He's contacted me again. I feel ill

[Depression = 72% of members]

I had a strong feeling that he'd contact me again and here it is. I'm trying to stay calm and focused, but my heart is beating out of my chest. I heard the tell-tale sound that indicates it's him texting me. I didn't read it for a full 10 minutes because my heart started to pump. It's beating even faster now and I'm full of anxiety as I've just read the message:

"I noticed you deleted all the nasty emails you sent from my account. Why do that? It doesn't change the fact you sent them. Your insecurity and casting around for others is what created all the anguish not my girls and I. I hope it has worked out for you."

It's completely out there. He's making this up, but does he believe it? He seems to be distorting reality. I did read his emails which I've discussed on here, but never sent any nasty emails from his account. This feels like an attack. Is it an attack or just a poor way to try to get my attention?

I feel ill. Why do I feel ill?

[Larmoyant]

I had a strong feeling that he'd contact me again and here it is. I'm trying to stay calm and focused, but my heart is beating out of my chest. I heard the tell-tale sound that indicates it's him texting me. I didn't read it for a full 10 minutes because my heart started to pump. It's beating even faster now and I'm full of anxiety as I've just read the message:

"I noticed you deleted all the nasty emails you sent from my account. Why do that? It doesn't change the fact you sent them. Your insecurity and casting around for others is what created all the anguish not my girls and I. I hope it has worked out for you."

It's completely out there. He's making this up, but does he believe it? He seems to be distorting reality. I did read his emails which I've discussed on here, but never sent any nasty emails from his account. This feels like an attack. Is it an attack or just a poor way to try to get my attention?

I feel ill. Why do I feel ill?

[gotbushels]

Hi Larmoyant 

I didn't read it for a full 10 minutes because my heart started to pump.

Fabulous job self-regulating before considering action. 

It's completely out there. He's making this up, but does he believe it? He seems to be distorting reality. I did read his emails which I've discussed on here, but never sent any nasty emails from his account.

From my perspective, this would sicken me. You quoted him first so I thought the general pattern on both sides was extreme. But then you shared he made this up. That would sicken me, and I'm not even you. 

I'd consider this not distorting reality. I guess technically that applies but I see this as outright making things up. He's making up a world and the situations in it. If it's distortion, I consider the bar bent completely out of shape. 

I don't know whether he believes it. I don't particularly want to put my head under the hood here--I'd suggest you don't poke around there either out of healthy self-safety. I mention that out of concern for your safety, due respect to your ex, and without negativity toward him.

I feel ill. Why do I feel ill?

Please see above. 

This feels like an attack. Is it an attack or just a poor way to try to get my attention?

I'd consider it both. It looks like an attack as well as a strong plea for attention by inciting you into a violent reaction. Normal people, I'd expect, would react strongly to outright false accusations. Imagine if someone was vehement, totally believed it, and told you that the earth is actually planet #2 instead of planet #3.

Is there any particular response (or lack of) you would consider good for you here? I'm sure you may find an action that would make you happy, but it's okay if nothing comes to mind. 

[Larmoyant]

Gotbushels, right now I just feel sick. It reminds me of all the false accusations of the past and how they made me feel so incredibly anxious trying to defend myself. I know there's no point in engaging to defend myself, but it doesn't stop me wanting to. How dare he do this.

What a messed up situation this all is. I was hoping he'd make contact again because I miss him a lot despite all the chaos and cruelty. It's hard to understand this, but slowly, but surely I'm starting to, but right this minute I've been thrown off the horse.

quote Is there any particular response (or lack of) you would consider good for you here?

Yes, it's good because he hasn't forgotten me! But, bl**dy h*ll. I was hoping for some kindness. Not false accusations and blame. I have never, ever blamed his girls for any of this. He told me they disliked me even though they hadn't hardly spent any time with me, told me that they didn't want me around and of course it hurt to hear this, but never did I blame them. They were innocent bystanders. I started to catch on that it was actually him using this as an excuse to keep me at arms length. I even told him this. And what does he mean about my "insecurity and casting around for others". I'll admit to feeling insecure, who wouldn't with all the push/pull, but casting around for others is pure projection.

I was both hoping and fearing further contact from him. I was hoping for some kindness. I mean my life is in ruins here!

I'm just crying now. Nothing makes sense.

[amunt]

how long you are separated ?

I believe he want you back, just ignored him

[Larmoyant]

Hi amunt, I called it off 8 months ago, but he kept contacting me up until a month ago when he wrote to tell me that he has moved on. So I haven't heard from him for a month and thought he'd finally gone this time.

I'm wondering whether or not to respond. Not to defend myself. No point, but in an effort to perhaps get some sort of closure. I'm not sure. Confused.

[Turkish]

I believe you that you didn't, but do you even harbor even a 1% doubt that you may have sent something that in his mind might have triggered this? 

[Larmoyant]

Hi Turkish, yes perhaps. I am shame-faced here because I went snooping looking for evidence of his dating site activity and/or other women so I read his emails. Wrong and no excuse maybe, but I was being pushed to the brink with anxiety. I found what I was looking for, and a bit more. Correspondence between him and his ex girlfriend with her telling him never to contact her again or she will call the police/his employer and that he needs the help of a psychiatrist. I shouldn't have looked I know. It was a mistake, but I'm only human and was in a terrible state at the time. I've since discussed this with him because it all came out after I read his mail. I did forward a couple of the emails onto my email address and maybe this is what he has discovered, but I have never sent anyone a nasty email from his account.

[Turkish]

So you did what you did,  but not to the extent of which he accuses you.  I intercepted several messages my ex sent to her paramour,  now husband,  while she was living with me, though she never knew.  Can you forgive yourself for what you know that you own,  and detach from his disordered accusations of what you didn't do? 

[Larmoyant]

Well, I waited until I'd composed myself, and talked with a friend and decided I had the right to defend myself and sent him this:

"I never sent anyone a nasty email from your account. I was insecure in the relationship for very good reasons. I was never 'casting' around for others. I often felt anguished, again for very good reasons. I have never blamed A, D or J for anything. I hope you are well".

His immediate response:

"You deleted the emails you sent to me. I am well. I had the operation on my left arm and that has not gone well. It isn't healing. I hope you're well. All the best"

He's now sent me Xray photos of his arm.

I'm glad I defended myself, and feel I handled it well enough, but I just feel sad now. He clearly accused me of sending nasty emails from his account, then changes it to I've deleted nasty emails that I'd sent to him from his account (!) which is also not true. Never deleted any of our correspondence. I think he may be looking back over our correspondence which clearly show who was being nasty and it wasn't me.

I think he was just trying to get my attention and I now feel sorry for him. I sometimes think I'm going insane seriously.

[patientandclear]

He could literally be looking for non-existent nasty messages from you and concluded you deleted them because he can't find them. I think he means you deleted them from his account, not sent them from his account.

He may be look for evidence of his memory of why things fell apart and since he can't find that evidence, has concluded you erased them.

He doesn't sound angry about it--more like that was a way to break the ice.

[Larmoyant]

PC, yes, he could well be doing that.

He’s often made things up in the past, or seen/heard/remembered things that never happened. Maybe he’s trying to find ‘facts’ to fit his feelings or something.

I think you’re right that he just wanted to break the ice. He’s sent me a couple more texts, telling me again that I did delete the emails and also that he’s had an infection. It really is sad.

Maybe he’s in abandonment mode and contact with me is soothing him in some way which I’ve read on here?

[mitatsu]

Maybe time to block his number and add email addy to spam folder?... .i find any interaction in the past to be only for their benefit and made me feel ill

[gotbushels]

Hi Larmoyant

I'm sorry. I'm apologising as my interpretation was incorrect. I assumed you had some level of NC being enforced on your side based on the language in the title and the first sentence of the post. I'd like to make it clear that this inaccurate interpretation is my mistake.

From that inaccuracy, these statements of mine are also inaccurate:

(... .) but I see this as outright making things up. He's making up a world and the situations in it. If it's distortion, I consider the bar bent completely out of shape. 

I'd consider it both. It looks like an attack as well as a strong plea for attention by inciting you into a violent reaction. Normal people, I'd expect, would react strongly to outright false accusations. Imagine if someone was vehement, totally believed it, and told you that the earth is actually planet #2 instead of planet #3.

I want to hold this out because based on how this has developed, it now seems like I was inaccurately judging the thing to the point where it may be construed as an attack on your ex. I try to avoid the bandwagoning thing. These aren't my intentions and I hope this clarifies that.

I'm putting this here so it makes the exchange look a little less dramatic, more accurate, and more appropriately centred. I think it would be good for how this progresses overall. 

[Larmoyant]

Hi gotbushels, please don’t apologise. I may have initially misinterpreted his words, but he’s still making things up. I have never deleted any correspondence between us. It’s still a false accusation, one that he is sticking to. Also, in his initial text, he is, I feel, attacking me, blaming my “insecurity” and me apparently “casting around for others” as a cause of all the anguish. It still feels like an attack to me and a distortion of actual events. Also, we do have some form of NC as he told me goodbye four weeks ago and said that he has now moved on. Although I suspected he’d make contact again part of me really thought he had gone this time and was relieved about that. I’ve come to the conclusion that he’s seeking attention and going about it completely the wrong way, making things up which he may well believe which to me is a complete distortion of reality and also blaming and projecting. Thank you for responding. I always appreciate your responses.

[Peterpan]

I'm no expert but from five years of reading about disordered people... .

He let you know he's moving on... .wanted a reaction, angry he hasn't had one?

He's still checking emails, but he's moving on?

Making scenarios up in his head?

Pity plays all the way... .I am well, surgery on his arm did not go well?... .angry because he's moved on but still needs you're undying pity and attention?

I dealt with all of this too and if you read it all again it's ' all about poor him'

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi L-

Others have helped you parse the words, and let's look at it another way: here's someone you're not in a relationship with anymore, don't want to be, he's said he's moved on as well, and then he sends you:

"I noticed you deleted all the nasty emails you sent from my account. Why do that? It doesn't change the fact you sent them. Your insecurity and casting around for others is what created all the anguish not my girls and I. I hope it has worked out for you."

An unfounded accusation and negative judgement out of the blue.  Just objectively, do you need that in your life?  Then you defended yourself, which you felt was right, and it was also reengaging with him; as an alternative you could have not responded at all, or simply said "please do not contact me again."

I feel ill. Why do I feel ill?

Because you're not emotionally detached.  

This is a great opportunity though, a chance to check in with yourself and see how your detachment is going.  You've been very strong lately, taking control of your life and taking your power back, although one text can still set you back.  I understand, I got an email from my ex about 9 months after I left her and it sent me off into the anxiety, the cold sweats, and the what-could-it-means, but using that experience as immediate feedback as to how my detachment was going, I noticed that by feeling all of those emotions all the way through them and adjusting my focus to what I knew was right, I got back to the "me" I want to be within a few hours, not bad I told myself, so time to celebrate.

You got that text about 12 hours ago, so how's it going?  How's your mindset this morning?  Have you found ground to put your feet on again?  And how can you use this experience?  What, if anything, do you need to do differently to manage your detachment, on the way to the empowered life you intend on living?  What if everything happens for a reason and it serves us?

[myself]

I heard the tell-tale sound that indicates it's him texting me. I didn't read it for a full 10 minutes because my heart started to pump.

There's obviously more going on here, following the thread, but maybe the following applies somewhat... .This reminds me of when I still had my exes number in my phone (took awhile to finally delete it) and a specific ringtone for her. At first it was so I would know it was her, which would make me smile. Until in the end it didn't, because it was over for us, and then that specific sound would instantly stir up much anxiety. Because I knew it wasn't likely going to be a good message, just wanting to drag me back into the turbulent and toxic soup. But I definitely remember feeling 'ill' (more like rattled) when that sound would go off. 

[Cleanglass]

It's very common for a BPD to believe their own lies. It's a coping mechanism to take the blame off of them and turn down the emotional intensity. Where we may feel guilt, they feel defensiveness and anger, projecting everything onto you in whatever way they can. Just know that this is at a subconscious level, deep rooted.

Other than emotional connections it also seems you haven't set boundaries which can knock your confidence. It's obvious that if a BPDex wants to contact you, they will find a way no matter how many blocks you do. My advice is to know exactly what stance you want to take and by that I mean value yourself and know what you want and what you can handle.

There is no shame in staying in contact with a BPDex but as long as you understand their disorder and it's effect on those who surround them, specifically yourself and more importantly know exactly where your boundaries are, based on triggers.

Telling your ex for example that they shouldn't lie won't work. Telling them that if they wish to contact you on a particular subject (children, posessions etc) they may and that all other comments will be ignored is setting a realistic boundary.

[Infern0]

It's very common for a BPD to believe their own lies. It's a coping mechanism to take the blame off of them and turn down the emotional intensity. Where we may feel guilt, they feel defensiveness and anger, projecting everything onto you in whatever way they can. Just know that this is at a subconscious level, deep rooted.

Other than emotional connections it also seems you haven't set boundaries which can knock your confidence. It's obvious that if a BPDex wants to contact you, they will find a way no matter how many blocks you do. My advice is to know exactly what stance you want to take and by that I mean value yourself and know what you want and what you can handle.

There is no shame in staying in contact with a BPDex but as long as you understand their disorder and it's effect on those who surround them, specifically yourself and more importantly know exactly where your boundaries are, based on triggers.

Telling your ex for example that they shouldn't lie won't work. Telling them that if they wish to contact you on a particular subject (children, posessions etc) they may and that all other comments will be ignored is setting a realistic boundary.

I agree 100% we need to grow some balls but I can only do it went drunk

[fromheeltoheal]

Larmoyant, September 13th:

He had chance after chance to stop what he was doing. Stop insulting me, belittling and faking our future. I'm glad I left. Glad I didn't go back.  Also, I do have moments when I want him to hurt, really hurt and (now this is going to sound really bad), but I am hoping upon hope that his next ‘attachment’ (because there surely is one) leaves him high and dry and quickly as possible. That way she gets out relatively unscathed (like his previous g/f who only managed 3 months) and he gets to feel pain. There I’ve said it!

I've made the decision to get out more and stop hiding from the world. Learning about BPD 'is' helping me take my power back. More and more I’m understanding where he was coming from which helps me unload much of it... .I like the idea of focusing on what’s real and what I know is true about me. I am ok. A good person. Not fake!

I’ve made a decision today to start moving forwards and have accepted an invite out this Saturday. This time I am going to make it.

Remember these L?  See how fast you can get back there, make it a game, an opportunity, with complete focus on yourself.

[Lifewriter16]

I found what I was looking for, and a bit more. Correspondence between him and his ex girlfriend with her telling him never to contact her again or she will call the police/his employer and that he needs the help of a psychiatrist.

Hi Larmoyant.

Contact with our exes is difficult, but it is an opportunity for us to build up our strength and gain confidence in ourselves.

I was struck by the quote above and I have a quick question for you:
What does the above say about who your ex is and how he operates/behaves with women?


Love
Lifewriter x

[Larmoyant]

He sent me more photos of his injury, and accused me again of deleting emails that I sent to him. Maybe he wanted to argue with me about it, I don't know, he likes to argue, but I ignored the accusation and he dropped it, but we exchanged a couple more texts talking about his arm. Then he went away again. The whole thing has left me feeling so very sad and confused. What did he want? I miss him a lot. I cancelled dinner plans last night, but did go for lunch with friends today. I tried so hard, pretended I was ok, but I’m not ok. I just can’t see myself getting over this man. I need help.

[Larmoyant]

Remember these L?  See how fast you can get back there, make it a game, an opportunity, with complete focus on yourself.

FHTH, I tried today. Went for lunch with some friends, but he was on my mind the whole time. I tried to change it, but I couldn't. I'm lost.

[Larmoyant]

I found what I was looking for, and a bit more. Correspondence between him and his ex girlfriend with her telling him never to contact her again or she will call the police/his employer and that he needs the help of a psychiatrist.

Hi Larmoyant.

Contact with our exes is difficult, but it is an opportunity for us to build up our strength and gain confidence in ourselves.

I was struck by the quote above and I have a quick question for you:
What does the above say about who your ex is and how he operates/behaves with women?


Love
Lifewriter x

Hi Lifewriter, I'm trying to answer your question. I just keep thinking that she obviously didn't understand that he had BPD traits (so many and NPD) and that she didn't handle him properly just like me at the time.

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi L-

Let me remind you again of what you said just 5 days ago:

I’ve made a decision today to start moving forwards and have accepted an invite out this Saturday. This time I am going to make it.

So what changed?  He contacted you.  You're not emotionally detached and you're conflicted, it is what it is, we've all been there, and the answer is simple: stop communicating with him.

The whole thing has left me feeling so very sad and confused. What did he want? I miss him a lot.  I just can’t see myself getting over this man. I need help.

And to remind you of something else you said just 5 days ago:

He had chance after chance to stop what he was doing. Stop insulting me, belittling and faking our future. I'm glad I left. Glad I didn't go back.

You're unhealthfully bonded to this guy, and the only way to break that bond is to stop communicating with him for a long period of time.  Simple.  The only question is will you?

[patientandclear]

I found what I was looking for, and a bit more. Correspondence between him and his ex girlfriend with her telling him never to contact her again or she will call the police/his employer and that he needs the help of a psychiatrist.

Hi Larmoyant.

Contact with our exes is difficult, but it is an opportunity for us to build up our strength and gain confidence in ourselves.

I was struck by the quote above and I have a quick question for you:
What does the above say about who your ex is and how he operates/behaves with women?


Love
Lifewriter x

Hi Lifewriter, I'm trying to answer your question. I just keep thinking that she obviously didn't understand that he had BPD traits (so many and NPD) and that she didn't handle him properly just like me at the time.

People with BPD generally behave in ways that sabotage and damage relationships with others. They break trust, their feelings change rapidly, they yank the rug out from under people, and often, they treat people as objects, sometimes interchangeable objects, in hopes of finding one that will make them feel good in a sustained way.

If one is going to stay, it helps to understand BPD and make changes in how we respond. Saying "wow, that's a crappy way to treat me" may not be the most skilled response if your goal is an ongoing r/ship with the person.

However, "wow, that's a crappy way to treat me" is not a bad or unhealthy response; neither is "you need the help of a treatment professional." Most healthy people would not stick around to do the advanced pseudo-therapeutic approaches taught here for making BPD relationships better.

I'm pretty good at dealing with my BPD ex. Very understanding, not critical. He has never heard from me how terribly I think he treats women. But he treats women terribly. Others have told him. Which of us is doing him the greatest favor in the end?

[Larmoyant]

He'd found me when she said those things to him. I later found out that he'd overlapped us, knew that she was withdrawing from him and set about finding her replacement. Me. She lasted 3 months, but who knows it could have been longer if he hadn't stumbled across me, but then again, maybe she is healthier. I have told him to go away too, many times, but I'm still susceptible. I stayed for over 2 years,  not a long time maybe, but long enough. I am damaged, emotionally attached to someone I know can destroy me, but I'm going to try again. Going to try to accept that this hurts. That it will go away if I stay away.

[fromheeltoheal]

I am damaged, emotionally attached to someone I know can destroy me, but I'm going to try again. Going to try to accept that this hurts. That it will go away if I stay away.

Good for you L.  You might look at your phrasing a little, you're not damaged, you're unhealthfully bonded, and more specifically, the emotional bond will lessen and eventually break if you remove him from your life entirely.  And that's only part of it, once you do that and get some time behind you, all sorts of stuff will come up for you, some you might not have seen coming, and the opportunity to address it is one of the gifts of the relationship, as you embark on that amazing, life changing project called detachment.

[Stripey77]

Hon, he is angling for a response, any response.  He's gone about it in a cack-handed, stabbing in the dark kind of way, but I'm guessing that this is because all other avenues have failed for him in the past - you called it off, etc. So he's swung to the other extreme of trying to provoke you into a response, to see if you still care, to see if you're still there. And guess what? You do, and you are. And there's his 'in' to talking to you again.

I frequently get anxiety/palpitations thinking about or seeing my ex. They have hugely dissipated, but as irrational as they sometimes are, I can feel it coming on. Not because I'm afraid of him, but afraid of him hurting him by rejecting me. Which has happened anyway and he still comes and goes, so as I say, the physiological effects are almost superfluous. But the bottom line is, we feel ill, get anxiety, etc. because our emotions were and are so heavily tied up in these people. They mattered to us, and it affects our whole body.  

I hope you feel better soon.

[Larmoyant]

Hi Stripey, yes, I think you’re right. The trouble with me is that I now interpret this as him caring for me but maybe he's seeing if I’m still there because all he wants is to soothe his abandonment fears in some way? Deep down I want him to care for me and I feel quite bereft.

As for the anxiety/palpitations, it got pretty bad at one point. Towards the end I often thought I’d have a heart attack. It’s as you say because I was so afraid he’d hurt me, drop me on my head over and over and he did.

I just feel incredibly sad.