I had this silly idea that we could be friends

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I had this silly idea that we could be friends. I thought that it would make it easier to let go if I knew he wasn't gone entirely. What I wasn't taking into account is the fact he really does have a mental illness. Somehow, I thought he was just throwing a tantrum to get his own way, but over the past 48 hours I've witnessed him swinging from one extreme to the other and back again. He really is all over the place emotionally speaking. He can't control his behaviour, rather than won't control it. He was adamant that he couldn't dump me if we were just friends, but I think we're heading for no contact again. I have to steel myself for the worst scenario because the fallback just isn't going to work.

Lifewriter x

[Lifewriter16]

I had this silly idea that we could be friends. I thought that it would make it easier to let go if I knew he wasn't gone entirely. What I wasn't taking into account is the fact he really does have a mental illness. Somehow, I thought he was just throwing a tantrum to get his own way, but over the past 48 hours I've witnessed him swinging from one extreme to the other and back again. He really is all over the place emotionally speaking. He can't control his behaviour, rather than won't control it. He was adamant that he couldn't dump me if we were just friends, but I think we're heading for no contact again. I have to steel myself for the worst scenario because the fallback just isn't going to work.

Lifewriter x

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Lifewriter, Nothing wrong with the concept of remaining friends, but like much of BPD the reality is different.  Just the way it is when a pwBPD is involved, in my view.  LJ

[Rayban]

In my experience, if you're not with them (in a relationship with) Then you're against them. Splitting is inevitable. At the end of a romantic relationship, devaluation if not painted black is already underway. Maintaining contact in the form of friendship with a person with BPD is just fertile grounds for more abuse, undermining, and a way for them to keep us as an option, to feed them when no one else will.

[Mutt]

Hi Lifewriter16,

I don't think that it's a silly idea, but your thoughts about remaining friends may change, when you have more time behind you.

[steelwork]

Hi Lifewriter16,

I don't think that it's a silly idea, but your thoughts about remaining friends may change, when you have more time behind you.

Yeah, mine have. I really thought I wanted that at one time and was so sad that he blew up the bridge. Now I only wish we'd had a more respectful and caring end.

[Dhand77]

I remember during my discard, I asked her to block me. I wanted to maintain my dignity, and knew that if she didn't block me, I'd reach out and beg and plead. I was told "I don't block people I still want in my life. I want us to be friends". Of course I wasn't having it. 5 days later, she was posting pics of her and the replacement out together. BOOM. I was LIVID and really torn into her.

I've been blocked ever since.

Guess she doesn't want me in her life anymore. Bwahahahahahahaha.

[Confused108]

My ex as she discarded and devalued me just was going to walk away. Then at first I thought we could remain friends. Well at first she told me she need space to think. So I said fine. Days later she got back to me and sent me a FB message at like 145 am! Woke me outta my sleep since my FB is connected to my IPhone with Messenger. She wrote me and said we can remain friends as long as I remember this is just for friends nothing else! Well I was livid! I sat there and thought how dare you! You run after me and after me the. Use me for 2 months. Now when your ready you dump my a$$ and now your gonna sit there and shove down my throat as long as I know it's just friends? Hell NO ! I wrote her back and as politely as I could I more or less told her what she was and she was toxic for me and I don't want her in my life.

[Fr4nz]

I think that being friends with BPD sufferers is extremely unlikely, even after a long time. And it is not going to last anyway, since it always ends up to be a one-sided friendship.

Take also into consideration my case:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=293648.0;prev_next=prev

We met completely by accident after 13 months of NC. It seemed that she painted me white again, so much that she even asked me to spend the evening with her (I had to refuse since I had to attend a friend's birthday).

Unbeknownst to me, she splitted me black again the day after.

Indeed, when I reached out 1 month later (we didn't have contact in the meantime), to see if she wanted to spend some time with me, she refused with a completely illogical and unfounded reason (very likely the true reasons are different; anyway, I don't care anymore about her, it is unacceptable to be treated so badly).

[Lifewriter16]

To me, I think the problem is that once there has been an attachment on both sides, the abandonment issues and the rage will never go away. In the last two weeks, I have watched my BPDxbf shifting from being sure he will be fine if we are just friends because it will give him the emotional distance that he needs, to suggesting we can keep our options open for more in the future, to getting angry that I have finished with him when he doesn't know why, to getting exceedingly cross when I clarified my reasons, to telling me he's had enough of me and won't contact me again, then contacting me next morning to say he'll contact me in a week but I mustn't contact him. He's been all over the place. It certainly hasn't reduced his dysregulations, if anything it increased them.

And I noted a similar increase in dysregulations when the possibility of us just being friends first arose 9 months ago. He chose to go no contact instead. It's as if it has to be ALL or NOTHING. I have to be the perfect 'anchor' and wife for him or he just can't cope with the relationship at all because of the impact it has on his emotions/abandonment issues.

Lifewriter x

[Mutt]

He's been all over the place.

For now, he's unstable, you don't have to be the perfect anchor to soothe him.

[Sadly]

It's strange. My BPD partner wanted the friends thing. I told him no way could I go through the amazing beginning, awful middle and dragged out ending of this relationship and just be friends. I have friends, but they wouldn't be if they talked and acted the way he did to me or me to them, not that I would. I realise now his idea of friends was to continue as before but with no commitment on his part. I was just there until he found someone else, all the time I'm thinking, he loves me really, he'll come back. He did for a while but it wasn't working, is all spoiled and is now in its last bitter hurtful stages again. I don't get the friends thing, don't see how it's possible.   x

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Sadly.

You sound in a painful place. It's such a shame that bitterness and regrets seem to be the only outcome for a BPD relationship once it goes wrong. I sat and asked myself what I really wanted from my BPDxbf and realised that I want him to NOT have a mental illness. In addition, I want him to handle the ending of our relationship in the way a person WITHOUT a mental illness would handle it. I want him to be someone else.

My relationship is in the bitter stages too. It's officially ended and it was me who pulled the trigger, but it happened on the spur of the moment as a reaction to fear and pain. Did I really want to end it? Yes, because his behaviour is unacceptable to me, and no, because I really wish he'd change those behaviours so we could carry on. Whatever my intentions, the ending has taken place and I'm stuck with it, but there's nothing good about that ending. That's the frustration.

I suggested we be friends because I want to redeem something good from the relationship. However, I'm beginning to think that the good I perceived was never there anyway, it was only in my head. His response to being friends is mixed. I don't think he's looking for someone else because he has is separated wife to play BPD-games with if I'm not around. Part of him thinks that being friends is a good idea because the closeness of 'love' is too triggering for him. However, it seems that the distance of friends makes him feel abandoned, so we're still on the seesaw. Another part of him feels he's driven me away. Yet another is trying to blame me for messing it up. All the characteristic BPD behaviours and reactions are still there as we debate being friends, so I don't think it is going to work. He's currently not communicating with me at all until Saturday and I doubt he'll contact me except to tell me he's had enough. I feel like I'm waiting for execution. And the wait is excruciating. I am feeling very, very sad.

Lifewriter x

[Sadly]

Hi Lifewriter, seems we are both in a very sad place right now. I am sat here crying again, lost lonely and devastated. I let it happen. We were supposed to be going on holiday tomorrow but I have always known it could end like this. Poor you, it doesn't matter if you instigated it, the hurt still hurts doesn't it. I want all those things too, I want him not to be what he is, not just for me but for himself. If he was a child I would hold him and kiss away his pain but we can't. I am not sure I have read about anyone here who have truly become friends, I don't want to be his friend. I know what you mean about excruciating waiting. Every time my phone pings its like a stab with a knife but whatever the next message be it good or bad, conciliatory or condemning the fact won't change, it's over. That's our sadness.   xx

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Lifewriter, seems we are both in a very sad place right now. I am sat here crying again, lost lonely and devastated. I let it happen. We were supposed to be going on holiday tomorrow but I have always known it could end like this. Poor you, it doesn't matter if you instigated it, the hurt still hurts doesn't it. I want all those things too, I want him not to be what he is, not just for me but for himself. If he was a child I would hold him and kiss away his pain but we can't. I am not sure I have read about anyone here who have truly become friends, I don't want to be his friend. I know what you mean about excruciating waiting. Every time my phone rings its like a stab with a knife but whatever the next message be it good or bad, conciliatory or condemning the fact won't change, it's over. That's our sadness.   xx

That's spot on. I'm sending you a big hug.  

Love Lifewriter

[Sadly]

  to you too my friend. Xx

[Lifewriter16]

Thanks. It alleviates the pain a little to know I am not alone. 

Lifewriter x

[Sadly]

Right back at you. I wish I had the nerve to turn my phone off. I did, but only for about 2 minutes.   xx

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Sadly, Next time, maybe you could turn your phone off for five minutes.  Then ten.  You get the idea.

LuckyJim

[Sadly]

  I do mate, thank you, but would have trouble writing to you guys if I did. x

[Lifewriter16]

I was surprised, but my BPDxbf did email me on Saturday as he said he would. However, all he did was update me on the outcome of his mental health assessment. I replied in kind, restricting my comments to making encouraging 'noises' about the assessment and asking him no questions. He didn't reply to my response. I've deleted his phone number and email address so I can't contact him unless I turn up on his doorstep. I think it's highly unlikely that I'll ever hear from him again.

The more detached I am becoming, the more I am beginning to question whether I was ever of any real significance to him. I so wanted to believe that we loved each other that I have blinded myself to what I suspect was quite obvious to others. As I wake up to these things, I feel sad.

I am struggling with the distinct lack of my BPDxbf in my life. I feel so empty. I think it's likely that I'll keep checking my email account for some weeks to come, hoping for an email from him, until I finally accept that it's over and I'll never hear from him again. He's told me so many times that it was over and yet it was nothing of the sort. This time, it looks like it really is. And although I resist it, it's probably the best thing all round. Why does it take so long to let go even when there is verbal abuse?

Lifewriter x

[myself]

Hi Lifewriter. What are the deeper reasons you're having trouble letting go? The ones that are about You, not Him. The sense of emptiness you mentioned? Where does that come from, and how could you help yourself get past that kind of feeling/situation without using a pwBPD to fill it? Are you leaving it up to him to end the relationship so you don't have to do it yourself? Deleting his contact info is a good step if you're truly choosing to walk away, but if you're still waiting for him to contact you and then responding when he does... .Harder to let go when you're not actually letting go, you know? What's best for YOU? What kinds of friends do you want, need, deserve? Keep the focus there, and don't accept too little, or abuse.

[Lifewriter16]

I'm not leaving it up to him to end the relationship. It's actually over. I ended it. The problem is, I'm still in the relationship emotionally even though it's no longer happening. There's something out of synch in my head.  I am struggling to detach. I can't say why I'm struggling because I simply don't know.

Lifewriter x

[C.Stein]

I am struggling to detach. I can't say why I'm struggling because I simply don't know.

I will speculate that the reason you can't detach is because there is a part of you that doesn't want to.  Even with all the dysfunction and pain, the relationship filled some fundamental emotional need within you (to be loved and wanted?).  Perhaps it isn't so much him you can't detach from but this need instead?

[Cynthia]

I too tried to say that when we get through this "transition  period" we could be "friends"... .how naive was I. In his mind I wronged him in the worst way. For 35 years I gave everthing, the support and help I have given so quickly forgotten . In his eyes I may just as well have sprouted horns & a tail. Apparantly I am just a mean, evil, nasty b___. So far from what he had always said, right up until I left.

It's so sad, I know there's nothing I can do or say. I have to let him spout his lies and just move on. Heartwrenching... .

[Invictus01]

The thing is - the disordered behavior doesn't apply just to relationships, it applies to friendships too. A good friendship has all the same characteristics of a relationship, just a few things missing. And so, a disordered individual would do the same thing to a friendship as he or she would do to a relationship - destabilize the cr@p out of it and blow it up to pieces.

While I was dating my girlie, I watched one of her co-workers become one of her best friends and then the biggest enemy to the point of her telling me that she might need a restraining order from her friend because she threatened my girlie with violence. All that happened within 3 months. It was bizarre to watch. And when it was all said and done, she told me "And that's why I just don't trust anybody"

[Herodias]

I feel for all the pain on this thread... .It's tough when they do things that force you to send them away. We can't live like that and they are not going to ever change. It's really sad. Then I wonder who they really world choose to be with in the end. He looked me in the eyes and said I wish I could just be alone! Sad... .

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Everyone.

Thanks for all your posts.      

It is tough having to send our pwBPDs away and it is painful and heartwrenching. And that is made even harder by the fact that they can not see the pain and the emotional conflict we experience during this process and can only construe it as us not loving them enough/abandoning them. They can't see their role in the outcome of the relationship. They don't see the lengths we go to to not have to leave them - trying to be friends when we'd ideally want more being one of them. I am so glad that I don't have BPD. At least I'll have a chance at a healthy relationship eventually.

C.Stein, you suggest there's a part of me that doesn't want to detach. There is. I really wish that it wasn't necessary. My BPD can appear 'normal' sometimes and I enjoy the discussions we have about personal development and healing. It leaves me doubting my own sanity and wondering if I am the one with the problem. And, as you suggest, he gave me love and I don't want to go back to the emotional barren land that I generally live in. I have to really focus upon ALL of his behaviours and keep reminding myself that I can't just have the bits I like, I have to take the whole package. I think that I'm the kind of person who would do better at letting go if I went into another relationship but I'm not sure I'd achieve the changes I need to make if I did that and I'm not convinced that relationship would have a better outcome, I'm still traumatised by this one.

Love Lifewriter

[Ahoy]

Hi Everyone.

Thanks for all your posts.      

It is tough having to send our pwBPDs away and it is painful and heartwrenching. And that is made even harder by the fact that they can not see the pain and the emotional conflict we experience during this process and can only construe it as us not loving them enough/abandoning them. They can't see their role in the outcome of the relationship. They don't see the lengths we go to to not have to leave them - trying to be friends when we'd ideally want more being one of them. I am so glad that I don't have BPD. At least I'll have a chance at a healthy relationship eventually.

C.Stein, you suggest there's a part of me that doesn't want to detach. There is. I really wish that it wasn't necessary. My BPD can appear 'normal' sometimes and I enjoy the discussions we have about personal development and healing. It leaves me doubting my own sanity and wondering if I am the one with the problem. And, as you suggest, he gave me love and I don't want to go back to the emotional barren land that I generally live in. I have to really focus upon ALL of his behaviours and keep reminding myself that I can't just have the bits I like, I have to take the whole package. I think that I'm the kind of person who would do better at letting go if I went into another relationship but I'm not sure I'd achieve the changes I need to make if I did that and I'm not convinced that relationship would have a better outcome, I'm still traumatised by this one.

Love Lifewriter

I think this might be the hardest part! I'm quite needy, I loved the closeness and constant touching/togetherness of my relationship, watching DvD's in bed stroking her hair... .going from that back to nothing has just been unbearable!

See I feel going into another relationship will certainly take my mind of things too and give me the comfort that I crave, but like you said, trauma still exists, I am slowly detaching, I have certainly learned a great deal but has enough time passed at 3 months to start seeing someone new? No way!

This is where I think it takes a wise and a strong person to be willing to stay by themselves, to endure all this pain and discomfort, for the greater good, so we give our next relationship the best possible chance it has to blossom.

This is all good stuff!

[C.Stein]

C.Stein, you suggest there's a part of me that doesn't want to detach. There is. I really wish that it wasn't necessary. My BPD can appear 'normal' sometimes and I enjoy the discussions we have about personal development and healing. It leaves me doubting my own sanity and wondering if I am the one with the problem.

I understand that feeling LW.  It is hard to let go of the good and sometimes it is very easy to overlook the bad.  It is important see the whole and to recognize how much of an impact the bad has on the good.  The thing with BPD is it impacts all behavior, including the good, and perhaps that is what makes the good so good ... .but also is what makes the bad so bad.

I have also questioned my own role in my relationship.  I see how I "changed" as a result of the things my ex was doing.  On the surface they may not seem all that bad but the cumulative impact on me emotionally was severe.  I don't think I really saw or understood what it all was doing to me while I was in the relationship, at least not a clear cause and effect understanding.  I do know I was apprehensive, anxious and fearful but I didn't quite see the subtle but deep impact it was having on me emotionally.  

I think it is important we all look within ourselves in order to understand how we contributed to the dysfunction but own only what is ours to own.  This is what we need to grow and learn so we can find what we all want ... .a mutually loving, caring and respectful relationship that supports not only our own personal growth but also the growth of the relationship.  This is sadly something that can never be achieved with a pwBPD.  I struggle with this every day, to find a way to finally believe there was nothing I could do to get this type of relationship with my ex.  This also generates a lot of guilt and doubt within me.

And, as you suggest, he gave me love and I don't want to go back to the emotional barren land that I generally live in. I have to really focus upon ALL of his behaviours and keep reminding myself that I can't just have the bits I like, I have to take the whole package.

This is something we all struggle with LF.  Seeing the whole package is so very difficult sometimes.  One reason for this cognitive dissonance is because we have a hard time accepting we didn't see it, or we did but allowed it to pass.  I for one feel deeply betrayed by my ex and a big part of this is because I allowed myself to believe in her.  I put my faith and trust in her even when I knew I was taking a big risk in doing so.  When she blew that all apart everything I had convinced myself to believe and all the trust, hope and faith I had put into her vaporized and severely compromised my personal self.   Coming out of the FOG after the relationship ended and the increased clarity about what happened that came as a result made it much much worse initially.  I think this may be the biggest reason why I have struggled so much with letting her go and healing from this.

I can't blame her for this either.  I made a conscious choice to get in a relationship with her knowing it might end this way.   There were numerous occasions where I should have said no, I can't do this, but I choose instead to believe and trust in her.  This has obviously caused me to question myself, my own judgment on where do I draw the line between giving someone a chance and not.  I don't believe people should be judged for their past but I also don't believe the past can be ignored.  This obviously creates a very difficult situation for me personally when faced with someone with a PD.  I want to believe in the best in people and that they can learn from past mistakes.  

He is not the only person that can love you LF.  I know how hard that is to believe sometimes, especially as you get older and opportunities to find love get fewer and fewer.  I think it is important for you to take a hard look at this emotionally barren land you speak of because i feel this is key to many of the difficulties you are having.  I think you realize you cannot look outside of yourself to populate your internal land with the emotions you desire.  Now the question is how can you populate your land on your own?  

I think that I'm the kind of person who would do better at letting go if I went into another relationship but I'm not sure I'd achieve the changes I need to make if I did that and I'm not convinced that relationship would have a better outcome, I'm still traumatised by this one.

I think we both know that jumping into another relationship before processing and learning from the previous one is not healthy.  It simply allows you to avoid/ignore the deeper issues and to cover up the pain that comes from a failed relationship.  It is a recipe for disaster.

[Herodias]

"I think this might be the hardest part! I'm quite needy, I loved the closeness and constant touching/togetherness of my relationship, watching DvD's in bed stroking her hair... .going from that back to nothing has just been unbearable!

See I feel going into another relationship will certainly take my mind of things too and give me the comfort that I crave, but like you said, trauma still exists, I am slowly detaching, I have certainly learned a great deal but has enough time passed at 3 months to start seeing someone new? No way!

This is where I think it takes a wise and a strong person to be willing to stay by themselves, to endure all this pain and discomfort, for the greater good, so we give our next relationship the best possible chance it has to blossom."

Ahoy, exactly! I have been by myself for over a year now... .am I ready for another relationship? No Way- but I am getting there... .I can tell. Being divorced will help in a big way. I did take my vows seriously and even though he is living with his gf and newborn - I would never break my vows.  I miss all the loving too, but I don't miss the grabbing, poking, prodding and constant need of attention and closeness he had to have. It was exhausting. I will be nice to be in a normal relationship one day. I can envision it