I'm a prisoner.

[Depression = 72% of members]

That's right - a prisoner.

I cant leave the house without permission - and I have to state reason for going out. If reason not accepted I cant go anywhere. I'm allowed out to the post box or post office - in some cases she will insist on coming with me.

If I defy her - she will threaten to smash up my office - or threaten to committ suicide.

I have read many accounts on here but you seem to have more freedom than me - even those of you who sound depserate talk about scenarios where you are apart from your partner.

how many of you married to BPD wives are denied permission (!) to leave the house, take  walk or whatever.

I read that BPDers fear abandonement - but this must be that and also a control issue.

I think my uBPD wife is in a class of her own - should be studied by someone big.

[MrRight]

That's right - a prisoner.

I cant leave the house without permission - and I have to state reason for going out. If reason not accepted I cant go anywhere. I'm allowed out to the post box or post office - in some cases she will insist on coming with me.

If I defy her - she will threaten to smash up my office - or threaten to committ suicide.

I have read many accounts on here but you seem to have more freedom than me - even those of you who sound depserate talk about scenarios where you are apart from your partner.

how many of you married to BPD wives are denied permission (!) to leave the house, take  walk or whatever.

I read that BPDers fear abandonement - but this must be that and also a control issue.

I think my uBPD wife is in a class of her own - should be studied by someone big.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[HelenaHandbasket]

Hi MrRight!  I'm glad you're posting here. 

Your situation sounds absolutely miserable. I'm so sorry you're going through that. Let me ask you a few questions, if you don't mind. First, is your wife seeing a therapist? Does she have a diagnosis and is she in any kind of treatment or taking any kind of medication?

Does she ever have moments of clarity about this situation? Moments where she'll say something like "I know I'm too controlling, I'm sorry" or anything like that?  I ask that because it's impossible to change something you don't acknowledge. Getting her to acknowledge the problem might be the first step in fixing it.

Do you have children?

[MrRight]

Hi MrRight!  I'm glad you're posting here. 

Your situation sounds absolutely miserable. I'm so sorry you're going through that. Let me ask you a few questions, if you don't mind. First, is your wife seeing a therapist? Does she have a diagnosis and is she in any kind of treatment or taking any kind of medication?

Does she ever have moments of clarity about this situation? Moments where she'll say something like "I know I'm too controlling, I'm sorry" or anything like that?  I ask that because it's impossible to change something you don't acknowledge. Getting her to acknowledge the problem might be the first step in fixing it.

Do you have children?

No - no therapy - and she is unlikely to respond well to suggestions the problem is with her. Sometimes she will say - well you knew I had a difficult character - you shouldnt have married me (she is right there). The problem is "with me" - I dont match up etc - dont do as I'm told - clean up to her standards etc - model correct moral and behaviour to our 14 y/o son (joking with him is frowed up - she doesnt want him to become like me - a clown, as she sees it).

she is a hopeless case. But I need to survive these last few years and figure a way out.

[GaGrl]

What do you see yourself modeling to your 14 year old son now, and is it what you want him to be as an adult?

[midwestrose]

This sounds very similar to my situation. My husband of five years does not like it at all when I leave the house. If I choose to go to the store or something without him, it almost always means a massive fight when I return. He sold my car when we moved in together, so I have no autonomy. He made me quit my job and work for his home-based business, so I never get any time away from him.

In the beginning of our relationship, he was downright scary. He has evolved to a more manipulative kind of control. If asked, he would say that he doesn't prevent me from going anywhere, but if I tell him I need to go out he will be dismissive or insult me as a way to get me to stay.

[MrRight]

What do you see yourself modeling to your 14 year old son now, and is it what you want him to be as an adult?

I talk to my son about this - he has asked me not to leave until he is older and neither is there any possibility of me and him leaving her.

He understands his mum is an extreme case - emotionally unbalanced etc and I have given him plenty of advice on avoiding the mistakes I have made - while making him understand I dont regret the day he was born and his importance in my life. These conversations have been unavoidable as he started asking me - has mum always been this way etc - and when I said well sort of - he said why did you marry her etc. He's a wise kid

To be frank - defying her would lead to a violent war between us and right in front of him - so am not prepared to push that far as she never backs down no matter what. he understands that. From what I have seen of his relationships with girls at school - I dont think he will repeat any of the mistakes I have made in life.

as for the mistake I did make in life - partly bad luck - wrong place at the wrong time - and some underlying character flaws on my part exploited to the full by a cunning and unscrupulous uBPD.

[MrRight]

This sounds very similar to my situation. My husband of five years does not like it at all when I leave the house. If I choose to go to the store or something without him, it almost always means a massive fight when I return. He sold my car when we moved in together, so I have no autonomy. He made me quit my job and work for his home-based business, so I never get any time away from him.

In the beginning of our relationship, he was downright scary. He has evolved to a more manipulative kind of control. If asked, he would say that he doesn't prevent me from going anywhere, but if I tell him I need to go out he will be dismissive or insult me as a way to get me to stay.

me too - if I say to her - you wont let me go out - she will say you are free etc - then if I say ok I'm off out for a walk - she will say - dont expect us to be here when you get back.

she's an extreme case - I dont believe the tutorials etc on this site will help me. But it's good, in a way - to know it's not just me living this kind of "life"

[waverider]

- she will say - dont expect us to be here when you get back.

Why does that become your problem.? She can choose to be there or not. Where is she going, and then what?

I had to go through wrist slashing, trashing things etc, to break this pattern. threats and even following through, only works when it works, if you know what I mean. Its a battle between her perception of what you might be up to vs your fear of what she will do. It creates a stalemate, you need to let cause and effect play out to prove these perceptions wrong.

To break this precedent i think you need to pick one issue and stick to it, rather than trying to push different issues. eg going for an evening walk. Do that and dont push it elsewhere. Her issues are based in insecurity. If nothing bad ever happens from your end, she will adapt eventually. Then you have set a precedent which can then roll out to other aspects. It is a long hard road, but it can be done.

[MrRight]

Why does that become your problem.? She can choose to be there or not. Where is she going, and then what?

I had to go through wrist slashing, trashing things etc, to break this pattern. threats and even following through, only works when it works, if you know what I mean. Its a battle between her perception of what you might be up to vs your fear of what she will do. It creates a stalemate, you need to let cause and effect play out to prove these perceptions wrong.

To break this precedent i think you need to pick one issue and stick to it, rather than trying to push different issues. eg going for an evening walk. Do that and dont push it elsewhere. Her issues are based in insecurity. If nothing bad ever happens from your end, she will adapt eventually. Then you have set a precedent which can then roll out to other aspects. It is a long hard road, but it can be done.

Thanks for your constructive comments.

to be honest - my life is such that I dont really care whether I can do what I want or not. I either have total freedom or no freedom - one or the other. an evening walk on my own is no freedom at all from the position I am in. even so - she makes life barely worth living when she cant have her own way.

[Naughty Nibbler]

Hi MrRight:   

To be honest - my life is such that I don't really care whether I can do what I want or not. I either have total freedom or no freedom - one or the other. an evening walk on my own is no freedom at all from the position I am in. even so - she makes life barely worth living when she cant have her own way.

So, might you be a prisoner by choice?  I'm thinking you must have felt less like a prisoner when you married your partner and that the situation evolved over time.  Waverider gave you some good advice.  Since the situation likely evolved over time, it will take some time to go in reverse.  With firm boundaries, and consistent enforcement, you can reverse it. 

Think my uBPD wife is in a class of her own - should be studied by someone big.

Your situation is not unique.  I've read similar accounts of controlling partners. A few months ago, a woman indicated she couldn't leave the home either.  She worked from home and, by her account, had to stay on the phone with her husband throughout the entire workday.  They both had to be poor performers on their jobs. 

 Usually, upon examination, those who are "controlled" generally lack boundaries (or don't defend them consistently) and are codependent. 

THE DYSFUNCTIONAL DANCE

CONTROL FREAKS

EMESHMENT AND CODEPENDENCE

[HelenaHandbasket]

It sounds like you might be suffering from learned helplessness. Have you read about this? It's basically a state of mind in which you are in a bad situation but feel you can't get out of it. I'm noticing that you seem to be shutting down a lot of advice that might actually be helpful--and I don't say that to be critical. I was once in an abusive relationship and I remember doing the same thing. For a while, getting out of that quagmire seemed about as likely as being crowned Princess of Lollipop Land. When people would give me advice I would find reasons why it would never work, why it didn't apply to my situation, etc. Twenty years later, I have to admit that at least PART of that was because I was just scared to leave.  I didn't know how. And I was afraid of pulling the pin on the grenade and having to deal with a total upheaval of the status quo. The devil you know, right?

Now, I dearly wish I'd left sooner. I wasted years of my youth with that asshat. Turned down a study abroad trip to Greece for him. Ugh.

Anyway, I really think you came here for a reason. I think you want out of this mess. But to get to the happier, healthier place both you and your son deserve, you're going to have to take some risks. You're going to have to disrupt the status quo. That may come in the form of sticking to boundaries within the relationship and risking her freaking out on you, or it may come in the form of leaving and dealing with a divorce. But dude, you can't go on like this. This is toxic for you and your son, however smart and well adjusted he may be.

I wish you luck. And courage. And peace.

[MrRight]

Thank you people for your excellent comments.

I must have come here for a reason.

yes - in a way - not advice. That sounds odd. I principally came here because I need to communicate with people who understand what is happening to me. I know the full score and I do have a plan and feel it is the best one.

It's been good to come on here and hear different points of view and also to read other people's problems etc and know there are other people in the world with these issues.

[Panshekay]

Pretty much everything that I have been a part of with our son and 6 GS going through this and through tons and tons of research and hours upon hours of reading what I have found is do it for your son if you can't do it for yourself. This is what my research shows... .the kids learn how to be an adult and how to let their own future spouse treat them by the example you and your wife provide. OR... .they grow up, leave home and don't want to be a part of that life, so they pull totally away from their dysfunctional family. OR... .they repeat what they have learned so it all continues for another generation. Until someone is willing to change something the past predicts the future... .I dont wish this hell on anyone.  May peace and discernment be with you. 

[Pedro]

Hell MrRight.

Welcome to the site. I can identify with some of what you have and are experiencing.  My ex g with BPD was quite controlling through the first 4-4.5 years of our 6 year relationship.  I enjoyed simple pleasures prior to meeting her such as going to a local coffee shop at a weekend & reading a newspaper whilst there.  She didn't like it, she would question, make me feel guilty for going, insinuating I was having a affair & was meeting up with somebody there. Also I would visit my mum & youngest brother who only lived a few miles away from us a couple of evenings a week. She would question, interrogate turn it against me making me feel guilty for leaving the house & doing other things. I allowed her to do this & I resent her for this & other things she controlled. Eventually I started standing my ground initially it would be that we had run out of milk or I needed pain relief for a headache, but in reality I was doing the 2 topics I have mentioned.
I don't know how to suggest what would be suitable for you, perhaps other members who are more experienced at using tools such as setting boundaries, validation, communication etc? I hope my experience gives you a smidgeon of motivation or hope to persevere?  I am at early stage myself of understanding the illness of BPD, how best to deal with, educate myself with tools & trying to reconcile with my ex g.  Good luck.

[MrRight]

Pretty much everything that I have been a part of with our son and 6 GS going through this and through tons and tons of research and hours upon hours of reading what I have found is do it for your son if you can't do it for yourself. This is what my research shows... .the kids learn how to be an adult and how to let their own future spouse treat them by the example you and your wife provide. OR... .they grow up, leave home and don't want to be a part of that life, so they pull totally away from their dysfunctional family. OR... .they repeat what they have learned so it all continues for another generation. Until someone is willing to change something the past predicts the future... .I dont wish this hell on anyone.  May peace and discernment be with you. 

Thanks for your comments.
perhaps he will make the same mistakes (or not) - which be odd - given that I have explained my mistakes to him and told him not to make the same - not to take any crap from a partner etc - and above all - how to spot early on behaviour patterns that can lead to a messed up marriage like mine and exclude that person from your life.
I cant make a life changing decision on behalf of my son "based on tons of research" - rather I listen to points of view and weigh up my options.

I am following several threads on this site with similar situations to my own - dad with child/children - tied in with obsessive BPD mum - and they all face this dilema. None that I have seen look close to getting out with the kids and leaving BPD mum to explode in solitude. Maybe you could point me to a "success story" where dad got out with the kids. I would be very interested.

[MrRight]

Hell MrRight.

Welcome to the site. I can identify with some of what you have and are experiencing.  My ex g with BPD was quite controlling through the first 4-4.5 years of our 6 year relationship.  I enjoyed simple pleasures prior to meeting her such as going to a local coffee shop at a weekend & reading a newspaper whilst there.  She didn't like it, she would question, make me feel guilty for going, insinuating I was having a affair & was meeting up with somebody there. Also I would visit my mum & youngest brother who only lived a few miles away from us a couple of evenings a week. She would question, interrogate turn it against me making me feel guilty for leaving the house & doing other things. I allowed her to do this & I resent her for this & other things she controlled. Eventually I started standing my ground initially it would be that we had run out of milk or I needed pain relief for a headache, but in reality I was doing the 2 topics I have mentioned.
I don't know how to suggest what would be suitable for you, perhaps other members who are more experienced at using tools such as setting boundaries, validation, communication etc? I hope my experience gives you a smidgeon of motivation or hope to persevere?  I am at early stage myself of understanding the illness of BPD, how best to deal with, educate myself with tools & trying to reconcile with my ex g.  Good luck.

thanks for those comments pedro - did you have children?

[Pedro]

Hi,
My ex gf is 40 & I am 46. Neither of us had children prior to this relationship, & due to her BPD & my 30 year history of Depression & Anxiety, we decided jointly & individually that we didn't want children. I didn't want to pass on these genes to my children, my Mum & youngest brother have 50+ years & 15 years respectively of Depression & Anxiety also which I feel is genetic. I didn't want to put my children through what I have experienced. But now we are separated & she has a new bf she may have kids with him, although she keeps making a point of telling me every week for the last 5 weeks since she ended our relationship she doesn't want children. My circumstances are not the same as yours, I do not have that added responsibilities that you do, & I wish you the best of look whatever happens from now on. Please please please read any advice that is suggested for your own learning & understanding. You do not have to act on the advice, but with hindsight I wish I had known about my gf's condition whilst in the relationship, or had accessed advice from BPD family here when still with her. Best wishes.

[MrRight]

Hi,
My ex gf is 40 & I am 46. Neither of us had children prior to this relationship, & due to her BPD & my 30 year history of Depression & Anxiety, we decided jointly & individually that we didn't want children. I didn't want to pass on these genes to my children, my Mum & youngest brother have 50+ years & 15 years respectively of Depression & Anxiety also which I feel is genetic. I didn't want to put my children through what I have experienced. But now we are separated & she has a new bf she may have kids with him, although she keeps making a point of telling me every week for the last 5 weeks since she ended our relationship she doesn't want children. My circumstances are not the same as yours, I do not have that added responsibilities that you do, & I wish you the best of look whatever happens from now on. Please please please read any advice that is suggested for your own learning & understanding. You do not have to act on the advice, but with hindsight I wish I had known about my gf's condition whilst in the relationship, or had accessed advice from BPD family here when still with her. Best wishes.

Thanks Pedro - as you will realise - when there are children involved the whole issue of setting boundaries etc is a whole new ball game.

I am still waiting to hear from a board member who has kids and a BPD wife. Nothing as yet.

[Fie]

Hello MrRight,

It might be useful for you to open a new thread with your specific question in the topic title.

Fie

[waverider]

I must have come here for a reason.

yes - in a way - not advice. That sounds odd. I principally came here because I need to communicate with people who understand what is happening to me. I know the full score and I do have a plan and feel it is the best one.

The first reason people come here is to seek validation that what they are going through is not unique to them, that it is real issue, and they are not going nuts.

The thing is with BPD it is not consistent, so plans go astray as the pwBPD changes/ reacts in a way that was not in line with "the plan". Hence a suck it and see what happens staged approach is usually what is best. At the moment you probably have few boundaries, once you set a couple then it becomes a precedent that you actually can and will enforce them. Thats why you start with one or two issues.

Even if ultimately your plan is to get out of there you are still going to have to interact and so the techniques for regaining your part of the paddock, remain. To simply cut and run will lead to enormous chaos that you will find harder to recover from. In short those who leave with less scars are those who have re established themselves within the relationship first. It reduces the 'what ifs" and recycling. Their decisions are more considered than desperate.

[cantmoveon]

It's not unique unfortunately. Some days only the threat of starvation would allow me out of the house to buy groceries and even then I'd need to walk around holding a phone letting her hear that I was really in a grocery store and wasn't flirting with anyone.

The really hard part is that its never consistent. You get used to living like that then they pull a 180 and completely ignore you, have no interest in your whereabouts for 3 weeks.

[Tattered Heart]

I know that each person's situation is unique and every pwBPD responds differently. I also know that as a nonBPD, when things are bad we have a tendency to get tunnel vision so all we can see are the negative aspects of living with someone with BPD. At times, it can feel like we are prisoners or stuck or hopeless.

Have you tried to use any of these tools or are you just assuming they won't work because things are too bad? I know there is ALOT of information on here and trying to put all of them to use at once can be very overwhelming. What if you just started with 1 tool. One easy one, such as Don't JADE or try to validate.

The first tool I began using was Don't JADE and I immediately saw changes in my H's response to me. He went from quickly blowing up to getting angry at a steadier pace, which gave me time to begin trying other tools, such as validation and asking him questions about what is going on. Now, he gets mad maybe every 2 weeks and only blows up every couple months. I'm working on using DEARMAN now.

You don't know if these tools will help until you try them. If you don't try them, then things will keep going the way they have been going. How has that been working for you?

[waverider]

If things dont change they will stay the same. You have the power to make a change, the reaction to that change is not a given, but it will not stay the same.

The tools are historically shown to generally cause a change for the better, even if they dont seem like they would.

We get stuck in assumptions in much the same way pwBPD do.

[MrRight]

Terrible week.
worst row in years - we threw everything at each other - dragged out all the dirt.
Half term - I told her our budget for going out - she wanted to triple it with several trips.
I caved in and financed it by taking a 1 month break on a loan I have.
She found the letter from the bank and went crazy. Accused me of everything she could think of.
I usually button my lips in these situations but I went mad  too - accusing her of driving us into debt etc.
Then I said I'll leave - ok she said but wants it done through a lawyer - then I said if it's going through a lawyer I'll be applying for custody.

So it got worse and worse - she threw water over me - drenching my office - destroyed my pc keyboard and other damage.

We patched it all up later like we always do. But I've been depressed since. There's nothing good between us - we dont agree on anything - politics - music - etc. Nothing to talk about. She's a ticking bomb.

[Balance714]

No - no therapy - and she is unlikely to respond well to suggestions the problem is with her. Sometimes she will say - well you knew I had a difficult character - you shouldnt have married me (she is right there). The problem is "with me" - I dont match up etc - dont do as I'm told - clean up to her standards etc - model correct moral and behaviour to our 14 y/o son (joking with him is frowed up - she doesnt want him to become like me - a clown, as she sees it).

she is a hopeless case. But I need to survive these last few years and figure a way out.

Sorry man, your wife is just like mine.  I know how you feel.  I think we are on the verge of splitting up too.