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Skills we were never taught
98
A 3 Minute Lesson
on Ending Conflict
Communication Skills-
Don't Be Invalidating
Listen with Empathy -
A Powerful Life Skill
Setting Boundaries
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Author Topic: Feeling pretty stressed, lost, angry, upset and confused  (Read 2734 times)
Confused2much

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« on: July 05, 2016, 04:35:19 AM »

Hey everyone,
I'll do my best to keep this short. My girlfriend / ex-girlfriend, who has been diagnosed with schizotypal/schizoid/borderline personality disorder and depression, has decided this weekend that after 2 years of struggling, arguing and making up and breaking up that she no longer loves me. That has hit me like a train and left me feeling broken into pieces after all of the claims that I’m everything, I’m her world, that she’ll always love me etc etc
Things were perfect when we met but that’s because it followed the usual process between a borderline and someone who was down and insecure like me. She gave me such inflated adulation and so much love and confidence. I felt on top of the world. Then, after about 6 months and multiple warning signs the wheels came off. We went to a music festival and she accused me of leaving her to fend off some aggressive girls in a crowd that I just did not see. She told me that I had seen it and I did nothing about it and she just wouldn’t accept my version of events. That argument went on for weeks and then to top it off, shortly after the festival, she took a random girl she’d just met to Ibiza for my birthday instead of me. I was booked to go, I’d saved my money and told all of my friends and family about it but didn’t want to approach her and ask and seem like a beggar. I just thought she’d obviously see it as the ideal way to get over the problem at the music festival. I was wrong.
I told her after that that my feelings had changed. Her total disregard for my feelings had hurt me badly but I was just in shock and confusion at her inability to see she was wrong. How could this girl who claimed to love me so much, who said I was her world, behave so carelessly and selfishly? I was in a state of pure anguish.
I went out for my birthday, got really really drunk and genuinely got spiked with ketamine. I was all over the place and ended up kissing another girl. I was with a crowd of people I didn’t really know too well and ended up at a hotel with them all. The girl from the club was there but we never spent the night together or had sex. I felt terrible, came round a bit from the drugs (I was informed by friend afterwards that I’d been given them, he found it funny, and I didn’t) and then I left and walked home. A video of us all messing about in the hotel surfaced on facebook and she caught sight of it. She was raging. She couldn’t believe I’d been out and then went to a hotel with the group. She kept asking over and over and accusing me for a good few weeks before I cracked and told her what happened. Yes, I’d kissed that girl but nothing more. I would pay for that mistake.
I told her that I realised, after that kiss, I wasn’t ready to move on. I was under the influence of a strange substance and my head had been all over the place after what she had done but I loved her. I know that people say that you love the way these people make you feel more than you love the person but with me I feel that’s different. Yes, she did make me feel on top of the world but she was beautiful, funny, sexy and could be so nice when she wanted to be.
She never let go of what I’d told her. I was accused of doing more. I was told that kiss was completely unacceptable, regardless of the situation. I agreed to an extent that it wasn’t acceptable.
I’ve spent the last two years trying, begging, assuring, arguing and fighting to be in this girl’s life and it’s just deteriorated and turned toxic. She’s done some really awful and careless things that I won’t list here and been she’s been so selfish but in between all of that hurt we’d spend a weekend together and have the time of our lives and agree that our time together was amazing.
I feel like whilst she’s said she doesn’t want me so many times she’s always left the door ajar slightly. She’d always answer the phone, reply to a txt, and keep me dangling. She’s used my guilt for a kiss to beat me into the ground and try to destroy me.
She’s told me she no longer loves me. Even though all I’ve done is fight to be with her. I’m gutted and not sure what to do. Thanks for listening.
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livednlearned
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« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2016, 10:42:15 AM »

Hi ConfusedJM,

You felt hurt and maybe over-corrected by getting drunk on your birthday and things went in a direction you never intended. It happens.

Interestingly, her response to a non-event (failure to protect her) was similar to a real event (kissing a woman). The difference is that in the second instance, you feel guilt.

Is the guilt justified? Often, we don't examine whether our guilt is justified or not. It sounds like you did not intend to hurt her (unjustified guilt).

When guilt goes unexamined, other people can exploit it. They feel the guilt and believe it represents something much more meaningful.

Maybe this is why she continues to focus on your guilt. You got drunk on your birthday and kissed a girl. That's it. Can you forgive yourself? This might help her move on, at least let go some of the emotional intensity around it. If you can overcome your guilt, she may regulate her feelings to reflect yours.

At first, if you change how you respond, she may need to test and make sure. She got used to a signal dialed up high, and when we turn the signal down low, the other person tries to dial it back up to hear it at the same decibel.

If you can get through this phase, the dynamic often changes.




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Confused2much

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« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2016, 02:11:25 AM »

Hi livednlearned,

Thank you for your response; it makes perfect sense. I have always maintained that it was a terrible mistake and overstated the significance thinking that will help her. I thought if she knows how much I regret it then it'll enable her to let go but after reading your response I think the opposite was needed.

Its been a long road over the last couple of years since that event. I've been dealing with the usual argument cycles and dealing with her not ever seeing my point of view and constantly shifting blame and making excuses. Shes blown hot and cold (mainly cold) and left me feeling worthless now.

Its now gotten to the point where I feel that I've pushed her away. Shes always been secretive with her phone, told me she messages other men (friends) and uses snapchat. I've been blocked on her phone and whatsapp on and off for years and blocked on facebook yet she fails to see how any of that makes me paranoid. Its been a nightmare.

Thank you so much for your advice and you're spot on about the guilt. I can forgive myself.
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Confused2much

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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2016, 03:18:08 AM »

What I've struggled with the most is the progressive distancing between us. Over the last couple of years she has shut down gradually, having less and less time for me, hardly calling or txting but then we'd meet up and it would be like everything was brilliant. I haven't handled it well. I've been nagging and I've suffocated her to the point where shes now telling me she no longer loves me. I'm just feeling completely distraught by that news.
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livednlearned
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« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2016, 10:54:23 AM »

What I've struggled with the most is the progressive distancing between us. Over the last couple of years she has shut down gradually, having less and less time for me, hardly calling or txting but then we'd meet up and it would be like everything was brilliant. I haven't handled it well. I've been nagging and I've suffocated her to the point where shes now telling me she no longer loves me. I'm just feeling completely distraught by that news.

Distancing is particularly tough, especially if we have an anxious attachment style. When someone we love makes themselves unavailable, we engage in protest behaviors. When the reassurance doesn't come, we double down and keep doing the thing that probably isn't working.

She probably loves the awesome person you were when you two first met. Over time, you've entered a place of weakness (it's common, BPD can be confusing), and the attraction is just not there like it once was.

Remember that she does not see her actions affecting you, as this would involve a very painful recognition of her own behaviors, and that is like kryptonite to someone who suffers with BPD. All she sees is what probably comes across as desperate, needy, clingy behavior on your part. She can't compute that you behave this way because of her.

It sounds like she is connected to you, otherwise the times when you are together, things would go down a little differently.

Can you change up your dynamic with her so she sees the original awesome ConfusedJM?
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Confused2much

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« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2016, 03:52:48 PM »

Thank you so much for your reply livednlearned

When we first met things were so amazing. We had so much fun, laughed at the same things, loved the same songs, texted all the time and such a unique connection and humour. I've read so much about the way that BPD individuals do things to entice you in and trap you but beneath those traits, at the core of the people we are, I honestly felt that we had a spiritual connection and she too admitted the same.

To feel that, be so sure of that and feel so safe within it was what I felt I lived for. I lived for our weekends and nights together. Then, to see it crumble and slip through my fingers like sand while I desperately tried to reshape it into what it once was has been pure torment. We were both so happy then the wheels came off and I feel like no matter what we'd done this was destined to end in tears.

In answer to your question - can I show her the original and awesome me? Yes, I've tried. Over and over. We have had amazing nights and weekends away together in the last two years and whenever I'd show up and take her out or appear at her door she would always seem pleased to see me, hug me, kiss me and we'd tell each other how much we missed each other.

Over the last couple of years my stability has waned. My mental state has deteriorated and my anxiety, paranoia and stress levels (all brought on by feeling worthless to her) had led me to lash out and say things I didn't mean and regret. I've been an idiot and I've pushed her to the point now where she has said those horrible words - "I dont love you anymore".

She still speaks to me, just about, and she has listened to what I've had to say. I've explained that years of being left out, pushed away, over looked, ignored and given the cold shoulder have led me to do it but, at the same time, its on me. I haven't needed to be so angry but I haven't understood whats been going on.

We've agreed to give each other a break. I've told her that I'll let her have some space from me and my ranting and nagging and she's going to go away and see how she feels. I fear this is only going one way. I know that people say "Just get out, its for the best, she's only going to destroy you" but I love her dearly.

What should I do? Give her a month to go away and forget me? I fear that shes not going to return and say "Oh, I have realised that I was responsible for the relationship going bad, lets get to work sorting it out". She keeps telling me she doesn't want me because of the arguing but then does nothing to resolve the root of the arguing... .

I could put my head through a wall  Attention(click to insert in post)     

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FallBack!Monster
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« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2016, 11:20:29 PM »



I could put my head through a wall  Attention(click to insert in post)

Let's say... .you put your head through a wall--> then what? a broken wall and a broken head.  That's it!

What I'm trying to say is... .Listen to the advise that was given by  "livednlearned".  Take a deep breath and change it up a little.  She's not a normal thinking girl and you yourself said it.  Listen to yourself.  If she's not a normal thinking woman then don't expect the actions and reactions of a normal woman.  I had to teach myself that.

At the end of the day, while changing it up, I started to think about "my" wants and needs more.  Not hers.  I wasn't over our awesome time, but she gave me enough time away from her for me to clearly see what she was lacking.  And trust me, she was lacking about 95% of what I've been looking for.  

In general, she gave me enough space to realize that I didn't need her for anything.  That I could actually live w/o knowing her or of her.  That's about the only thing she gave me.  Space to open my eyes.  Of course, at the time I wanted the things you want.  I thought the exact thoughts you shared here. But the result were... .the smoke screen was no longer as thick as it once was.

Keep your head up... .Give it one day at a time.  I think most of us here started out like this; with the same words, thoughts, feelings, and emotions.  But sooner or later, if you continue to join us, you WILL see how things are going to change, in your thoughts.

I thank my friends here for the rude awakening.  Thought

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Confused2much

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« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2016, 03:23:20 AM »

Thanks Back2Me16,

That's what I crave now. I want that smoke screen to shift. My friends and family have often asked me "Why would you even want to be with someone who makes you feel like this" and they are right and I know that.

It's so difficult because there are problems inside of me that I obviously need to fix. Why would I have tolerated the marginalisation, being excluded from plans, being blamed for everything, blocked constantly, ignored then told I'm loved over and over when I knew I was being totally fair and reasonable in my demands. I just wanted the odd sign, a nice text, a visit that meant she had to go out of her way to show me that her actions at least sometimes matched her words. These girls are so selfish its untrue. The way I feel right now I wouldn't wish on an enemy.

I've been to see a counselor and at the end of 6 hours of sessions his conclusion - "You need to let go of this woman and get rid of her from your life - now".

Seriously, what is wrong with me. I love what seems to be a devious monster who has tried to destroy me.
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Confused2much

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« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2016, 04:24:29 PM »

I sent my ex this earlier today in an attempt to explain what it's been like at my end:-

"Here's what it's been like. The only way I can describe things.

When we met I was drifting, lost, out in the middle of the sea. I wasn't sure which way to paddle or where I was going. Then you appeared in the distance, hooked your boat up to mine and made me feel like I was saved. I'd finally found someone!

The feeling of someone real appearing and our boats hooking up so snug was amazing and I thought we'd drift off together into the sun set and be happy forever.

Even though we loved each other so much and had so much fun for some reason you started to untie the boats. You started to push my boat away and in a moment of madness I kicked them apart.

They still had a good few stands holding them together but we were starting to drift apart. You were adamant that you wanted to leave me to drift on my own again but occasionally id jump into your boat and we'd have a great night together. You'd tell me everything would be OK and that you loved me.

Then, whenever I had to go back to my boat, you'd carry on cutting threads and paddling away but as you got further and further I would panic and jump up and down screaming "don't leave me here!".

Each time I'd panic you'd tell me that my behaviour was the reason for your boat drifting but I was scared and didn't want you to disappear over the horizon. The more I screamed and jumped and cried out the further away you got until finally, that final thread was broken, I couldn't see you anymore on the horizon and now I've capsized the boat, I'm sinking and drowning"

Her response (classic) - "It wasn't me that started to untie the boats, it was you"

I had to just laugh otherwise I'd have cried.
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FallBack!Monster
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« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2016, 05:48:53 PM »

I sent my ex this earlier today in an attempt to explain what it's been like at my end:-

"Here's what it's been like. The only way I can describe things.

When we met I was drifting, lost, out in the middle of the sea. I wasn't sure which way to paddle or where I was going. Then you appeared in the distance, hooked your boat up to mine and made me feel like I was saved. I'd finally found someone!

The feeling of someone real appearing and our boats hooking up so snug was amazing and I thought we'd drift off together into the sun set and be happy forever.

Even though we loved each other so much and had so much fun for some reason you started to untie the boats. You started to push my boat away and in a moment of madness I kicked them apart.

They still had a good few stands holding them together but we were starting to drift apart. You were adamant that you wanted to leave me to drift on my own again but occasionally id jump into your boat and we'd have a great night together. You'd tell me everything would be OK and that you loved me.

Then, whenever I had to go back to my boat, you'd carry on cutting threads and paddling away but as you got further and further I would panic and jump up and down screaming "don't leave me here!".

Each time I'd panic you'd tell me that my behaviour was the reason for your boat drifting but I was scared and didn't want you to disappear over the horizon. The more I screamed and jumped and cried out the further away you got until finally, that final thread was broken, I couldn't see you anymore on the horizon and now I've capsized the boat, I'm sinking and drowning"

Her response (classic) - "It wasn't me that started to untie the boats, it was you"

I had to just laugh otherwise I'd have cried.

 Bullet: completed (click to insert in post)
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livednlearned
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« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2016, 11:44:47 AM »

I sent my ex this earlier today in an attempt to explain what it's been like at my end:-   

We can help more before you send the messages, afterward is harder  Being cool (click to insert in post)
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Confused2much

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« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2016, 12:48:28 PM »

We can help more before you send the messages, afterward is harder  Being cool (click to insert in post)     

Yeah, I can see how me thinking I understand her mindset, her condition and her feelings is naive. I want to understand and I want to know what to do but all I seem to do is dig the hole deeper.

The game between yourself and a pwBPD is just awful. I hate it.
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FallBack!Monster
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« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2016, 12:55:46 PM »

Sure! Too bad it doesn't feel like a game. It's real. Today I know that. I'm sure she thinks it's still a game. I don't play with my life. No games for me. Reality hit me and that's that. But her loss. Not my win. But her loss. And please don't tell me I win. I wasted my time so no wins all around. But I will move forward with my life as usual.
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livednlearned
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« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2016, 01:12:08 PM »

She has a belief system in which she is victimized by others. An email is not going to change her beliefs.

For our part, we have to look at our own needs for validation. Usually, people who end up in BPD relationships are pretty thirsty. We can't ask someone going through a 100-year drought (pwBPD) to fill our cup.

People who have been severely invalidated (BPD) are not likely going to have the skills to validate us.

What she needs and wants is someone who comes to the relationship with a deep spring of fresh water, unlimited supply. Every time she gets frustrated about the drought, you point once to the spring. If she throws a tantrum about being thirsty, you validate how it feels to be thirsty. You point to the spring and let her know it's there when she's ready. If she won't drink from it, that's the best you can do.

You are thirsty, she is thirsty, blaming each other for being thirsty is not going to produce water.  

Saving the relationship is about finding your own spring, tending to your own thirst. That way, you can be in the relationship without being so emotionally injured.

It's not intuitive, none of this is. We're here to walk with you. 
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Confused2much

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« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2016, 01:25:47 PM »

She has a belief system in which she is victimized by others. An email is not going to change her beliefs.   

That's an incredibly insightful and accurate way of putting exactly whats been happening. The arguments have been based on me explaining that I need just basic stuff and her explaining that she has no idea what I'm moaning about.

All I ask for is a sign, the odd bit of reassurance she has feelings for me, or a show of kindness. Its been terrible but I'm glad I've found somewhere where people seem to genuinely understand.
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« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2016, 01:51:05 PM »

yip,

It is horrible to feel the way you feel... .still this site will help you a lot and you'll realise that you may never give your live, your happiness into the hands of someone else.

After one your you''l be able to look back and laugh!
You'll be able to see what a fool you've been to feel the way you feel now.
It is about power, take back your power and don't give her the power to brake your boat.
She cannot have THAT much power!
Find the thingd you liked doing before you met: the nature?... for me it is Always been the healing place when I ran off from my BD father and my BD partners.

Good luck and well... .we love you!
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Confused2much

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« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2016, 02:03:13 PM »

After one your you''l be able to look back and laugh! 

I look forward to the day when I can look back and laugh at this. The world seems like a very dark and lonely place right now. I feel like I've been saturated by her. Every emoji in my phone, every TV show, every song and I see her sat next to me smiling.

It hurts that she seems to just be fine. I call and she answers the phone with such a happy tone until she realises its me and I think "What have I actually done to deserve this?"

I have just one more question - Will she ever have an awakening? A moment where she realises how harsh, cold, unloving and unreasonable she was? Maybe not in the coming months, but ever?
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« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2016, 02:09:39 PM »

All I ask for is a sign, the odd bit of reassurance she has feelings for me, or a show of kindness.

Can you accept that she may not be able to reassure you? She can show you she cares when she cares.

Remember that she regulates her emotions externally. If you are stable and solid, she will be more likely to reflect that in her actions.

I know it's hard when there is a history. You start to read everything so closely until you're tripping all over yourself, meanwhile trying to hold her up.

Focusing on yourself right now, figuring out what it means to validate your own needs, to communicate (validation, SET, DEARMAN, etc.) and set (and keep) boundaries is critical to being in a BPD relationship. And these are skills that are pretty great in any relationship, romantic or otherwise.

First step is to take care of yourself, get that spring running. Second step is to let go the dream of who you want her to be and learn to accept who she is.

If she is BPD, she is not "just fine." It's a disorder marked by persistent self-invalidation and hopelessness.

She may never have an awakening like the kind where you expect her to clean up her side of the street and then yours. To be fair, this is true of most people. Getting well is painful, in my experience. I can understand, now, why it is so terrifying for someone with BPD to take inventory. It can feel like annihilation. When you go through it, have a good support system in place so people can walk through the dark place with you. On the other side is compassion, for yourself, most importantly. Then others.
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« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2016, 02:20:14 PM »

She will.

You might want to read about BD, learn about it.

I hope you can be strong enough NOT to call her.

You'll be hurting youself when you call and you'll want her to be friendly where she has "the right to remain silent"... .as my BD used to say to me.

Find God, find Jesus... .find anyone but a BD!
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« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2016, 02:59:29 PM »

I'm not sure I understand anything at the moment 
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« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2016, 02:59:39 PM »

If she is BPD, she is not "just fine." It's a disorder marked by persistent self-invalidation and hopelessness.

In the old Everclear song - "Father of Mine"   one of the lyrics reads "I will always be weird inside.  I will always be lame."  My wife once told me that's how she felt, every. single. day. With all due respect to No Country for Old Men, I don't know what to make of that.  I surely don't. 

Livednlearned is one of the the brightest, most thoughtful people I've ever come across in my life, and her posts have been a godsend during this time in our lives.  So, I want to highlight one other thing she said:
Second step is to let go the dream of who you want her to be and learn to accept who she is.

Is my wife the woman I fell in love with - who retains many qualities I love - or the woman who left, who was the epitome of mental illness?  All signs point to the latter.  In your case, your SO is well-documented with various illnesses.  Are you pushing aside those diagnoses to focus on the good stuff?  Or is the other stuff the bulk of who you love?
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« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2016, 03:18:06 PM »

I can absolutely back up what's been said about LivedAndLearned, absolute life saver.

I won't wade in on how to handle things as I'm here for guidance too but I will say, focus on you, be strong for you and focus on making yourself happy. Whether you can fix this relationship or not.

I've thrown myself into everything I was planning to do (long story, have Bipolar II myself and finally getting some financial support) and then some, it's been an adventure that's helping make me stronger. With that is your best chance to getting back together, they will see your strength and know they can count on you and if you don't get back together, you are a better person for it, never a bad thing, you can use that as fuel for your future either way.

If nothing else, it will pass the time as you heal  Smiling (click to insert in post)
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
What is your relationship status with them: Divorced January 2012
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« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2016, 03:36:40 PM »

I'm not sure I understand anything at the moment 

She can act competent, sometimes. Other times, her actions and words make no sense. Meanwhile, she talks and walks like her thoughts are normal, having no idea that they aren't. Inside, it's like this for her too. Who can she trust? No one. Not even herself, the most important person. You think she is confusing to you, you should hear how she is to herself. 

Meanwhile, we try to figure out when the person is stable, and when they aren't. Meanwhile, the behaviors really, really hurt us. People who hurt, hurt people. The people who love them the most. We think they must be stable when they are nice. Unstable when they are cruel.

The truth is that they are both people, they feel both ways.

It's very confusing, and it can rock us to the core. You have to give yourself time-outs.

Me, I finally caved and started to practice mindfulness, which is about making friends with your own mind. Mindfulness is a ribbon that runs throughout the day and I try to reach out and hold onto it when I need it.

The first time you start doing this, it will feel weird and boring and you'll be restless and think you're doing it wrong. You'll wonder what the big deal is all about, maybe you'll feel silly. Keep working on it, keep coming back to your breath. Then, you start being able to do this when someone is driving 10 miles under the speed limit in front of you  Being cool (click to insert in post) then you can do it when the airline cancels your trip. Then when the telecom company overcharges you. Then, one day, your pwBPD rages at you or blames you or does something painful, and you find yourself reaching for the ribbon and it's there.

And instead of going down the whirlpool with her, you look down and you're on solid ground.

That's what you're going for here. That's self-care.

We cannot know if she will stay away or come back or leave forever. We can only know that a pwBPD does not want nor need someone who is susceptible to the whirlpool. That's her world. Even though it seems she may be trying her darndest to pull you in there with her, she needs you to stay grounded.

Worst thing that can happen is that you get healthier and make some friends with total strangers on the internet  Smiling (click to insert in post)


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« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2016, 08:39:19 PM »

Excerpt
Livednlearned is one of the the brightest, most thoughtful people I've ever come across in my life, and her posts have been a godsend during this time in our lives.

Agree. I'm in a hellish place right now and reading her comments and posts is one of the few things helping me hold myself together.  
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Confused2much

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« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2016, 01:42:15 AM »

We can only know that a pwBPD does not want nor need someone who is susceptible to the whirlpool.

That makes perfect sense and I see that she is searching for ways to stop the whirlpool. No, actually, she is running and hiding from the whirlpool. That's the thing that makes me really suffer. I'm here for her. I've told her she can tell me anything and I'm not scared. I like to think that I'm understanding and supportive and there are no thoughts or fears that would scare me away but she isn't interested in facing up to the problem - only run from it, mask it and be around people who don't know it exists.

Now that I know she has an element to her personality that is disordered I feel like I've depersonalised some of her actions and I feel like I could mould my own behaviours and not get so mad at her when she does certain things. The problem is that the things she does are so hurtful and her lies about her motives are so obvious that I really struggle to accept them.

She seems to test me and push my buttons constantly. If I give her a signal that something upsets me, like being blocked from calling, she will amplify that behaviour. The first time I got blocked I reacted by calling her house and asking her why. That showed her that I cared enough to react and ever since I have been blocked 1000 times on and off over the last couple of years.

Another example - I had calmly told her that her blocking me plus her social media activities and secrecy with her phone etc had left me feeling paranoid and insecure. So, one day she unblocked me on whatsapp to send me a link to a video and there is a display picture of her with non-existent shorts on, legs in the air, ass on display and I asked "Are you taking the piss?" and she acted like she had no idea what I was talking about.

Its just a constant drain. She'll act like shes totally unaware of why I'm bothered. She acts like she doesn't realise that the being blocked, the constant ignorance, the games, the booking holidays without me, the trips to festivals without me, letting me down and going to the pub, the phone secrecy, the social media, the distancing etc etc it causes problems! It wears you down and over time you just start to snap! You could have the patience of a saint but two years of this BS has left me feeling broken. I've been swamped with guilt and my heart is just broken.

No one seems to fully understand why I feel the way I do. She doesn't either which is the most infuriating thing.

Occasionally, when I get chance to talk to her and she claims to listen I'll put all of this down into lay mans terms and at the end of it all I'll get "Yeah, but... ."

I just want my girl back. The one who I have such great times with (even just 2 weeks ago). I want her to trust me and I want to repay her with love and loyalty. I miss her.
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livednlearned
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« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2016, 08:45:59 AM »

I see that she is searching for ways to stop the whirlpool. No, actually, she is running and hiding from the whirlpool.

The searching and stopping and running and hiding is the whirlpool. You cannot be trusted because she cannot trust. If you can see that, a lot of these behaviors make sense, and you can depersonalize them.

Telling her that she can trust you does not help her learn to trust herself.

Some of the most important skills we practice are about helping others learn to trust themselves, especially how they feel.

This:

Excerpt
I've told her she can tell me anything and I'm not scared.

does not match this:

Excerpt
the things she does are so hurtful and her lies about her motives are so obvious that I really struggle to accept them.

She knows that she can tell you things that will scare you and hurt you. She can do things that will upset you. You can be scared, and hurt, and upset. Therefore, you can reject and abandon her. If she is BPD, then this is her greatest fear and she does what she can to beat you to the abandonment.

Excerpt
She seems to test me and push my buttons constantly. If I give her a signal that something upsets me, like being blocked from calling, she will amplify that behaviour. The first time I got blocked I reacted by calling her house and asking her why. That showed her that I cared enough to react and ever since I have been blocked 1000 times on and off over the last couple of years.

When you get blocked now, what do you do?

Excerpt
She'll act like shes totally unaware of why I'm bothered. She acts like she doesn't realise that the being blocked, the constant ignorance, the games, the booking holidays without me, the trips to festivals without me, letting me down and going to the pub, the phone secrecy, the social media, the distancing etc etc it causes problems! It wears you down and over time you just start to snap! You could have the patience of a saint but two years of this BS has left me feeling broken. I've been swamped with guilt and my heart is just broken.

What happens when she reaches out to you? How long have you gone without connecting with her?

Excerpt
Occasionally, when I get chance to talk to her and she claims to listen I'll put all of this down into lay mans terms and at the end of it all I'll get "Yeah, but... ."

Maybe take a break from talking about how her actions make you feel? It isn't working, sounds like. Could be that what she needs to see is that you can take care of yourself, because she knows she cannot.

Excerpt
I just want my girl back. The one who I have such great times with (even just 2 weeks ago). I want her to trust me and I want to repay her with love and loyalty. I miss her.

It may be that every time she has a great experience, she starts to feel dependent, and so needs to pull away. You may have to accept that she does this. It's her way of controlling her feelings, and it's the best she can give at the moment.
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« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2016, 09:24:12 AM »

"Usually, people who end up in BPD relationships are pretty thirsty."



livednlearned

for the most part, I love your writing, ideas, and how simple (for folks like me) you define any given situation.  But when you say things like this, it feels like you're saying that anyone looking for love and finds someone who seem capable of giving it to you, there must be something wrong with them too.

Really? So you find someone who you enjoy being with, like the fact that they are a bit quirky and fun to spend time with, so you're messed up?  Aren't we all looking to find an all in one?
The part that we didn't know is when the honeymoon period ended, we were not going to move on to a more mature stage of a relationship. 

I don't think it is fair to even imply that someone must be unhealthy themselves to have fallen for the delusional ideas of a pwBPD. Once we found out, we just got stuck believing that this obviously ill person was going through something, and will soon get back on track.  Once again be that fun affectionate person, would move on from there and grow together.  When reading other people's postings, that's the feeling I get.

Even if some of us have had unhealthy upbringings and or past unhealthy relationships, I just can't understand why someone would tell a person, whose inside has been turned upside down by a pw a PD, that its b/c they were wrong (in a way) for wanting to be loved. If so, then the whole world is thirsty and messed up because we all want for something.
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livednlearned
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« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2016, 09:32:46 AM »

Nothing wrong with being thirsty  Smiling (click to insert in post)

Attached: New Science of Adult Romantic Relationships by Amar Levine is a good book to help understand. Attachment styles are stable, and plastic throughout our lives. That means they can change, they also remain fairly stable.

We can have secure attachment styles and yet, in a difficult relationship, develop an insecure attachment style. Or, start off with an insecure attachment style and, with a lot of healing, develop a secure attachment style.



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Confused2much

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« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2016, 10:09:40 AM »

Hi livednlearned,

Surely there is a difference between talking to me about her feelings and carrying out awfully hurtful acts? She can talk to me and tell me her insecurities and work through them - surely there is no need to channel these feelings via awfully selfish, careless and cold behaviour.

It confuses me because I love her but she is disordered. Ok, so, that means that because shes had problems developing I should learn to accept her selfish behaviour? She is a grown woman with a brain that seems to function perfectly when shes in the club, flirting with lads, laughing with friends and going to work yet with me I have to accept that she can't take on simple information?

I'm starting to realise that this girl, for whatever environmental or genetic reasons, is a complete and total [insert expletive here]. She chooses to put revealing pictures up, she chooses to talk to me like I'm worthless, she chooses to come around my house, sleep with me then decide she doesn't love me afterwards. I've been used. I've been played. There is no excuses. Shes an adult and she knows right from wrong.

I've come to the conclusion that I won't get answers because there are none. Not from her, not from here, not from anywhere. She isn't a very nice person and they can categorise it however they like by studying her behaviours - I don't care.

I've been gullible, naive and insecure. They are my crimes. I've been prayed upon and played with like a lion playing with its food before striking it with a heavy blow in an attempt to put it out of its misery. I'm not going out like that, she wont finish me off, I'm going to fight back.

I'm going to start by calming down, relaxing and remembering that this person literally told me she doesn't care about me or love me this week. This person has been sent here to test me and I'm going to learn my lesson, watch out for the warning signs and move on.

I'm going to start up at the gym, get fit, eat right, read books, stabilise myself over the next couple of months then hopefully look back at this episode and laugh at what a complete mug I was. How dare she leave me here questioning life, my existence and the point of anything?

So angry right now.

I'm just venting my thoughts. Why do I love this person? I must be troubled.
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Confused2much

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« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2016, 10:14:13 AM »

When you get blocked now, what do you do?

What happens when she reaches out to you? How long have you gone without connecting with her?

Maybe take a break from talking about how her actions make you feel?

When I get blocked I feel anxious to let her know that this is all stupid. The arguing, the fighting etc - I love her why is she shutting me out?

I'm not sure she will reach out, its usually me, I've never gone longer than 2 or 3 weeks.

I agree 100%. She doesn't want to hear about how shes hurt me. It obviously makes no sense to her whatsoever.
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