Detaching by dating again...

[mar356]

"If I could have learned to discuss with her things like "Hey I'm feeling angry. I know it's going on inside me. Can you help me see why that is?" I know it could have made a world of difference. Tomorrow I'll have differing views I'm sure .

 if I was more mindful, I could have avoided. And I know I know "Well now you know for the next one." But I guess it's still early for me where I wish it could have been with her."

Unfortunately, you're wrong there is no open and honest communication with a BPD. You probably tried to express your feelings early on in the relationship to be stonewalled and learned to not worry about your feelings with her and only care about hers.  This is very one-sided.  This is covet manipulation and emotional abuse on her side. The sooner you stop thinking it is your fault and look at the relationship through the lens as a movie director (as you watching your relationship from an outside view) the quicker you will see that you didn't do the things she accused you of... .

[once removed]

I think the tell tale sign is to pay attention to the black and white thinking, that is a deal breaker for me now.

Unfortunately, you're wrong there is no open and honest communication with a BPD.

You couldn't have save the relationship. The outcome is always the same with exBPDs... .Just assume everything that your exBPD tells you is a lie because it is.

... .

They cannot be saved.

is this not some of the black and white thinking you were talking about?

[roberto516]

"If I could have learned to discuss with her things like "Hey I'm feeling angry. I know it's going on inside me. Can you help me see why that is?" I know it could have made a world of difference. Tomorrow I'll have differing views I'm sure .

 if I was more mindful, I could have avoided. And I know I know "Well now you know for the next one." But I guess it's still early for me where I wish it could have been with her."

Unfortunately, you're wrong there is no open and honest communication with a BPD. You probably tried to express your feelings early on in the relationship to be stonewalled and learned to not worry about your feelings with her and only care about hers.  This is very one-sided.  This is covet manipulation and emotional abuse on her side. The sooner you stop thinking it is your fault and look at the relationship through the lens as a movie director (as you watching your relationship from an outside view) the quicker you will see that you didn't do the things she accused you of... .

Mar i enjoy our discussions

I mean if I look back on it rationally you are right. Right in the beginning I remember an instance where I said, "Hey I'm feeling angry because you said this and this and I want to talk about it with you." And it was the first of many that she said "Are you gonna leave me?" And that's what we did. And I think the arguments increased because I wasn't willing to let my feelings not be heard. Damaging and terrible for a relationship but you're right. I learned how to communicate and I tried. It's all I could have done.

It's funny, even if I said "I'm angry because I feel like a hurt person and that's just my childhood stuff." She would have walked away from that thinking "He hates me." So thanks for the conversation. Because I just realized that insight. Even perfect communication wouldn't have stopped her from being a harsh critic on herself. It was only positive emotions or bust that she expected from me. Or If I specifically said i was angry with other circumstances. Then she was fine with it.

[mar356]

"I mean if I look back on it rationally you are right. Right in the beginning I remember an instance where I said, "Hey I'm feeling angry because you said this and this and I want to talk about it with you." And it was the first of many that she said "Are you gonna leave me?" And that's what we did. And I think the arguments increased because I wasn't willing to let my feelings not be heard. Damaging and terrible for a relationship but you're right. I learned how to communicate and I tried. It's all I could have done.

It's funny, even if I said "I'm angry because I feel like a hurt person and that's just my childhood stuff." She would have walked away from that thinking "He hates me." So thanks for the conversation. Because I just realized that insight. Even perfect communication wouldn't have stopped her from being a harsh critic on herself. It was only positive emotions or bust that she expected from me. Or If I specifically said i was angry with other circumstances. Then she was fine with it."

I enjoy the conversation as well Rob. 

Even if something was bothering me with my exBPD she would make an excuse and say we will talk about this later, which ended up being a communication via text where they can be manipulative with their words and where you can't see the empathy in person.  As soon as I was devalued I threw it right back in her face. Probably not the best decision because I wasn't informed about BPD until afterwards, but it did paint me black to her or complete the discard phase, so in a way it was bittersweet, knowing I had zero chance allowed me to start healing. I'm not suggesting you do this, but she will eventually paint you all black it is part of the process, you were an object to them not human.

[Mr.R.Indignation]

In my experience it's like being the wind on a sail. Whatever direction you blow you push the ship away, it just happens faster or slower.

Maintaining empathy is great but it has its own complications. I'd say overall there's very little impact on anything more than your own sense of dignity, since it's not especially likely that there'll be reiprocal attempts at understanding as you've highlighted. In order to have a constructive relationship both sides need to be making that effort.

[mar356]

"In my experience it's like being the wind on a sail. Whatever direction you blow you push the ship away, it just happens faster or slower."

Great analogy!

[roberto516]

In my experience it's like being the wind on a sail. Whatever direction you blow you push the ship away, it just happens faster or slower.

Maintaining empathy is great but it has its own complications. I'd say overall there's very little impact on anything more than your own sense of dignity, since it's not especially likely that there'll be reiprocal attempts at understanding as you've highlighted. In order to have a constructive relationship both sides need to be making that effort.

All so true. In my experience you can have all the empathy in the world. But if you share and commit to a relationship eventually every human will like to have empathy given in return. We are all humans. We all mess up. If our partner never cuts us some slack then it's bound to be a loss