I thought I detached successfully...

[Insom]

I'm here because memories of a BPD-ex that I thought I detached successfully from many years ago surfaced in the last year in kind of an intense way.  Something I've discovered at as part of going through this experience is that I may not be very well in touch with my basic needs as a person.  In general, I've had a hard time throughout my life understanding what I want.  It's been easy enough for me to understand what I don't want but I have struggled to articulate what I do.   Maybe some of you have felt this, too.  

Anyway, I started a journaling exercise this week that is helping me a lot.  In a nutshell, I'm writing a paragraph or two on the question, "How do I feel?"  Essentially, it's a catalog of body sensations - pain, hunger, etc. -  but covers emotions as well without trying to analyze them.  The goal is to notice and record.  It's only been a week but already I feel like I'm gaining some some sensitivity in areas that I tend to deny.

How many of us have put off eating or sleeping or socializing with friends because we're working, on a deadline, or dealing with a personal crisis?  And what happens when you put off listening to body cues that signal the need for basic nurturance - physical, social and emotional - over a lifetime?  

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Insom, It's easy to lose oneself in a BPD r/s because the needs of the pwBPD can become paramount to one's own.  Care-taking a pwBPD is also a way of avoiding self-care.  In short, it's possible that your r/s with a pwBPD could have contributed to your difficulty understanding your own needs; maybe that's why you got into a BPD r/s in the first place?  The expressive writing you describe is a great way to get back in touch w/oneself.  I do it myself, from time to time, in order to sort out my feelings when something throws me for a loop.  It definitely helps!  Another technique is to pay attention to small desires, which Robert Bly refers to as golden threads, and then follow them to see where they lead.  I also recommend listening to your gut feelings.

LuckyJim

[Stjarna]

Oh, wow, Insom - I so identify with this.  I also struggle so much with processing my own needs and wants.  I am going to try the journal that you mentioned. 

I am over 4 years out from a 40-year marriage to my ex-husband with BPD traits.  And Lucky Jim, I think you hit the nail on the head with your assessment that the care-taking of the relationship -- and perhaps for me it goes even further back to my FOO, being the oldest sibling of four with a working mom (in the 50s and early 60s, the days where that was more a rarity than it is now), parents who fought constantly, and many responsibilities that I took over for my siblings as a result.

It's funny that even "listening to your gut feeling" is something I have rarely been able to pinpoint as authentic for myself.  I need to get unstuck from this and know what this feels like. 

Thank you both, for your thoughts.

[Lucky Jim]

It's funny that even "listening to your gut feeling" is something I have rarely been able to pinpoint as authentic for myself.  I need to get unstuck from this and know what this feels like. 

Stjama:  "Gut feelings" emanate from one's body, not one's head.  It's a different kind of thinking.  I find that gut feelings are like a quiet voice in the background that require one to reduce noise and distraction in order to hear.  You could say it's a low-frequency broadcast!  I'm confident that you can learn to perceive your gut feelings.  LJ

[Insom]

Good luck with your journaling, Stjarna!  I won't say too much else because I don't want to spoil the process with too many words . .  . but thanks for commenting.  I relate to this:

Perhaps for me it goes even further back to my FOO, being the oldest sibling of four with a working mom

[Insom]

Another technique is to pay attention to small desires, which Robert Bly refers to as golden threads, and then follow them to see where they lead.  I also recommend listening to your gut feelings.

Yes!  Thank you, Lucky Jim. You know what's funny is I've actually thought of myself as someone who listens to my gut on big-ticket decisions but haven't done so at all with the small-bit, day-to-day inklings for a long time, if ever.  For awhile now I've sensed that this resurgence of memories I'm dealing with has had a connection to feeling stuck in my work life.  What I'm finally arriving at is that there's been this long period in my life of simply not paying attention to what my needs are and therefore not understanding what I want for my future in general, not just work-wise.  Love the term "golden threads . . ."

[heartandwhole]

I think this is so great Insom! I'm glad you are finding getting in touch with your physical and emotional sensations helpful. I am a big believer in taking time to do just that, regularly, and preferably without running a story about what I'm experiencing.

Writing it down is a step that sounds even better. The act of writing really concretizes the practice, and I think would make it easier to stay focused?

Would love to hear some of the insights you've experienced since taking this up, if and when you are ready to share.

heartandwhole

[marti644]

Insom,

Thanks for sharing! I can understand where you're coming from and have been trying to focus on "feeling" instead of "thinking my feelings" since I realized many things about myself after my breakup with my BPD-ex.

To add to H&R's point about writing (which I have found incredibly useful too) I found that the best thing I did to help me work through the unprocessed "gut" feelings was exercise. Specifically for me running and feeling some of the emotions of anger, sadness, regret, among other various emotions while running as fast as I could helped me to not only process many many years of unprocessed emotions  (which I previously didn't think were valid to have because of FOO dysfunction), but also stopped my ability to overintellectualize my feelings (because I am focusing on running and can't use my old defense mechanisms effectively).

This has been helping me focus on feeling those repressed wounds and my gut feelings, which for most of my life I was neglecting.

I would also like to hear more about your insights, sounds like you are doing great and would like to continue to hear about your progress!

Take care,

marti

[Insom]

Thanks for the encouragement, everyone.  I am still doing this and finding it surprisingly helpful.

The act of writing really concretizes the practice, and I think would make it easier to stay focused?

Great observation, heartandwhole!  The writing, for me, has turned out to be more ritual than anything.  It doesn't matter so much what I write, but the act of doing it is helping me pay more attention.  It is a signal, a way to signal to my whole self that I'm paying attention to personal navigational info. (basic, human feelings) that I've been ignoring. 

I found that the best thing I did to help me work through the unprocessed "gut" feelings was exercise.

Yes!  Thank you so much for saying this, marti644.  I agree that this is a whole body experience and not just a thinking thing. It's interesting what you've been able to do with running!  These relationships, for many of us, have such strong physical and emotional aspects that it stands to reason there would be a physical component to the healing as well?   I'm doing as part of a yoga practice.

I would also like to hear more about your insights, sounds like you are doing great and would like to continue to hear about your progress!

Thank you.  I started doing this - jotting down observations about how I feel each day - almost four weeks ago.  Here are a few of the things I've noticed.

•  There is something about this that is like peeling an onion.  Once I write a feeling down it helps clear it out of the way so I can notice other things.  There's a sense of discovery and a sense that things are calming down.

•  This process is helping me make better decisions about day-to-day things.  Sometimes you need rest and sometimes you need to push.  For me, it hasn't always been clear when to do which.  I have a tendency to overdo and then collapse.  While I've know this isn't a constructive pattern, I haven't understood how to change it.  This exercise is helping me make changes based on visceral information.  I am starting to understand better what I need from moment to moment and am going with it. 

•  Here's my most painful insight:  There was something about the idealization/devaluation process that created a powerful feeling in me that my BPD-ex saw potential in me that I hadn't yet met and wanted to achieve.  I see now that this wasn't the case.  (What he actually did was use emotionally manipulative tactics to control my behavior for his own benefit and somehow I perceived this as nurturing.)  Anyway, while it's hard to admit this, for years I've used the memory of this experience as a measuring stick.  "What would BPD-ex think?" is a question I've asked myself many times.  Obviously, much time has passed.  While his judgments were never truly relevant, there were kernels of what I wanted for myself in what I projected onto him.  But they may not be relevant either because of all the time that's passed.  So what's left?  How to assess going forward?  What do I need?  What do I want?  These feel like hard questions that hopefully I am finally willing to broach.

•  Finally, I am thinking about my BPD-ex much, much less.  He is less interesting, less curious to me than he has been at any point in the last year, no willpower or hypnosis required.  Somehow, and I don't understand how this works (perhaps someone can explain?) the more attention I pay to how I feel, the less relevant these memories are to me.

[JaxDK]

I'm here because memories of a BPD-ex that I thought I detached successfully from many years ago surfaced in the last year in kind of an intense way.  Something I've discovered at as part of going through this experience is that I may not be very well in touch with my basic needs as a person.

When you have been in an intense relationship It's bound to leave some marks on you. We get triggers, that's going to go off at times. You may find yourself in a existential situation, crisis, loneliness or something else, that triggers a longing for our ex's. This can happen years after. It's just a testament of the residue and having your brain rewired, being in such a difficult relationship with a PD person. We make our lives evolve around their needs, we forget ourselves or have to fight for it. It's not uncommon non's develop PTSD from being in such relationships either. It just goes to show how far we can be pushed.

I think you did detach successfully. Rather than looking at it as you not having detached, maybe you need to look at what's going on with you right now that's causing a trigger. You are going through something you should explore, like you are doing.

[Insom]

Thanks, JaxDK.  If detaching is an action you can take, then I have detached.  But if it's a psychological state, then I'm on the spectrum.

[heartandwhole]

Thanks, JaxDK.  If detaching is an action you can take, then I have detached.  But if it's a psychological state, then I'm on the spectrum.

Insom,

I think this is a very good point, that bears remembering. Many of us did all the things like  NC, exercising, getting out with people, etc., and yet "detachment" might as well have existed on another planet. 

Detachment is a state of mind (and/or heart) in my view. We can take action towards it, but the actions are not it.

Where are you on the spectrum, do you think?

heartandwhole

[Insom]

Where are you on the spectrum, do you think?

Good God, I hope I'm on the cusp of indifference.  But who knows, right?  The relationship happened when we were both in our teens and into our early twenties.  I am in my forties now.

The most searing part of detachment for me was having that "aha" moment when you realize that there's something false about the relationship.  After that I made a plan to leave that took about a year to implement so he and I had a full year of back and forth to get ready.  Then I moved away and ended contact.  About eighteen months later he tracked me down by phone.  This terrified me but I was somehow able to say some closure-type things (that I hope he perceived as caring) and decline further contact and that was the last time we spoke.

What I failed to do at that time was acknowledge how abusive the relationship was because I didn't want to view myself as victimized by him.  I also believe I had some undiagnosed PTSD that resolved on its own over a period of five years or so.  I guess you could say I just stowed a bunch of stuff away and pretended it didn't happen. 

Fast forward twenty-something years . . . About a year ago my memories of him intensified.  I started having a more-than-typical amount of emotionally vivid dreams about him, plus started remembering things.  The memories had a strong emotional component.  There was this intense mix of fear and curiosity and I found myself wanting to reach out to him to resolve?  Then, thankfully, I found this forum where I've been able to talk about this stuff and update my understanding (of family of origin stuff, plus willing to look at past abuse) and how it's affected me.

Today, the intensity has resolved.  I'm no longer feeling that intense push/pull about him -  fearful of him plus wanting to reach out - like I did a year ago.  But in this last year of exploring this stuff I've developed what I think may a habit of thinking about him that I'm ready to drop.  That's where I'm at today.  Still remembering, but with a broader perspective and ready to put this down so I can redirect some energy toward my current life and future.

Can anyone relate?

[Insom]

Hi again.  Here's an update about how the journaling is going.

I fell down this week (metaphorically) and didn't engage with the process as much as I was (missed half the week) and am feeling the loss of it.  The change was due to a change in my schedule.

I'd describe the loss as a diminished sense of brightness and clarity about my own life.  Noticing how I feel brings a sense of presence into to my life.  Like I'm an active participant in it.  When I don't pay attention to how I feel this other quality (heaviness, susceptibility, dullness) creeps in.

[heartandwhole]

I'd describe the loss as a diminished sense of brightness and clarity about my own life.  Noticing how I feel brings a sense of presence into to my life.  Like I'm an active participant in it.  When I don't pay attention to how I feel this other quality (heaviness, susceptibility, dullness) creeps in.

That is very interesting, Insom. It sounds like this practice is important to not only your recovery, but to the feeling of being connected to yourself. I can definitely relate.

Someone said that the human condition is "lost in thought." I find that very revealing and know how it feels. For me, when that happens, I've described it as a kind of "tinny" experience (metallic, hollow, clanging?). Checking in with how I feel, daily, is something that supports my well being immensely. And I also slack off and override my practice with busyness and thought caroussels!

When that happens, I try to remember to come back to myself—who I really am. It's the most important work we can do, in my opinion. That brightness and clarity that you experience is something that you share with the world, and I think that's a very good thing.

Will you have time over the weekend to get back to your practice? If so, let us know how it goes.

Could you take mini-pauses during the busy times to check in with yourself?

heartandwhole

[Insom]

Thanks for listening, heartandwhole.  I love your analogy, "lost in thought," which reminds me of these classic images of Narcissus lost in his own reflection.

https://www.google.com/search?q=narcissus+myth+wiki&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjShdLr_afWAhWqsFQKHSIqCtwQ_AUICigB&biw=1308&bih=719#imgrc=JdlF8Mh9RU3sGM:

It's all too easy for me to get lost in an imaginary world of past and future people/events/projects.  I think I've avoided the type self-focus I'm doing in this journaling project because I thought it narcissistic.  But what I'm finding is that paying attention to how I feel is helping me get outside my head so I can connect more with the outer world?  This is counterintuitive, I know.  I don't fully understand how or why this is working, just that it is.

I am back on track with the journaling and can report that it's added a sweetness to my life that's subtle and growing.  Overall, thoughts of BPD-ex have diminished significantly and feel less relevant than ever.  Knock wood (I imagine there'll be flareups), but I right now I feel simply open to other thoughts and experiences.