The No-Win situation

[inthemiddle1]

Hi everyone,

I’m here to present another problem! I know this is an extremely common problem within every BPD relationship, but I need some guidance on how to use the tools and lessons on here in order to learn how to better deal with this situation. I’d greatly appreciate someone pointing me in the right direction and giving some advice on what they do when presented with this kind of situation.

I work with my dBPDbf and occasionally he will have bad days where he believes everyone is being off with him and doesn’t want to speak to him, etc. I’m a naturally optimistic person and tend to see the good in people. Therefore whenever my boyfriend presents this situation I try and give him comfort by saying to him that it’s probably nothing to do with him and more their own problems that are then coming out in their attitudes towards him. Originally this did provide him comfort but recently he’s accuses me of not caring about his feeling when I say this and that I’m not validating his feelings or presenting the situation like it is not reality and that he’s making it all up in his head.

However, I feel like the only alternative to this situation is to tell him it is completely real and that people are being weird with him (I can’t say this isn’t true because I’m not around for all my colleagues interactions around him). I don’t know what that would achieve anyway? I know he would turn around and tell me ‘great! What’s been said around work about me?’ And would cause him to be even more paranoid and isolate himself further.

He’s now frustrated at me, but it just seems like a no win situation for me either way he’s going to be upset and I hate seeing him like this!

Any advice or pointers would be much appreciated!

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[once removed]

im not BPD, but i do have days like that. im sure we all do, but i can get pretty down about it, where every interaction seems to reinforce that everyone is being off with me, i can get downright self loathing, i withdraw, and then i usually wake up the next day and the world feels very different (better). im aware of this as it goes on. in your partners case, feelings can become facts.

there are a lot of ways to address this. you know him best, and whats more likely to land. i dont know if validation is necessarily the most effective tool here, and/or its not the only one.

i would start off with listening with empathy (https://bpdfamily.com/content/listen-with-empathy), perhaps asking questions, and sympathizing. a genuine, heartfelt "im sorry youre having a bad day" and a hug can go a long way. i know on those days, i can be pretty needy, need my hand held, and i need patience. a few extra spoonfuls of love can go a long way. sometimes "tomorrow will be a better day" can help, sometimes it can be invalidating or feel dismissive.

it may be some trial and error, and there may be nothing that "works" every time; odds are you cant just fix it for him when it comes up or get him to snap out of it. you certainly dont want to argue with him about it. but listen to what hes saying, which at the end of the day is that he just wants his feelings to be acknowledged, and hes not really looking for perspective (feels its presenting the situation like it is not reality).

[Speck]

Hello, inthemiddle1!

He’s now frustrated at me, but it just seems like a no win situation for me either way he’s going to be upset and I hate seeing him like this!

Any advice or pointers would be much appreciated!

I know it can be very frustrating to communicate with someone who suffers from BPD. Even so, I just have to applaud you for being willing to continue to put forth effort into understanding your SO. In my opinion, that's true love. It sounds like you are really interested in utilizing the tools and lessons in order to be a better partner to your SO, and that speaks to your maturity and kindness. As you know, there are many, many articles related to bettering your relationship with the angle of using healthy communication techniques (SET), setting needed boundaries, and validating what is valid. I, myself, needed to re-read them a couple of times, in order for them to sink in.

I like what once removed says about using empathetic listening. This technique really can go a LONG way in helping your boyfriend feel heard.

Please feel free to pop in anytime to tell us how you're doing. We can help you with questions, point you in the direction of additional resources, or just be a sounding board. I wish you much success in trying to communicate better with your boyfriend.

Keep writing, keep processing, keep learning... .


-Speck

[BasementDweller]

You can try to use the basic validation tool that can often diffuse most low level issues where the person isn't feeling great but isn't raging.

Sometimes my dBPDbf can feel that way too, and while we do not work together, he sometimes comes home and tells me about colleagues or clients who have been rude to him. I suspect he may be misreading it sometimes, though it may also be true sometimes. I really have no way of assessing since I wasn't there to observe.

What has worked for me in the past is something like this:

Him: "I had a sh!t day at work! My boss was rude all day, and some client gave me a bunch of attitude for no reason."

Me: "Oh, I'm sorry to hear that! I totally understand how that could make your day sh!tty! Do you want to talk about what happened?"

Him: "The boss was surly and dismissive and I tried to help a client and she yelled at me." (It could be anything - which may or may not be entirely how it went down.)

Me: "That sounds like a tough day. I would also be upset if I knew I was working hard and doing my best, and feeling like nobody appreciated it. That is so frustrating, isn't it?"

This way you are validating what he says he feels/observes, but at the same time you are not agreeing that these people were actually being rude intentionally. (Or at all.) But he knows you heard him, and can empathize with how frustrating it would be if that were the case. This typically works with my BF, and sometimes I can even make him feel better while commiserating a bit. "It seems like the whole world is stressed these days. I agree that when my colleagues are being negative it can really put a damper on the day!"

There could be a bit of your bf feeling like his colleagues are "against him" and he wants you to rescue him a bit. When you suggest that they may not have meant to be rude (it's a well meaning gesture and normally works fine on non-disordered thinkers) it seems like you do not want to support him. (To him. We here know you do want to support him.) By validating his feelings without blaming the other people at the job, you are comforting him and hearing him without confirming it's "their fault". I used to do the same. Try to reassure him by saying "Maybe he/she didn't mean it like that." It didn't work because it made him feel like I was "against him" too. But the validation/empathy tool really works well. :-)

[isilme]

Hi there.  Yes, telling him his feelings are wrong IS invalidating, but you are not stuck having to agree with something you don't perceive yourself.

It's a bit tricky to avoid validating the invalid, and many times a lot of us do just that to keep the peace.  

My H does the same thing, likes to claim he has no friends, no one likes him, etc.  And at times, given the situation, I will ignore the comments to avoid engaging in a conversation about the invalid, I will hazard to correct him or add to the statement (you have friends but you've been ill and so they have left you in peace and you can contact them to go to dinner if you want when you feel better), or I try what I find to be the hardest - "I know it's terrible to feel like no one likes you.  What would you like someone to do to show you otherwise/would you like to invite people over for a game night/movie night to see them but also not stress your health too much?"

I also look for an underlying trigger/cause.  He gets like this sometimes when he feels HE upset someone and it trying to turn it around to not be his fault.  Or, when he's lonely and they have been busy, so he feels left out.  Seeing a pattern, seeing that even if he is complaining about A, he might really be upset because of B, helps me not focus on A so much, but on the actual underlying emotions.  They will blow up over things that seem small, because it's really not that small thing triggering it.  That was just the easiest thing to latch onto.    

If you can share some examples of conversations, members on here might be able to show you variations of how to say things to go from being accidentally invalidating to communicating what you intend.

[inthemiddle1]

Hi onceremoved

a genuine, heartfelt "im sorry youre having a bad day" and a hug can go a long way. i know on those days, i can be pretty needy, need my hand held, and i need patience. a few extra spoonfuls of love can go a long way. sometimes "tomorrow will be a better day" can help, sometimes it can be invalidating or feel dismissive.

I try and do this but I feel like he just pushes me away! I know this is his defence mechanism kicking in, but then when I do give him space he feels like I don't care!

Yes, telling him his feelings are wrong IS invalidating, but you are not stuck having to agree with something you don't perceive yourself.

It's a bit tricky to avoid validating the invalid, and many times a lot of us do just that to keep the peace. 

I can't think of any example conversations, but I can definitely see that the way I deal with the way he's feeling can be somewhat dismissive, even if I am not doing it intentionally.

I will try reading all the tools here and re-read my 'walking on eggshells' book and hopefully I can start learning and applying.

There could be a bit of your bf feeling like his colleagues are "against him" and he wants you to rescue him a bit. When you suggest that they may not have meant to be rude (it's a well meaning gesture and normally works fine on non-disordered thinkers) it seems like you do not want to support him. (To him. We here know you do want to support him.) By validating his feelings without blaming the other people at the job, you are comforting him and hearing him without confirming it's "their fault". I used to do the same. Try to reassure him by saying "Maybe he/she didn't mean it like that." It didn't work because it made him feel like I was "against him" too. But the validation/empathy tool really works well. :-)

BasementDweller, this is exactly the problem! I apply my normal way of thinking and acting as though he was a normal thinker and actor! Thanks for the reply, it's nice to know that I am not alone in my way of doing things, but obviously need and can change given time.

[BasementDweller]

You definitely aren't alone, and I think this is one of the big reasons it is hard to have a relationship with a pwBPD... .and why these things escalate so fast and far. We apply logic in a situation where the other person sincerely can't grasp that their feelings are not facts, and us not seeing things as they do is not a personal attack.

I have found when I apply the validation tool, "I can understand why that's upsetting. It's very frustrating when you don't feel appreciated by your colleagues... ." it kind of doesn't give my partner much ammo to argue against, and also soothes him a bit.

The problem is when I am also on edge and I forget myself and invalidate.   Working on that. Well that, and just exiting if he's really wound up and being hostile. Those moments are getting less frequent, thankfully.