Never like her again

[blackbirdsong]

Ok, was going just fine in last period but I knew that would also pass... . Mini-crisis today

Don't worry, I am aware that this shall pass also... .

So, as I already mentioned in my story few times, my dBPDexgf is celebrity in my country so I sometimes bump into her pictures/videos/interviews on Internet or TV.

Today was one of those days. She gave an interview for some TV show and I saw it while changing channels. I didn't switch the channel when I saw her... .:/

I freezed for a moment and just looked at her.

Look, she is gorgeous even without the makeup but she was really something in that TV show. As a male , I already admitted to myself that her physical appearance has also a big impact on my detaching process. I am not an ugly guy, but she is definitely "above my level" I would say - and I caught myself saying today: 'You will never ever again have a girl that looks so good. Why the hell did you left?' (funny how I often forget the reasons for this  )

It is sad, but I really think so - and looks is not my primary concern, really - but it was just hard to process this type of realization.

Also, don't get my wrong, I really primarily fell for her personality (mirroring?) during idealization phase but looks is something that for sure attracted me to her in first place.

Also, from previous research I found out that BPD woman tend to give more concern about their physical appearance as a way of coping with personal insecurities, and I read many stories here that mention 'beautiful BPDs' so do you have similar thought like I do today? How do you handle them?

[once removed]

interesting topic, blackbirdsong.

i was wildly physically attracted to my ex before and after we met. i even began to have "soulmate" feelings upon seeing her picture. ive had those before. its kind of embarrassing really, but it is what it is. i have noticed certain, hard to discern or describe, patterns in the kinds of girls im most physically attracted to, and their level of emotional health.

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

i remember when it clicked with me that women in general are more attracted to confidence than looks. i am also confident in my looks, but i remember observing my ex seemed to date men that were less physically attractive than she was, and if im honest, that made her seem like an easier catch.

related, i seem to gravitate toward women who would be considered by most to be attractive, but tend to have a "flaw" (and i mean in the most shallow sense of societies standards, not necessarily my own), like for example, a weird nose (i have a weird nose myself). it feels kind of creepy to put it in these terms. id like to think its more about likeness than the "easier catch" theory - maybe its both. ive heard other men express similar things - we often look for some quality that fits our fantasy that a woman is uniquely attainable.

in terms of women with BPD, low self esteem is found in virtually everyone with BPD, and some of the most beautiful people in the world feel ugly underneath. as we all know, society places a greater pressure on women to fit these standards, so it makes sense to me that a woman with BPD (though not unique to women, with BPD or otherwise) would give more concern to physical appearance as a way of coping with personal insecurities. as a celebrity, the person you describe would face a particular and unrelenting pressure.

interestingly, i have virtually no physical attraction to my ex anymore.

[bAlex]

This definitely rings true for me, it's one thing that makes it especially hard for me. Looks matter to me and I've dated some very beautiful girls in the past, but it seems she raised the bar too high this time. She basically ruined everyone else for me... .I have no way around this, that's why I try to avoid seeing her pictures or bumping into her.

[C.Stein]

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

Yup, I can totally relate to this.  I see women all the time that I am physically attracted to, but there are those that are just different, an attraction on a much deeper level.  I see it as an attraction to the energy of that person.   I am sure we all have walked into a room where someone is giving off a very negative energy ... .it is readily discernible if you are open to seeing/feeling it.   Same thing occurs when you feel that deeper attraction to a pure stranger.  The attraction goes beyond the physical.  It happens to me on occasion as it did to me with my ex.  It is not a once in a life time thing, but it certainly isn't an every day occurrence either.

[bAlex]

interesting topic, blackbirdsong.

i was wildly physically attracted to my ex before and after we met. i even began to have "soulmate" feelings upon seeing her picture. ive had those before. its kind of embarrassing really, but it is what it is. i have noticed certain, hard to discern or describe, patterns in the kinds of girls im most physically attracted to, and their level of emotional health.

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

i remember when it clicked with me that women in general are more attracted to confidence than looks. i am also confident in my looks, but i remember observing my ex seemed to date men that were less physically attractive than she was, and if im honest, that made her seem like an easier catch.

related, i seem to gravitate toward women who would be considered by most to be attractive, but tend to have a "flaw" (and i mean in the most shallow sense of societies standards, not necessarily my own), like for example, a weird nose (i have a weird nose myself). it feels kind of creepy to put it in these terms. id like to think its more about likeness than the "easier catch" theory - maybe its both. ive heard other men express similar things - we often look for some quality that fits our fantasy that a woman is uniquely attainable.

in terms of women with BPD, low self esteem is found in virtually everyone with BPD, and some of the most beautiful people in the world feel ugly underneath. as we all know, society places a greater pressure on women to fit these standards, so it makes sense to me that a woman with BPD (though not unique to women, with BPD or otherwise) would give more concern to physical appearance as a way of coping with personal insecurities. as a celebrity, the person you describe would face a particular and unrelenting pressure.

interestingly, i have virtually no physical attraction to my ex anymore.

But then you should be perfectly fine. I know that when the day comes that I don't think my ex is pretty anymore is the day I'm over her. I don't mean when she loses her looks, but rather that she's not pretty anymore once I've moved on emotionally if that makes sense... .

[bAlex]

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

Yup, I can totally relate to this.  I see women all the time that I am physically attracted to, but there are those that are just different, an attraction on a much deeper level.  I see it as an attraction to the energy of that person.   I am sure we all have walked into a room where someone is giving off a very negative energy ... .it is readily discernible if you are open to seeing/feeling it.   Same thing occurs when you feel that deeper attraction to a pure stranger.  The attraction goes beyond the physical.  It happens to me on occasion as it did to me with my ex.  It is not a once in a life time thing, but it certainly isn't an every day occurrence either.

Interesting point. Have you noticed how people giving off this "energy" tend to attract seemingly everyone around them? 

My ex wasn't physically perfect in every way but there was a very sensual, feminine, and extreme sex appeal energy about her also. Her looks made her hot but that made her irresistible.

[C.Stein]

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

Yup, I can totally relate to this.  I see women all the time that I am physically attracted to, but there are those that are just different, an attraction on a much deeper level.  I see it as an attraction to the energy of that person.   I am sure we all have walked into a room where someone is giving off a very negative energy ... .it is readily discernible if you are open to seeing/feeling it.   Same thing occurs when you feel that deeper attraction to a pure stranger.  The attraction goes beyond the physical.  It happens to me on occasion as it did to me with my ex.  It is not a once in a life time thing, but it certainly isn't an every day occurrence either.

Interesting point. Have you noticed how people giving off this "energy" tend to attract seemingly everyone around them?

No, every one is different.  Confident people and leaders attract many people ... .this is not that.

My ex wasn't physically perfect in every way but there was a very sensual, feminine, and extreme sex appeal energy about her also. Her looks made her hot but that made her irresistible.

I'm not talking about sexual attraction here, but I know what you mean.  This goes far deeper than any physical/sexual attraction.  It has happen to me three times in the past three years (including my ex).   The feeling of connection/attraction almost knocks me off my feet.

[once removed]

interesting topic, blackbirdsong.

i was wildly physically attracted to my ex before and after we met. i even began to have "soulmate" feelings upon seeing her picture. ive had those before. its kind of embarrassing really, but it is what it is. i have noticed certain, hard to discern or describe, patterns in the kinds of girls im most physically attracted to, and their level of emotional health.

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

i remember when it clicked with me that women in general are more attracted to confidence than looks. i am also confident in my looks, but i remember observing my ex seemed to date men that were less physically attractive than she was, and if im honest, that made her seem like an easier catch.

related, i seem to gravitate toward women who would be considered by most to be attractive, but tend to have a "flaw" (and i mean in the most shallow sense of societies standards, not necessarily my own), like for example, a weird nose (i have a weird nose myself). it feels kind of creepy to put it in these terms. id like to think its more about likeness than the "easier catch" theory - maybe its both. ive heard other men express similar things - we often look for some quality that fits our fantasy that a woman is uniquely attainable.

in terms of women with BPD, low self esteem is found in virtually everyone with BPD, and some of the most beautiful people in the world feel ugly underneath. as we all know, society places a greater pressure on women to fit these standards, so it makes sense to me that a woman with BPD (though not unique to women, with BPD or otherwise) would give more concern to physical appearance as a way of coping with personal insecurities. as a celebrity, the person you describe would face a particular and unrelenting pressure.

interestingly, i have virtually no physical attraction to my ex anymore.

But then you should be perfectly fine. I know that when the day comes that I don't think my ex is pretty anymore is the day I'm over her. I don't mean when she loses her looks, but rather that she's not pretty anymore once I've moved on emotionally if that makes sense... .

if by perfectly fine, you mean over the hurt of the relationship, that day came several years ago now (the growth ive taken with me, and working to further it are not something i will ever take for granted). its not that i dont think my ex is pretty - she is, and im not unattracted to her, im just... .not attracted to her. it started when the concept of her as an emotional toddler began to sink in. that reached a place where my attraction just wont go. however, that was not the end of my emotional detachment. theres a lot more to recovery than no longer being physically attracted to our exes, and for most of us that will never happen, and need not happen.

C.Stein, i think i know what you mean, im not sure. i tend to project all sorts of things upon people of both sexes based on their looks; i consider myself intuitive and a good reader of people, but i find what i project onto others (good or bad) is usually just totally off.

elaborating on my point about "attainability", ive heard similar expressions from both sexes - youll hear someone say "oh im more attracted to someone in the ol jeans and t shirt". men will often include "no make up". youll also often hear men say they prefer a "girl next door type" to a "super model type". some women will prefer a bit of a gut on a guy as opposed to a really fit/muscular guy. youll hear both sexes express a preference for "cute" over "hot". i remember overhearing girls in middle school say "hes only cute, but his personality made him hot."

humans and attraction are weird

[C.Stein]

C.Stein, i think i know what you mean, im not sure. i tend to project all sorts of things upon people of both sexes based on their looks; i consider myself intuitive and a good reader of people, but i find what i project onto others (good or bad) is usually just totally off.

As you said, it is hard to explain.  What I try to describe here is instantaneous, no interaction with the person is required.  The last two times it happened to me was in a grocery store just seeing/walking by them.  Didn't even have eye contact both of those times either.

[bAlex]

once removed, to me it happens every time, just not this time. And by "not pretty anymore" I mean sure, she's still pretty to some extent, but just not desirable like before. Hard to explain. Sounds like you're in a wonderful place.

[once removed]

C.Stien, yeah. i had that with my ex just based on pictures and it can happen to me seeing/walking by a person as well. i wish i knew more about whats at play there.

bAlex, i continue to believe self improvement plays a role in the idea of no longer being attracted to a person, or less attracted to them. either physical self improvement, or mental/emotional self improvement. it seems shallow on the surface, but it makes sense to me. what happens every time but this one? losing physical attraction?

[C.Stein]

once removed, to me it happens every time, just not this time. And by "not pretty anymore" I mean sure, she's still pretty to some extent, but just not desirable like before. Hard to explain. Sounds like you're in a wonderful place.

There is a lot of truth in the saying ... .Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes clean to the bone.

C.Stien, yeah. i had that with my ex just based on pictures and it can happen to me seeing/walking by a person as well. i wish i knew more about whats at play there.

Takes your breath away.  I clearly remember these two women, yet the amount of time I was looking at them can be measured in seconds on one hand.  One of them wasn't even really my "type".

[bAlex]

C.Stien, yeah. i had that with my ex just based on pictures and it can happen to me seeing/walking by a person as well. i wish i knew more about whats at play there.

bAlex, i continue to believe self improvement plays a role in the idea of no longer being attracted to a person, or less attracted to them. either physical self improvement, or mental/emotional self improvement. it seems shallow on the surface, but it makes sense to me. what happens every time but this one? losing physical attraction?

Yes I still find her attractive/desirable, it won't go away, not this time.

[bAlex]

once removed, to me it happens every time, just not this time. And by "not pretty anymore" I mean sure, she's still pretty to some extent, but just not desirable like before. Hard to explain. Sounds like you're in a wonderful place.

There is a lot of truth in the saying ... .Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes clean to the bone.

Sure, but I don't think she's a bad person. Flawed in many ways, yes.

[C.Stein]

once removed, to me it happens every time, just not this time. And by "not pretty anymore" I mean sure, she's still pretty to some extent, but just not desirable like before. Hard to explain. Sounds like you're in a wonderful place.

There is a lot of truth in the saying ... .Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes clean to the bone.

Sure, but I don't think she's a bad person. Flawed in many ways, yes.

I don't think my ex is either and I am still very emotionally attracted to her good side, as well as physically.  She is a really good and genuine person outside of intimate relationships.  The thing is, she is more than just her good side ... .there is her "dark side" (her words) as well.  Her dark side IS ugly to the bone and it does impact her at every conceivable level.  This is something I have struggled to accept ... .but accept I must if I will ever have any hope of moving on.

[Dhand77]

to put it in simpler terms, i might see a girl and think "wow shes hot", but feel no draw. ill see another girl who is very physically attractive, but theres a unique draw that induces those "soulmate" feelings. based on my experiences, i dont think this is entirely physical at all, though i lack the knowledge to articulate whats behind it on a deeper level.

Yup, I can totally relate to this.  I see women all the time that I am physically attracted to, but there are those that are just different, an attraction on a much deeper level.  I see it as an attraction to the energy of that person.   I am sure we all have walked into a room where someone is giving off a very negative energy ... .it is readily discernible if you are open to seeing/feeling it.   Same thing occurs when you feel that deeper attraction to a pure stranger.  The attraction goes beyond the physical.  It happens to me on occasion as it did to me with my ex.  It is not a once in a life time thing, but it certainly isn't an every day occurrence either.

I remember seeing my ex's pic on a dating website, I HAD to message her. I still remember it like yesterday. She wasn't the hottest or the prettiest, although she was plenty attractive. But I still remember spending an entire a day coming up with a good opening message. I had been using that site for about a year prior, dated a few girls, but my ex, as soon as I saw her pic,  I HAD to meet her. I always found it really weird.

Lol. In retrospect, I kinda wish I botched it.

Funny enough though, I'm no longer physically attracted to her as well. But her inner ugliness has a lot to do with that.

[blackbirdsong]

Did you have a feeling, during you r/s that he/she is "one level above you" regarding the looks?

I recognize this as my problem also, as a trait in my personality that adds to my core insecurity and underdeveloped inner self.

I can count many positive things about me, but looks is not one of them. Other people say that I am handsome (not the prettiest guy in town but I am not that bad), and on some rational level I also believe that my girlfriend wouldn't end up with someone who looks very bad but my emotional part of me always questiones this (something that originates from my childhood )

Also, during my psychological testing I got result that I have traits of perfectionism. I mean, I knew that even before. I am perfectionist. In some aspects of my life it served me so well (e.g. career) but it is not so beneficial in a r/s with BPD.

In addition, it doesnt contributes to accepting my self image. I want it all (brain, looks, career). Like I cannot accept that someone can love me if I am not perfect. BPD trait actually - maybe I am also a borderline

[C.Stein]

Did you have a feeling, during you r/s that he/she is "one level above you" regarding the looks?

I would say my ex and I were about the same on the "number" scale.

Also, during my psychological testing I got result that I have traits of perfectionism. I mean, I knew that even before. I am perfectionist. In some aspects of my life it served me so well (e.g. career) but it is not so beneficial in a r/s with BPD.

In addition, it doesnt contributes to accepting my self image. I want it all (brain, looks, career). Like I cannot accept that someone can love me if I am not perfect. BPD trait actually - maybe I am also a borderline

Nothing wrong with striving for perfection as long as you realize two things.  First, perfection is subjective and Two, you will never achieve it.  I set some very high standards for myself, some would say I am a perfectionist/anal retentive.  That said, I am reasonable in my expectations of myself and more importantly, I don't expect others to operate at the same level I expect from myself.   For me these standards don't spill over with respect to self-image.  I don't really care what people think about me in that regard as it has no impact on my internal self-image and self-worth.  Oddly though I am somewhat self-conscious just not enough to act on it.

[once removed]

Did you have a feeling, during you r/s that he/she is "one level above you" regarding the looks?

i said it to her, and im sure i thought it at the time. i think we are/were on the same level looks wise. ive read articles here and there that suggest its best to look for people that are more or less equal to you looks wise - but thats more in terms of setting reasonable standards. ive seen couples where its just not the case, and theyre as happy as anyone else. i am still at a stage where im separating fact from fiction/myth about women in general, though i tend to believe, have been told, and read, that women (in general. clearly there are many exceptions) place more emphasis on things like confidence and sense of humor than looks.

i have traits of perfectionism as well. i have a tricky relationship with my inner critic. i trust it because it consistently knows what my best is. when i feel i do my best, i am satisfied, proud, happy, i have a feeling of accomplishment, which is healthy. often perfectionists lack those feelings. on the other hand, when i dont feel i do my best, my inner critic is harsh and overbearing and induces feelings of self loathing. it doesnt seem to like when i show hints of insecurity, yet it can sure create them.

its a mixed bag. i mostly have a good grip on it. i could really benefit from some better organization skills though... .more perfectionism

In addition, it doesnt contributes to accepting my self image. I want it all (brain, looks, career). Like I cannot accept that someone can love me if I am not perfect. BPD trait actually - maybe I am also a borderline

it sounds like you accept it on an intellectual level - thats part of the battle. it means youre open to the possibility, but you or someone else can tell yourself "i am loveable" all day long, and still not believe it. that can change

[earlgrey]

Know its an old thread, but thought there were some interesting remarks here... .in particluar this idea of unexplained pretty much instantaneous attraction.

One of the times it happened to me (instant attraction) it ends up with a pwBPD. (The only other time the r/s never developed enough to know).

Is this kind of start (ie strong early attraction) a regular/intrinsic part of a BPD r/s, and who is leading whom?

Whether this is BPD territory or simply human stuff I have no idea but find the subject fascinating.

[C.Stein]

Is this kind of start (ie strong early attraction) a regular/intrinsic part of a BPD r/s, and who is leading whom?

This is a good question and leads one to wonder if this deeper level of instantaneous attraction, the one that goes way beyond physical, should be considered a red flag, or at the very least a half-mast red flag? 

[earlgrey]

... .if this deeper level of instantaneous attraction, the one that goes way beyond physical, should be considered a red flag, or at the very least a half-mast red flag? 

I would say most certainly... .and here's why I think that.

I like John Bowlby's attachment theory... .it seems so obvious, to learn attachment habits (good and bad/useful and useless) from the person right in front of you as a child, a 'caretaker'. Then with this information loaded into our hard drives we set out later in life on our romantic missions without the slighest considersation that this information is anything but reliable, useful, works even. Its all we have; then when r/s don't quite work out (because our attachment model is actually out of whack) it is highly unlikely that we question our approach (my experience), but lay the blame on 'not the right person'. This process probably repeats a bit because we do not have the skills to understand anything about a healthy, secure attachment... .this part was just plain missing during our education.

Attachment in the real world of adults could mean secure people are able to build a bespoke healthy r/s, while the others possibly 'choose'/end up with something sadly familiar. JMO

So taking pot luck at r/s, but probably using the only parameter understandable to us, physical attraction, we stick at it with varying degrees of success. And hence our mission to find "the one", it seems to be a simple lottery as rational thoughts seem to vacate us most of the time.

Then one day bang! we meet someone that makes us wake up and pay attention. We are feeling some powerful emotion... .what is going on? I believe it is because we have met someone that exhibits similar traits to the caregiver that taught us how  to bond (ha! ha!) in the first place. We (I probaly mean I so please excuse the group approach) are unable to attach in a healthy way by finding and appreciating a suitable partner, so eventually if/when we dicover this familar 'vibe' it is not about the right choice but simply finding something familiar.

Now, if one has had the misfortune to get substandard 'attachment' education as a child (certainly my case), there is a chance that the caregiver was not up to the task for whatever reason. But my opinion would be that when you get a powerful feeling of attraction to someone, and that later this someone turns out to be a pwBPD for example, i would say that the a learning circle has been completed and that by an attraction to the familiar, rather than a healthy open choice, you end up where you started with a partner that has the familar characteristics of you primary caregiver.

So yes, I'd say watch out, love at first sight may well be   , but it may also be something special too.

Despite my conviction it was the latter, sadly it was 

[C.Stein]

There is also this to consider.

www.apa.org/monitor/mar04/mixing.aspx

[earlgrey]

thanks CS for the link... .nice read, also ties up with another link you (?) gave; an article by Joan Lachkar https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=98299.0

Now I have a great deal of respect for the profession, but for all those erudite people with letters galore, I was hoping for a bit more than 'opposites attract'.

In fact I (no license here just an avid reader of this site) would question their conclusion... .a partner seeks another with bits/traits they are missing or having a negative attitude towards. You seek an adverturer because you're a bit of a stay at home, you seek an emotionally open person because you are a bit closed. Really, this doesn't really do it for me. A hypothosis perhaps as good as any other maybe. But if you ask someone (someone from these boards for example) to explain the attraction in the r/s it would be very interesting to analyse the findings.

For me it would certainly not be te attraction to things I don't like... .in fact as I've mentioned elsewhere, I could not explain the nature of the 'very real' attraction. But given the conclusion to the r/s (in my case) is finding a pw the same traits as the primary caregiver, I would hyposthesise that the attraction is finding the familiar.

OK i'm on a bit of a hobby horse here i know, but there seems to be a bit of traction. An emotionally impaired caregiver 'teaches' a child how it all works. It doesn't, and the child subsequently in later life tries its best at r/s. Does s/he  (the now adult) venture into the arms, and feel good, of someone with totally opposite traits. I'm sure it can happen, but it just doesn't work for me.

But I'm working on it.

[C.Stein]

Now I have a great deal of respect for the profession, but for all those erudite people with letters galore, I was hoping for a bit more than 'opposites attract'.

I believe the article was written about a much larger body of work.  I didn't check the sources. 

I don't look at that article as an end all explanation of why but rather one piece of a much larger and more complex puzzle.  It is something to consider when trying to find answers and who knows, maybe that was the piece of the puzzle missing.

You seek an adverturer because you're a bit of a stay at home, you seek an emotionally open person because you are a bit closed. Really, this doesn't really do it for me. A hypothosis perhaps as good as any other maybe. But if you ask someone (someone from these boards for example) to explain the attraction in the r/s it would be very interesting to analyse the findings.

In my case this was partially true.  One of the things that did attract me to my ex was that she helped me be less "introverted".  This certainly wasn't something I needed from her, but it was part of the reason I was attracted to her.

I think there is just a good of a chance that "likes" attract as there is for "opposites" to attract.  The one thing that stood out to me in the article was that each person looked to the other to "complete" them, make them whole.  Perhaps this deeper attraction is a result of an unconscious awareness that a person can "complete" them, even if they are not themselves aware they need to be completed?

[StayStrongNow]

I can definitely relate to that initial attraction that became firmly embedded of my ustbxBPDw especially during the idealization stage. This lasted about 8 1/2 years into our marriage. I was so attracted to her, she was so irresistible. Even through the devaluation stage, after she filed for divorce, after 3 DV events one leading to her arrest and conviction, and after many other events I was still finding a need to have sex with her and I did.  Looking back it was so strange being in the heat of a contentious divorce, after being accused of sexual assault, but yet I would let her come over to see the kids and I would pick up her clear cues she wanted sex and I delivered. I now see how wrong this was of me to do this. This was all before I joined this site and now completely understand about recycling for one. As a textbook case of a pwBPD, she did everything for personal gain for the divorce to go favorably for her and that she could see the kids.

When I learned about NC and LC I started to gain mental clarity. Then her circling the drain continued, and her divorce by attrition intensified.

As I post now, the attraction has faded. When she calls I have her mug shot of her in her yellow jail jumper looking so mean on my iPhone screen. I now notice her Pinocchio nose that I really did not notice so much before (love is blind) but I think has grown due to continuous lying. Due to her drinking she has gained weight.  Perhaps these changes in her or my perception thereof are really just gifts to me to be able to flip that switch off of attractiveness to her and permanently to boot.

Still being in shell shock I guess a bit of PTSD if you will, I am weary of starting a new r/s. I saw a very attractive woman smile at me while I was at the grocery store and when I was single I would have pursued her to get to know her but I didn't. I am not ready and I just cannot do this to any woman to try to start a r/s now. But another thing that I now really could not stand was the ex's persistence in her wanting to give and receive the most slobbering kisses I ever had. I tolerated it because of course my pwBPD had me, lock, stock and barrel. Now I long for a passionate non slobbering kiss with a woman void of any personality disorder of any kind. But that is in the next season, I am not there yet.