Resolving Vows: I will not file for divorce. I will let go if she decides to.

[Depression = 72% of members]

Out of everything that I have had to process after my wife's sudden discard in January, the questions that result are probably the hardest. If someone can discard you that quickly, cut off all communication and move on with their life as if you don't exist, did they ever love you genuinely? It leaves you shocked that you could sacrifice so much, lose so much and give so much willingly, to someone you believed in your heart was your soulmate, only to find out that in the big scheme of things, you really didn't matter that much. it's almost as if my wife can turn her emotions and love for me on and off like a light switch. To me that means the love was never there in the first place. Because, there is no way I could ever abandon her or discard her like this, no way I could ever do any of the god awful things she has done without thinking of my well-being or the consequences... .I could never do any of those things to another human being let alone to the person that I love. It makes you feel extremely worthless in general, and absolutely worthless to them. Would like to hear other perspectives and other experiences in this regard and to know how you feel, and how you processed it.

[PianoDood]

Out of everything that I have had to process after my wife's sudden discard in January, the questions that result are probably the hardest. If someone can discard you that quickly, cut off all communication and move on with their life as if you don't exist, did they ever love you genuinely? It leaves you shocked that you could sacrifice so much, lose so much and give so much willingly, to someone you believed in your heart was your soulmate, only to find out that in the big scheme of things, you really didn't matter that much. it's almost as if my wife can turn her emotions and love for me on and off like a light switch. To me that means the love was never there in the first place. Because, there is no way I could ever abandon her or discard her like this, no way I could ever do any of the god awful things she has done without thinking of my well-being or the consequences... .I could never do any of those things to another human being let alone to the person that I love. It makes you feel extremely worthless in general, and absolutely worthless to them. Would like to hear other perspectives and other experiences in this regard and to know how you feel, and how you processed it.

[lighthouse9]

Hey PianoDood,

Funny, I was considering posting about something similar, about the sudden discard - which happened around the same exact time as yours. Are there movements towards divorce in your relationship or have you already started that process? My STBXw asked for a divorce out of nowhere (after I basically asked her if that's what she was getting at) and then went months without making any movement. When we finally got to the point that she would talk about filing (I told her she had to do it, since I didn't want it), she respected my request to wait a few more weeks so I could figure out health insurance stuff. Now, I'm left wondering if there's any chance she'll turn things around in this limbo period and try to recycle. I've been clear in my head about the only conditions where I let that happen, but I would be lying if I didn't say I didn't want us to get there.

The sudden discard has just been maddening and has almost made me wish I could dissociate like she does. I still have so many moments where I'm like wait a minute, is this real? Is this really happening? I'm not checking out of reality in those moments, but more getting gut checked and reminded that yes, she just bailed out of nowhere and is so convinced (or at least convincing) that she's done and has "nothing left for me" as she put it, or that "I'm just a person in her life." REALLY? The marriage has meant nothing? How does a person that quickly just have nothing left? No sentiment? Nothing? It just all feels too absurd to be real sometimes... .

but then I jump on here and I see all of us dealing with similar things and I'm reminded that yes, this is real, yes this does happen, yes she is sick and yes there's a name for this (and a way to get better, but I can't want that enough for her - she has to want it for herself). She's even admitted to thinking she's BPD and desires to get better, but then lied to me about starting DBT. Thus, all I'm left with is the discard and picking up the pieces of our life that she completely abandoned and has taken very little responsibility for.

I'm not sure if this is the right thing to do, but I lurk on boards for people with NPD/BPD and listen to the ways they describe their discards or manipulation or bad behavior in general. It reminds me that there's a human behind this behavior, I human I still very much love, but who absolutely shattered me and our marriage. I feel sometimes like an alien abducted my wife and replaced her with this person - but then I realize no, this was her all along, and the facade of being my wife was what was actually less real and more alien. It breaks my heart, truly, and it doesn't always help shake me from the "Is this really happening?" moments.

Asking yourself about if she loved you and comparing it to how you would behave as a loving person is like comparing apples and oranges. Sure, we're all fruit, but the differences are important. I carry a post it note in my pocket that says "She's doing the best she can, are you?" because I really do believe this is the best she can do - right now. Her best, unfortunately, is not enough for me - even if I still want her back, I can still acknowledge that it's not enough. Could she get better? I think she can. She's smart enough and resourceful enough. But, I've stopped trying to fix her, and she's made her wish clear that I stay out of it.

I ask myself daily if I'm doing my best, not to be a perfectionist, but because my one goal in all of this has been to be the kind of person I can respect. Have I had my weak moments? You betcha. Have I text bombed her or reached out to friends? Yep. I wasn't proud of those moments and they weren't my "best." But, they were real-  and they were where I was at at the moment. I've also realized in all of this that my mental health is a privilege. The ability to not act on impulse (typically) and to be able to discern my emotions and hold conflicting emotions at the same time, to take responsibility, to be humble, all of those things are things I can do but she can't. It makes me sad for her - but also gives me faith in my healing. In a magical world, she gets help and I get to use all of my new tools to be her strong partner. But will we ever love the same way? Probably not. We're wired differently, and that's ok, as long as no one's boundaries are crossed.

You sound like you have some amazing values, especially in a relationship. Is it worth writing some of these things down? I am a person who... .fill in the blank.

I also could never do the things to her that she did to me. I also did some stuff to her that in her book was inexcusable. Unfortunately, I didn't know I was doing them, because I didn't know I was dealing with an emotionally sensitive person. She acted like she didn't give a sh*t about anything - and that should have been my first clue that she actually cared deeply.

You could go two ways with this - you could spend your time trying to figure out her motives, her brain chemistry, try to understand her

and/or

You can spend time understanding yourself, your values, what makes you tick, and what you bring to a relationship, no matter what.

I've been doing both, but the more time passes the more I focus on the latter one. That doesn't mean I don't double over in tears (or even cry in public, god those moments have sucked) or find myself with a knot in my stomach so big that I everything hurts when I think about the discard. It doesn't mean that I'm not having awful dreams and that I can't yet wake up without thinking about what has happened. I'm working on distress tolerance, but even still, I feel like I'm being ripped inside out at worst and just passing for functioning at best most days.

here's one i can say for sure though:

I am a person who can suffer, who has suffered, and who knows life will be full of suffering. But I am a person who keeps going.

Wishing you so much support - I wouldn't wish a sudden discard on anyone.

[Insom]

Hi, PianoDood.

It sounds like you're asking yourself some tough questions.  You are not alone!  I went through a similar process.  I call it my "aha" moment when I realized when my ex and were having two very different relationship experiences.  It marked the beginning of the end for me.  It's when I started detaching.  And it was probably the most painful time I experienced in the relationship because it felt like everything I believed and invested in was false. 

Would like to hear other perspectives and other experiences in this regard and to know how you feel, and how you processed it.

First, congratulations on getting to this point.  Realizing the reality of a BPD relationship can feel emotionally hard, but it's an important part of the process if you're seeking to detach.

What sort of resources and support do you have around you?  Is there anyone you feel you can talk with while you go through this?

[wellwellwell]

I'm sorry you've reached this point, PianoDood. There's still something strange, for me, in reading about so many identical experiences, from the sudden divorce to the delay in filing. I had to politely request that my ex got on with the filing. At the same time she seemed to treat me as a great old friend, without realizing what I felt at all. It took everything I had to keep myself calm enough not to trigger another outburst or destructive withdrawal.

What I took from asking exactly your questions has been summarized really well by Lighthouse 9 and Insom. Although things might get worse before they get better, I can promise you that the feelings you're having now give you a route to healing and recovery, even if the path doesn't become clear until you've re-centered your life. I'd even say that your only option is to put yourself at the center of your life, but it's very hard to do that at first.

I have to say that I'm no longer sure that I love or loved my ex. I did conclude that I'd projected my own empathy onto her. It took me a while to reach that point, and I'm still a bit surprised to find myself writing it. Most of my relationships have been abusive (another hard thing to write), and I'm slowly understanding that my idea of love involves more equality, more real support, and more completeness on each side. Caring deeply about someone, particularly when you know that they're ill, is a different feeling. Sentimentality was the dominant emotion around my marriage, not love. Love is stronger; it grows over time. It doesn't turn to mistrust when you're separated.

The best advice I can give is to try to focus on your feelings, not your thoughts. The feelings are part of your world - the thoughts you're having may lead away from your own center of gravity.

[PianoDood]

Lighthouse9... .
 there is so much in your response and your well-articulated delivery that resonated so deeply with me that I want to respond to. I want to initially just acknowledge and thank you for responding because it made me feel like someone understands. But also to tell you that I have taken screen prints of your response so that I can go through it and relate everything that I feel, think and then processing right now that relate so closely to what you said. I will respond very soon.

[PianoDood]

Insom,
 I have reached that point of detachment. I realized that my enemy has not been my wife, but her illness. And what makes it worse is that even though she has in the past admitted that she is probably BPD, she will not humble herself to heal. And I have reached that point where I can no longer do this. I can no longer sacrifice myself, my life, my relationships, my finances, everything in my life for someone who clearly does not and cannot love me genuinely. So I have reached that point where I feel I must detach no matter what she decides. My question is more related to how spouses of BPD Partners who discard deal with the separation and the uncertainty of what they plan to do. Because regardless, I meant my vows. I am a man of principle. I believe if we don't have principles in our life, we have no Centerline in the road to follow. Therefore, we will waffle back and forth right and left without principles. We have no Compass without them. I feel the same for marriage. I have told my wife multiple times and she knows, I know she knows, that I will not file for divorce. But, knowing that I am justified and letting her go if she decides to file, I'm willing to let her go freely this time. Because it's time for me to detach and heal if she cannot take responsibility for her own healing, which has been the driving force of the toxicity in the relationship. I'm just in that limbo state right now we're two months out, she's not told me she's planning to file for divorce, I've received no divorce papers, I don't know what her intent is or whether she's just so wrapped up in her own personal issues that she has no time to even think about it. But, what I do know is I have walked around this Earth with the same last name all of my life. She's walking around with my name attached to her right now. At some point she has to choose. Does that mean that I will take her back? No. I believe in marriage and I believe in my vows, and the only way I would ever take her back is if she committed to weekly couple and individual therapy sessions and showed it genuine desire to heal herself. Because without it, there is no relationship. I've just been pretending there was a relationship to keep myself from being destroyed. The last time we had an argument right before she just started, I told her that I would rather be destroyed and live in a shelter then to live with someone who does not genuinely love me. And she knows I will not file for divorce, so she knows that the decision is on her. And this time, I'm willing to let her go if that's what she decides because I have had enough. But, my point was to find out if other people have experienced situations where their BPD spouse discarded and left but failed to file for divorce. Because typically, when a relationship ends and someone decides to leave a marriage, they either file for divorce before they leave or shortly after they leave. And I'm trying to figure out from other experiences from other people if they have gone through something similar where they have waited for months for their BPD spouse to file. If she is so Resolute that she's moving on with her life and she's done, then why hasn't she filed for divorce? Is it money? Is it because she's so focused on whatever she's going through personally emotionally that she doesn't have time to even think about it? Who knows? All I know is, for my own self respect I have to remain a man of integrity, regardless of what she chooses. To me, as a Christian, that means I have to allow her to leave if that's what she wants as an unbeliever, but I won't take the action to file myself because I meant my vows, every word of them. So, that is not a sign of weakness, that is me trying to remain a man of integrity and remain true to myself while allowing her to make whatever choices she needs to make and deal with the consequences as a result.

[PianoDood]

Wellwellwell,
Since I decided to go no contact a little over a month ago, no more text bombing, no more emails, no more voicemails through her mother's cell phone, nothing., I have decided to focus on myself and detach. Since then, I have rebuilt immensely the things that she destroyed and just a little over a month. And, one of the most important things I've rebuilt is my sense of self. I have a long way to go in that regard because God knows, being in a BPD relationship will destroy that. But, I am beginning to be able to see my future without her, I'm beginning to rebuild my sense of self confidence knowing that I am capable, able, lovable, level-headed, and able to love. My focus for the past month has been resetting myself on myself, on my life and my future. Regardless of whether she is a part of it or not. The focus of my question was if anyone had ever asked the same questions that I ask myself about whether she ever loved me, how could she have done any of the things that she did, and whether or not they're BPD spouse seem to go into limbo in regard to actually taking action to divorce if that's what they wanted. My wife has told me she's moving on with her life... .Leave her alone... .Okay, then why haven't you file for divorce if you know that I take my vows seriously and will not file myself? That was the Crux of my question. And yes I totally agree with you and thank you for your feedback. I have to Center myself on myself and my life. And that's exactly what I've been doing by rebuilding my self-confidence, rebuilding my finances, rebuilding my self-esteem and self-respect not only through the work that I do but through self-realization. Cuz that's the only way I'm going to heal is to get to know myself again.

[once removed]

hi PianoDood,

i can really hear your pain.

i did ask similar questions to the ones you are asking. they are very common questions among us, and they are difficult questions to answer, and very personal and unique to us. a common defense mechanism that people with BPD (not unique to BPD) use is called Compartmentalization. it is well honed.

another aspect that was beyond me at the time is that often times when a relationship ends, both people are on very different pages. the person doing the leaving has done some level of grieving. they have a different perspective. i cant necessarily tell you what your wife is experiencing or not, i am generalizing; but once that sunk in with me, although baffling, it did remove some of the sting over time. it wasnt as simple as "my ex simply doesnt care and is completely unaffected".

regarding a partner initiating divorce and then dragging their feet, yes, this is a common scenario, you will find it all over the Family Law board.

[Woolspinner2000]

Hi PianoDood, 

I'd love to chime in on this very real and present struggle that you are having.

I meant my vows. I am a man of principle. I believe if we don't have principles in our life, we have no Centerline in the road to follow. Therefore, we will waffle back and forth right and left without principles. We have no Compass without them. I feel the same for marriage. I have told my wife multiple times and she knows... .

To me, as a Christian, that means I have to allow her to leave if that's what she wants as an unbeliever, but I won't take the action to file myself because I meant my vows, every word of them. So, that is not a sign of weakness, that is me trying to remain a man of integrity and remain true to myself while allowing her to make whatever choices she needs to make and deal with the consequences as a result.

Are you referring to the passage in 1 Corinthians 7? My faith is very important to me, and I also struggle with some of the same issues you've mentioned. I'm guessing anyone who uses the Bible and Christ as their guiding force in their lives will struggle to know what to do. Divorce goes against all that we have been taught in the church and quite often within our families too.

I am not married to a pwBPD, however, my mom was an uBPD. Since my siblings and I grew up under such an influence, none of us knew what love was and none of us chose wisely when it came to getting married. In my own situation, while my DH doesn't have BPD, he has many many traits that are like those of my mom, and he has N (narcissistic) traits as well. Nearly every single day I am triggered by his words to me or his nonverbals. It has been an uphill battle for me to grow in my healing and in my faith. We've been married for over 33 years, and it's only been in the past 6 years that I've begun to make sense of all the dysfunction in us each individually as well as in our marriage, and we are both Christians. There has been a tremendous amount of spiritual abuse directed towards me that has confused me to no end. T (therapy) has helped me tremendously, and it has helped me to stay in my marriage longer than I thought I would. The Lord has had things for me to learn during this time, about myself and about DH, so it has not been in vain. You also will most likely find that you will grow and learn during this time of limbo that you are currently going through.

I have struggled with the same thing that you shared, and it is my deep faith and belief in God ordered marriage that keeps me in my marriage. However, if the Lord shows me it is time to go, then I will go. Circumstances have made it more difficult for me to stay, and at the same time, I know that such a marriage is not in the will of the Lord. It is my belief that He already paid for our sins, and it is not our job to keep paying for the sins of others which the Lord has already paid for. Keep your eyes on the Lord to guide you, and not on your circumstances, as best you can.

Each of us has to work through this process step by step. What I hear from you is that you also are working your way through. Good for you!  Keep at it! The work to heal yourself will not ever be in vain.

 
Wools

[Outdoors Girl]

Hi Pianodood,

Thanks for sharing your story.  The timing is the same for me, the discard, devaluing also began in January for me.  The feelings I have are so similar on so many levels and it appears for others here posting as well.  I am also focusing to rebuild myself and I am going to re-read your description of this and possibly print it out so I can concentrate on it.  That was my moment of turning the corner with the process, when I realized I was losing part of myself in the r/s.  That scared me!

I do not have any information to offer on the filing for divorce or the process of separating as I was not married to my s/o.  I sincerely hope you weather that storm in good condition and get the answers you are seeking.

You sound so solid and healthy in your process of sorting out yourself.  It is admirable that you feel you have come such a long way in your healing.  Can I ask you to share specifics if you are able on how you are rebuilding yourself?  Maybe some of it will apply to all of us here.

[Moselle]

Regardless of whether she is a part of it or not. The focus of my question was if anyone had ever asked the same questions that I ask myself about whether she ever loved me, how could she have done any of the things that she did, and whether or not they're BPD spouse seem to go into limbo in regard to actually taking action to divorce if that's what they wanted. My wife has told me she's moving on with her life

Pianodood, I'm so sorry to hear about what you're going through. My heart goes out to you as you agonize over these tough decisions. I've walked this path too and It's tough. I'm glad to see you are having lighter moments

These types of relationships have uncanny similarities and I found myself in a very similar situation 3 years ago.

I came to a similar point and assumption that she had never loved me. So I said as much to her and her response was interesting. She said "I did love you... .my way" The qualification is very important!

If I can describe her love for me, it would be something like this:

- extreme dependence on my supply of money, compassion, care
- need for my willingness to endure and share her intense emotions and abuse ( including physical)
- need for me to endure the push/pull of a Borderline relationship. (I hate you, don't leave me)
- intense sexual experience with no intimacy

Does this sound familiar or was her love different in your case?  

You sound so solid and healthy in your process of sorting out yourself.  It is admirable that you feel you have come such a long way in your healing.  Can I ask you to share specifics if you are able on how you are rebuilding yourself?  Maybe some of it will apply to all of us here.

Yes. Please do share how you are recovering?

[Speck]

Hello, PianoDood:

I am so sorry to hear that you are weathering this storm. I understand what you're going through, and, as you probably know, MANY others here do as well.

Your story is eerily similar to mine. In short, my uBPDw left me abruptly 4 times in 10 years. That's just bad math, but each time, I told her that I meant my vows and would not be divorcing her; she'd have to be the one to pull the trigger. The last time that she walked out on me (this past November), I finally (mentally) let her go for good, but still, I told her that she'd have to file, as I would not. My reasons for not doing so were identical to yours.

Yes, she just walked out with barely a word, cut off all communication beyond the immediate logistics of moving her stuff out in December and then sporatic chatter regarding our kid. She also dragged her feet about filing for divorce all through Christmas, then January, then February... .I got so down about her dragging her feet about filing that I created a thread just to process the process, if you know what I mean. I don't know if it would be helpful for you to read about it, but it's there if you need to. I received some good advice and support there that may also help you. Long story short, she finally filed, and I'm just waiting for the judge to sign off on it.

If someone can discard you that quickly, cut off all communication and move on with their life as if you don't exist, did they ever love you genuinely? It leaves you shocked that you could sacrifice so much, lose so much and give so much willingly, to someone you believed in your heart was your soulmate, only to find out that in the big scheme of things, you really didn't matter that much.

I have formulated your exact words in my mind so many times, I am not sure if I've ever solved this riddle for myself. Not even a little bit.

Because, there is no way I could ever abandon her or discard her like this, no way I could ever do any of the god awful things she has done without thinking of my well-being or the consequences... .I could never do any of those things to another human being let alone to the person that I love.

Same. It's another riddle that I cannot understand. It's just something that I must accept.

It makes you feel extremely worthless in general, and absolutely worthless to them.

I know how you feel, friend. With the passage of time, I have come to the conclusion that I am a worthwhile person, a safe person, a good friend, a good husband, a good father, a good provider... .but, all that was simply lost on my wife. She did not appreciate what I brought to the marriage. She told me that she viewed me as "nothing more than a brother, a sibling." Yes, and ouch! However, it's just something that I must accept.

Would like to hear other perspectives and other experiences in this regard and to know how you feel, and how you processed it.

I'm still healing. I don't know how long that road is, but I'm here for the duration. Doing so is a gift that I give myself; an act of self-love that is long overdue.

We are here for you. You are NOT alone.

Keep writing, keep processing, keep learning.


-Speck

[PianoDood]

Outdoors Girl and Moselle... .
I came on the board to catch up on reading responses and re-center this morning and I wanted to respond to your responses first.

First, I must say that I probably sound a lot stronger in my recovery in some of my responses than I really am.  Just because I AM taking positive steps and I AM trying to embrace my emotions and do things that rebuild my sense of self DOES NOT MEAN I'm always strong or that I don't struggle.  I have reached out to as many positive resources I can while walking through this valley.  If I had to list the top 3 (in no order of importance), I'd have to say (1) therapy with a good therapist, (2) connection with my support system and good friends (people who KNOW THE REAL ME and LOVE THE REAL ME, not the codependent rescuing empath I had become... .my sister even told me, "I want my brother back" and (3) learning as much as I can about BPD to understand the disorder, how it affected me and my relationship with my uBPDw, what brokenness inside of me made me both a perfect target for her disorder and how my own brokenness participated in the unholy dance of our relationship... .and, connecting on this board.  When you feel all alone, there are few things more relieving than finding that you're NOT ALONE in your struggle, there are people who can relate and there are resources/people who can help guide you through detachment and healing.  I find it cathartic.  And I'm not too proud to admit that I've cried while I'm writing this.  Detachment, healing and rediscovering yourself is a process, a journey.  And it's not an easy one.  That's what I've learned.  My favorite saying now is, "The good thing is that I am now dealing with and learning positive ways of coping with my negative emotions.  The bad thing is that I am now dealing with and learning positive ways of coping with my negative emotions."  LOL.  The "bad" part is sarcasm, but it's still true.  Learning to heal my own brokenness that contributed to the unholy dance is HARD!  But, it's necessary.  I'm still fighting to maintain while I wait for my heart to catch up to my head.  I still walk around with a knot of pain, withdrawal and longing for my wife in my stomach.  That's the emotion.  But, cognitively, in my mind, I KNOW OUR RELATIONSHIP IS UNHEALTHY because she is unhealthy and in my own ways, I had unhealthy ways of coping that feed into her disorder.  But, I still have days where I shut down and just allow myself to "feel" and "process" what I'm going through.  That's called being kind to myself as I walk through this process.  So, no, I'm not nearly as strong in my sense of self or in my process of detachment and recovery as I might sound in my posts.  But, I AM taking the steps necessary and still learning other things I can do to move forward in a healthy way.  It's a process.  Two days ago, I actually had a thought to send flowers to my wife at her work, triggered by driving by the florist I had always used to send her flowers in the past.  And it really tugged at my heart... .her favorite purple flowers... .everything.  But, almost immediately, I shoved the thought out of my mind and, frankly, my logical, realistic self was REVOLTED by the thought of sending flowers to someone who had done and said the things she did.  It's taken me 2 months just to get to that point.  But, that doesn't mean I'm strong.  I'm just dealing and processing just like everyone else on this board.

Keep reading about the disorder, the part your own brokenness may have played in it, read the lessons and information on this board, reach out to your support system and seek professional help to assist in coping with the negative emotions.  It's hard.  And the disorder of our SOs makes it a TOXIC hard.  It's a day by day journey.  And my experience so far is that the days do get harder.  Not usually in leaps and bounds.  I like to think of it this way.  On June 21st, for those of us who live in the northern hemisphere, the days begin to become shorter a few minutes every day, until eventually, we reach the shortest day of the year in terms of sunlight on December 21st.  That's what my relationship with my uBPDw was doing to my self-esteem, my self-respect and boundaries and to the light that is ME.  But, recovery is just the opposite.  Once I determined to detach and take a leap of faith that my heart would eventually catch up to my head and to start taking baby steps every day to heal myself, the days began to get longer for me, a few minutes every day.  My December 21st was a month ago when I realized that I was destroying myself and my own self-respect by continuing to try to communicate in any way with my wife after her discard.  Since that moment I decided to go no contact, based solely upon my realization that I couldn't continue that direction, nothing more, and I stopped communicating and resolved to detach simply because I knew continuing what I was doing was destructive and pointless, my healing began.  At the moment, I was still non-functional.  I went an entire week without eating.  I couldn't think straight.  I isolated from everything and everyone and laid in bed all day.  But, I had made the LOGICAL choice to stop "dancing".  Initially, every emotion and it seemed like every fiber of my being SCREAMED and RAILED AGAINST the decision.  It didn't just knock me to my knees.  It knocked me on my back.  Literally.  I was so devastated that it took me over a month after discard just to cry for the first time.  And letting that emotion out happened AFTER I had decided, logically, to detach and go no contact. 

I'm on the same journey as everyone else on this message board, so I'm not even certain I'm always walking the right path perfectly.  I know I'm not.  For me, making the choice to save myself by detaching and going no contact was my turning point.  That's when I opened the door to healing.  And, day by day, the sun stays in the sky a few minutes longer.  And every day, I keep focusing on that day when the daylight will be the longest.

[PianoDood]

Speck... .thank you for sharing your own experience with me and giving your perspective.  It's nearly identical to what I experienced and it's comforting to know I'm not alone.  Although, I will say, you seem further along in the process of healing.  I haven't really drawn many "conclusions" about anything related to what she did/didn't feel or to any of the how or why questions.  But, the one conclusion I have drawn lately is that even THINKING ABOUT why she did what she did, what she did/didn't feel or how she could do those kinds of things to someone she said she loved... .doing ANY of that is like chasing a rabbit down a rabbit hole.  It's dark, paths leading many directions and none of them go anywhere with light and it's easy to get lost or stuck.  That doesn't mean I'm ANY GOOD at stopping myself from ruminating on those questions... .I'm really not yet, but I'm trying.  What I'm finding in my process is this... .and it might sound cliche or an over-simplification, but it's true... .the more I accept what IS, regardless of how I feel about it, the more I place my focus and energy on me, my healing and my future and the LESS I spend any time, focus or energy thinking about my uBPDw in any way, the easier it is to detach and do the things I need to do for me.  It's hard.  But, those questions do pop into my head a lot and I still struggle with it all regularly.  I'm nowhere near where I need to be in terms of dealing with my triggered thoughts and emotions, I still have my bad days, I still struggle badly at times.  And, I've even realized that I may very well still have triggered thoughts and emotions years from now.  All I can do is put one foot in front of the other every day and try to stay on the healthiest path I can.  But, I will say, this process is HARD.  It's sometimes hard to define the line between where healthy "feeling" and "processing" in my detachment and healing ends and "ruminating" and "dwelling negatively" starts.  I supposed those lines will get clearer for me as I walk the path and avoid the rabbit holes. 

Thanks for sharing your perspective and experiences, Speck.  Seriously, it's almost identical to mine and it makes me feel not so alone.

[PianoDood]

Moselle... .something you said in describing your wife's love for you really hit home.  You said... .

"If I can describe her love for me, it would be something like this:

- extreme dependence on my supply of money, compassion, care
- need for my willingness to endure and share her intense emotions and abuse ( including physical)
- need for me to endure the push/pull of a Borderline relationship. (I hate you, don't leave me)
- intense sexual experience with no intimacy

Does this sound familiar or was her love different in your case?"

That is the exact same description I would use to describe, in reality, how my wife "loved" me.  As long as I was making good money or able to throw money to her anytime she had made bad choices or used her money for other things behind smoke a mirrors and I could continually sustain her until her next pay day and provide money for us to do things together, she was happy, affectionate and, as much as she was capable of, connected.

Yes, my wife was always telling me about the latest drama with her ex (the father of her children) or issues at work or drama with her children.  And she would devalue if I didn't read her mind/emotions or didn't seem interested in listening and giving feedback to every single detail of her emotions.  Just like the money issue, the emotional support in the relationship was also imbalanced... .always me listening, lending supportive feedback or adjusting to whatever her circumstances required her to do... .most of which never had anything to do with me.

The push/pull was always present in our relationship from her.  Sometimes the push/pull cycled slowly, sometimes very quickly.  And, most of the time, it was triggered by her stress level and life circumstances that had nothing to do with our relationship.  For instance, during her last devaluation and discard, she would say things like "my whole family thinks your a loser" and then say, the next day, "it's ok.  It's just temporary.  It takes time to find a job.  You'll find something soon".  And, I did, but after she left.  Or she would do things like take the day off to spend all day with me at a local museum... .one week before she discarded. 

And the sex?  Yes, very intense, but devoid of emotion.  I often told her that I enjoyed "making love" to her, not just having "sex".  Not to get too intimate in my disclosure, but she rarely every kissed me during sex and never told me she loved me during sex.  It felt like an intense sexual act, but never a "bonding" experience for her.  However, it WAS a bonding experience for me and I always longed for it to be for her too.  Interestingly enough, my wife was very self-conscious about her body as well.  And she could not allow herself to feel very comfortable with being intimate because she has a very low-image of herself physically (and emotionally).  I could go into more detail about this in a way that would explain fully what I'm saying, but I don't think it's appropriate for a public post on the board.  And no matter what I said to her and no matter what I did to ensure that she knew she was the sexiest woman in the world to me, I only wanted her and I was very satisfied by her sensually, she still always had unfounded suspicions that I was doing inappropriate things with other women (friends), she still remained negative about her self-image and, when devaluing, would make very hurtful comments to me about our sex life, very personal put-downs. 

[Outdoors Girl]

Pianodood,

What a beautiful reply and I love your analogy about the sun. The last paragraph in this post was so  heartening.

My December 21st was last Monday and I have nowhere to go but up!

Thank you for this,

Outdoors Girl

[wellwellwell]

And the sex?  Yes, very intense, but devoid of emotion.  I often told her that I enjoyed "making love" to her, not just having "sex".  Not to get too intimate in my disclosure, but she rarely every kissed me during sex and never told me she loved me during sex.  It felt like an intense sexual act, but never a "bonding" experience for her.  However, it WAS a bonding experience for me and I always longed for it to be for her too.  Interestingly enough, my wife was very self-conscious about her body as well.  And she could not allow herself to feel very comfortable with being intimate because she has a very low-image of herself physically (and emotionally).  I could go into more detail about this in a way that would explain fully what I'm saying, but I don't think it's appropriate for a public post on the board.  And no matter what I said to her and no matter what I did to ensure that she knew she was the sexiest woman in the world to me, I only wanted her and I was very satisfied by her sensually, she still always had unfounded suspicions that I was doing inappropriate things with other women (friends), she still remained negative about her self-image and, when devaluing, would make very hurtful comments to me about our sex life, very personal put-downs. 

I can completely empathize with this. I'm sorry to hear it was your experience, too.

I struggled for work, as well. That's another weird common experience I find on this board. There seemed to be a complete lack of awareness on my ex's part about the impact on me and the reasons why, e.g. the energy it was taking to keep the relationship going and the lack of meaningful support I was getting from it. Raising these concerns, no matter how respectfully, risked her leaving without explanation (but with blame). Again, and again. I was punished for having very normal and healthy response to her behavior. So that's what I was required to accept. And I shouldn't have accepted it.

Really helps to share this today.

[Speck]

Hello again, PianoDood:

Thank you so much for sharing your story with us and for such a frank and open reply. I do have some things to add:

Although, I will say, you seem further along in the process of healing.

Well, my wife left me in November... .so maybe, I got a two-month head start in what I call the Great Numb. But, trust me, I'm sitting in front of my computer scratchin' my head much like you are.

I haven't really drawn many "conclusions" about anything related to what she did/didn't feel or to any of the how or why questions.  But, the one conclusion I have drawn lately is that even THINKING ABOUT why she did what she did, what she did/didn't feel or how she could do those kinds of things to someone she said she loved... .doing ANY of that is like chasing a rabbit down a rabbit hole.

I know, friend. It's terribly difficult for Nons to understand the scaldingly hateful behavior of someone who suffers from BPD. For example, without first understanding that my uBPDw's behavior is absolutely related to her own sense of survival rather than having anything to do within the realm of logical reality, I'm not sure I would ever be able to reconcile how she treated me. But, I now think that I can. It's a small crack... .but I think that I can.

That doesn't mean I'm ANY GOOD at stopping myself from ruminating on those questions... .I'm really not yet, but I'm trying.

 

Well, to this, I would have to say that however you need to heal is an individual course. There is no statute of limitations on grieving and no defined timeline. If ruminating is where you are on a random Tuesday, then allow yourself ample time and space to do that. Be gentle with yourself. Forgive yourself for being stuck, for allowing yourself to get hurt.

The more I accept what IS, regardless of how I feel about it, the more I place my focus and energy on me, my healing and my future and the LESS I spend any time, focus or energy thinking about my uBPDw in any way, the easier it is to detach and do the things I need to do for me.

Absolutely. Same here. I'm still learning to secure my own oxygen mask first... .

It's hard.  But, those questions do pop into my head a lot and I still struggle with it all regularly.  I'm nowhere near where I need to be in terms of dealing with my triggered thoughts and emotions, I still have my bad days, I still struggle badly at times.

I fully understand. This absolutely sucks. But, intellectually, I know that I must run this gauntlet of grief so that I can smell the daffodils on the other side of the tunnel. And... .it is a tunnel.

And, I've even realized that I may very well still have triggered thoughts and emotions years from now.

Count on it, brother. You love her. That stuff dies hard. Myself, I cannot even conceive of a scenario wherein I think it's safe or prudent to ever marry again. I have thoughts of being on the Learning Board five years from now asking awkward first date questions.

All I can do is put one foot in front of the other every day and try to stay on the healthiest path I can.  But, I will say, this process is HARD.

Yes, but I've been told a forest is always more beautiful and healthy after a devastating wildfire.

It's sometimes hard to define the line between where healthy "feeling" and "processing" in my detachment and healing ends and "ruminating" and "dwelling negatively" starts.  I supposed those lines will get clearer for me as I walk the path and avoid the rabbit holes. 

Well, just bring your rabbit holes here. We'll help you fill them in with dirt so your feet can't find them.

Step by step, we heal.


-Speck

[Moselle]

Well, just bring your rabbit holes here. We'll help you fill them in with dirt so your feet can't find them.

Step by step, we heal.

  Hope you have a great week Pianodood. You're not alone!

[space261083]

Insom,
 I have reached that point of detachment. I realized that my enemy has not been my wife, but her illness. And what makes it worse is that even though she has in the past admitted that she is probably BPD, she will not humble herself to heal. And I have reached that point where I can no longer do this. I can no longer sacrifice myself, my life, my relationships, my finances, everything in my life for someone who clearly does not and cannot love me genuinely. So I have reached that point where I feel I must detach no matter what she decides. My question is more related to how spouses of BPD Partners who discard deal with the separation and the uncertainty of what they plan to do. Because regardless, I meant my vows. I am a man of principle. I believe if we don't have principles in our life, we have no Centerline in the road to follow. Therefore, we will waffle back and forth right and left without principles. We have no Compass without them. I feel the same for marriage. I have told my wife multiple times and she knows, I know she knows, that I will not file for divorce. But, knowing that I am justified and letting her go if she decides to file, I'm willing to let her go freely this time. Because it's time for me to detach and heal if she cannot take responsibility for her own healing, which has been the driving force of the toxicity in the relationship. I'm just in that limbo state right now we're two months out, she's not told me she's planning to file for divorce, I've received no divorce papers, I don't know what her intent is or whether she's just so wrapped up in her own personal issues that she has no time to even think about it. But, what I do know is I have walked around this Earth with the same last name all of my life. She's walking around with my name attached to her right now. At some point she has to choose. Does that mean that I will take her back? No. I believe in marriage and I believe in my vows, and the only way I would ever take her back is if she committed to weekly couple and individual therapy sessions and showed it genuine desire to heal herself. Because without it, there is no relationship. I've just been pretending there was a relationship to keep myself from being destroyed. The last time we had an argument right before she just started, I told her that I would rather be destroyed and live in a shelter then to live with someone who does not genuinely love me. And she knows I will not file for divorce, so she knows that the decision is on her. And this time, I'm willing to let her go if that's what she decides because I have had enough. But, my point was to find out if other people have experienced situations where their BPD spouse discarded and left but failed to file for divorce. Because typically, when a relationship ends and someone decides to leave a marriage, they either file for divorce before they leave or shortly after they leave. And I'm trying to figure out from other experiences from other people if they have gone through something similar where they have waited for months for their BPD spouse to file. If she is so Resolute that she's moving on with her life and she's done, then why hasn't she filed for divorce? Is it money? Is it because she's so focused on whatever she's going through personally emotionally that she doesn't have time to even think about it? Who knows? All I know is, for my own self respect I have to remain a man of integrity, regardless of what she chooses. To me, as a Christian, that means I have to allow her to leave if that's what she wants as an unbeliever, but I won't take the action to file myself because I meant my vows, every word of them. So, that is not a sign of weakness, that is me trying to remain a man of integrity and remain true to myself while allowing her to make whatever choices she needs to make and deal with the consequences as a result.

Hi there.
I am in a bit of limbo with this too. I am 6 months out of a 20yr relationship. My ex initially said she wanted a divorce when she moved a new guy into our home 2 weeks after I left. She emailed a few weeks back about the kids and I used this opportunity to ask about starting the divorce process. If I file I have to pay which is fine but I'm saving for a bigger place for me and the kids so money is tight right now. Because she does not work and receives state benefits I'm pretty sure she can get financial help with the process. She denies this and says it has to be paid for, whether that's true or not I don't know but I suggested to her that we meet halfway and both pay towards the costs. Its £275 each, really not a lot considering. She has simply not replied. I am in your shoes, what does this mean? She has made her choice, she is soo "happy" now, why not get the ball rolling.
I have read that people with BPD take failure very hard. Divorce is obviously acknowledging something failed. I have read many instances too where the spouse leaves and drags their feet detaching. Something for you, and me I guess to think about.

[PianoDood]

 Wools... .
Yes, that is the passage.   I have resolved to let her go unless she has a "magical revelation" she hasn't had in our 12 years together,  decides on individual and couple counseling of her own volition and takes ownership to own all of the above and irritated it all.  And,  I probably don't have to tell you,  the odds of that happening is almost nill.  So, I have no illusions.  I will either be dealing with her eventually filing for divorce or I'll be rejecting yet another recycle
  She has always recycled or attempted to get a narcissistic "fix" from me 2-3 months after every discard.  She's been gone 2 months.   So, I'm waiting for either divorce papers or a generic text trying to reconnect.   And I know this.   That's why I am mentally and emotionally preparing myself ahead of time.   Should she try to  recycle,  she will get NO response.   Just because I will not file for divorce because of principle doesn't mean I won't sign uncontested if she files.   I will.   I have rebuilt far too much in the last two months since she discarded to ever allow her to get close to me or my efforts again.

[lighthouse9]

We are in remarkably similar places PianoDood- with very similar conditions for reconciliation. Cheers to us holding strong to our boundaries and continuing to rebuild every day.

What are some of the things you've been able to rebuild or things you've been able to remember about yourself in this more quiet time?

[Enabler]

Likewise Pianodude and Lighthouse,

My W called divorce exactly a year ago today 21st Mar 2017... .WOW, I just realised that... .WOW WOW WOW WOW. Sought valuations for the house in May17, talked about contacting a legal mediator in June17, actually contacted the mediator in Oct17, agreed the wording of the divorce petition in Nov17 and very very very little since. There's been some activity on the financial disclosure information and half hearted efforts to sell the house in Feb18 but nothing else since.

I refuse to petition or be proactive since I disagree with the divorce from the very core of my personal values. I see good in the relationship even if it's the faintest of embers. She has the means and intelligence to get what she wants if this is truly what she wants, so as far as I'm concerned she can make it happen.

My lack of certainty is emotionally agonizing but something I have chosen to sit with and endure. I often feel tempted to petition for divorce if only to push her one way or the other and break the limbo of her being content to leave the relationship and family unit on the precipice of the cliff... .but then realise this will just feed the monster it's desires... ."I knew you'd leave me".

Those whom are willing to stand for their personal values are in short supply in this world it would seem to me... .I often wonder how many people would appreciate their spouses receiving the same advice they have given me or my wife... ."it's over just move on"... ."Kick him/her to the kerb". Is it a function of our throw away culture, our millennial sense of entitlement or idealised utopia view of what constitutes a happy relationship.

I like this talk by Ester Perel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iu9_8Vsmtk   

Relationships are tough, BPD relationships are REALLY tough, and I think we all have to be a bit pragmatic about the expectations we have for them.

[PianoDood]

Once Removed,
Actually, my wife hasn't initiated anything except leaving/discarding.  She has simply gone radio-silent/no contact.  The only issue is, I didn't do anything that would motivate her to leave, let alone cut off all communication.  And the fact that I am now over 2 months out and she hasn't filed for divorce yet... .yes, truly baffling.  I am sure, as you said, she can't be unaffected by it after 12 years.  She's compartmentalizing.  She's sticking to whatever narrative she has created to ensure in her mind, she has no responsibility.  It's what she's always done to avoid dealing with the real issues.  And yes, I do imagine that she did her own form of "grieving" silently before she discarded.  However, she kept that secret from me, along with the real motivation behind her discard.  I get the fact that it's too hard for her to face things directly, especially if they could cause conflict.  It's simply easier for her to blame and run.  That's an over-simplication, I know, but it fits.  It's too hard to be emotionally mature, talk about issues openly and deal with things at face value for her.  Especially if it might result in her having to take any responsibility, being faced with any kind of tension or conflict or having to be empathetic.  She's simply not able, in her emotional state, to deal with any of those things.  So, yes, she probably silently grieved, but to me, it looked like devaluation and discard.  And, yes, it's extremely baffling to be 2 months out without any communication and no initiation of divorce.

[PianoDood]

Lighthouse9,
In your last response, you asked me 2 question.  Forgive me if I paraphrase:
(1).  What things have I done to rebuild myself
(2).  What things have I remembered about myself.
First, I would have to say that I don't know if I would call it a "quiet" time with so much turmoil inside me emotionally.  But, I do understand, you were probably referring to the "quiet time" of being alone and not having that one here with me. 
(1).  Rebuilding.  Honestly, there is so much to rebuild in so many facets of my life, I almost have to separate them into categories.  At the time my wife discarded, I had been unemployed for about a month, but was fervently looking for work.  But, since it was the holidays, I knew no one would be seriously hiring until sometime mid-January.  And responses to my resume had just started when my wife discarded.  One thing I found in regard to my wife over the years is that during the devaluation, the things she said to me ALWAYS gave direct clues to the specific, underlying reasons for her discard.  For example, one night, after she had trampled a boundary of mine and I called her on it, she went on the attack (always did to deflect when called out) and said, "My whole family thinks you're a loser".  Her intention was to devalue, hurt me, make me feel less-than.  But, because I was accustomed to her behavior and attuned to the motivation behind her abuse, it gave clues.  Her issues were financial.  She was feeling financial stress because she was being pulled by her adult children to provide personal needs and legal expenses (defense against criminal charges) and, instead, she was having to cover more of our personal expenses, which put her in a position of having to make a choice where her resources were utilized.  So, her easiest target was me.  And, it was easier for her to move back to her parent's house and put her resources into them than it was to stay committed to our marriage and weather the financial storm while not giving her children all they were asking for.  At the time, understanding this about her verbally abusive statements, it made me even MORE uneasy about a potential discard because I knew that, in the past, it was her family and children who were always the motivation behind her discard for various reasons.  So, I saw the same pattern (devaluation) occurring, I just didn't know when the discard would occur.  And there was nothing I could do about it.  I said all of that to say this about rebuilding.  At the time she left, I was faced with rent and utility bills of $1,500 that I had no way to pay.  I had no job.  But, 2 weeks after she left, 2 private veteran groups paid all of the $1,500 (I'm a USAF veteran) and I landed a very well-paying job that same week.  Finances have always been tied to our relationship.  For the first 6 years of our relationship, I was making an good living as an IT project Manager for companies like GE, Ford Motor Company and National Steel Corporation.  She was unemployed or underemployed.  And, if I didn't read her mind about her financial needs, she literally would RAIL me and tell me I was a horrible boyfriend and even on occasion made veiled threats about "finding someone who actually cared about her and her needs".  I was her personal ATM.  And since she actually began working solidly, she has been underemployed, spent her money behind smoke and mirrors, never wanting to sit down and make a marital budget because it would mean working as a team instead of just doing what she wanted.  The only problem with that was, 4 days after payday, she would be out of money and asking me to help her with expenses.  Yet, she would never disclose where her entire paycheck had gone in just 4 days.  I said all of that to say this about rebuilding... .I have gotten on top of my financial debt, I have rented a 3-bedroom house in a MUCH nicer area of the city instead of living in what I consider to be a sub-standard apartment in an undesirable area and I have begun to save money again.  That's the financial rebuilding.

As for rebuilding myself, I am sort of discovering that as I go along, somewhat.  But, I have re-engaged in therapy I had begun about a year ago (had to stop for financial reasons) to address my co-dependent "rescuing" tendencies.  I have re-engaged in hobbies that help me express my artistic side, focus my mind on something I enjoy and have an end result that gives me pride (sounds crazy, but I do scale modelling).  And the reason I said I was discovering it as I go along is that I feel there are certain things that I don't feel comfortable doing just yet... .like going places and doing things by myself.  Still feels too lonely.  And, since the only reason I am in this city (200 miles from my own family) is because I moved here for my wife so that she didn't have to leave her family (which I now know is her constant "back-up plan" aka, enablers).  So, I am here alone in a city that I've gotten to know somewhat, but I am, except for a few friends, alone here.  And everywhere I go alone would just remind me of things I did with my wife.  So, I have stalled doing that just yet until I feel comfortable.  My work takes a LOT of effort and time, sometimes 10-12 hours per day, 6 days per week.  So, I've pretty much been too busy and focused on work to do much socially alone.  However, I work with people who I've known longer than just the time I've been employed with the company... .so, they were actually my friends before I got hired.  And they understand my situation.  They've seen her discards before. 
There is probably more I could write here, but beyond those specifics, I am feeling my way through this tunnel.  Oh, and I've gone on a low-carb diet to reject my wife's name-calling and to become more fit to raise my self-esteem.  She called me "fat", which wasn't true.  I was carrying about 25lbs over my ideal weight, but was never obese.  But, the words still cut deeply.  So, I've also done that to rebuild my self-esteem.  And, the house I'm moving to has a full set of weights and a weight bench in it, so I will also be also exercising when I move there.

(2).  What have I remembered about myself.  I'm responsible and level-headed.  Interacting with other "normally emotional" people through my work and reaffirmed my belief that I am NOT crazy.  I'm actually quite normal emotionally when I am not dealing with the instability of my relationship with my wife.  I am a very hard-working, successful and goal-driven person and not the "loser" my wife called me.  I have never been a loser, but, as I said before, it gave more clues that her discard was about her family, children and money, which has almost always been the case.  I have remembered that I am a good person, with good values and principles.  I am a person who cares deeply about others, am able to empathize with the plight of others and put myself in their shoes.  I have remembered that I DO LOVE GENUINELY.  And, in my mind, I remember that I am lovable, but it's going to take some time for that to be restored.  My self-esteem has been severely damaged.  That's not going to heal overnight.  I remember a lot of things about myself in my head more than I fully realize and remember them in my heart right now.  But, slow, I am re-learning myself.  I'm learning to be comfortable being alone again.  I am learning to be content where I am, with what I have.  I am learning to put my own mental, emotional, physical and spiritual health ahead of the needs of my wife again.  That's a slow process, but I am making progress. 

I feel like I remember a lot about myself, but there is so much more in the nooks and crannies that I still haven't rediscovered and only a portion of the major pieces of me have been remembered so far.  Bottomline is that I am learning that I was NOT what my wife said I was.  Never have been.  But it takes time to erase the words and actions that made me feel like I was. 

I hope this at least partially answers your question.

PD

[PianoDood]

Enabler,
You said "Those whom are willing to stand for their personal values are in short supply in this world it would seem to me... .I often wonder how many people would appreciate their spouses receiving the same advice they have given me or my wife... ."it's over just move on"... ."Kick him/her to the kerb". Is it a function of our throw away culture, our millennial sense of entitlement or idealised utopia view of what constitutes a happy relationship."

So much in this statement resonates with me.  It really mirrors my thoughts, feelings and experiences with others in that regard.  First, "it's over, move on" are the exact words my wife has told me several times at discard.  So, hearing that from someone else is even that much more painful because they do not understand the situation and what it's like to be a "non" in a BPD relationship.  I too believe that we have a "throw away" culture that is focused on selfishness to some degree.  If you're not happy, just throw it away and start all over again.  Go get a new one.  And, IMHO, that actually PERPETUATES the unhealthy cycles because no one is ever required to self-evaluate or heal unless they do it because they've personally hit bottom.  It perpetuates the thought that "it's not my fault", I can just throw it away and find something better, something that doesn't make me feel uncomfortable.  But, I will say that those to tend to buy into that kind of behavior and not the healthy types in the first place.  Emotionally mature people tend to be more empathetic and less selfish in that regard.  But, I think that's because they have probably come from a background where they were taught such things and learned fairly healthy ways of coping.  And they tend to be more committed.  Just my 2 cents on what you said.  I agree.

I too have struggled with the lack of action from my uBPD wife toward divorce.  But, I am no longer thinking in terms of reconciliation unless a literal miracle occurs and she takes responsibility to heal herself.  My position is exactly this.  I have walked this Earth with the same last name all of my life.  I can continue to rebuild and rediscover myself regardless what she chooses to do.  So, there is no loss for me in continuing to heal, continuing to rediscover myself and rebuild myself while she sits doing nothing.  She's the one with my last name.  She's the one who made the decision to leave.  She's made nearly all of the decisions that put us where we are.  So, there is no loss for me, not even legally, if I keep doing what I'm doing for myself and let her do whatever it is she is doing or will do.  I can remain true to my vows, still wear my ring, still be her husband... .until she takes action.  It has zero effect on me to still be married to her.  She can't do anything legally or financially to hurt me.  All of our finances are separate.  She can't open any accounts or get credit in my name, with my social security number.  My state is a no-fault divorce state.  I did speak to a lawyer about the situation and the "date of separation" will be recognized as the "date of separation" of EVERYTHING should she move forward with divorce at some point, meaning financially and all other ways.  She has zero claim on anything I've done or accomplished since she left.  So, let her walk around with my last name.  It doesn't hurt me a bit.  That's how I now think of it.  I hold no illusions.  The chances of her having an epiphany and deciding, wholeheartedly, that she needs to seek help and heal herself are almost literally nill.  And, that would be the ONLY conditions under which I would ever entertain letting her close to me again.  So, as I said before, I can continue to remain true to my vows and continue to rebuild and heal myself while she sits in limbo in regard to me and it doesn't hurt me a bit.  Quite honestly, knowing my uBPDw and her condition under stress, she's probably compartmentalized so much that she's doing all she can to not even THINK about me, our relationship and divorce.  She's too busy putting out emotional fires and dealing with the stress of the corners she paints herself into with her way of dealing with life that she isn't even thinking of me.  Knowing her, she may very well be trying to force me to file by waiting... .figuring I'll eventually find someone else (which tells me even more that she has NO CLUE WHATSOEVER how strongly I feel about my marital vows).  But, at some point, she will have to deal with it.  And until she makes some kind of a choice, I'm fine moving forward with me while I wait for her to do something, whatever that something may be. 

[Speck]

Hello again, PianoDood:

It's good to hear an update from you. I know you addressed the following to once removed, but I'd like to comment on a few things:

She has simply gone radio-silent/no contact.  The only issue is, I didn't do anything that would motivate her to leave, let alone cut off all communication.

That's the tricky part. Unbeknownst to you, there's probably something that you did or said to trigger her into leaving you, but you didn't know it in real time because she did not tell you. The trigger could have even been a loving gesture or kind overture on your part, which banged her fear of engulfment, causing her to bolt. This is the most difficult thing for Nons to understand. It doesn't have to make logical sense.

In my case, I woke up one morning in November and found my uBPDw already up (which was strange) preparing to leave the house. I simply asked her if she was avoiding me (which she HAD been doing for several weeks). That's all it took to have her pack some things and leave me standing in our kitchen wondering what in the hell just happened. Without another word, she drew up divorce documents and emailed them to me six days later. Brutal.

She's compartmentalizing.  She's sticking to whatever narrative she has created to ensure in her mind, she has no responsibility.  It's what she's always done to avoid dealing with the real issues. I get the fact that it's too hard for her to face things directly, especially if they could cause conflict.  It's simply easier for her to blame and run.

Same. Damn. Thing.

I can totally relate to this.

It's too hard to be emotionally mature, talk about issues openly and deal with things at face value for her.  Especially if it might result in her having to take any responsibility, being faced with any kind of tension or conflict or having to be empathetic.  She's simply not able, in her emotional state, to deal with any of those things.

 

I have absolutely said these exact words to my T.


On a lighter note, do you play the piano by chance? 

Take care, Pianodood. Write when you can. We're always listening.


-Speck

[PianoDood]

Speck,
Actually, yes, I do play the piano.  I also play guitar, sax and am a tenor vocally.  I've been a musician all of my life and performed professionally for many years.  But, going through this, I can't even stand to listen to the radio in my car.  LOL.  Music is that emotional for me.  It's hard to explain to other people that I have basically set aside my music (during the relationship and since the discard)... .most people who know me closely understand because they know the part music has played in my life.  But, those who don't often ask me why I don't play or perform... .they think it would cathartic for me.  But, it's such an emotional thing for me that until I feel more myself and more stable, I can't express myself that way.  Eventually, that also will be restored.  Just not right now.

PD

[Speck]

Pianodood,

Same here. I play the guitar and played professionally in my 20's and early 30's. Recorded an album, even. Loved it! But, like you, I set it all on the backburner when I got married. Ten years went by, and I barely picked up my beloved Taylor jumbo cutaway. Now, she's gone. I cannot listen to music right now, either, as it cuts to the center of me, and I'm not ready for that. So... .I drive to work in silence. It's okay. I'll get there.

And you will, too. Thanks for sharing.


-Speck

[PianoDood]

Speck... .about the "trigger".  My wife's triggers have always been stress related to finances, her family and her children, almost exclusively.  And this time is no different.  The devaluation and abuse is just the "path" and her "means to her end" by which she executes whatever "solution" or "end" decided upon to relieve the stress she's dealing with.  My wife has always made very emotionally driven choices based upon stressful circumstances instead of standing her ground and trying to make RATIONAL, RESPONSIBLE decisions that allow her to remain where she is... .remain committed.  Instead, it's as if she's constantly weighing things against each other... .which ultimately leads her to choose which thing she should make priority.  If she ever finds herself in a situation where everyone in her life may judge her for her decisions, then she will decide which of those people are "white" and which ones are "black" based upon which ones provide the most "comfort zone" for them.  In my case, her husband is unemployed, her family and adult children need her resources, which put the needs of her marriage and the needs of her adult children in direct conflict.  Either way she chooses, someone close to her is going to think negatively about her.  So, she chooses what gives her the most comfort zone.  She devalues and discards the "fat,ugly loser" husband and runs back to mom and dad's house to live with her parents and 2 of her adult children so that she can have less financial burden and focus all of her resources on her family and children.  But, in order to do that, she had to somehow make a husband who was actually being a pretty good husband under the circumstances look like a bad guy she could blame.  In the process of creating her "narrative" she has to stick to in order to get to the "end" she has chosen, she has to devalue, abuse, manipulate and generate conflicts that she can use to blame, devalue and discard.  I literally did NOTHING to trigger her except being unemployed, which, at the time, was beyond my control.  :)oes what I've explained make sense?