How do others deal with the BPD habit of projecting?

[Depression = 72% of members]

My estranged husband with BPD has been incredibly verbally and emotionally abusive and we are divorcing. I still have to deal with him on practical matters until all gets sorted out. He sends ridiculous emails that sound like those of a 15 year old boy claiming that I have "tormented" him when, in fact, nothing could be further from the truth. I am a browbeaten shell of what I used to be before him. He has emotionally brutalized me and, honestly, discoveries about the secret life he's been leading remind me of a Russian doll: I think I've finally been confronted with the worst of it and some new grisly discovery of him going behind my back and bad-mouthing me to associates pops up (he shared intimate photos of me with his co-workers), and then some guy he messed around with while high shows up on the doorstep, and then... .and then... .I'm actually afraid to answer the door or the phone or read emails.
And yet, oddly enough, after so many horrifying scenes in which he screamed at me and swung his fists at my face and called me a c*nt in front of the kids and made such an awful to-do on the lawn at 1 a.m. that the neighbors came out, he says I'm the "tormentor" and, no matter what I am going through, if I mention it (as in responding to his yelling "You have ruined my life!" with "I just got home from the hospital because of all the stress of this, so maybe you could try to be a little more civil." he becomes enraged. It's as if I am not allowed to have any problems at all. I can't be the victim. He insists upon being the victim even as he is doling out the attack.   
When we were still together, when I got sick or injured, he would get angry like a kid gets angry when mom is too sick to take him to the park. Once when I was vomiting because I had the flu, he stood in the bathroom doorway and screamed "This wouldn't happen if you took better care of yourself! You're doing this on purpose! Why are you doing this to me?" (That was minutes after I said I was too sick to have sex.)

[Breathe066]

My estranged husband with BPD has been incredibly verbally and emotionally abusive and we are divorcing. I still have to deal with him on practical matters until all gets sorted out. He sends ridiculous emails that sound like those of a 15 year old boy claiming that I have "tormented" him when, in fact, nothing could be further from the truth. I am a browbeaten shell of what I used to be before him. He has emotionally brutalized me and, honestly, discoveries about the secret life he's been leading remind me of a Russian doll: I think I've finally been confronted with the worst of it and some new grisly discovery of him going behind my back and bad-mouthing me to associates pops up (he shared intimate photos of me with his co-workers), and then some guy he messed around with while high shows up on the doorstep, and then... .and then... .I'm actually afraid to answer the door or the phone or read emails.
And yet, oddly enough, after so many horrifying scenes in which he screamed at me and swung his fists at my face and called me a c*nt in front of the kids and made such an awful to-do on the lawn at 1 a.m. that the neighbors came out, he says I'm the "tormentor" and, no matter what I am going through, if I mention it (as in responding to his yelling "You have ruined my life!" with "I just got home from the hospital because of all the stress of this, so maybe you could try to be a little more civil." he becomes enraged. It's as if I am not allowed to have any problems at all. I can't be the victim. He insists upon being the victim even as he is doling out the attack.   
When we were still together, when I got sick or injured, he would get angry like a kid gets angry when mom is too sick to take him to the park. Once when I was vomiting because I had the flu, he stood in the bathroom doorway and screamed "This wouldn't happen if you took better care of yourself! You're doing this on purpose! Why are you doing this to me?" (That was minutes after I said I was too sick to have sex.)

[balletomane]

You just described my ex in detail. He called me his "tormentor" too and screamed, "You ruined me!" He also said I was the worst abuser he'd ever met in his life (and he claimed all his previous partners had abused him, so that was saying something). I remained the "worst abuser" until things fell apart with the woman he discarded me for and she took on that role.

At the time I was devastated by it all and my 'strategy' was to apologise and apologise and apologise for whatever he accused me of, alternately begging him through my tears to stop. Of course it never stopped.

He accused me of only being with him "until someone better came along" - yet he was the one who was shopping around for other women behind my back. (He discarded me as soon as he'd secured a new relationship.) He accused me of cheating on him, but he was the one who cheated. He accused me of emotionally blackmailing him because I told him I was upset about the cheating. His exact words were: "You are reacting to my happiness with depression. That is emotional extortion." Then, immediately after that, he went, "I just had to cut myself so I could breathe. Now I need to not talk to you, otherwise it will be pointless." The list of projections went on. Some of them I recognised at the time, others I did not.

Dealing with what these projections did to me was the hardest part of my recovery. It was only when I accepted that this behaviour was tied to his feelings (and not to anything I did or didn't do) that I was able to stop stinging at the memories. There is nothing I could have done to prevent this behaviour or to ward it off. It took me a long time to accept this.

[OptimusRhyme]

Yeah, I heard "you ruined me" a lot too, and that I was a master manipulator. I didn't know what BPD was at the time, and I tried my best to listen to her, try and explore her feelings with her, but made clear that I didn't understand why I should accept responsibility for her actions and feelings, and that my alternative perspective wasn't mutually exclusive with hers being validated.

She would frequently sleep with other people and then freak out at me when I'd mention other women (friends, acquaintances, etc) about how "sex was sacred" and "she's not a hypocrite". When I'd mention that I hadn't even accused her of being one, and half playfully brought up "the lady doth protest too much, methinks", she shut down and freaked out.

I eventually chose to leave the confusion when I decided I couldn't accept it and it wasn't going to change. I now know the dynamics behind the situation I found so baffling, but I havent found any tricks besides "leave". Edit - and once you've left, to remember that your intuition is objectively good, and to trust that when things that you've made an honest effort to inspect seem impossibly confusing, you are always correct.

Sad.

[Breathe066]

Balletomane, holy smokes, maybe it's the same guy!  Everything you are saying is so painfully familiar. Thank you.
And you, OR. It is very comforting to know I am not all alone. That others have endured this.
How's this for confusing? He messages that I must let him go, so I say sure. I am absolutely silent in accordance with his request that I let him go. Each time I leave him alone as requested, he blows up and makes some new demand regarding the divorce.
He says he is blocking me on his phone and half an hour later he calls and yells at me and hangs up.
It really is like dealing with an adolescent. 

[Inneedofhelp]

To hear other people explain my situation is so strange... .and somewhat comforting to know we are not alone. The things you all describe have happened to me over and over again... .especially the "I never want to talk to you again-you make me crazy"... .then a call (or several) in the next few hours and days where he rants about how awful I am and he can't believe I am not willing to change to get along with him. He absolutely can NEVER take any responsibility in the horrible interactions. He also gets rageful and says it's my fault because I never let him talk, and that i shouldn't be surprised that he needs to express his anger at/on me because I am the cause. After years of abuse (and only recognizing recently it really is abuse) I am so ready for a divorce and a separate life path but he just keeps coming back. I am just starting to work individually with a therapist to help me set boundaries-my hope is to do it in a mostly peaceful way but have to prepare that he might act out once I start further detaching. Anyone have advice or experience? To complicate things, we have 2 children (8 and 12) so he feels that gives him the right to be too involved on my side-"it's best for the kids". Not!

[nomotime]

I think the problem with projection is it's difficult to validate without making matters worse.  Or maybe I just haven't got the hang of it yet.  But I tend to sidestep projection with 'We're not talking about me, we're talking about X' Not allowing conversation paths of blame to continue will not affect their opinion after a dysregulation it seems any more or less than agreeing or denying, so I've found its the quickest route out of a loop. If she pushes, eg. the sarcastic "Of course we're not talking about you because nothing can be wrong with perfect you" (I can hear it in my head... .not sure I realised til right not quite how predictable the pattern can be) I continue to enforce as calmly as possible that we're not talking about me at this time and that breaks off pretty quickly.

I used to take the projected accusation to heart a lot and self-criticised a lot until I started to realise it was absurd.  Particularly when my upwBPD started referencing my exes telling me I drove them insane (because I had one ex many years in the past who was/is clinically depressed) I started to realise she will say anything and I really shouldn't beat myself up or rise to the bait.  'Manipulate' is a favourite of hers too. It seems to be BPD code for, "You're trying to make me take responsibility" or "You're not doing what I want". Nowadays when she accuses me of manipulation, I often ask 'to what end'? 'What am I manipulating you to do'? So I don't have to invalidate her claim/feeling but I put the burden of proof back in her hands. She very rarely has an answer to this, or at least not one that can be taken seriously ("To torture me" or the like are not real answers as we know we have no desires to do such things) so even if if the episode continues at least I can walk away psychologically unbruised. 

[heartandwhole]

Hi Breathe066,

I think projection is one of the hardest features to deal with in relationships. It caused me a lot of frustration and hurt. I hear you about not being able to have problems, either. I think it stems from the symptoms of the disorder that make many with BPD feel like abandonment, pain, and rejection are only a heartbeat away for them. That's why they need defense mechanisms like projection to ward off the worst that can happen.

It's really quite sad. And it hurts so much to be on the receiving end.  

As for how to deal with projection, I'm not sure there's a sure-fire way, but communication tools and good boundaries will help.

We have a workshop here that you may find helpful:

BPD Behaviors: Projection

As you can see, you are definitely not alone !

Since you have to deal with him regarding practical matters, I'd recommend taking a look at  the communication tools. You can find many of them on this page:

Ending Conflict

heartandwhole

[LilMe]

The projection is the worst part for me and my children too.  He tells everyone that I took everything from him, but in reality, I lost everything. The children and I left with only the clothes we were wearing. No money, nothing. I lost my home, my business, everything. Our 8 and 9 year old are devastated by it also. He tells them that I abused them when actually  they were the ones abused by him. They can't understand how he can lie and actually believe it.

We all just have to be quiet and not respond. My children cry and beg not to go for visitation and ask how much longer until they are old enough to refuse to go. I am doing my best to help them be strong and be true to themselves. I am 1 year out and doing ok, but feel like I will never really recover from this.

Although knowing others experience the same craziness is comforting, I also hate that others go through the same pain!  Hugs to you all 

[Aesir]

I would pivot away from it and focused on her issues. In the end this failed because she was determined to shift blame.

[jambley]

This is hard for me because I kept notes/journal of so many instances where I can see now it was due to her past rships/failed marriage and I got blamed. Projections are my biggest as I gave her so much and got so little back - it hurts

[Breathe066]

In Need of Help,
Wow! One of my pwPBD's themes is/was that I don't let him talk! He claims that I go on and on and that he never gets to tell about his day. But there is/was really no way for me to avoid criticism on the matter because if I am quiet and ask him about his day he says "What's wrong? Is there something you aren't telling me? Why are you asking me these questions? Why are you withholding information about your day?" No joke. He complained that I hogged the conversation when we got home from work so I made an effort to be quiet and let him talk and then he became absolutely enraged because he claimed I had "withdrawn" from him and shut him out. In fact, that was the last fight we had before he left.
I wonder how common the conversational push/pull is in BPD relationships. How many of us caretakers have been accused of either talking too much or withholding?

[kentavr3]

After going through a lot of critical situations with exBPDw and  going through divorce now, I realized that situation could be painted by humor.
Please! Remember and Understand!  Listen carefully. Write down.
 THEY COMPLAIN YOU ON Themselves!
This is it! very short and funny!
Samples from my past experience.
BPD words                 -   meaning
Your mother is dumb - my mother is dumb
did you have women - BPD stared cheating.
why you are in a bad mood today again - BPD is in the bad mood.
and etc.
 add humor in this. Over wise you'll get crazy.

[jambley]

Ha! That made me laugh the last post. My ex said similar things, complete w@nker

[W2do]

I recently discovered my husband of 20 years may have BPD.  It was the day I realized I need to get out of this relationship.  All the screaming at me and the kids, the blaming, the verbal abuse and threats of physical abuse.  I have no clue how I endured all these years!  The threats of physical abuse started 6 years ago and those moments were just horrifying!  I can honestly say I never understood the projecting until recently.  I think I dealt with it because for many years I blamed myself for everything that went wrong.  He was never forced to take any responsibility for any of his actions.  Even when I suffered a period of depression with thoughts of suicide, he blamed me, never supported me, told me I was lying.  The constant belittling in front of the kids.  I am emotionally done with him.  The police have been called many times and children's aid has been involved as well.  We are still living under the same roof, while I am attempting to come to some separation agreement.  I have a long road ahead. But with help from medical professionals, friends & family, I hope to get out of this intact.  Thank you all for listening and allowing me to read your stories.  I definitely can relate to what  you post.

[In a bad way]

Yep if she was in a bad mood she accused me of being in a bad mood.
A classic one would be when she was quiet and staring at the TV, I'd ask her if she was Ok and was anything wrong.
She'd say she was OK and nothing was wrong.
After a few attempts at conversation she would say shut up I'm watching this.
Then a couple of hours later she would say I've been miserable all night and she has tried to talk to me and I have ignored her.
When I pointed out it was the other way around she would start the screaming and swearing and then accuse me of screaming and swearing at her.
I was left dumbfounded that she could actually believe what she was saying.

It was the same in the morning, she didn't talk, I at first put it down to her not being a morning person like me but I made an effort.
Then at night she would say she can't get a word out of me in the morning but I talk too much at night and spoil her TV.
She couldn't leave her phone alone at night.

[Breathe066]

In a Bad Way and W2do,
Sounds remarkably familiar. The "I've been trying to talk to you all night" has been turned around on me constantly. W2do, I am glad to hear you are working your way out of that situation. Mine left, but now, incredibly, I miss him and find myself blaming myself, wishing I had managed to "hold onto" him--which is absurd; now that I look back, there's plenty to suggest he never really wanted to stay in our marriage. That has been a real revelation. Stuff I never even noticed before now seems to make sense in terms of his need to leave in order to avoid being abandoned.

[Herodias]

Sometimes I would just listen and know he was talking about himself. Other times I would say, " I'm a reflection of you!" That would either make him laugh or make him stop and think. It's difficult at times. They get all disregulated and act like toddlers and have tantrums. If you act calm they get mad- if you get mad they act calm. You just have to do your best in that moment.

[kentavr3]

If you still with relationship with BPD/NPD , you can blindly hear them without any attention and ask as many questions as possible. This is called Detailization. BPD gets tired. Unfortunately, this will be a treatment for one time. BPD will get another subject to press you. If BPD is in hate/love stage, nothing will change. You'll be confused where you are. BPD will turn upside down your reality.