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Author Topic: BPD Mom obsessed with her health & uses it to manipulate me  (Read 1161 times)
Finallyawake
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« on: May 10, 2017, 07:46:11 PM »

My unofficially diagnosed BPD mom has ALL the traits of a high functioning hermit witch borderline. Of course, she has no idea she has this. However, she is completely obsessed with her health.

Let me be clear - my mother is in her 70's and has an endless stream of health issues and it has been this way for over 30 years. Yet, she has no known life threatening conditions and is not taking any medications.

Some of her health problems are 100% real, but I think she is using these conditions to manipulate me.

Seriously, it must be 90% of her conversations are either about her health or is criticism about me.

She worries about her health. She looks up every symptom online. She will see doctors, but she fears medicines and tests.

She refuses to take her doctor's advice, nearly 3/4 of the time. She has blamed me for times when her doctor did procedures she didn't want, but agreed to. She said she freezes up at the doctor and said I should have known she didn't want the procedures. On at least two occasions, she disassociates at the doctor's office and then blames me because she remembers the experience incorrectly.

She discusses every little symptom nearly every waking hour.

When she was younger, she never worked and blamed her physical health as the reason.

She randomly uses her endless list of symptoms as excuses to have me stay home from work to take care of her.

She uses these excuses to say she is too sick to let me do anything that she doesn't want me doing.

She looks for any excuse to blame me for her health. Examples - her symptoms got worse because she falsely claimed I didn't remind her to do her exercises (I actually did remind her many times) or she will say I didn't remind her to take her vitamin supplement. She always makes me remind her of stuff and it always feels like a trap for me and lets her evade responsibility for herself.

Sometimes she will tell me her symptoms and then ask me what I think is wrong with her physical health. If I give her an answer she doesn't want to hear, she rages and then gaslights me. For example, she told me a symptom she had. I looked it up and it was a symptom of diabetes. She got furious and told me that I am the one with a symptom of diabetes, not her. Then she told me I need to see a doctor for my concerns about me having diabetes, when we were clearly talking about her.

She will sometimes quiz me to see if I am listening and she will make me tell her what she told me her symptoms were. If I cannot remember, she will rage at me.

Is she simply using her health as a vehicle to help her manipulate me or is there something beyond BPD going on here?
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Turkish
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« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2017, 01:21:16 AM »

To put it simply,  it sounds like she is reaching out to you in order to validate her disordered world-view.  There's a saying on this site,  "validate the valid; invalidate the invalid."

The Hermit's dominant emotional state is, fear ("life is too hard", or is it the Waif's message, helplessness. In either case, "rescue me!"

How would you feel to step out of Rescuer mode, even if you may have been there for so many years? What do you think it would look like to step away?
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    “For the strength of the Pack is the Wolf, and the strength of the Wolf is the Pack.” ― Rudyard Kipling
Sunfl0wer
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« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2017, 07:38:58 AM »

I'm not sure if this is BPD or something else.  However, I don't think the label will impact her behaviors towards you.

Turkish makes an excellent point about rescuing behaviors.

I'm thinking starting with learning some boundaries may be a decent place to start.  We have lots of great boundary info around here, idk if you have had chance to look at some of it.  (Not so good at hunting down links, eh)

My guess is this is a long long pattern with relating to mom and you may want to be prepared for some extinction bursts... .so may as well read up on that if you haven't yet.

If I were in your shoes, I would begin by setting small goals for myself.  I really would prefer mom not speak of any health issues with me, but after all these years is likely not going to be easy for me to set that boundary.

I may start with something smaller like say: I will not give medical advice when asked.  Instead I will simply state, "sounds like a question for a doctor." Or "I guess your guess is as good as mine, could be anything, or nothing, I simply am not sure."

I might start practicing some boundary language in small things like this.

She may become verbally abusive, so it is a good idea to set boundaries around abuse going into this. Decide ahead of time how to disengage from abuse.

I'm sure there are endless ways to go about it... .

Another way that has helped for me is taking a relationship break for a couple of weeks.  Sometimes getting space from the person helps me to wrap my head around my own thoughts without worrying about how they will react to my interactions.  Then when we reunite, it can be easier to set small goals... .or I can reunite in small increments, managing my exposure to the person. 

It could be though, that she engages you via this method and may not accept the relationship changing.  She may just only want a relationship under these current conditions, could be how this ended up this way, which is pretty sad.  Well, reading about FOG is helpful to me in this regard.  (My own mom simply would not engage in any lasting healthy way.)
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« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2017, 11:50:52 PM »

Hey Finallyawake:  

Just sharing, in case you are up to reading a bit of a vintage technical document from 1994.  An excerpt from the document appears within the quotation below:

Excerpt
Emotional Hypochondriasis, Hyperbole, and the Borderline Patient

MARY C. ZANARINI, ED.D.
R. FRANKENBURG, M.D.

The Journal of Psychotherapy Practice
and Research 1994; 3:25-36

The authors define a new defense mechanism, emotional hypochondriasis, that is hypothesized to be central to borderline psychopathology. The behavioral manifestation of this defense-the hyperbolic stance of the borderline patient-is also defined and related to the complex phenomenology of borderline personality disorder. Borderline patients are seen as making an active attempt to maintain a tolerable, if tenuous, adaptation in the face of tremendous subjective emotional pain that has been shaped in large measure by traumatic childhood events that
have never been validated. Twelve treatment implications and three expectable, if overlapping,
stages of treatment stemming from the use of this defense and its behavioral se- quelae are detailed.

Copy and past the address below in a new browser window to get to the 12-page PDF file:

www.vuir.vu.edu.au/19368/9/25.pdf

NOTE:  The link does not work, so copy and paste

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Finallyawake
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« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2017, 12:00:01 PM »

I do not see it as possible for me to step away from the rescuer role. Don't get me wrong, I would be happy to do it, but I don't think my mother can fend for herself. She's never really had to. Now, in her 70's, I don't think she could learn how. I do feel responsible for her well-being. She has no one else besides me. Yes, I know all about FOG.

I am okay with being my mother's rescuer to some extent because I love her and at times she is wonderful, but I am NOT okay with her managing our interactions together any longer. I need to change the dynamics of our relationship. I will be there for her, but it needs to be on my terms. Both she and I need to treat me as an adult. This is one of my goals for my upcoming therapy sessions.

One of my triggers is listening to her talk about her health ALL THE TIME. It is mind numbing. I know I need to set boundaries. Again, this is another goal for therapy. I am ridiculously bad at setting boundaries.

Since my first post on this topic, I did read the linked document that Naughty Nibbler referenced. It was interesting and seemed to support the theory that BPD and hypochondria can coexist.

However, my Mom's issues seem to go beyond hypochondria. I do think she uses her real health issues to feed her BPD. For example, she uses health issues as excuses to need my help and avoid facing her abandonment fears. She will have me stay home from work if she is sick. To me, it's somewhat because she is sick and somewhat because she does not want to be alone.

My original post in this topic was meant to find out if other people have seen the BPD person in their life have a total obsession/preoccupation with their physical health. I am still curious how common this is.
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DonnaQuixote

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« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2017, 12:58:40 PM »

Yes, my sister has a total preoccupation with her physical health.   I'll leave it to others to give you advice, b/c I still don't know how to deal with it.  It must be extra hard for this to be happening with your mom, and you be in a role of active caregiver.  This is how it is with my sister:

On the phone, she can get through about 2 minutes of forced pleasantries like "how's the weather" and then launches into a litany of what's wrong with her, what doctors are or aren't doing to help her, what meds she's on or thinks she needs (she's a prescription narcotics addict), etc.  It's distressing to listen to b/c if you take it at face value, she's physically suffering and in need of all kinds of urgent medical attention.  One time I even had a pizza delivered to her b/c it sounded like she couldn't move around well enough to cook for herself.  Phone calls go on like this until I have to hang up for some reason... .upwards of an hour with her just churning away at this medical monologue. 

I've set some boundaries in terms of how many phone calls and text messages she should expect from me in a given week, and when during the day those can occur.  That has been super helpful, but I haven't successfully set any boundaries in terms of what we can talk about.  If I do anything other than validate her health problems she flies into an angry fit.  She seems to want/need to family contact of talking to me on the phone, but I'm not sure if it's helping or hurting to let her have these health-problem monologues.

In her case, the medical problems also validate her claimed need for prescription narcotics and for staying on disability and "not being able to work." So she really seems to need buy-in to these health problems.  And you can't invalidate them without invalidating her entire existence b/c everything about her lifestyle revolves around the health problems.

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Finallyawake
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« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2017, 02:08:50 PM »

DonnaQuixote, thank you for validating my experience by sharing your own. You have described 99% of what I am experiencing with my mother.

You might appreciate the 1% difference. My mother is absolutely petrified of medications and will not take practically any! She is the complete opposite of an addict. If ever she takes medications, she believes she is having every known and unknown side effect possible.

She goes for natural home remedies, which often work for her. I'm not sure if they are legitimately working or if it's a placebo effect.

Yes, everything else in my experience is the same as what you described. If I don't validate Mom's health issues then she would view me as invalidating her entire existence. "Health problem monologues" is the perfect name.

I am sorry that you are going through this too. I have no idea how to put boundaries in place with this. I am hoping to learn how to do this in therapy this summer.
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Cariadai

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« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2017, 11:37:08 AM »

This sounds pretty similar to what I'm currently going through with my uBPD mother. My research on the subject shows hypochondria is definitely co-morbid with BPD.

I drastically cut back contact with my mother about six months ago, because I couldn't take her aggressive and unpredictable behaviour more. I practised the medium chill technique, and while it definitely helped me, the health dramas have snowballed ever since. To the point we are at right now, where she is telling everyone in our church that she has extensive terminal cancer. When in reality, all the tests so far have come back either clear or inconclusive. After the first hospital appointment (where they did some of those tests that were clear, with my sister present, such as an MRI and a camera down her throat) she has refused to have family with her at the appointments, which is making it very difficult for us to get any solid facts to refute her allegations. It's also making us look uncaring and neglectful, which is distressing.

Needless to say, I don't think she's ever enjoyed anything as much, to say that she is basking in the attention is an understatement. I've never seen her so happy or bubbly. She's taken it a step too far this time though, as she's arranged for a minister to accompany her to her next consultant's appointment, where she will receive the final diagnosis, based on the rest of the tests she's having this week (including a CAT scan). She's requested that he communicate the results to us directly. If, as we are quite certain, this is all just a case of cry wolf, I envision one almighty meltdown, since she's already told everyone in her life that she's had the diagnosis, and that she has terminal cancer, in all her lymph nodes, larynx, spine, shoulders, neck, and head. She's also saying this is her sixth bout of cancer; in reality, she's never had a malignant tumour once. How she's going to backtrack from this one, I'm almost interested to see.

A year ago she was calling 911, claiming heart attacks, every few days, until they told her conclusively that her heart was fine. A month ago we were called to the emergency room, she'd been taken in by ambulance after a little fall (she is 84). I was present when she got her X-ray results, no bones broken, just a slight graze on her nose and a bruised wrist. She's still telling people, in my earshot, that she broke her wrist and nose, and loosened all her teeth.

It's all a desperate need for attention, to feel important and special, and to show us up, and/or guilt us into control. We did try, tactfully, to put a few people wise, but she is so convincing, and we were beginning to look like the heartless monsters she tells people we are, so we've stopped trying. Time will tell.

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Daughter123

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« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2017, 02:46:32 PM »

I don't have any words of wisdom or advice but I just wanted to say that you are not alone- I am in the same boat. My mom is always "sick" and expects me to drop everything and run to her when she has a COLD. Most recently, she didn't call me for weeks after I had a baby and is mad at me because she could have been lying on the ground... .
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anyplacesafe

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« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2017, 10:23:50 AM »

Yep yep yep. My mum has had some very genuine health challenges in her life but never cancer, and yet I find it impossible to remember that she has never actually had a cancer diagnosis. Every year, her mammogram became this big terrifying ordeal equivalent to e.g. a day of diagnosis after a biopsy - this with no lumps etc. Because my dad worked away, she ended up going alone while I was a child, and even as a child I was made to feel guilty about this. She would always tell me she didn't mind for herself but for me because she didn't want to ruin my life by dying. But for example:

- she has repeatedly thought she was having heart attacks which turn out to be nothing, no ECG or blood test suggestion of the same (I think panic attacks)
- 'cancer of the vulva' turned out to be a UTI
- annual 'scares' about breast cancer (no family history, no lumps, no actual scares in the past)
- she does have kidney stones which are a terrible thing to live with but every time thinks it's kidney cancer
- her dad had a gallstone, she had a gallstone attack but decided it was liver/pancreatic cancer
- her mum has bad arthritis but arthritis pain or sciatica in her must be bone cancer

If you don't share her anxiety you 'don't care' and she is incredibly hurt at your 'callousness'. I was also told from a very early age that I was 'making her ill', that any day I was naughty was 'a day she would never get back' (as if she were terminally ill), and that 'she could be dead this time next year'. I am meant to always console etc but she does NOTHING to manage her genuine health issues (kidneystones and irritable bowel). It's so manipulative.
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LittleLucy

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« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2017, 07:34:07 PM »

My Dad had BPD and NPD and used physical illness all his life as an emotional prop to get attention from his wife and both us daughters, if we did not pander to his mystery illnesses, usually digestive issues, then we were in trouble.  My sister who also has BPD has followed suit, she claims she is constantly ill and is too weak to do any house work or paid work or to every tidy up her house.  As children we grew up in a house where my Dad's illnesses were the most important issue, we spent our lives soothing him, preparing special meals and trying all sorts of things medicines and diets to help. Our needs as children were invalidated and denied only his was valid.  Now my Dad has died I realise that the above article is true and that it was my Dad's mechanism for coping with terrible psychological and emotional trauma from his own very dysfunctional childhood.  It is sad that this condition has been passed on to my sister.  Good luck with your Mom
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2017, 12:28:36 PM »

Thank you for all of your responses. Anyplacesafe, I wanted to say that from the time I was a child, my mother did the same thing you mentioned. If I did anything she didn't like - disagreed, had a contrary opinion, didn't do exactly what I was told, expressed any anger or fear, showed any signs of thinking about myself before her - I would then be told that I made my mother sick by upsetting her. It seemed like she would find any reason to blame her being sick on me or anyone else. It often is the case that she is sick with something that is he fault of someone else.

And LittleLucy, my mother did the same thing you referred to. My mother claimed for years that her parents made her too sick to work. She worked maybe two years cumulatively my whole life. She went from depending on her parents to depending on me.
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Cariadai

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« Reply #12 on: June 17, 2017, 02:07:03 AM »

An update on my situation: it turned out my mother was partially right, she does have cancer, although nowhere near as widespread as she made out, it is just in her lymph nodes. She went in for surgery last week, and came through that fine. Before she went in she did everything in her power to prevent us from being there for her, but we just ignored it all, and have been at the hospital every day. Needless to say, now that she's getting the attention she craves, and thinks we are dancing to her tune, she's being very pleasant (temporarily).

The whole situation has plunged me into black depression though, having to deal with her brings back all the traumatic stuff that she's put me through, and now that she is genuinely sick, I feel trapped into maintaining this level of contact and support.

I actually don't know how I'm going to cope.
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Chambers

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« Reply #13 on: June 17, 2017, 03:21:29 AM »

Interestingly enough I jumped out of the frying pan into the fire with the males in my life. Husband (Mr H) is BPD and my Dad is a hypochondriac BPD and claims that everything he eats upsets him, he is gluten intolerant with every digestive disorder coupled with serious anxiety. If I ignore his graphic explanations of bodily functions he will find someone who will listen at a later date, normally when having a social lunch! So I have learnt to say to him that I am not a professional and suggest that he writes down his concerns because they appear to be causing him stress and something really should be done as he keeps mentioning it. I have encountered some terrible episodes where he has blamed me for his illnesses though and that if I do not take him to the doctor I will have to live with the consequences! That episode made me very ill and resulted in 4 weeks of counselling and medication. So I hear your pain. I'm a rescuer which is clearly why I attracted Mr H but I have now changed from rescuer to enabler. I still help as Dad is 72, but if there are things he can do I let him do them. I just get him to be more responsible for his decisions about his health. If he is not being validated through he will purposely eat something that upsets him to get the sympathy.
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Chambers

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« Reply #14 on: June 17, 2017, 03:35:54 AM »

Cariadai Sorry to hear about your mums diagnosis but there is a silver lining. You know the facts now and assume you know the treatment and care for her wellbeing now she is out of surgery. There is lots of information about the drama triangle which I think will help you, as it did me. Become the adult and not the victim in her life, if you want to support her and have no regrets about doing the right thing but protecting yourself using the adult technique will be of tremendous help. Not sure if you believe in crystal therapy but I carry black tourmaline with me when I visit Dad now which enables me to communicate better without anxiety.

Also negotiating shared responsibility with the rest of the family. Do the others share your feelings?

You will find the strength, you just haven't know where to look.

www.johngouletmft.com/Breaking_The_Drama_Triangle_Newest.pdf
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