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Skills we were never taught
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Author Topic: How to communicate with someone who just wants to yell all the time?  (Read 444 times)
Oak Tree

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« on: January 20, 2018, 06:41:18 AM »

It's me again BPD family, any ideas on how to even begin to communicate with someone that just wants to yell over you all the time?

Last night W got home around 11PM
I was already in bed because I work the next day.
She comes into the room doesn't say a word, goes to the kitchen where I hear she's making herself a drink.

Now after work she went to a bar/restaurant near her job and had drinks, from the look of the bank account she had at least two.

Then she came to our area and went to another bar/ restaurant and had more drinks spent over $80 on drinks to come home and continue drinking.

After she made her drink she went up to the third floor to her daughter's house where she continued.

This morning when I woke up to go to work she was not there, I got up to get ready and she walks in with a drunk smile on her face.
She asks if I was going to work, then got on the bed and came to my side on her knees.
She puts her arms around me again the way she did the last time, then when I don't hug back stops.
Of course now she's feeling a certain way because I didn't hug back.

She gets under the covers fully clothed so I turn off the tv so she could sleep and once again that was wrong.

So I had her the remotes and continue to get ready, so she starts in.

First she starts with the email I wrote her daughter (God when will I learn)
Then she started with all the things she's done for me.

Then she went to how she's been there for me when my brother was in a coma in the hospital, and through my two surgeries.

Then she went down the list of her button pushing tactics, from her thought that I don't love her because I haven't tried to fix this.

To her thought that I am only with her for convenience, then she starts talking about my daughter.

All through this I'm telling her I don't want to argue, and I ask her to lower her voice.  (Yeah like that was going to happen)

I tried to talk to her, I tried calming her down but that was next to impossible.

So again I asked her to listen to me, to let me speak, when she wouldn't I stopped trying.

I had to get to work, she spoke about divorce again, she followed me to the door and briefly tried to stop me from leaving.

It was like I was going to leave but on her terms not mine.

As I'm walking to the train she calls me phone, and continues yelling and repeating herself, again i ask her to hear me out, again she continued to verbally try to belittle me.

I felt similar frustrations coming so I told her if you don't stop I'm going to hang up the phone.
She kept yelling, I tried to speak she would get louder.

So I said I'm hanging up, and she hangs up, again she has to control the situation.

I'm hoping when I get home my stuff is untouched and in one piece.

How do I communicate with someone like this?
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Skip
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« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2018, 07:15:05 AM »

She asks if I was going to work, then got on the bed and came to my side on her knees.
She puts her arms around me again the way she did the last time, then when I don't hug back stops. Of course now she's feeling a certain way because I didn't hug back.

Was not hugging her a way to show your disapproval with her going to a bar?
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ortac77
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« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2018, 10:12:31 AM »

I don't know if this helps but I worked out a long time ago that whilst it can be difficult I can usually deal with my pwBPD's behaviours when they are sober however once alcohol is involved I have to walk away and disengage.

You ask how do I communicate with someone like this? Again I have found that when they are inebriated its time to put my BPD toolbox away and calmly (not easy) avoid any discussion as it is pointless, frustrating and will only lead to my becoming upset and angry.

In Al-Anon they talk about detachment with love, I don't think it requires 'disapproval' of the drinking (even when you feel that way) it requires the space to consider that you cannot really debate or discuss anything in a way that will lead to any resolution for either of you when one party is affected by  powerful and debilitating drug that acts on their emotions in n unpredictable way. All IMHO.
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Oak Tree

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« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2018, 01:22:32 PM »

@Skip,

My not hugging her back had nothing to do with her bar hopping, or even the fact she came home at 4AM super drunk.

My not hugging her back comes from the last time she came home drunk and hugged me like that and the next day rejected me.

Think she's been so disrespectful to begin with, but I didn't like the way she made me feel that last time.

And truth is if she has to get that drunk to hug me than I'd rather not.


@Ortac77

I don't know if you have read some if my other post but I have learned to not allow her button pushing.
I know it's never a good idea to try to communicate with her when she has been drinking.

Disengaging hasn't always been easy especially when she follows me from room to room.

Yes I know I should run away but as I have stated in past post it's not always a good time to hit the streets.

I thank you for replying to my post both of you.


Oak Tree
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Tattered Heart
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« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2018, 09:47:39 AM »

One thing I do with my H when he starts to raise his voice is that I simply tell him that "it's important to me that I hear you, but I cannot understand you when you are yelling. Would you please lower the volume of your voice so we can continue talking?"

When she calls you on the phone and just starts yelling, what if you just hang up? Of course, let her know that you don't like to be yelled at. Then if she continues, then simply say "I'm not going to be yelled at on the phone." And hang up. No conversation about it. Just end of conversation. Do not answer until she calms down. Sure, it's going to make her mad in the short term, but if you are consistent, over time she may begin to understand that you won't engage in conversation with yelling.

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Hope deferred makes the heart sick, but a longing fulfilled is a tree of life Proverbs 13:12

Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2018, 08:44:48 AM »

Hello Oak Tree,

It's been a while.  How are you doing?

WW
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Oak Tree

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« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2018, 05:57:33 AM »

Hello Wentworth,

Yes it has been awhile, it hasn't been great on this end many many ups and downs.

She was talking about divorce and how this relationship wasn't working, I told her I don't want this relationship to end when the love is still there.

She agreed but things at home still felt strained and I felt those egg shells crunching under my feet.

Valentine's day we went out to dinner and decided that would be our let's try this again date, it went ok.

The other day a female friend was forwarding quotes that had to do with irony and she sent them to everyone on her list.

When my wife saw a female had messaged me she flipped out and accused me of cheating.

And then said that was it she was filing for divorce!

Here I am trying to be patient with her and all her drama and because of an innocent text I get the short end again?

I give up! I can't do this anymore!
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2018, 01:54:43 AM »

Oak Tree,

I'm glad to hear from you.  Sorry for the slow response, I've had my hands full.

It sounds so frustrating to be accused of cheating!  What did you do when you heard the accusation?  When you need to respond to something like that without JADE, an alternative is to use S.E.T. (Support, Empathy, Truth).

It's been a few days since you posted.  How has the last week gone?

Best,

WW
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Oak Tree

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« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2018, 05:49:26 AM »

Hello, Wentworth

It's been a crazy time for me, after I was accused of cheating I was amazed at how quickly she jumped to that conclusion.

A female friend sent me some qoutes on irony nothing to do with romance, she never did that before so i found it odd.

My wife is generally suspicious/nosey so when my phone made the message sound right away she asked who was that.
Keep in mind we had already been having issues, I looked at my phone and was surprised to see the girl had messaged.

I showed my wife the qoutes and all she saw was that it was from a female.

She grabbed my phone and right away started talking about divorce, that this was all she needed for her to file.

I tried to tell her I wasn't cheating, not like that was going to do anything for me, I tried to tell her she was making the wrong assumption.

She called the girl and cursed her out for having the nerve to message me, the girl was trying to explain that it was sent by mistake that she had been sending the qoutes to friends on her list.

That did nothing, my wife was already in her mode.

She ran up to her mother's apt and told her mother and daughter that I was cheating and that now she had the proof!

That's when I said to myself "I can't do this anymore" she spent the next 3 nights sleeping at her mother's apt.

When she came down again to sleep in our apt she made a huge fuss about me sleeping in "her bed" told me to find someplace else to sleep.

When I said I wasn't sleeping anywhere else she threw water at me from her bottle and started trying to kick me off the bed.

She was being very verbally abusive at this point so I grabbed my pillow and left to the next room.

She followed me in there yelling at me about everything under the sun, I pulled out my phone to record her and she started getting physical.

At one point her son woke up and came into the room and when she was attacking me he pulled her off, like he's done many times before.

But this time he got in my face, I told him this had nothing to do with him.

He said I don't care, she's my mother.

Now she pulled him away from me, after that everyone went back into separate rooms.

The next day I actively started looking for a place to move to.

According to my wife she wentr that Friday to file for divorce, but the office was "closed".

One afternoon I got an email from someone about a room for rent so I went to see it.

When I got back my wife was in the living room, I went to another room.

She came over and motioned me to the bed room where she asked what are we going to do?

I told her you want a divorce and I don't... .but we can't keep up like this, she agreed and started crying.

I comforted her and came to the conclusion that we didn't want the divorce.

At this point we are trying to work at it, and we are looking for a therapist.

Right now things seem somewhat normal.

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Radcliff
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« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2018, 01:43:02 AM »

she made a huge fuss about me sleeping in "her bed" told me to find someplace else to sleep.

When I said I wasn't sleeping anywhere else she threw water at me from her bottle and started trying to kick me off the bed.

She was being very verbally abusive at this point so I grabbed my pillow and left to the next room.

She followed me in there yelling at me about everything under the sun, I pulled out my phone to record her and she started getting physical.

Oak Tree, the quoted scene above happened to me exactly.  Many times.  Even including the water!  And calling it "her" bedroom.

It is super important that the physical altercations stop.  

If you talk to your wife after an event like recently happened, does she realize that she acted inappropriately, or is she justifying her actions or blaming you?

WW
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Oak Tree

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« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2018, 09:32:49 AM »

Hey again, she always blames me for the things that happen.
She just can't apply positivity when it comes to me, she says we are too much alike that's why we clash so much.

We've been getting along no fights or arguments for about two weeks, yesterday she mentioned praying together.

I'll try anything to make this work, but the therapy has to be one of the things we do and the search has somewhat stalled.

I will bring it up again soon, and I will tell her that even though things are somewhat stable now we still need to see someone.

Thanks Wentworth for touching base with me, I'm sure your a busy guy.
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Radcliff
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« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2018, 11:31:21 PM »

Hi Oak Tree, sorry to be slow, I had some custody stuff that threw me for a loop.  I'm temporarily in better shape!

I'm glad you had a good two weeks.  Have you made it to three, or has there been more trouble.  I totally understand what you mean about progress stalling in calm times.  That exact thing happened in my relationship for many years.  I was so relieved to have peaceful times, I didn't want to "rock the boat" by pushing for change.  But you need to keep up the momentum for change even in peaceful times; especially in peaceful times, since that's when everyone is the most rational.

Have you heard about the risks of couples therapy in a violent relationship?  Most therapists are trained to see relationship issues as a balance of responsibility between the two people, were each person has a point of view that's valid.  Each person has to stretch to accommodate the other person's perspective.  Therapists often don't have much training in domestic violence.  Being violent or abusive is not a valid perspective.  You should not stretch to accommodate it.  Another issue is that the abuser may actually get provoked by something the victim brings up in the session and become violent after the session.  A third issue is that the average therapist does not understand the dynamics of entrapment and why a victim might stay in an abusive relationship.  There are other concerns, but these are the three that spring to mind at the moment.

There is a very small number of therapists who actually are qualified to work with couples experiencing domestic violence.  You may be able to get some leads by inquiring with local domestic violence agencies, though you may find that the folks at these agencies are thoroughly bought into the "don't get couples counseling for domestic violence" philosophy.  You may be able to find one through an Internet search.  When you interview them, ask careful questions about how many couples they've treated, where they got their domestic violence training, and how they decide whether the couple's case is one that might be successful.  As an example, my therapist does couples counseling for domestic violence, and will take couples who have had three or less incidents.  She contrasts this with the dozens or hundreds that my wife and I have had when she counsels me that reconciliation may not be possible.

Do you have a journal where you've recorded when she attacks or abuses you?

WW
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Oak Tree

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« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2018, 07:32:05 AM »

Hello Wentworth, don't sweat any slow response.

I understand we are all going through something here, you got back to me and that's what counts (Thank you)

Things are still peaceful at the moment, we are still looking for a therapist.

I sense she is trying hard to change, she goes the extra mile to try to avoid situations.

Guess her brothers conversation made some kind of impact on her.

I was trying to keep a journal but it was not consistent, I mainly wrote when there was an incident.

Hopefully we will find the right therapist to help us with all this, I'll keep you posted.

Thanks again
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2018, 12:08:55 AM »

Hello Oak Tree,

I'm glad things are going well!

Just journaling the abusive incidents is fine.

What was her brother's conversation?

Have you been able to use any of the skills taught on this board to help things go more smoothly sometimes?

WW
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Oak Tree

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« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2018, 12:35:20 PM »

Hello Wentworth,

Her brothers conversation had to do with her making decisions while emotional and upset, he told her she needed to work on herself before we worked on ourselves as a couple.

He said that the physical stuff had to stop, he's with LA PD so he's seen alot of domestic issues.

He more than likely spoke about that with her.

She's been calling different therapist trying to set up appointment and waiting for call backs.

This is an excellent site, and I'm sure all the boards offer something to help, always good to know I am not alone in this.

I've been trying to stay with the people that have responded to my plight.

I appreciate you giving me input, and feed back.

Hope your situation had improved some.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2018, 01:22:46 PM »

Oak Tree,

That's really good news that you have someone on her side of the family pushing back against the violent behavior.

I'm getting by on my end, thanks for the kind wishes.

Do you know if your wife is looking into DBT therapy?

WW
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