Meeting them for dinner

[kc sunshine]

Hi gang,

I haven't seen my BPD ex for 7 months, but for those of you who have followed my story (three years of it!) I'm trying to "release with grace." I'm here visiting her town and am going to have dinner with her and her daughter and her new partner. I hope this will be okay-- I would have preferred to have dinner just with my ex and her daughter but my ex wanted her new partner to come as well. Maybe it is good in the big picture of letting me see and get used to her new reality. Any words of advice or wisdom dear bpdfamily?

 

[UnforgivenII]

Yes. Do. Not. Go!


Please... .Take care of your heart

[Sadly]

 Dear KC
7 months isn't long, I fear for you but hope with all my heart it goes well and will be your final closure.
Love from
Sadly xxx

[kc sunshine]

Can you guys talk a little more about what you fear for me here? That it will be too much for my heart to take? Thank you for your love and concern and insight 

[Larmoyant]

Hi KC, oh my, am I ever worried about you now. I understand that you’re trying to “release with grace” as that’s my intention too, but I can see some glaring red flags in this scenario. Do you still love her? Do you still harbour thoughts of being with her? You can release with grace from a distance and at the same time protect your feelings. You’ve recently experienced a huge loss (big, big hug) and I’m worried for you . Are you strong enough for this?

[Pretty Woman]

KC, I do not see this ending well especially if you are not fully dettached.

I just posted today. I am NOT fully detached 2yrs out and I am in a good, drama free relationship now.

I fear she will contact you after this meeting extoling all the virtues of the new amore and how much he is "better" than you, how he makes her the happiest she's ever been. I am afraid she will rub salt in your wounds and make you doubt yourself.

I also fear she will do the same to your replacement and try to manufacture jealousy.

Bringing her new love to dinner is NOT closure. She wants to "show off" her new "family unit" and see if she can get a reaction.

KC, a week after I was replaced I was extremely suspect my ex was BPD. She had put me through the wringer for years. She invited me out for a drink but prefaced it with saying, "But I'm with Lisa now so there is no chance we are getting back together".

She had done this before when she left me for another ex.

I asked her "are you in love with Lisa?"

Her answer: "Oh Pretty Woman, I love her more than anyone I ever met. She is the deepest most intelligent person I've ever known."

I told her to F off and we haven't spoken since. I knew this was NOT love when I asked, I mean they had known each other a week. Still, she went on to describe this person to possess qualities she believed I didn't which were very hurtful.

Don't give her an opportunity to hurt you, please.  

[glaciercats]

It actually may be good for you to meet up and see how her and the new partner interact.  I did this yesterday and it totally opened my eyes to how fake my relationship with her really was. 

[Pretty Woman]

Glaciercats,
    Out of curiosity what did you view when meeting your ex? Did you see her current relationship as fake? Please elaborate.

Thanks!

[glaciercats]

Pretty Woman,

Her current relationship did seem so fake.  She was trying to do cute things like twirling her hair.  And she was telling her current partner nice memories that we shared when we were together, and would look at me really passionately.  Mind you I was not feeding into any of this, but her new partner was intensely jealous of me.  And totally trying to control her and the situation by sending her texts across the table while we were sitting at the restaurant.   One time she even made her follow to the bathroom so they could have a discussion.  My ex was totally eating this up. Like I think the whole reason she wanted me to go was to get this jealousy and fight out of her new partner. 

It made me wonder if I acted like her new partner was acting in the beginning.  It shows me how much I have grown during this time.  I would never want to be the person her new partner is again.  It seems weird but in a way it was refreshing for me to see this.  I think a lot of us sit back and think they are so happy with the replacement and we feel so sad.  But if we could just be a fly on the wall we would know it is far from paradise.       

Glaciercats,
    Out of curiosity what did you view when meeting your ex? Did you see her current relationship as fake? Please elaborate.

Thanks!

[kc sunshine]

Yeah, I totally see what you guys mean. I am not fully detached and am jumping into this fire.

At first I texted her no about the dinner, explaining that I'd like to see her first (since it has been so long) and see how that goes before I meet the new gf. But then I thought I was being to drama-y and said what the heck, let's give it a try. I think she might rub it in my face, the three of them as a new family unit.

I think that my strategy for coping will be:

1) order something that I can eat quickly if it is a bad scene and hurts too much.
2) go in there with super low expectations for the encounter-- just that we all show up
3) appreciate that we have all (her daughter, her, and me) landed on our feet, post break-up
4) pray and remember to breathe deeply while I'm there

Any other ideas? Thanks for all of your love and support gang-- it means so much 

[Pretty Woman]

I think that is a good game plan for you if you want to meet her.

None of us can make you do anything one way or another. If you do decide to go, stop by and update us on here. It would be good to see how you feel after going through that experience and it might help someone else.

I don't agree with your choice (it wouldn't be good for me personally) but it doesn't mean it's a wrong choice.
 
Good luck!

[kc sunshine]

I will, for sure, PW!

I think I'd feel worse not seeing her at all while I'm here-- maybe this can be an exercise in "faking it to you make it." I also had the thought that maybe bringing her new gf gives her a sense of emotional safety, so it is less about me than about her. I'll try to send her thoughts of safety.

[Anez]

KC,

Been following your story for a long time. I get wanting to go out with the ex and talking to them and I wish you the best. I personally don't think it's a good idea tho I definitely thought about it when i was about 7 months into NC/LC (my ex and I work together).

But i'm now in the "leave them behind" mindset and never look back. there's nothing good that can come from these people. Go in there with that expectation and take care of yourself. You've come a long way. don't let something like this set you back.

[Rayban]

Hey kc,

I'm going to echo the others on this board and say this is not a good idea ... .for you  ... .for her this is paradise.

I suggest you read up on triangulation. Basically, she'll play both sides. She'll try to make the new guy jealous, and make you feel worse for not being enough to be with her. I've been in both roles (new guy meeting exes, and ex seeing replacement ) In both cases I felt like an object.  I was jealous of the attention she showed her exes, and was made to feel I wasn't good enough when she was dangling replacements in my face. Remember if she truly is BPD, this is all about her.  She doesn't care how this will affect you.

Even if you have an exit plan, you'll be ruminating about this for months.  You don't know what she's told the new guy about you or how he will react. She could be telling him you're the guy who insisted on this dinner and how you just can't let go.

Her daughter will be there you seem to have been close to her. What if the daughter seems to like the new guy better? What will that do to your self esteem? If you wanna picture worse case scenario, well here it is ... .You leaving that restaurant feeling like crap, while she snuggly sits with her new family smiling.

What do you wish the end result will be for you?  Closure? Maybe you feel you're two grown adults who are catching up 7 months after a break-up, except that she is disordered and will crush your heart without blinking am eye, cause in her mind that's what you deserve. The only reality that should matter if you're truly trying to detach is the one you could control which is your own. Hers will just keep you stuck in a world of hurt.







 

[glaciercats]

Rayban is correct. That's exactly how it went down when I went to dinner with her and the replacement. It sounds like she is trying to triangulate you. But at the end of the dinner she will be leaving with them and you will be leaving alone. It's not a good feeling.

[stimpy]

I'm going to echo the sentiments made by others here already. At the same time, sometimes we need to do these things and I can see why you would want to and I hope it goes well if you do go.

But don't forget, there is absolutely no need to stay if you are not enjoying the evening. If the situation becomes difficult (triangulation/projection/devaluation/disrespect/lack of compassion/ lack of empathy/ blaming/shaming etc... .etc... .) and you feel your personal boundaries are being crossed, then enforce your boundaries and leave. Keep some cash ready for a speedy exit. There need be no drama, and indeed it is easy to make an excuse. You could even arrange an "escape call" from a friend an hour into the meal if you wanted to.

Above all, safeguard your emotional well being.

If you do go, I wish you the best of luck.

[hopealways]

I second the emotion of the first response above: DO NOT GO.

[kc sunshine]

okay, gang, here's the report! I was so so nervous-- shaking nervous-- when I went (luckily it was cold out so hopefully they thought I was just chilly) but I think it went okay. The new girlfriend was very warm and kind and they weren't too lovey dovey (a little, but not over the top). We laughed and exchanged stories and updates and left warmly. It was really good to see her daughter and she was full of stories. So all in all it was pretty good, and I enjoyed the time. It seems like my ex is doing a little better-- she has stopped drinking so that is good-- that was always an issue for us.

The problem is now, the aftermath, as you all predicted. My head is full of "new information" and I can feel my brain in overdrive processing it. I guess I should get busy, get exercising, and focus on my life. Here's my plan (so strange that I have to do this to get control of my head, usually I'm more laid back):

get some tasks done at work
exercise
see friends

Thanks you all for being there! 
 
 

[stimpy]

That's great KC, I'm glad it went well.

[kc sunshine]

The dinner went well but the aftermath (trying to recenter, etc) is hard. Price of the ticket I guess!

[kc sunshine]

Hi gang,

Still struggling over here in the aftermath of the dinner (as you all predicted).

The thought that woke me up too early in the morning-- I think she might be pregnant. She made a big point to tell me that she is not drinking and that she hasn't told her daughter about it yet. It could be that she stopped drinking because she didn't want to be so volatile, but now I think it is more likely that she is pregnant or trying to get pregnant. Whoa.

I guess this all is a lesson in radical acceptance. I'm struggling though.

[Pretty Woman]

Hang in there. 

Now you know. This triggered you. Meeting her was a trigger.

I will be honest, the last few days I too have been triggered by someone bringing up the fact my ex may be getting married. I know this is the best news for me... .it gives me closure on some levels because to me marriage is "sacred". Then again, this is someone who cheated on her husband and every person she dated after that. Could she return someday? Maybe. Do I need that in my life?
No.

Still, hearing anything about her is a trigger.

I will admit, I have another FB account and have spied from time to time. That is what has held me back from healing.  I deleted it yesterday. I am ready to stop dwelling, stop hoping for their relationship to fail to prove to me she is crazy.

I KNOW SHE HAS SERIOUS ISSUES. This person wasn't good for me. If she works with someone else and they are not wreaking havoc on everyone around them (like we did) that's a good thing. It's healthier for the people around them regardless if their relationship is toxic or not.

I know I am better off without her and I know you are better off without your ex. You've come a long way baby!

KC, what are you struggling with the most? Is it the "what ifs"?

You don't know if she is pregnant or trying so try to get that out of your head. You are focusing on something that may not exist at all, or it could be a game she is playing with you intentionally... .to see if she still has you in some capacity.

My ex introduced me to several exes and in retrospect I see she did this to manufacture jealousy. It's triangulation at it's finest.

And it worked. I also found out my ex would call her exes to complain about me. She could care less about her exes, she was just using them to gain sympathy and recruit "rescuers". As soon as we were "good again" she'd tell them out of respect for me and our relationship (ha) she couldn't talk to them anymore.
She would dump them all over again. It's unbelievable how many of her exes would return for more abuse.

In my opinion, it's safest for you, especially if you truly want to move on, to stay away from her. Trying to even be friends with someone like this is fruitless. They treat you worse than when you were together and because there is no "commitment" involved like in a romantic relationship they walk away from you even easier. It sucks. They will use you over and over until you have nothing left to give and you feel like the Tin Man walking... .walking around without a heart.

I am so glad you are posting here and expressing your thoughts. You need to feel your way through this. It isn't easy and it will hurt a bit but it's the only way to get through it.

And then set boundaries for yourself. As long as you don't "make exceptions" boundaries are what will get you through this.

Have a great day, KC.
 

[Tottie]

It takes two to tango. It see she is borderline, probably she will have instable relationship with everyone.

But even If she has a stable relationship with another guy. It doesnt matter Because she was bad in your relationship, thats the only thing Which matters. Let them just be happy like pigs in ___

[steelwork]

kc, so sorry to hear you are struggling. I'm thinking that going to this dinner was you expressing a kind of optimism that is true to who you are. Obviously, many of the members here wouldn't have gone, and you are paying a price, but life is sometimes a balance between self-protection and generosity of spirit. Your tendencies (from what I've seen) lead you to err on the side of generosity. You were being yourself as best you could. Going forward, maybe you can balance things a little more on the side of self-protection if you feel the cost was too high, but I know you won't become bitter. I don't think you have it in you. Take care.

[steelwork]

Hey kc, I thought I'd check in and see how you're doing. I hope you're not struggling as much as you were right after the dinner. 

[kc sunshine]

Hi Steelwork,

Thanks so much for checking in and for your and the others' wisdom and care  ! I'm doing better and home from the trip but it was a bit of a push-pull rollercoaster while I was there. I could still felt the heady force of the pull and the aching pain of the push but could recognize it and put it in perspective a bit more. I think it all went okay in the big picture, and we left on pretty good glad-we-are-friends terms. How are you doing?

[kc sunshine]

Oh man, I wrote this optimistic reply too soon! That very same day (last Monday) my ex texted me asking me what I'd say if she asked me to get back together again. We talked and the pull was so strong. I haven't heard from her since, though, so the push is equally as strong. I'm experiencing all the mixed emotions of the intense pull-push whiplash, trying to steady myself again with my kids and my work and with doing enjoyable things in the sunshine as my ballasts. It's tough though 'cause I do love her. Dang disease.

Hi Steelwork,

Thanks so much for checking in and for your and the others' wisdom and care  ! I'm doing better and home from the trip but it was a bit of a push-pull rollercoaster while I was there. I could still felt the heady force of the pull and the aching pain of the push but could recognize it and put it in perspective a bit more. I think it all went okay in the big picture, and we left on pretty good glad-we-are-friends terms. How are you doing?

[jhkbuzz]

 

At first I texted her no about the dinner, explaining that I'd like to see her first (since it has been so long) and see how that goes before I meet the new gf. But then I thought I was being to drama-y and said what the heck, let's give it a try. I think she might rub it in my face, the three of them as a new family unit.

You actually knew what you needed to do to keep yourself emotionally safe - and then you minimized it and put her needs above your own.

No condemnation from me; it sounds like you have a generous heart. But that generosity needs to extend to yourself - what you need, what you want. It's okay for you to have needs too. Like the very healthy need to keep yourself safe, sane and whole.

Consider it a lesson learned?... .

[kc sunshine]

Yeah, I think you are right. The thought that went through my head yesterday was "someday I'll learn. But that day wasn't 4/3/17!" Maybe today? We should make pop quizzes for our board based on lessons learned/to learn!

You actually knew what you needed to do to keep yourself emotionally safe - and then you minimized it and put her needs above your own.

No condemnation from me; it sounds like you have a generous heart. But that generosity needs to extend to yourself - what you need, what you want. It's okay for you to have needs too. Like the very healthy need to keep yourself safe, sane and whole.

Consider it a lesson learned?... .

[jhkbuzz]

Yeah, I think you are right. The thought that went through my head yesterday was "someday I'll learn. But that day wasn't 4/3/17!" Maybe today? We should make pop quizzes for our board based on lessons learned/to learn!

It's not quite that simple. Somewhere you learned how to subjugate your own needs for those of another. We all do that in various ways from time to time for very good reasons - but I don't think this was one of those times. Someone who had a healthier sense of themselves (emotionally) would have RUN from the idea of dinner with the ex and the replacement - especially if they still had residual feelings AND the ex struggled with mental health issues.

Might be worth exploring.

(PS I'm almost three years out of my r/s, and if my ex contacted me and wanted me to have dinner with her and her new s/o I wouldn't even need a millisecond to think about it - the answer would be no, no and HELL no.)