Parent child, divorce, boundary setting

[Brighterdays26]

Hello (a lot to unpack here sorry if this is scattered there is a lot), 2 decades ago my parents finalized a divorce in which my dad received custody my sister and I. Parents first separated when I was 3, custody battle finalized when I was 11. It was a grueling time for all of us. My mom didn’t live close, and would often start fights about how we didn’t see her enough - as if that was my responsibility as a child. My dad dropped us off to religious facilities she stayed at without a vehicle, on holidays although we didn’t like going there, and drove us 2.5 hours halfway (more than) whenever we wanted to go, which wasn’t overly frequent but he did not want to force us to do anything. He always supported our relationship with our mom and was there to help when she would lash out at us and we didn’t understand - but he always responded with kindness and tried to help us understand BPD and how to navigate it. I have had seasons of having to completely cut off my mom, and my sister has at this point had more no contact than contact. Essentially I was always the last one standing with my mom for most of her life. I am reaching another breaking point now.

Throughout the years I have been blamed for our lack of closeness, like I initiated a divorce, or even had a car at 11. She has spent decades trying to convince me that I was a victim of parental alienation, but I wasn’t. I am not sure after having so little contact while she was off finding herself, getting married multiple times and moving throughout the country where she came to this conclusion. She has not been able to move past the divorce and that has been the major stress in our relationship. It’s ironic because it’s almost like she’s trying to brainwash me into admitting I was brought up brainwashed about her, but it has been her own actions and words that have caused the strain. My sister and I are so gentile with her, we don’t bring up all of the trauma she has caused us and will only use examples lightly when we are defending ourselves or our loved ones from the blame she puts on us and then for missing the formative years of our lives. She does not listen to anything we say and refuses any accountability aside from an occasional moment of clarity or perhaps just pretending she believes our POV because she is bored of fighting.

I have reconnected with her in adulthood with more effort, and things were better, with semi frequent bumps in the road. It’s pretty typical parentified child relationship, she relies on me heavily for emotional regulation which can be a lot, but I sensed she was trying which made my hopeful. Nonetheless, there is always some other drama or anger towards the past, but she was happy with me. She then began to target my fiance, who is amazing and kind, but not used to walking on eggshells because he didn’t grow up with this specific relationship, pain and trauma. I am highly emotional and empathetic, and I don’t like confrontation -  and I feel like it would be constant if I didn’t pick and choose my battles. But this has affected my life in so many way, and I am at a loss because I am constantly stonewalled and can’t even share my own person lived experiences and perspectives without being stonewalled. There is so much to this I’m not even sure where to begin or end so I will get to my main questions.

I fear my mom sees my fiance as a threat since I believe she is so dependent on me, my time - and my emotional support for her. But even 3 days where I take a break and try to slow down the contact when we talk she is “more down then ever”. I never have time to myself to decompress without worrying about her. Has anyone found a sweet spot for regular but safe amount of contact- and if so, how did you set that boundary?

Does anyone have experience with bpd and divorce/ claims of parental alienation and choosing to not cope with the past?

Has anyone experienced a BPD parent trying to rewrite their own reality that they weren’t even present for?

Does anyone have advice on how to cope with upholding boundaries and personal healing while feeling like your parents life is in your hands? I can’t heal if I am always putting her emotions first.

I am battling so much pent up grief, guilt - and I know it is not my burden but I constantly feel bad my mom has no one left, but I am concerned for my marriage and my future and my future children - but I can’t keep this one boundary - please don’t discuss the divorce we have different experiences.

I think the hardest thing to grasp is that if I, her child, was truly brainwashed by my dad and stepmom into “hating her”, which I don’t, I love her very much, what would that even accomplish? Wouldn’t someone just feel bad their kids were brainwashed and not make them relive it constantly? I’m not sure what she is trying to accomplish by this, but it is really upsetting but nothing I say or do gets through to her. All I want is for my mom to move forward and have a better life, but this divorce and anger has consumed her and it’s hard to constantly (I haven’t gone 1 month when in contact with her without having to discuss her anger) relive a traumatic time in my life to help her cope, as much as I feel ready to move forward and I have forgiven a lot, it was a painful time in my life and I lost a chunk of my childhood to this. Why re-traumatize me about it for decades? And when I bring that up (not having my mom present was hard for me and this is a traumatic topic) she has no empathy of being the child in the scenario. Totally dismissive like no- it’s not as bad being the kid - she had it much much worse. Any advice helps. I can’t continue to pour every last drop of myself into trying to help her heal with 0 progress. Looking to begin therapy soon with a specialist, so I am hopeful for that.

[ForeverDad]

Does anyone have advice on how to cope with upholding boundaries and personal healing while feeling like your parents life is in your hands? I can’t heal if I am always putting her emotions first.

I am battling so much pent up grief, guilt - and I know it is not my burden but I constantly feel bad my mom has no one left, but I am concerned for my marriage and my future and my future children - but I can’t keep this one boundary - please don’t discuss the divorce we have different experiences.

... All I want is for my mom to move forward and have a better life, but this divorce and anger has consumed her ... she has no empathy of being the child in the scenario. Totally dismissive like no- it’s not as bad being the kid - she had it much much worse. Any advice helps. I can’t continue to pour every last drop of myself into trying to help her heal with 0 progress. Looking to begin therapy soon with a specialist, so I am hopeful for that.

When I first learned of the pervasive impact of BPD (shortly before I arrived here in 2006) I recall that it was known as a Blamers disorder.  That's what you've experienced, Denial, Blaming, Blame Shifting, Projection, etc.  The problem is that trying to use logical approaches (JADE = Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain) will fail against the aggressive negativity of a person steeped in emotional perceptions rather than facts.

I went through a two year divorce where I had to record my interactions for self-protection, even at exchanges, just to document I wasn't the one posing aggressively as the victim.  You just can't make this up, it's that unbelievable.

Frankly, unless your mother starts and sticks long term with intensive therapy (DBT - Dialectical Behavioral Therapy is most helpful) and diligently applies it in her life, then she's unlikely to improve her aggressive blaming and behavior negativity.  Accept that.

So, what to do since she won't accept reasonable behavior boundaries?  Around here we recommend that effective Boundaries are for us.  Think about that for a moment since it's not intuitive.  Our Boundaries are our response to poor behavior.  Consider a bare bones framework such as "If you do or don't do ___ then I will in response do or not do ___."  It's not an ultimatum strictly speaking but simply what you will do in such scenarios.
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For example, if she starts blaming or is otherwise overly negative, then you - in response - are justified to say you're going to hang up, end the texting or leave and not return until she has had time to calm down or reset.  Then do that every time it happens, ad nauseum.

Be aware that likely this new boundary will trigger extinction burst(s) where she aims to wear you down until you go back to prior failed patterns.  Whether she eventually accepts your new smarter boundaries, only time will tell.  The point is that you set limits to your contact with her, since there is no other choice to not negatively impact your own health or that of your future family.

And good for you for seeking a local experienced counselor or therapist who knows how damaging people with BPD traits (pwBPD) can be.

[CC43]

Hi Brighterdays,

After reading your post, I can see that you are yearning for brighter days ahead, but that your mom is keeping you tethered to her backward-looking, negative narrative.  I think you are probably the bright one in the family, in part because of your dad, who tried to do what was best for you in a tough situation.  In turn, you've tried to keep everyone in the family happy, even if it meant parentification at a very young age.  I also get the feeling that you're very bright, in the sense that you're smart and can see what's really going on.  You've nailed how your mom relies on you to be her emotional caretaker.  But even if, intellectually, you see what's going on, you're conflicted about how to prevent your mother from dragging you (and your new family) down to her level.  You probably yearn to have a "normal" mother-daughter relationship, but your mother just isn't able to handle that, not when you were a kid, not now, and probably not in the future, for as long as she's clinging to the woe-is-me victim narrative, the stuck-in-the-past divorcee who refuses to face reality, take responsibility, move on and make a nice life for herself.  Even so, you feel guilty whenever you don't do your mother's bidding.  Does that sound about right?

I think that by now, you've seen that no matter how much you walk on eggshells around your mother and mollycoddle her feelings, she's still going to act needy, throw tantrums and believe falsehoods.  When she does this, it could be to get attention, to get you to over-function for her, or just to unleash her pent-up anger/frustration/jealousy/loneliness.  It's no surprise to me that she's acting up right now, precisely when you have some good news (and added stress) in your life:  an engagement and plan to start a family.  On the one hand, she's probably straight-up jealous of you, your happy news and your accomplishments.  On the other hand, she's jealous of your fiance, because much of your attention will be redirected towards him, and away from her.  I think you've seen through your mother already and understand that this is the problem du jour.  As you might know, the fear of abandonment is core to pwBPD, and your mom probably thinks she will be "losing" you to somebody else.  Cue the breakdowns, the feigned illnesses, the plaintive calls at all hours of the day and night, the desperate neediness, the blaming of others for ruining her life, the constant "testing" of your "loyalty" to her.  The second you start to pull away, she amps up her behavior, in the hopes that you will relent, only to get her to stop.

But here's the thing.  No matter what you do, your mom will still be upset, and she'll still have her unresolved issues.  Just look at the past decade or two:  her dysfunction/despair/lashing out/convoluted narrative have been pervasive, systemic, unrelenting, because she hasn't gotten treatment for BPD, or she hasn't taken treatment seriously.  In other words, no matter what you do, it will make no lasting difference to her behavior.  That's because you didn't cause BPD, you can't control it, and you can't cure it, no matter how much you want to.  Only your mom can do that.

So where does that leave you?  You could try to do whatever your mom asks, in a vain attempt to make her feel better.  But if you sacrifice your health, your life, your finances, your upcoming marriage and your other relationships, your mom will have succeeded in ruining your life, right along with hers.  I beg you not to let her do that.  You deserve to have a wonderful life!  And you are responsible for making that happen.  If your mom were of a right mind, that's what she'd want for you too.  So I think you honor your mom by making your life wonderful, OK?

What you can do is erect some boundaries.  Like ForeverDad states, boundaries don't change your mother's behavior; they focus on YOU and dictate YOUR behavior.  Maybe you could focus on one or two of your biggest issues right now.  One might be that your mom is calling you at all hours of the day and night, consuming too much of your time and emotional energy, when you need to work and get your rest.  Your boundary might be, all calls from mom go directly to voicemail.  You check your messages/texts from her once a day, when it's convenient for you.  If any message requires an actual response from you, then you will call your mom on your drive home from work, talk with her for 10 minutes, and hang up when you arrive home.  But if your mom starts shouting or criticizing, you will hang up immediately.  Maybe another issue is that your mom brings up the topic of your dad or the divorce, which stresses you out.  Your boundary might be that when your mom talks about your dad or divorce, you give one warning:  "Mom, talking about dad/divorce stresses me out; if you continue I'm hanging up/leaving."  And if she continues, you hang up or leave.

But maybe your mom's behavior is so toxic right now that you can't stand it anymore.  If that's the case, I'd say, you go ahead and take a break right now, because you need it.  You're no good to your mom if you're a basket case anyway.  You don't have to announce this strategy; just take a break--don't call, don't answer texts if that distresses you, don't visit in person, whatever.  You decide if you go Low Contact or No Contact, and you decide how long you need to take a break.  There's no clock on this.  I'd say, give it a try and see how you feel.  You just get busy with your life--planning for your marriage, seeing your friends, whatever.  You're young, you're supposed to be busy, and you're supposed to be prioritizing making an independent life for yourself.  That should be your focus, not caretaking your mom's emotions, OK?

[Notwendy]

https://slate.com/technology/2022/03/mentally-ill-parent-elder-care-boundaries-liz-scheier.html

I have posted this article before as it's a good description of what this dynamic feels like. While posters here may have different situations- the dynamics described in this article are relatable.

My parents did not divorce and while my father did take on the larger part of caretaking for my BPD mother, her emotional needs also involved us kids, and others. PwBPD tend to project their feelings and blame others and so while your mother is blaming the divorce, your fiance, or whoever for her situation, my BPD mother did this as well- it is a part of the disorder. Of course you did nothing at age 11 to cause a divorce or not drive to see her.

Where I felt this dilemma was when, in their elder years, my father got ill. I did visit, to help, but I had my own family too. My BPD mother's behavior escalated during this time, and her needs were constant.

My BPD mother was overwhelmed with her own emotional needs, she couldn't think beyond them and likely your mother can't either. Boundaries are necessary, and the difficult aspect of this is that you do care about your mother. If your mother's needs and expectations of you are not reasonable, she will react to that. It is good you are getting therapy to help you to cope with this. You are not doing anything wrong by choosing your own life, a relationship, independence. Emotionally stable parents want this for their children. Your mother isn't able to think in this way- so it is up to you to take steps to have this.

[bigapple313]

It’s pretty typical parentified child relationship, she relies on me heavily for emotional regulation which can be a lot, but I sensed she was trying which made my hopeful. Nonetheless, there is always some other drama or anger towards the past, but she was happy with me. She then began to target my fiance, who is amazing and kind, but not used to walking on eggshells because he didn’t grow up with this specific relationship, pain and trauma. I am highly emotional and empathetic, and I don’t like confrontation -  and I feel like it would be constant if I didn’t pick and choose my battles. But this has affected my life in so many way, and I am at a loss because I am constantly stonewalled and can’t even share my own person lived experiences and perspectives without being stonewalled. There is so much to this I’m not even sure where to begin or end so I will get to my main questions.

Thank you for sharing so much about how his relationship has impacted you. I completely relate to what you said about being highly emotional, empathetic and confrontation-averse. I am exactly the same way, and as I've learned more about BPD (in my case it is my sister), I am realizing that some of these core pieces of my personality have developed due to the efforts I've taken to navigate an unpredictable relationship with an individual locked into a victim mentality. I am curious how many other community members here relate to that as well.

While the nuances of all of our stories are different, I think one of the biggest themes that we all face is understanding how to set boundaries that protect ourselves while still being present for our loved one who is suffering. But at the end of the day YOU deserve to have peace. Sometimes protecting yourself and the other relationships that you cherish means releasing control and divesting yourself of the caretaker role. I'll share something that happened to me that got my wheels turning about this: last year I hosted Thanksgiving, and I caught myself going to extreme lengths to keep my sibling happy and entertained and calm at my own expense. Because of the empathy I've developed, I can feel the shifts in her mood and can usually feel an emotional episode brewing before it happens. During this holiday weekend I realized I was taking it upon myself to "head her off at the pass" by adjusting any variables that were upsetting to her, whether it was the direction a conversation was going or a comment someone made that she found upsetting. After the holiday I got very sick, and I had a bit of an "aha" moment that I couldn't do it anymore. Walking on eggshells with her was impacting me both mentally AND physically.

Al Anon is designed for loved ones of individuals suffering from substance use disorder, with the core philosophy being shifting focus from your loved one to yourself. I've actually found Al Anon meetings to be really helpful with boundary setting and detachment for my pwBPD. If you're looking for more resources, this may be a useful model to take a peek at. Ultimately, we can't control our loved ones' emotions or how they choose to interpret the past and the present. But we can find ways to prioritize our own emotional needs.

[ForeverDad]

None of us are vengeful, of course, but I am reminded of an old saying in which I will replace 'revenge' with 'outcome' ... "The best {outcome} is to live a good life."

[Pook075]

Hello and welcome to the family.  I'm so sorry you're in this situation and I wish there was a way to "fix this" so it doesn't continue.  Unfortunately though, BPD can't be fixed unless someone is ready to put in considerate time and effort in therapy.  Even before that though, they have to realize that the problem within their life actually comes from within. 

But to admit that to yourself as a mentally ill person when there's zero answer on how to overcome it...it's almost impossible.  For that reason, your mom deserves compassion.  What she says and does is genuine since she believes it wholeheartedly.  Why?  Because the actual truth is too much to bear- every failed relationship came from her sabotaging everything good in her life.

I remember a time my BPD daughter sprained her ankle.  It was a bad sprain and the doctor told her to move around as little as possible for a month, to wear boots that supported the ankle, etc.  But instead, my kid wore flip flops and ran/jumped every oportunity she had.  As a result, a short term injury became like a two-year cycle of anger, blame, sympathy plays....even though there was a clear way to fix things.  Just do what the doctor said, what everyone is telling you.  Just let it heal.  But she simply refused to be told what to do.

Your mom is in the exact same position, she needs to mentally heal through therapy.  But instead, she leans on you for emotional support while trying to destroy anything in your life that gets in the way.  That's why your parents' marriage failed, and it could be why your marriage eventually fails as well.  It is manipulation at its finest.

I said all of that to say this- you are responsible for you.  Mom is responsible for mom.  When that no longer feels true, it's time to take a few steps back.  I do agree with you that mom needs your endless compassion and empathy to function, but once you begin to withdraw, she will simply find someone else to fill that void.  She's done it her entire life.  This is not your job though and it's not your responsiblity.

Push back on her narratives surrounding your childhood, but at the same time make it crystal clear, "I love you but I will not talk about this anymore.  It is emotionally draining."  If she respects that, great.  If not, hang up and distance yourself for a few days.  Then rinse and repeat.

Do this exact same thing when it comes to your job, your partner, your lifestyle, your family, etc.  If this is to be a mutual relationship, then you get some say in what you actually talk about and your feelings should be respected.  The one-way relationship has to end though, there's nothing in it for you but harm and emotional trauma.

This plays out one of two ways- either mom learns to respect your boundaries, or you end up no contact.  The only one who can change this dynamic is you though, and your healthy boundaries will drive her one step closer to admitting the ugly truth- she's seriously ill and needs to take therapy seriously.  Letting her dominate your life has the exact opposite effect; there's no need to change anything if she gets her disordered emotion support from you.

You have to choose one path- either you're in charge of you, or mom's disordered thinking is.