BPD as Muse

[Insom]

Some artists use the word "muse" to describe someone who inspires them to create.  A muse can be male or female.  While there is very often an erotic or romantic connection between artist and muse, there doesn't have to be.  A muse can be someone whose style attracted you when you saw him or her on the street.  A muse can be a friend or someone else you meet who captures your imagination to a degree that you want to explore what they're sparking in you.

When I think back to my relationship with my ex with BPD, in many regards he was a muse.  There was an aspect of the relationship that felt unreal, like it transcended day-to-day reality.  The idealization phase felt intoxicating, maybe even healing.  I felt like he saw qualities in me that I aspired to but didn't think I possessed.  That felt compelling.  He inspired me to reach for goals that I'd kept hidden but that resided deep down.  So, even though the relationship was abusive, I learned (and continue to learn!) so much about who I am from the experience that I don't regret it happened.

I don't want to romanticize BPD because I know the diagnosis is very serious, painful and problematic on so many levels.  But what I'm learning by exploring my own problems is that sometimes problematic things like BPD relationships can have destructive aspects and also push you forward in your development as a human at the same time.   

Can anyone relate with what I mean?

[The Cat in d Hat]

I understand what your talking about. I was already great at all the things she admired about me, and while we were talking, I actually pushed myself even harder to make those qualities even better. I studied more, worked out more, got better at my art hobby even.

I even said this to her, “You inspire me, and I apparently cause you anxiety”. (I didn’t know what triggers and devaluation was at the time).

She was definitely inspiring, when she wasn’t eventually  trying to tear me down that is.

[Insom]

Hi, Cat! 

She was definitely inspiring, when she wasn’t eventually  trying to tear me down that is.

Yes, I can relate with feeling encouraged and put down simultaneously.  Alas, it's only recently I've been able to put two and two together and understand that this is also how I feel in a relationship with a narcissistic family member.  I wonder if I hadn't met my BPD-ex - if it would have taken me a lot longer to become aware that I also have problems in my family of origin.  He helped me become more aware. 

It is complicated. 

[Harley Quinn]

Great topic Insom!  

Yes I can wholly relate.  I would happily go through all of the disruption, chaos, pain, abuse,trauma and destruction again in order to learn what I have about myself and to propel myself forwards in the ways that I have.  Very much as Cat has said, I did rise up to his idealisation at the outset too and that was in many ways positive, both in my relationship with my son and my own realisations of the qualities I possess which make me who I am.  These are things I can be proud of and also work harder to nurture and protect.  Although he was over the top, he recognised me and that in itself was healing, as you express it, after being in a long term r/s where I was largely feeling as though I no longer existed.

I believe the personal growth that can arise from going through a BPD r/s is known as the gift of BPD.  It certainly does put a different slant on things, doesn't it?

Love and light x

[once removed]

But what I'm learning by exploring my own problems is that sometimes problematic things like BPD relationships can have destructive aspects and also push you forward in your development as a human at the same time.   

Can anyone relate with what I mean?

yes. i look at it as a gateway. i dont necessarily attribute it to my ex, or to BPD. but the experience (more so than anything else i can think of) led me here, and it taught me a lot about psychology, human nature, and relationships, and im still learning.

one caveat though, is that before it, i had a tendency to flirt with and chase destructive paths/muses, at least partly in order to "grow". i dont do that anymore.

[heartandwhole]

Interesting question, Insom!

I must say that during our relationship, I was more creative and felt inspired. PwBPD supported that and urged me on. In that sense, I think he was a kind of muse for me.

heartandwhole

[Jeffree]

I experienced mine as the one person who always seemed to touch me in the most primal ways.

The first time I ever saw her I was awestruck. I was 13. Later that day, she would become the first girl I ever asked out. Turned out she was 15 and had an 18 year old BF. I figured as much, but I couldn't help myself from asking.

I kept wondering what it must be like to be able to enjoy the company of such a beautiful, sexy woman.

30 years later we reunited on FB and she liked me back.

It was as though time never passed and that she was THE ONE for me always, only we had to live much more life for it to happen.

But, yes, Insom, mine was the face (and body) that launched 1,000 ships within me.

J

[Insom]

Hi, HQ!

I believe the personal growth that can arise from going through a BPD r/s is known as the gift of BPD.  It certainly does put a different slant on things, doesn't it?

This is my first time hearing the phrase, gift of BPD.  I like it.  While I don't want to minimize anyone's suffering (including my own) I am more grateful than not that my relationship with BPD-ex happened.  There was something about the moment of the relationship, the timing of it, the extremity of it, that was catalyzing for me.

I love your gateway analogy, once removed.

one caveat though, is that before it, i had a tendency to flirt with and chase destructive paths/muses, at least partly in order to "grow". i dont do that anymore.

Yes, I hear that.  A friend who is a nurse once told me that whatever your issue is, it'll keep coming at you, louder and louder, until you finally are able to address it.  She was talking about physical illness, but it's an idea that maps onto mind and spirit as well.  It sounds like you've learned well!

heartandwhole:

during our relationship, I was more creative and felt inspired. PwBPD supported that and urged me on. In that sense, I think he was a kind of muse for me.

Again, I don't want to romanticize abuse, but yes!  I can relate with this.  When I left my relationship with BPD-ex I went through a long phase of thinking it was all bad.  That he was bad.  That the relationship was wrong.  It's only more recently that I'm allowing myself a more complex memory where good and bad can co-exist and not feel in conflict.

Jeffree:

30 years later we reunited on FB and she liked me back.

It was as though time never passed and that she was THE ONE for me always, only we had to live much more life for it to happen.

Yes! I think many here can relate with what it feels like to have that kind of connection.  Your choice of the word primal is spot on.  It's so interesting to me how these relationships can touch us in ways that feel beyond reason. 

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Insom,

I don't find abuse conducive to creativity!

No, I wouldn't describe my BPDxW as my muse.  She was too insecure to be inspiring.

When we were dating, she tore up one of my watercolors in a rage.  That was one of many red flags  that I chose to ignore!

LuckyJim

[Insom]

When we were dating, she tore up one of my watercolors in a rage. 

Oh, no, Lucky Jim!  I'm sorry that happened.  And I agree, abuse isn't conducive to creativity.  How did that feel, to have your creative output torn up?

[Lucky Jim]

Thanks for asking, Insom.  I felt angry about her wanton destruction of my artwork, yet back then I was good at submerging my feelings, sad to say.  I didn't know myself well enough to pay attention to my feelings.  You could say that I was in a sort of trance as a result of being in a BPD r/s.  Now I'm getting angry feelings in the present, which I will let pass thorough me!

LuckyJim

[rj47]

Can anyone relate with what I mean?

A twist on it in my case. My BPDw would regularly encourage and build me up, then shred me without mercy. However, she did inspire me to be a better man. I was determined to outlast the demon, be better, and bring her some measure of happiness and fulfillment. In the end, it was for someone else. I want to be better for different reasons now; for a woman that inspires me every day by her life. If there's a downside its that I don't have the ability for emotional conflict of any kind. Neither of us do after having both spent nearly half a lifetime in despair. The alternative to me is a borderline madness of its own. Did my ex inspire me to evolve into a better man? Quite likely. I still look daily in the mirror telling myself "you ain't so special". Someone thinks I am. Different muse... .similar outcome. At least I hope so.

[Sirnut]

Can anyone relate with what I mean?

Yes, in my case it was a musical partnership, more intense and vibrant than any I’ve experienced.

[icky]

Some artists use the word "muse" to describe someone who inspires them to create.  A muse can be male or female.  While there is very often an erotic or romantic connection between artist and muse, there doesn't have to be.  A muse can be someone whose style attracted you when you saw him or her on the street.  A muse can be a friend or someone else you meet who captures your imagination to a degree that you want to explore what they're sparking in you.

When I think back to my relationship with my ex with BPD, in many regards he was a muse.  There was an aspect of the relationship that felt unreal, like it transcended day-to-day reality.  The idealization phase felt intoxicating, maybe even healing.  I felt like he saw qualities in me that I aspired to but didn't think I possessed.  That felt compelling.  He inspired me to reach for goals that I'd kept hidden but that resided deep down.  So, even though the relationship was abusive, I learned (and continue to learn!) so much about who I am from the experience that I don't regret it happened.

I don't want to romanticize BPD because I know the diagnosis is very serious, painful and problematic on so many levels.  But what I'm learning by exploring my own problems is that sometimes problematic things like BPD relationships can have destructive aspects and also push you forward in your development as a human at the same time.   

Can anyone relate with what I mean?

Yes, I agree with this.
It was a once in a lifetime experience.
It changed who I am forever, in a positive way too.
It wasn't "healthy", so I won't be repeating it.
But it made me *transcend* myself.
I do a lot of art too, and I think this BPD relationship will be a source of inspiration (good/ bad/ strange) for decades to come.
I am lucky I was with a "quiet" subtype BPD. So apart from abrupt, toxic emotional abandonment and toxic silent treatment, I was spared the horrors and abusiveness that many here have gone through.
In some ways the relationship was like being with an alien of sorts - someone who is "not from this world".
Amazing, transcendent, but not very healthy.

[icky]

Oh and THANK YOU for asking about this.

I'd kind of "lost" this under all the pain, sorrow, disappointment and abusiveness.

I was feeling "wrong" to subtly miss this transcendent stuff. It felt like I was somehow twisted to be missing elements of something that had been so unhealthy overall.

You've worded it in a way that reminds me that it was there, that it was unnatural, but that is was an amazing experience that has shaped me as a person.

It just wasn't *a relationship*, which I'd have preferred. It was *an experience*.

I am going to print out this thread. Because it was a *huge* part of the BPD experience for me. So this is a big deal in terms of me understanding this and growing past/ beyond it.

[icky]

Some here have mentioned that the idealisation phase made them rise up to it and be even better at stuff they were already good at. I agree with that.

In an even more meaningful way, that phase made me be *MORE ME* than I have ever been in my entire life. I blossomed and grew into being the most me, the fullest potential, the most myself I have ever been in the universe.

I have never felt more real, more alive, more everything-that-I-am.

It's loopy to realise that was based on false-adoration and the mirroring of someone who needed to attach to me to survive emotionally.

But the experience itself was intense, healing, transcendent, incredible.


Due to all this, I also let him into the very core of me, into every single part of my soul.
I've let him see me in every possible way, on every possible level. I let him see my soul bare and naked.
It's like he touched every single cell in my body, caressed each and everyone of them and I allowed him to leave his trace there.

That is also an amazing experience in and of itself. To have opened up so unreservedly to someone. It's something I never, ever expected to happen "in this lifetime" or "in this universe".

[icky]

I experienced mine as the one person who always seemed to touch me in the most primal ways.

The first time I ever saw her I was awestruck. I was 13. Later that day, she would become the first girl I ever asked out. Turned out she was 15 and had an 18 year old BF. I figured as much, but I couldn't help myself from asking.

I kept wondering what it must be like to be able to enjoy the company of such a beautiful, sexy woman.

30 years later we reunited on FB and she liked me back.

It was as though time never passed and that she was THE ONE for me always, only we had to live much more life for it to happen.

But, yes, Insom, mine was the face (and body) that launched 1,000 ships within me.

J

Wow.
You just told my story with my BPDex.
Haha.
I met him at school at 12 and was awestruck.
And we got back in touch via email at 40.
And I was still awestruck. All those years.

[Jeffree]

Icky,

So sorry for the unhappy end of your once in a lifetime pwBPD, but I am sure it's for the best.

Your reply to my response here reminds me of the one fortuitous dynamic of my marriage to my STBx, I never completely lost myself in it.

There were certainly moments where it did happen and could have happened in a bigger way, like when she wanted me to move out West instead of she moving East with her kids and pets. I had moved four times for my ex wife and wasn't uprooting myself again. Plus, she was originally from the East and still had lots of family and friends here and wasn't working, so I won out.

Despite being with the woman who so completely connected to my innermost being, I kept myself as tethered to reality as I could given who I was with.

Yeah, I wound up losing two very good paying jobs and am bankrupt in the aftermath, but those are superficialities that can be recovered. My mental health and spice for life are still intact.

I really can't say how I managed that, given her disposition, but luckily I was a fully formed man when we reunited. If this happened for my first rodeo, I shudder to think how I would have been impacted.

You sound as though you're well on your way to recovering from yours, too. 

J

[Lucky Jim]

Yeah, I wound up losing two very good paying jobs and am bankrupt in the aftermath, but those are superficialities that can be recovered. My mental health and spice for life are still intact.

Nicely said, Jeffree.  Like you, I lost virtually everything of material value in my marriage to and subsequent divorce from my BPDxW.  Yet I don't regard it as a total loss because it was worth it for me to bail out of an abusive relationship.  Plus, I still retain the important stuff: warm relationships with family and close friends; the capacity to love in a healthy, respectful way; my intellect; my appreciation for nature; my musical and artistic talents; my physical health; and, most importantly, my overall happiness.

Perhaps others have experienced similar financial setbacks in exchange for freedom from a BPD r/s?

LJ

P.S. Sorry, Insom, to divert this thread temporarily.

[Insom]

rj47:

My BPDw would regularly encourage and build me up, then shred me without mercy.

Yes, I can relate to this.  Alas, the line for me between abuse and encouragement is a fine one.  In an ideal world, encouragement always feels great, but for me it is more complicated and I have often experienced encouragement and disparagement side by side.

Lucky Jim:

I felt angry about her wanton destruction of my artwork, yet back then I was good at submerging my feelings, sad to say.  I didn't know myself well enough to pay attention to my feelings.  You could say that I was in a sort of trance as a result of being in a BPD r/s.  Now I'm getting angry feelings in the present, which I will let pass thorough me!

Thank you for underlining the role anger can play in helping understand transgression.  Understanding anger and letting is pass through is something I'm working on!  I haven't always recognized emotional abuse when it has happened to me.  Understanding anger helps. 

Sirnut:

Yes, in my case it was a musical partnership, more intense and vibrant than any I’ve experienced.

I hear you.  Were you able to take anything you learned in that partnership and apply it moving forward?  Or did the relationship feel like a singular event?

Icky:

I'd kind of "lost" this under all the pain, sorrow, disappointment and abusiveness.

Yes, I can relate with this.  I had to get angry to leave the relationship and a for a long time that's all I allowed myself to feel (for my own protection), either anger, betrayal or a vaguely negative nothingness.  It's only recently, as I seek to more fully heal, that I'm able to see the good parts, what I liked about him and what he catalyzed for me.   I think I'm looking for a middle, more real place  between idealization and degradation where I can ultimately file these memories. 


 Lucky Jim/Jeffree:

I wound up losing two very good paying jobs and am bankrupt in the aftermath, but those are superficialities that can be recovered. My mental health and spice for life are still intact.

Perhaps others have experienced similar financial setbacks in exchange for freedom from a BPD r/s?

Interesting question.

Since my relationship happened when I was very young there were no setbacks because there were no assets to lose.  Though I can see how this could be an issue especially for primary breadwinners. 

[Sirnut]

Thanks for asking about me Insom

We had something special, there was a kind of magic to it like we were musical soul mates. I’m pretty sure it’s ended now in drama and tears. But I can still say she helped me to grow and develop my skills. These are things that will stay with me for sure.

[kfry2679]

When I think back to my relationship with my ex with BPD, in many regards he was a muse.  There was an aspect of the relationship that felt unreal, like it transcended day-to-day reality.  The idealization phase felt intoxicating, maybe even healing.  I felt like he saw qualities in me that I aspired to but didn't think I possessed.  That felt compelling.  He inspired me to reach for goals that I'd kept hidden but that resided deep down.  So, even though the relationship was abusive, I learned (and continue to learn!) so much about who I am from the experience that I don't regret it happened.

I don't want to romanticize BPD because I know the diagnosis is very serious, painful and problematic on so many levels.  But what I'm learning by exploring my own problems is that sometimes problematic things like BPD relationships can have destructive aspects and also push you forward in your development as a human at the same time.   

Can anyone relate with what I mean?

I completely relate to this. I think part of it, for me, is that my relationship with her expanded my emotional experiences in so many ways (on both ends of the spectrum) so now, when I write, I can describe things with more color than I used to.

She spent so much time in the beginning telling me everything she found amazing about me that I think I internalized those as beliefs about myself. We had talked about going somewhere for me to try stand-up comedy and she was completely gung ho and supportive about it. Even though the relationship disintegrated before we did this, a couple of weeks ago, I did stand-up for the first time and loved it.

I described her as a muse, too, and I don't think it's romanticizing it; it can just be part of the experience.