I wondered for the longest time if I were narcissistic

[Depression = 72% of members]

Lol, just thought of something funny.

I wondered for the longest time if I were narcissistic because my exgf said I was and I just realized I usually blame myself for everything, even how people feel. So maybe I can put this fear to rest?

I'm no professional so I'm just stating what I believe. I don't brag about my accomplishments or take credit for being superior to anyone. I used to wish I had super powers so I could defend my family from being harmed by my abusive father. Couldn't wait to get strong enough to take him out.

[JerryRG]

Lol, just thought of something funny.

I wondered for the longest time if I were narcissistic because my exgf said I was and I just realized I usually blame myself for everything, even how people feel. So maybe I can put this fear to rest?

I'm no professional so I'm just stating what I believe. I don't brag about my accomplishments or take credit for being superior to anyone. I used to wish I had super powers so I could defend my family from being harmed by my abusive father. Couldn't wait to get strong enough to take him out.

[Lilyroze]

Lol, just thought of something funny.

I wondered for the longest time if I were narcissistic because my exgf said I was and I just realized I usually blame myself for everything, even how people feel. So maybe I can put this fear to rest?

Jerry, thought the same thing. Not the NP but I always took the blame, for whatever, wanted to fix or make everything OK or everyone happy. The times I couldn't was blamed by my Mom or stbex.

I tend to be an optimist, so like researching, learning and always wanting to be better then the day before. Learn from my mistakes.

I was in such a FOG in end started researching everything I could on BPD, NP, as I wanted an explanation. A way to help my kids understand, have them grow up healthy, valued, and with their core values intact.

I went to a Pastor then T and asked is it me after a few sessions? They both  laughed and pretty much said the same thing. If you have to ask no. Those with BPD never ask how to fix, apologize and understand or mean it and they can never say and. Meaning I am upset right now and still love you. They rage, project, hurt, and can't look within. It is the disorder.

Having said that I have a childhood girlfriend that was diagnosed bi polar and said NP or BPD but wouldn't accept that diagnosis or help.
After having destroyed another set of  relationships at work, her family and now personal. She got serious and is getting help again. Seems like she is very serious to understand and heal. I really hope she can do it. I have known her since 3rd grade, I escaped most of her wrath when moved a couple times and cross country. I don't judge her, and try to as I say love her and show her truth. Not her emotions. She is one person that always made me want to try hard not to be like. I mean no offense to her. I love her but don't like what she does to others. Thrilled she is now looking into healing herself and the damage she has done.  We grew up going to same camp every year and both went on to teach dancing, so kept in contact as at same events every year.

[JerryRG]

Thanks Lilyroze

The one thing that still haunts me the most is that lingering belief this failed relationship was my fault, that always wanting to fix things and make people happy as you said.

It was my role growing up, I looked at what was going on and dared ask why, my siblings just accepted the way things were or they were in denial. They just left home and the dysfunction to never return again. I tried saving my parents from themselves thinking if they were happy I would be too. Classic codependency.

I didn't know way back then, I was simply a child in a dysfunctional environment using the tools I had to survive. Not anymore.

I can change and I have as much and as quickly as I am able too. I've done the difficult work, faced my demons and listend to the truth whether it hurt or not.

My exgf is living in her own world, I've lived in her world too, not a pleasent place to visit let alone live in. My foo set me up to accept unacceptable behaviour and it's my choice to allow it any longer.

Our lives are ours, no one can make my choices for me and to allow someone who is mentally ill influence our right to choose and be free is foolish and utterly insane.

[seenr]

This is a brilliant post JerryRG.

I have so much in common with you – childhood etc.

How did you face your demons? I have been looking at online programs for recovery from Narcissistic abuse. There is one that seems to be very beneficial.

Did you do it through counselling/therapy?

The one thing that still haunts me the most is that lingering belief this failed relationship was my fault, that always wanting to fix things and make people happy as you said.
It was my role growing up, I looked at what was going on and dared ask why, my siblings just accepted the way things were or they were in denial. They just left home and the dysfunction to never return again. I tried saving my parents from themselves thinking if they were happy I would be too. Classic codependency.

[Leonis]

My exgf is living in her own world, I've lived in her world too, not a pleasent place to visit let alone live in. My foo set me up to accept unacceptable behaviour and it's my choice to allow it any longer.

Our lives are ours, no one can make my choices for me and to allow someone who is mentally ill influence our right to choose and be free is foolish and utterly insane.

My ex and both came from an abusive household. The difference was, I actually spent the first few years of my life with my grandparents, so I had a small sense of what was normal before living with my parents, and my ex lived within a dysfunctional household all her life.

I supposed that I had found a kindred spirit when she revealed to me about this past right before we reconciled the first time. Just like some combat vets get PTSD, some don't. I didn't really end up having BPD traits like my ex. Instead, I probably developed more of her "matching" issues, so we winded up together.

Staying with the thread, the only friend (27F) I know that has "recovered" from a cluster B, in this case it's HPD, did so by having an epiphany after being surrounded by healthy company for a few years in college and sought intense therapy. In addition, she stayed AWAY from her family. Being away from her dysfunctional family helped her to not have the negative enabling force, which my ex is still ensnared with, in her early 20s.

[seenr]

I did notice my ex go through a period of maybe 7 months where she made a big effort to improve. We had been apart for a year and in that time I had tried to move on as did she. We both met other people, but for me nothing seemed to mean as much as she did. When she came back into my life, I saw a change, but to be honest, the push/pull mentality was still there. That said, things that would have made her explode in the past, didn’t. For example, she and I were doing something one day in a house and I hurt my hand. I was angry about it, but didn’t say much. Previously, any expression of anger on my part would have been a reason for her to explode. She didn’t. Also, it seemed like she really wanted us to have a baby and we did. Things began to change once we knew our baby was on the way though. The only way I can describe it is like she knew she had something precious to me and knew I was desperate to have it. At that point things went back to how they had been. Rage, tantrums, anger, violence, pain.

Based on that experience I’ve had, I do think that someone like this knows they can change for the better. But it is like they just need a reason to go back to old ways and then if they feel they have found it, things regress. I do agree with the poster who mentioned family influences too. I have noticed that the more she got involved with her family of origin, the more negativity came out of those relationships. I have spent some time recently around my FOO. I know that the relationship between my parents for example often sees them ‘barking’ at each other as a method of communication. I have picked up on things in the last couple of weeks that trigger me – the patterns that occur when they go into a negative spiral and end up in a row. I see now how this also happened to my ex and I. I think this provides a lot of learning & as I said here many times, I am emerging from this relationship a better individual than when I entered into it. I’d like to think my ex will too, but somehow, don’t foresee that.

[gotbushels]

Hey Jerry:) It could be other things like high emotional sensitivity and tendencies to jump to conclusions. Those aren't necessarily related to any NPD criteria.

[atomic popsicles]

I've wondered that myself. I read a book where the author said codependency was failed narcissism... .that you have narcissistic thinking but deal with it in a codependent way. After much thought, I have rejected that.

It's easy when you are a blame taker (me too) to either believe the things they spew in anger OR look back and see individual examples, but not patterns, of things. For instance, my stbx accused me of being abusive like the father who beat him daily for 18 years. I try to reason with my kids, spanked them maybe 3 times each (they are teenagers)... .I do tend to yell when I am angry, like when they don't do their chores but spend the day on social media while I am at work. I give pretty logical consequences, and take away privileges.  It has taken me weeks to look at all the evidence and reject that accusation.

Maybe it's a kind of gaslighting? Can you even be BPD without narcissism?

[Fr4nz]

Hey Jerry,

I think that the best thing to do is to read this book chapter, and check if some of the traits apply to you or not:

www.universitypsychiatry.com/clientuploads/picp/05_PICPs.pdf

PS: Particularly interesting is the "covert narcissist", which is different than the grandiose in how it expresses the narcissism.

[once removed]

Can you even be BPD without narcissism?

narcissism is on a spectrum and everyone is on it to a degree. a narcissist is not exactly the same thing as a braggart. there is also healthy narcissism (which we couldnt really function or relate to others without) and unhealthy narcissism. big difference between NPD and narcissism as well; we all have narcissism, BPD and NPD are two very different disorders.

its worth noting that a common partner of someone with BPD tends to be higher on the spectrum of narcissism.

its also worth learning more about little n narcissism, in terms of how we relate to others.

[woundedPhoenix]

The one thing that still haunts me the most is that lingering belief this failed relationship was my fault, that always wanting to fix things and make people happy as you said.

It was my role growing up, I looked at what was going on and dared ask why, my siblings just accepted the way things were or they were in denial. They just left home and the dysfunction to never return again. I tried saving my parents from themselves thinking if they were happy I would be too. Classic codependency.

Same here, ofcourse my BPDex could shift all her blame and projections onto my shoulders for why the rs ended, it shouldn't have hurt that much where it not that i am conditioned to assume that if somebody is so emotionally convinced of it, it must be all true.

Staying for too long in the FOG also makes that you can't tell the head from the tail, and are so confused that you can't even build a solid theory about what went on until much later... .

Internalising guilt is something sneaky, i am consciously revisiting every thing i felt guilty about in the relation and look if it really was justified. Turns out i have been seeking excuses for her behaviour all the time, never for my own.

[atomic popsicles]

Internalising guilt is something sneaky, i am consciously revisiting every thing i felt guilty about in the relation and look if it really was justified. Turns out i have been seeking excuses for her behaviour all the time, never for my own.


Oops sorry, I was trying to quote. I think your last sentence is really powerful and important!

[Herodias]

Internalising guilt is something sneaky, i am consciously revisiting every thing i felt guilty about in the relation and look if it really was justified. Turns out i have been seeking excuses for her behaviour all the time, never for my own.


Oops sorry, I was trying to quote. I think your last sentence is really powerful and important!

Me too... .that is good. I was always making excuses for him! If anything, I thought I was narcissistic, because I told him what to do when it came to certain things... .but I have my own insecurities and I don't think the things I "corrected" weren't anything any normal person would do. He would just say, "don't tell me what to do!". Well, fine then... when you break the disposal you can pay to get it fixed! How about, don't lie, don't cheat, don't drive drunk. Hmmm. I am so controlling! It wasn't me... .I just made too many excuses for him for too long. I found myself acting like him a little bit... .I think it rubs off. I have had  to stop myself sometimes.

[JerryRG]

Thanks everyone

If I had not blamed myself or at least accepted my part in the relationship I would not have joined Alanon and then get bumped into AA and asked my ex many times to go to couples counceling. I did everything I could to better myself. I did everything including offering to care for our son alone and for her to get any kind of help she needed to get well.

[Herodias]

Thanks everyone

If I had not blamed myself or at least accepted my part in the relationship I would not have joined Alanon and then get bumped into AA and asked my ex many times to go to couples counceling. I did everything I could to better myself. I did everything including offering to care for our son alone and for her to get any kind of help she needed to get well.

Couple counseling only gives them more ammunition, I went to 5 different counselors with him over the years. Not worth the effort. He wanted them to fix me... .He went to many more over the years alone, but I think he lied about going. I don't think he went more than once or twice in a row. He said they couldn't help him. It's because he wouldn't be honest with them. He may have known he was narcissistic or anti-social and couldn't be helped... .I don't know. I have seen him cry, but usually for himself. He's all over the place... .I can't believe I married someone mentally ill... .make me feel like I have some serious problems... .smh

[Leonis]

Couple counseling only gives them more ammunition, I went to 5 different counselors with him over the years. Not worth the effort.

My ex claimed that it was a way for ME to control her.

She mentioned that she had gone to couple's counselling with the previous ex to work on his PTSD, lying, etc. By this point, I don't know if the other guy actually has the issues she's claimed. Dude's been married since 2014 and last time I checked, he's on his way to become a dentist. Note that this guy was 12 years older than her. It's like she's having some daddy issues.

My ex claims that the guy is actually doing sales, etc. Either she continually kept in touch with him or just making up stuff to suit her own needs.