BPD (maybe) mom, family estrangement and wedding planning (LONG)

[Depression = 72% of members]

*Content warning: loss of family member to suicide*

Long time listener, first time caller here. My therapist helped me understand that my mother possibly has BPD almost a year ago, but since she's not currently in therapy (and can be charming/high functioning), a true diagnosis is not in the foreseeable future. Still, I've done a ton of reading (including this forum and Understanding the Borderline Mother) and compared notes with a friend whose mom has been diagnosed with BPD, and I'm comfortable operating as if mine does too. It was actually a massive relief to find other people who had similar experiences growing up. I'm an only child, and was mostly a golden child to my mother (with a few scapegoat phases), so I think I've come away with the issues of anxiety, perfectionism, depression, etc., rather than inheriting BPD myself.

Anyway, I am recently engaged (yay!) and starting to do some wedding planning, but the guest list on my side has got me tied up in knots. Here's the overview:

My mom: We have been estranged since the start of 2017. She started melting down over my impending year of travel and eventual move overseas - my partner and I met in the US but are moving to Europe to be closer to his family. Each major life event for me has triggered a fear-of-abandonment blow-up from her. In the past, we've either resolved it by letting her scream at me, or the few times I decided I wasn't going to take it, my grandma (her mom) intervened and brokered a deal that we would just move past the rift and not discuss it.

Anyway, my grandma has since died, and given that the light has been turned on for me regarding her possible BPD, AND because I am in a healthy, securely-attached relationship with my partner (allowing me to see her abusive behavior more clearly), I have set out some boundaries to protect myself. I refuse to call her and let her rage at me - I sent her a calm/compassionate email in May, detailing my side of things and how I would like us to move forward. After a few attempts at derailment, she concluded the conversation with an email saying she and my stepdad "wish [me] all the best," instead of actually addressing anything I brought up in the email. She's blocked me on social media, but my partner can see that she's posted stuff on Facebook about how I don't speak to her anymore, which is a serious mischaracterization of the situation.

I understand that with BPD patients, setting boundaries--while crucial--may make things worse before they get better. After a year of serious work on myself, I understand that I cannot change her reactions and that I am not responsible for managing them. I have accepted that I may hear from her later today, or in a year, or in five years, or 20, or never again. I'm proud of my attempts to bridge the gap and start a healthy discussion with her, and I feel that the ball is fully in her court. I've made it clear that my door is always open, but that we need to have the conversation on even footing (mutual openness, no screaming, shouting, etc.). So, back to her in a second.

My maternal grandpa: He understands my mom for who she is--he knows the s*** she's pulled over the years. He and I have never, ever had any problems before, and he canNOT say the same for my mom. Up until March, I maintained a relationship with him, making sure to visit whenever I was in town. He's a mean, stubborn, prejudiced man, and it's only gotten worse since my grandma died a few years ago (suicide), but he's never been that way to me. However, after a week with my mom, she dripped enough poison into his ear that the next time I called him to visit, he told me he didn't want to see or hear from me until I fixed things with my mom. He didn't have any interest in hearing my side of things or recognize that she's the one who put him in the middle, not me.

So, I haven't bothered to tell him about my attempts to fix things with her, which she rejected. My feelings for her are complicated, and I feel pity for her sometimes. But with my grandpa, it's just so unbelievably awful of him that he gave me this ultimatum without even being willing to listen to my side of things AND with him knowing how my mom is and how she's fallen out with everyone she's ever been close to. I'm definitely pissed at him.

My maternal aunt: I haven't had a relationship with my aunt, her husband, or my cousin since just after my grandma died. She's estranged from my mom and grandpa too. Basically, after my grandma died, my grandpa decided he didn't want to own the house or land my aunt was living on for free. My grandma made him, but after she died, he told my aunt she either needed to buy the property from him or he was going to sell it to someone else. He gave her a good price and more than enough time. She was 50 at the time, and my grandparents had been supporting her, her husband, and my cousin on and off for about 20 years. So there was a massive breakdown there, with my cousin harassing my grandpa and the potential new buyer and he posted some pretty sick stuff about my grandpa on Facebook, saying how understood why my grandma killed herself, after seeing what she'd been living with all those years. My aunt and uncle just packed up and left the place one night and didn't say anything else to my grandpa.

Now, knowing how my grandpa is, I take some of this with a grain of salt. I doubt he was an angel here. But I made the decision to take a step back from my aunt, uncle, and cousin, even though my aunt continues to reach out to me on Facebook with over-the-top lovey-dovey stuff. She's never done anything to me personally, and at this point I'm not really angry with her anymore, but I'm not sure how much of a relationship I want to have with her. I doubt I would have anything more than a superficial connection to her. And just because I'm now estranged from my mom and grandpa doesn't mean I suddenly want to jump to her "team." I put distance in from her and her family for a reason, even if my strong feelings about it have softened over time.

So, I am estranged from much of my mother's side of the family, for different reasons. (As a side note, I get along great with the rest of my family and my fiance's family, and my friendships have been enduring and mostly drama-free. I consider myself fairly easy to get along with.)

I'm now stuck with what to do regarding wedding invitations.

For my mom, I'm definitely thinking I or my fiance will call and tell her we're engaged before we make it public. We will likely invite her and my stepdad to both the wedding in Europe and the US reception, though I doubt she'll come. I don't really plan to involve her in wedding preparations unless she started to sing a radically different tune. But if she's not really receptive when we tell her we're engaged, I don't really know what I should do. Also, I have a good relationship with my stepbrother and his wife, so I would like to invite them, even though things are broken down between me and my mom and stepdad. (Side awkward note: I have literally no relationship with my stepsister because of age and life differences, not because of a problem, but do I have to invite her if I invite my stepbrother? She literally knows nothing about my life or my fiance, and it would be weird if she came. Doubt she would, but what if she did?)

For my grandpa, I'm thinking about sharing my long exchange with my mother, so that he can see I made an effort with her, but really, I'm pissed at him and feel like I'm owed an apology. I doubt I'll get one, and I'm not sure what's best to do here. I don't know if I should invite him to the wedding, the US reception, both, or neither.

And for my aunt, uncle, and cousin, I'm really stuck. I don't want to hurt her feelings - she actually reaches out to my stepmom a lot and asks about me. But I'm also not sure if I want to rekindle a relationship with her/them. Plus, if she actually came to something and my mom or grandpa did too... .god, I don't even want to think about that.

All in all, I doubt that any of them would actually come to the wedding (because of anger on my mom and grandpa's part and because of money on my aunt's part). But by inviting them to either the wedding in Europe or the US reception, I take a chance that they do come, and I'm not sure how I feel about that happening on what is supposed to be one of the best days of my life. And ugh, what if that's the first time I've seen any of them in years at that point - so awkward.

By not inviting them, well, it feels like I'm sending a clear message that I don't want them in my lives going forward. I'm not ready to make such a strong statement, but I'm also not ready to rush into trying to fix things just because my wedding is approaching. I'm still healing and figuring out what role I want them to play... .and giving them time to decide if they can be in my life on mutually shared terms.

Anyone who's still reading at this point, THANK YOU. Thoughts?

 

[Brkfst@Tiffanys]

*Content warning: loss of family member to suicide*

Long time listener, first time caller here. My therapist helped me understand that my mother possibly has BPD almost a year ago, but since she's not currently in therapy (and can be charming/high functioning), a true diagnosis is not in the foreseeable future. Still, I've done a ton of reading (including this forum and Understanding the Borderline Mother) and compared notes with a friend whose mom has been diagnosed with BPD, and I'm comfortable operating as if mine does too. It was actually a massive relief to find other people who had similar experiences growing up. I'm an only child, and was mostly a golden child to my mother (with a few scapegoat phases), so I think I've come away with the issues of anxiety, perfectionism, depression, etc., rather than inheriting BPD myself.

Anyway, I am recently engaged (yay!) and starting to do some wedding planning, but the guest list on my side has got me tied up in knots. Here's the overview:

My mom: We have been estranged since the start of 2017. She started melting down over my impending year of travel and eventual move overseas - my partner and I met in the US but are moving to Europe to be closer to his family. Each major life event for me has triggered a fear-of-abandonment blow-up from her. In the past, we've either resolved it by letting her scream at me, or the few times I decided I wasn't going to take it, my grandma (her mom) intervened and brokered a deal that we would just move past the rift and not discuss it.

Anyway, my grandma has since died, and given that the light has been turned on for me regarding her possible BPD, AND because I am in a healthy, securely-attached relationship with my partner (allowing me to see her abusive behavior more clearly), I have set out some boundaries to protect myself. I refuse to call her and let her rage at me - I sent her a calm/compassionate email in May, detailing my side of things and how I would like us to move forward. After a few attempts at derailment, she concluded the conversation with an email saying she and my stepdad "wish [me] all the best," instead of actually addressing anything I brought up in the email. She's blocked me on social media, but my partner can see that she's posted stuff on Facebook about how I don't speak to her anymore, which is a serious mischaracterization of the situation.

I understand that with BPD patients, setting boundaries--while crucial--may make things worse before they get better. After a year of serious work on myself, I understand that I cannot change her reactions and that I am not responsible for managing them. I have accepted that I may hear from her later today, or in a year, or in five years, or 20, or never again. I'm proud of my attempts to bridge the gap and start a healthy discussion with her, and I feel that the ball is fully in her court. I've made it clear that my door is always open, but that we need to have the conversation on even footing (mutual openness, no screaming, shouting, etc.). So, back to her in a second.

My maternal grandpa: He understands my mom for who she is--he knows the s*** she's pulled over the years. He and I have never, ever had any problems before, and he canNOT say the same for my mom. Up until March, I maintained a relationship with him, making sure to visit whenever I was in town. He's a mean, stubborn, prejudiced man, and it's only gotten worse since my grandma died a few years ago (suicide), but he's never been that way to me. However, after a week with my mom, she dripped enough poison into his ear that the next time I called him to visit, he told me he didn't want to see or hear from me until I fixed things with my mom. He didn't have any interest in hearing my side of things or recognize that she's the one who put him in the middle, not me.

So, I haven't bothered to tell him about my attempts to fix things with her, which she rejected. My feelings for her are complicated, and I feel pity for her sometimes. But with my grandpa, it's just so unbelievably awful of him that he gave me this ultimatum without even being willing to listen to my side of things AND with him knowing how my mom is and how she's fallen out with everyone she's ever been close to. I'm definitely pissed at him.

My maternal aunt: I haven't had a relationship with my aunt, her husband, or my cousin since just after my grandma died. She's estranged from my mom and grandpa too. Basically, after my grandma died, my grandpa decided he didn't want to own the house or land my aunt was living on for free. My grandma made him, but after she died, he told my aunt she either needed to buy the property from him or he was going to sell it to someone else. He gave her a good price and more than enough time. She was 50 at the time, and my grandparents had been supporting her, her husband, and my cousin on and off for about 20 years. So there was a massive breakdown there, with my cousin harassing my grandpa and the potential new buyer and he posted some pretty sick stuff about my grandpa on Facebook, saying how understood why my grandma killed herself, after seeing what she'd been living with all those years. My aunt and uncle just packed up and left the place one night and didn't say anything else to my grandpa.

Now, knowing how my grandpa is, I take some of this with a grain of salt. I doubt he was an angel here. But I made the decision to take a step back from my aunt, uncle, and cousin, even though my aunt continues to reach out to me on Facebook with over-the-top lovey-dovey stuff. She's never done anything to me personally, and at this point I'm not really angry with her anymore, but I'm not sure how much of a relationship I want to have with her. I doubt I would have anything more than a superficial connection to her. And just because I'm now estranged from my mom and grandpa doesn't mean I suddenly want to jump to her "team." I put distance in from her and her family for a reason, even if my strong feelings about it have softened over time.

So, I am estranged from much of my mother's side of the family, for different reasons. (As a side note, I get along great with the rest of my family and my fiance's family, and my friendships have been enduring and mostly drama-free. I consider myself fairly easy to get along with.)

I'm now stuck with what to do regarding wedding invitations.

For my mom, I'm definitely thinking I or my fiance will call and tell her we're engaged before we make it public. We will likely invite her and my stepdad to both the wedding in Europe and the US reception, though I doubt she'll come. I don't really plan to involve her in wedding preparations unless she started to sing a radically different tune. But if she's not really receptive when we tell her we're engaged, I don't really know what I should do. Also, I have a good relationship with my stepbrother and his wife, so I would like to invite them, even though things are broken down between me and my mom and stepdad. (Side awkward note: I have literally no relationship with my stepsister because of age and life differences, not because of a problem, but do I have to invite her if I invite my stepbrother? She literally knows nothing about my life or my fiance, and it would be weird if she came. Doubt she would, but what if she did?)

For my grandpa, I'm thinking about sharing my long exchange with my mother, so that he can see I made an effort with her, but really, I'm pissed at him and feel like I'm owed an apology. I doubt I'll get one, and I'm not sure what's best to do here. I don't know if I should invite him to the wedding, the US reception, both, or neither.

And for my aunt, uncle, and cousin, I'm really stuck. I don't want to hurt her feelings - she actually reaches out to my stepmom a lot and asks about me. But I'm also not sure if I want to rekindle a relationship with her/them. Plus, if she actually came to something and my mom or grandpa did too... .god, I don't even want to think about that.

All in all, I doubt that any of them would actually come to the wedding (because of anger on my mom and grandpa's part and because of money on my aunt's part). But by inviting them to either the wedding in Europe or the US reception, I take a chance that they do come, and I'm not sure how I feel about that happening on what is supposed to be one of the best days of my life. And ugh, what if that's the first time I've seen any of them in years at that point - so awkward.

By not inviting them, well, it feels like I'm sending a clear message that I don't want them in my lives going forward. I'm not ready to make such a strong statement, but I'm also not ready to rush into trying to fix things just because my wedding is approaching. I'm still healing and figuring out what role I want them to play... .and giving them time to decide if they can be in my life on mutually shared terms.

Anyone who's still reading at this point, THANK YOU. Thoughts?

 

[Woolspinner2000]

Hi Brkfst@Tiffanys, 

Welcome to our online family!

You have a lot of challenging people and relationships in your life, but it sounds as if you are doing well in attending T and working on so many things. Good job! 

As I was reading your questions, I wondered if you've asked your T for thoughts as well? There is a lot of complication with weddings and relationships. Forget about obligation. What would you like or prefer to do? This is your day, not theirs.  If you chose to have various family members attend, others here have found it helpful If they assign a friend to hang out with the particular people and help keep them occupied and busy during the wedding. What do you think of that idea?

 
Wools

[Panda39]

What is it that you and your fiance want?  I agree with Wools keep Obligation out of it.

I don't know that you can assume they won't come.  How would you handle this if you knew they all would come if you invited them?  Would you still invite them?  If you invite them and they all come how do you expect them to behave at the wedding?  Do you think your assessment is accurate or might you have some wishful thinking going on?  If you invite them and they come could you relax and enjoy your day? If you don't invite them what do you think is going to happen?  Would they be any happier if you invited them vs not inviting them... .does anything you do ever make them happy?

If this were me I would surround myself on my wedding day with all the people that love and support me, who's company I enjoy.  Do these family members love and support you, do you enjoy their company?

Food for thought,
Panda39

[Brkfst@Tiffanys]

Forget about obligation. What would you like or prefer to do? This is your day, not theirs.  If you chose to have various family members attend, others here have found it helpful If they assign a friend to hang out with the particular people and help keep them occupied and busy during the wedding. What do you think of that idea?

I think I would ultimately be the most relaxed if they weren't there, particularly if we hadn't talked things out ahead of time. However, weddings are a big deal. I'm an only child, one of only 2 grandchildren, and I'm afraid of the message I'd be sending by not inviting them. It feels like I'd be the one shutting them out then, and I'm just not sure I'm ready to create that rift.

I guess I have a few more distant relatives on mom's side who I'm planning to invite, and I think they would help me manage my mom on the wedding day. And my grandfather and aunt too, in the event they came. That's something to consider for sure. Thanks for that idea!

[Brkfst@Tiffanys]

What is it that you and your fiance want?  I agree with Wools keep Obligation out of it.

I don't know that you can assume they won't come.  How would you handle this if you knew they all would come if you invited them?  Would you still invite them?  If you invite them and they all come how do you expect them to behave at the wedding?  Do you think your assessment is accurate or might you have some wishful thinking going on?  If you invite them and they come could you relax and enjoy your day? If you don't invite them what do you think is going to happen?  Would they be any happier if you invited them vs not inviting them... .does anything you do ever make them happy?

If this were me I would surround myself on my wedding day with all the people that love and support me, who's company I enjoy.  Do these family members love and support you, do you enjoy their company?

I think my fiance wants them to be a part of my life again on better terms. He wants us to work it out and have them at the wedding, because he thinks it will make me happier. I ultimately would be happier having them in my life, but only if we all can move into new, healthier chapters of our relationship. They make me anxious and unhappy the current version of our relationships - it's the version where things are on their terms and I have to accept whatever they throw at me.

I actually don't think they would come if we haven't worked anything out ahead of time, nor would I want them to. My mom has frequently planned trips abroad, including to see family, only to cancel at the last minute. I think if she feels like things aren't ok with us (and that my dad and stepmom will be playing a large role in things), she won't go. She may be confrontational in her own house, but she doesn't go seek out confrontations wherever she can find them - I think she relates the most to the Hermit archetype (from the book Understanding the Borderline Mother). My grandpa hasn't travelled abroad in decades, and he doesn't really like to fly. Even if we were on good terms, I'd be surprised if he didn't just fall back on going to the US reception. My aunt may not be able to afford the trip and would also rely on there being a US reception, I think.

I mentioned in my response to Wools that my fear is creating an even bigger, potentially unhealable rift by not inviting them. I'm not trying to destroy our relationships. I want them to be better. But you do make a good point about whether or not inviting them will make them happier either way. If we haven't worked it out, I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. But I think not inviting them may have the more far-reaching consequences.

If I invite them and they all come, my mom is the big risk there. Even if we were really good right now, I would be afraid of how she managed (or failed to manage) her emotions on the actual day. No matter how happily involved she is leading up to the wedding, I know it would be overload for her (only child now married and living abroad, ex-husband there playing a big role, estranged sister there, etc.), and I think she'd really struggle. When she gets sad, she gets mad, and that's when the meltdowns happen. I haven't really thought about it like that, since things haven't been good. But it's something for me to consider.

Thank you for your response!

[Panda39]

I think my fiance wants them to be a part of my life again on better terms. He wants us to work it out and have them at the wedding, because he thinks it will make me happier. I ultimately would be happier having them in my life, but only if we all can move into new, healthier chapters of our relationship. They make me anxious and unhappy the current version of our relationships - it's the version where things are on their terms and I have to accept whatever they throw at me.

How do you see this changing between now and your wedding?  If they don't change can you accept things as they are?

I mentioned in my response to Wools that my fear is creating an even bigger, potentially unhealable rift by not inviting them. I'm not trying to destroy our relationships. I want them to be better. But you do make a good point about whether or not inviting them will make them happier either way. If we haven't worked it out, I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. But I think not inviting them may have the more far-reaching consequences.

So the plan is to invite them so you don't cause a bigger rift, but hope they don't actually come.  You know them best and it sounds like you are pretty sure they won't come.  But if I were you I would have a plan... .maybe what Wools has suggested... .in case they to decide to come.

If I invite them and they all come, my mom is the big risk there. Even if we were really good right now, I would be afraid of how she managed (or failed to manage) her emotions on the actual day. No matter how happily involved she is leading up to the wedding, I know it would be overload for her (only child now married and living abroad, ex-husband there playing a big role, estranged sister there, etc.), and I think she'd really struggle. When she gets sad, she gets mad, and that's when the meltdowns happen. I haven't really thought about it like that, since things haven't been good. But it's something for me to consider.

Just be conscious of the fact that at the heart of BPD is the fear of abandonment so you getting married could be very triggering for your mom and she could become emotionally deregulated.

Panda39

[bright_future_mama]

I went through all of this same junk at my wedding.  My mother and father ended up ruining it.  No one was even speaking to me at the rehearsal dinner or the wedding.  My Dad told me as soon as I walk you down the aisle, I'm done with you.  Then my mother manipulated all her extended family to think I was the problem. You don't get that day back.  Since then, my parents have ruined countless birthday parties, the birth of my daughter, graduations, holidays, etc.  It's always about them.  You would think my parents would have learned from my wedding, but when my middle sister got married, it was the same thing.  You are kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't in this situation.  Same thing at my youngest sister's wedding.  Just be prepared if you choose to invite them.  You deserve to focus on you and your fiance that day and not all their crap.  It's sad you are even having to worry about this at such a joyful time.  What's crazy is that no one has remorse for any of it.  It crippled me and didn't phase them in the slightest.  FYI--my father is a narcissist and my mom is BPD.  Hugs to you and good luck. 

P.S.  Your fiance may not realize the depth of the issues--mine didn't.  He knew my parents had issues but I think he thought it was all a fight that would blow over.  Not major personality disorders.  18 years later and it still affects our marriage.  I still get upset and they still trigger me.  Nothing has changed with them.  I can only change my reaction to it.  I went NC in February with both of them.  My husband now begs me to stay away from them so our family stays healthy.  I'm often so tied up in knots and if affects him and our four children. 

[Turkish]

We've seen a lot of ruined weddings,  like bright_future_mama describes. 

Nothing to do with BPD,  but my best friend got a lot of flack from his relatives by deciding to limit his wedding to about 20 people.  They were still hurt even though they planned a reception cruise on Lake Tahoe soon after where everyone was invited (over 100 people). He and his wife wanted the ceremony itself to be intimate.  Their wedding,  their choice. 

In your case,  it sounds like a bigger deal.  I'd send the invites,  and whoever shows up does; whoever doesn't doesn't.  Toss the ball into their courts and let it go. 

Or elope 

[Brkfst@Tiffanys]

Thanks for the perspectives!

My fiancé actually spoke with my mother to tell her we got engaged, and it went as expected. She has shown no growth after my attempts at a constructive conversation earlier this year, and her projections are at an epic level. Every single thing she accused me of doing since May 2016 (yeah, she’s got a long list, it seems) is her own behavior projected onto me. She’s accusing me of being aggressive and picking fights, when I’ve spent my entire freaking life trying to avoid fights with her. She says I’ve been hostile and screaming at people, and that’s not even one iota close to my personality. She also says I’m clearly still working out issues related to my parents’ divorce (24 years ago) whenever it’s her who ends up on that topic in  every single argument, regardless of where the argument started. It’s so infuriating!

How do you deal with the projections? This is not a semi-rational person who will be reflective and say, “oops, yeah, I own that one, that’s actually mine.” She lives in an alternate reality... .

On a side note, after having conversations with her himself, my fiancé is starting to understand how a relationship with my mom may not actually be sustainable. Before, he was pushing me to keep trying to reach out, but I think he gets the depth of the issues now.

[bright_future_mama]

She also says I’m clearly still working out issues related to my parents’ divorce (24 years ago) whenever it’s her who ends up on that topic in  every single argument, regardless of where the argument started. It’s so infuriating!

Wow!  Same here.  Sounds so familiar.  Both parents are remarried yet it always come back to this.  Maybe it is the abandonment she feels as a result of the divorce?  Isn't abandonment a major issue related to BP?  My mom cannot move on from it and used me and my sisters as her "minions."  We were forced to take sides.