after sex but can only remember feeling those positive emotions once in her life maybe twice.  She hates foreplay and just wants sex.  Says she hates feeling aroused.  She does have abuse in her background.  For most of her adult life she isolated herself from any type of relationship outside immediate family.  Not sure how to help her overcome her negative response to intimate touching.

Not sure what you mean by approach to sex... .

"approach" really meant the way it is viewed as a means to an end rather than as part of the emotional experience.

Though that doesn't seem the case here. It sounds like it has some deep seated negative association. It could need some kind of post traumatic stress type therapy to deal with that, which is a specialized area and not something you can do.

Possibly in her mind, Emotion=validation, sex=objectification & invalidation.
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zodi 2010

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« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2016, 09:29:03 PM »

Oh it is definitely a means to an end... .she believes it's all about orgasms.  She says i only want to have sex so i can have an orgasm.  She can barely grasp how emotions can be involved although she does want emotional involvement.  She just doesn't know how.  I believe your right on with the objectification and invalidation... .she has called herself a sexual toy.  She feels used after sex, dirty.  How can I help her?  I'm very sexual and want to share my enjoyment of it with her.  She says she feels tortured when she's aroused and gets angry if I just want to do foreplay and not have sex.  If I touch her sexually there must be sex is how she feels.  No messing around.
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an0ught
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« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2016, 10:51:21 AM »

Hi joshbjoshb,

not feeling loved in your relationship is sad .

It is in any case important to pay attention to how we communicate. Validation is a key connection skill and being in a marriage with kids means you need to work together.

We had to go somewhere with the children. As usual, she is blaming, screaming, part of me and part of the children. Then in the car she says "I feel bad for you, you can't even look at me and say that I am beautiful because I am driving you crazy".

(A) I responded that yes, when I am being yelled at I am not really in the mood of complimenting her.

Then she was like - do you feel loved?

(B) I said no.

She mumbled something (maybe that she feels bad for me) and that was the end of that conversation.

(C) Those BPD people are really funny. Obviously she doesn't take any of it to heart, it's almost like a fleeing data point for her, a little ray of light that made her think that maybe what she is doing is not really a good idea, then back to her "normal" self.

(A) was validating. There was tension and you did not flinch away from confirming that she is causing problems for you. You also added some useful information and qualified your response.

(B) was b&w from your side. Understandable, not really invalidating as she expected something negative but still hard to swallow for her. A response along the lines of A may have been better but still you stayed true to yourself which is key.

(C) From all what you have written in (B) your message has been heard. This was a tough conversation for both of you! She has twice inquired about your emotions and now is talking stereotypes. How are you really feeling?
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