Timing..,who’s on first and where?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Hi everyone,

Wentworth suggested I post here today, that several of you were very knowledgeable about the decision I am trying to make. Here’s a link to my last thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=323519.msg12968323#lastPost

I am in one state, away from friends and family, and my parents are in another. 16 hours drive. My parents are in their mid 70’s. I would like to be allowed to go home to be with them, with my S5. The law in my state, where I currently reside, where S5 was born, says I cannot move more than 59.9 miles from our current residence and share joint custody. That law will prevent me from moving back where I’m from. (No, not military, I met him online and married him and moved here to be with him).

S5 has special needs. I would like to homeschool him. My bachelors degree is music education. I taught school for nearly 10 years, but stopped just before I married my husband. I let my certification expire. I cannot go back to work professionally, without more schooling. My uBPDh refuses to pay for that, but he couldn’t stop the government from giving me loans for my masters degree. I will be done spring of 2020.

I have to do a 9 month internship, unpaid, to graduate. Without graduating, I’ll owe the government $50k without the professional  career to repay it. My uBPDh May let me do it in my parents state. If so, I can regain residential status in that state, file there, and possibly avoid the 59.9 mike rule.

Another horrible law in my state, we have to be married for 10 years for me to receive retirement alimony. Without making it to the 10 year mark, I’m only allowed 3 years of rehabilitation alimony. That’s a big difference financially. I haven’t workedd since 2009.

The law t recently changed in my state, to permit judges to use their discretion about awarding lifetime alimony. But my attorney says, they can, but since there’s no legal precedent, it won’t happen.

My uBPDh is escalating, in a major way. I think he is trying to get me to file first. So that he can claim victim status, not make it to the 10 year mark. Since we are church people, that also gives him clearance to remarry with ththe churches blessing.

I am headed to my parents next week. He is escalating. I don’t want him to file here while I’m there. That would be bad I want to make it to the end of my long term plan.

The latest today is, he had our S5 40 feet up in our oak tree, no harness, just for fun. Our S5 is missing on hand. He could have died. There is a history of dangerous parenting with him, but this is the worst.

Thoughts? Advice? I record him with an audio recorder. I kee notes in my phone, by date of incidents. It would take some doing to compile it.

Dig

[Dignity&Strength]

Hi everyone,

Wentworth suggested I post here today, that several of you were very knowledgeable about the decision I am trying to make. Here’s a link to my last thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=323519.msg12968323#lastPost

I am in one state, away from friends and family, and my parents are in another. 16 hours drive. My parents are in their mid 70’s. I would like to be allowed to go home to be with them, with my S5. The law in my state, where I currently reside, where S5 was born, says I cannot move more than 59.9 miles from our current residence and share joint custody. That law will prevent me from moving back where I’m from. (No, not military, I met him online and married him and moved here to be with him).

S5 has special needs. I would like to homeschool him. My bachelors degree is music education. I taught school for nearly 10 years, but stopped just before I married my husband. I let my certification expire. I cannot go back to work professionally, without more schooling. My uBPDh refuses to pay for that, but he couldn’t stop the government from giving me loans for my masters degree. I will be done spring of 2020.

I have to do a 9 month internship, unpaid, to graduate. Without graduating, I’ll owe the government $50k without the professional  career to repay it. My uBPDh May let me do it in my parents state. If so, I can regain residential status in that state, file there, and possibly avoid the 59.9 mike rule.

Another horrible law in my state, we have to be married for 10 years for me to receive retirement alimony. Without making it to the 10 year mark, I’m only allowed 3 years of rehabilitation alimony. That’s a big difference financially. I haven’t workedd since 2009.

The law t recently changed in my state, to permit judges to use their discretion about awarding lifetime alimony. But my attorney says, they can, but since there’s no legal precedent, it won’t happen.

My uBPDh is escalating, in a major way. I think he is trying to get me to file first. So that he can claim victim status, not make it to the 10 year mark. Since we are church people, that also gives him clearance to remarry with ththe churches blessing.

I am headed to my parents next week. He is escalating. I don’t want him to file here while I’m there. That would be bad I want to make it to the end of my long term plan.

The latest today is, he had our S5 40 feet up in our oak tree, no harness, just for fun. Our S5 is missing on hand. He could have died. There is a history of dangerous parenting with him, but this is the worst.

Thoughts? Advice? I record him with an audio recorder. I kee notes in my phone, by date of incidents. It would take some doing to compile it.

Dig

[Radcliff]

Dig,

Can you please explain "retirement alimony?"  Does that just start after you are 65, or is it something that starts right away?

Is your phone backed up to the cloud?  Is the passcode secure from him?

Have you read, "Splitting," by Bill Eddy?

Does your state measure the 10 years as of the date of separation, the date of filing for divorce, or the date of divorce finalization?  I don't know about how that works.  It'd be nice if it was divorce finalization, since you can drag that out.  But I suspect that would be too good to be true.

WW

[Turkish]

Normally my initial response would be,  "what's best for your child vis-a-vis keeping the other parent more in the child's life."

I climbed trees like that and worse... .when I was an early teen. 

Can you summarize the history of dangerous parenting for this board?

[Dignity&Strength]

Hi WW, Turkish,

I’ll try to explain a little more. Retirement alimony is significant here because my husband works for the railroad. It’s really lifetime alimony, I think, which includes part of his railroad retirement. Guaranteed substantial monthly payments for the rest of my life.

The dangerous parenting... .let’s see if I can recall some incidents. A big one was the day of the solar eclipse. I couldn’t get viewing glasses, and had planned on staying inside, and watching it on tv. I didn’t know until the day of the eclipse that my husband would be home. When I realized he would be there, I discussed my plan to stay inside and not go out, and asked if he would agree to that, and not take our son out without glasses. Our son was 3 or 4 at the time. But when it actually started happening, he changed his mind. He wanted to take our son out to look at it, with no protective eyewear. I had to literally sit in the living room floor holding onto my son, preventing him from going out with his dad. In his defense, my husband says he wasn’t going to let him look up at it, but really, that involves my little boy obeying. At that age, he doesn’t obey 100%, and still doesn’t. So he was going to put his eyesight in danger if I hadn’t resort s to extreme prevention.

Other issues probably sound like parenting differences. My husband has a food and body image issue. So, I can’t count on my son not going hungry if I let daddy feed him. My husband refuses to let our son feed himself, and insists on feeding him one bite at a time while he plays, instead of sitting down and letting him feed himself. The food choice issue is, my husband leans towards all boiled vegetables. Little meat and tidbits if any of starch. So, typical kid fare of Mac and cheese, or cereal, my husband frequently denies him. I find that without grains and such, S5  ends up hungry.

Playing in the woods and stream where there are poisonous snakes in the summertime. I do not mind that in the winter, or if he were older,  but those things are out and plentiful in the summer. Our son is young enough and small enough, if he got bit, it’s likely he wouldn’t survive. One of the neighborhood dogs, a full grown golden retriever, weighing about the same as my son, didn’t survive a copperhead snake bite there a few summers ago. My husband could choose safer places to play. Last week, my husband and son came back from a walk in the neighborhood, and my son had a snakeskin. My son proudly announced, we’ve been playing in the ditch with the snakes.

The tree thing, I wouldn’t freak out so much if he were a teen, but he’s not. He is five years old and only has one hand that works and has a thumb. If he were to slip, he likely wouldn’t be able to hold on.

The medicine... .a few days ago, I was trying to give my son his medicine before bed. He was sick, and the doctor that day had advised what to give. One was an herbal capsule, that I had given him several times before, with no issues. My son wasn’t afraid to swallow it, until my husband intervened. Then he was scared of it, and I couldn’t give it. My uBPDh literally pushed me away from my son at the kitchen counter and blocked me from giving it. It was an oil of oregano herbal capsule, and is antiviral. Our son had an ear infection. This is significant, because he can only hear out of one ear. Meaning, we have to guard his hearing in the only ear he can hear out of. The ear infection is in his good ear.

Other special needs related medical issues that my son has, my husband doesn’t think the individual plan for our son is necessary. For example, one major issue is, he has the genetic mutation, MTHFR. According to his pediatrician, there is a super strong correlation between that mutation and vaccine injury. So, our son has only received vaccines up to  9 months old. His one year shots, now containing over 13 vaccines at once, could cause permanent brain injury. So, he will not have those. At age 5, he would stand a better chance fighting off measles than surviving the aluminum in the vaccines with his genetic mutation. My husband thinks this is nonsense. There are no pediatricians in our area/state that see patients who are not planning on being fully vaccinated. So, I drive almost 2 hours to near a large US city, where we see an integrated family doctor... .like Dr. Oz, on tv. The cost is comparable to an emergency room visit. But the level of care he receives, and their knowledge of his special needs, especially the MTHFR, is a fortunate blessing for us. My husband agrees sometimes, and at the beginning, but now that he wants to divorce, he wants to deny our son this amazing doctor. There’s nothing local like it.

There are other incidents, I just need to stop writing for a while, breakfast and morning time here.

One important last thing to mention, I’ve found a good attorney whose son also has special needs, some of them the same as my son. So he gets it. Thank goodness.

Thank you, everyone.
Dig

[Radcliff]

Dig,

Let us know if you've read "Splitting."  If not, you'll want to get a copy very soon.  There is a section on picking a lawyer.  You'll need a special kind of lawyer, someone who is "assertive," which means they can be a courageous advocate for you -- not a pushover but not unecessarily combative...   The book also talks about how the high conflict parent can manipulate the system around things like child custody evaluations, etc.

If you were divorced, what custody and parenting time arrangement would you think would be in the best interests of your son?

I know you want to stay focused on the legal questions on this thread, and I think the folks here can do that, but since we're talking about issues of custody and parenting safety it may be helpful to give folks a little more background.  Things you've said in the past about the toy helicopter, the songs your husband teaches your son, the cats, your missing wallet and challenges to your ability to further your education were examples you've brought up in the past that helped members understand your situation. 

WW

[livednlearned]

Hi Dignity & Strength,

I can identify so much with your story, my heart goes out to you. I'm glad you posted to the legal board -- preparing for and going through a high conflict divorce does require some ingenuity, and people here have walked in your shoes and can share collective wisdom. This board was my superpower during my own high conflict divorce. I waffled around for two years before finding my way here 6 years ago and hope what you learn here will help you in the same ways it did for me.

Wentworth asking you about the book Splitting. Are you able to get a copy? It's available on Amazon Kindle -- I know there are security issues with using Amazon accounts for some folks. Another option, if you have access to a library, is to request interlibrary loan. Or perhaps your parents could order it for themselves and read it, or have a copy for you at their home that you could read.

Bill Eddy, the author, is a former LCSW who was familiar with Axis II Cluster B. He went on to become a family law attorney and wrote a book for spouses trying to divorce someone with a Cluster B personality.

Like you, I was aiming for the 10 year mark. And like you, I was in graduate school while raising a young child (now 16). My son was recently diagnosed/labeled high-functioning autism and had a lot of sensory processing issues that my ex refused to "indulge," which created a lot of anxiety for our son (and me). Ex also would punish our dog to get to me, and moved my purse and keys, then accused me of being a space cadet.

Similar to your story, my ex also threatened to file for divorce, but then would flip back and focus on "improving" the relationship through controlling measures, like talking about taking away credit cards or access to joint accounts. He both wanted me to get my degree, and also wanted me to give it up. He liked when my career was successful, then would become utterly enraged by any positive attention that came my way.

You did a really good job describing the rock and a hard place you're in, with the 10 year mark on one hand, and the 60-mile joint custody law.

It sounds like you have consulted with a lawyer, but have not retained him?

When you consulted, with him, did he suggest filing for joint custody?

My ex was a former trial attorney and he inflicted a lot of damage on me financially and legally. Even so, I ended up with full custody of my son. It took a long time, probably longer than most because my ex could represent himself at no cost. I saw no other way than to do what was best for my son. It's the most powerful thing I've ever done and it helped me grow a titanium backbone.

You're not alone. Others are here to walk with you on this path.

 

LnL

[ForeverDad]

Does your state measure the 10 years as of the date of separation, the date of filing for divorce, or the date of divorce finalization?  I don't know about how that works.  It'd be nice if it was divorce finalization, since you can drag that out.  But I suspect that would be too good to be true.

While I don't know my state's law, I was married about 15.5 years when we separated and the final divorce decree was two days after our 18th anniversary.  Alimony was based on 18 years.  Another indication that the determining date might be the final decree is that you can't cancel the other's health insurance during a divorce but must be ended soon after the final decree.  Ask your lawyer how your state and its agencies handle the requirements for alimony and retirement benefits.  Probably best to confirm that with a second opinion.

I think bringing a 5 year old high up in a tree without safeguards would be considered endangering but I'm no authority.  If push came to shove, so to speak, how could it be proved?  In general, poor parenting behaviors can be considered 'actionable' if there is substantive child abuse, neglect or endangerment.

Another factor to consider is timing.  If he did this last week and you reported it you might get attention.  If this was 10 months ago and you report it only now, it might be considered 'stale' or not urgent.

As for filing in another state, I believe the USA has standardized residency for child custody issues as requiring 6 months before you can file.  Can you reside in the other state for that long without him filing first?

Another question, How determined will he be to parent?  Is he an involved parent now?  Right now he may be inclined to fight, perhaps to look good in the paperwork or thinking he can reduce child support payments.  Do you think he will lose interest over time and fade into the parenting background?

[Dignity&Strength]

Wow everyone, thank you so much! I feel like the calvary has arrived! You are all so knowledgeable and well spoken. It makes me feel like I’m in better company than in my own home. Bless you.

I was able to get the kindle copy of splitting. Fortunately, access to my amazon, Paypal, etc., he does not have. Purse strings that control the money funding them, yes. But, he is fairly gullible, and a smal purchcase like that can easily be something for S5 in the bank statement. It’s really hard to read without it pushing my panic buttons. Deep breaths. I think that means my learning may be a tad ahead of the circumstances. That’s good maybe. I read thinking, surely this won’t happen. But, that’s wishful thinking. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. That’s gotten me through some tough calls over the years.

6 months of living in a state before filing first, that’s true of where I’m from and where I hope to return. It’s a guessing game. I hope he will allow me to go there to for my internship. I hope he doesn’t file before I am there 6 months. I hope I can file first there.

However, he is running out of control measures to tighten the reigns on. Each time I go home to my parents, he ups the anty. I wonder what elements are remaining, that he may choose to do before moving out and filing for separation? Regarding the pets, Already, he’s made the cat disappear for a few weeks one trip, and half poison him another. Regarding legal matters, he’s changed the executor or his will to exclude me, yet I remain the sole beneficiary. Another trip, he rerouted half of his paycheck to an account I don’t have access to.

Let’s see, some threats he hasn’t made good on... .1) upping his retirement contributions so there’s less money each paycheck. 2) upping the amount going into his account and only leaving me an “allowance” for groceries and other needs. 3) seeing/hiring an attorney 4) moving out 5) killing himself? Nah, he only joked about  that twice before. Surely not. ?
A friend warned me, he could pay off my van, get the note from the bank and have my name taken off the title... .pawn the title and not pay it, I’d have it repossessed somewhere in town and stranded... .? Geez. Sometimes I wonder if all this is truly real.

I need to pause, and I’ll and give details about the list wentworth mentioned filling you al in on. I’ll be back shortly.

[Dignity&Strength]

 Hi everyone, this is from WW’s comment, to fill you in on the issues:

I know you want to stay focused on the legal questions on this thread, and I think the folks here can do that, but since we're talking about issues of custody and parenting safety it may be helpful to give folks a little more background.  Things you've said in the past about the toy helicopter, the songs your husband teaches your son, the cats, your missing wallet and challenges to your ability to further your education were examples you've brought up in the past that helped members understand your situation.

 

My husband IS going to fight to be an involved and active dad and may even file for sole custody, even though his job puts him away from home most of the time. Our son would then end up at my in laws full time while my husband keeps on call out of town hours.

This is bad. But I can see it coming. My father in law... .I know for a fact, he showered with his sons, their whole life, way past when they were little and that wasn’t appropriate. My husband and his brother, as grown men, shower together and sleep in  the same bed when they are back together at their parents. They are in their 40’s now. This leads to some of my husband’s behaviors in our marriage:

He isn’t interested in me, and told me so the day after our wedding. (I know, I should have had it annulled) He is obsessed with his body, keeping it the same size he was in high school. This means, he is restricts food and over exercises. These behaviors are indicative that my husband is likely an adult male survivor of sexual abuse. This is the level of dysfunction that has me in turmoil over the possibility of joint custody. I wouldn’t be allowed in my in laws house anymore. I wouldn’t be able to prevent this from happening to my son. And I can’t prove that it happened to my husband. And if I say anything about it in the legal arena, it makes me look hysterical and paranoid.

My husband’s other issues look mostly like oppositional defiant disorder, antisocial personality disorder, and some borderline/narcissism. All covert, controlled, and done with maliscious intent. This leads to the events WW mentions:

My husband doesn’t want my son to be happy with me or love me at all. He only wants him to love him. This is where the toy helicopter I gave my son for his 5th birthday comes in. My husband broke it, right after I gave it to him, while I was away from the house for a short meeting about our son’s kindergarten next year. My husband used the remote and crashed it over and over, from the floor to the ceiling, my son says. Along these lines, if I buy my son anything while we are out on errands, it makes my husband livid. He threatens to reduce the amount of money I have access to. So, we hide little toys in the van, and my son is only allowed to play with them when my husband is gone to work.

Covert lying, stealing, hiding things, twisting and denying his actions and words to me... .ugh. This one is hard. I’ve been wearing a small flash drive size recorder for several years now. This hopefully will help prove I am telling the truth.

He stole my wallet recently, with my entire safety plan hidden inside... keys, band cards, etc. that’s blown over and I was able to give reasons they were there.

The songs he has taught my son to sing... .are really messages to me, that are really veiled threats on my life. So, I sleep with Christmas sleigh bells, real ones, on my bedroom door. And a small runners glove with mace under my pillow.

So, flash drive recorder pinned in one bra strap and a key to my storage unit  that my parents pay for) in the other. When he’s really scary, I wear a concealed travel pack around my chest, under my clothes,  with a small spare cell phone, house key, van key, and $100 bill.

If you want to look them up, the songs he’s taught S5, there ar 3 so far:
1) the walrus and the carpenter, from Alicenin Wonderland. It’s a poem, where thebwalrus talks some oysters out of the water by promising them a grand life, and when they have followed him, he kills them and eats them. Which is, by the way, a metaphor that mirrors how my husband and I met- online, and he talked me out of my hometown, and into a life with him. Just before the walrus eats the oysters, he says “the time has come”. That’s the part my H loves for my son to recite.

2) I’m so cute, a song by Frank Zappa. Basically, he’s so cute and all the ugly fat oeople need to drink cyanide and die. My husband taught my son to sing one line and the chorus; “he’s sweet as honey, as a piece of cake”, and “a re nen nen, a ren nen nen ni”, the Chris that rhymes with drink cyanide and die. Scary sh**, that is, and I don’t use that kind of language.

3) Barnacle Bill the sailor, sung by Popeye to Olive Oil. “I’ve changed my mind so you can wed, I’m Barbacle Bill the Sailor; You’re nothing but a cabbage head, I’m barnacle Bill the sailor”

What else? Hm. Ok. My husband has a childhood friend. They have something interesting in common from childhood. He did this to his wife, and has coached my husband to do it to me, I’m sure. The thing they have in common... .the sports team at their private school. There’s a team photo of my husband on my in laws wall; the coach has a creepy look on his face, and his hand on my husband’s shoulder. My husband has an uncomfortable look on his face, and his jersey number had been fixed differently than the rest, with sports tape, so he is singled out in several ways there. My husband’s friend’s dad was the head coach for the sports teams. The creepy coach was just an assistant. So, I’m getting at a Sandusky style sports team situation from my husband’s past, that has yet to be uncovered. One more possible source of sexual abuse my husband may have survived. But I can’t prove it.

The things my husband’s friend may have coached him into doing, I was forewarned by his ex wife, my friend. He would move her keys, hide things, try to make her think she was going crazy. This is like part of your story, LNL. The friend also mailed a “souvenir” from a railroad museum to the house last summer. It was a bandana, printed with hobo symbols, that are common in railroad yards. The center symbol was “target, easy mark” and beside it, “man with a gun”. Across the top of the package, in red permanent marker, he had written, “I know how this will be used”. Interestingly, he wrote the return address as a false name, the name of a company that makes tools, and gave the address of the post office under the tool name. The idea is, to make me panic, go to the police, have them think I am hysterical and paranoid. Like that old Gaslight movie.

Ugh. So, I’ve got to compile all of this, with any evidence I have and email it to my attorneys secretary. I have retained him. He says he won’t charge me until we file, and thinks I should try to make it to the 10 year anniversary. But that was before the incidents the last few weeks.

I can fee my heart sinking, and uncomfortable knots forming in my chest. This is as bad as I think  it is, isn’t it? I need sole custody, with supervised visitation. I need to be able to live 16 hours away from my husband, and get like a camper or something to stay in on summer weeks that my son will have visitation here. That’s what I’m hoping. But golly that’s unrealistic, because all of this chaos, can easily be explained away.

Another crucial procedure, the Latin phrase about the jury resting... .after I’ve oresented and used up all this established pattern of scary behavior, it can’t be used again. So if I initially win, but it gets overturned on an appeal, A new case with new damaging proof of who he is, is highly unlikely I’d be able to get.

Sigh. I just want to pull the covers over my head and pretend it’s not happening. Please tell me it ends eventually. That the losses I’ll suffer won’t hurt that bad, and healing is possible? From what I’ve been reading here, it’s a long process, several years sometimes.

Dig

[Dignity&Strength]

A short note, I apologize for the spelling errors, I’m texting this all out on my phone. The auto correct and tiny letters make this hard! I think you all will understand though.
Dig

[Dignity&Strength]

Here’s a link to a chart that really describes my situation well. There are things my husband does in every category. It has only escalated to physics
Violence, mildly so, a handful of times. Yet he denies even that.
https://www.theduluthmodel.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/PowerandControl.pdf

[livednlearned]

My husband IS going to fight to be an involved and active dad and may even file for sole custody, even though his job puts him away from home most of the time.

He can ask for anything he wants, but in my experience, it's very unusual for a dad to get sole custody, especially when a mom is working just as hard to get the same. In my state, which is one of the least progressive in the country (we still have alienation of affection laws here, where you can sue the "paramour" who seduced your spouse away), it is even hard for a mom to get sole custody in a contested divorce, much less a dad. I have the battle fatigue to show for it  

What really matters here is that your H appears willing to go to the mat, and that's no real surprise knowing there is a personality disorder in play.

Our son would then end up at my in laws full time while my husband keeps on call out of town hours.

There is something called right of first refusal (ROFR) that is designed to prevent a parent from using babysitters when the other parent is available. Can you access or document your husband's schedule? Status quo goes a long way with this stuff. If your husband is away from the house for long periods of time, try to calculate the percentage of time he is away, and if there is irregularity in his away days, then he is in a bit of a one-down position. Two down if you factor in his gender, since courts are typically biased toward moms.

My husband’s other issues look mostly like oppositional defiant disorder, antisocial personality disorder, and some borderline/narcissism. All covert, controlled, and done with maliscious intent.

This is why shining light on the behaviors is helpful. Shining light can happen with a custody evaluation that includes an MMPI-2, which is used to detect pathologies that might impair parenting. Custody evaluations are pretty standard in contested divorces, so it will be interesting to hear what your lawyer's strategy is around this.

I can fee my heart sinking, and uncomfortable knots forming in my chest. This is as bad as I think  it is, isn’t it? I need sole custody, with supervised visitation. I need to be able to live 16 hours away from my husband, and get like a camper or something to stay in on summer weeks that my son will have visitation here. That’s what I’m hoping. But golly that’s unrealistic, because all of this chaos, can easily be explained away.

I say this with tremendous empathy, kindness, and love  

There are many unknowns, that is true. And some you cannot anticipate, including the good and wonderful ones. People who care about you may surprise you, and total strangers could offer small kindnesses that were hard to predict.

One foot in front of the other, big deep breaths, and keep moving forward. Your future is uncertain, but our future is always uncertain. For every catastrophic thought, think of times in your life when something unexpectedly good happened. Good, surprising things can happen now, too.

Plus, there is a technical nature to family law court that is unknown to you at the moment, and it will play a very big part in what happens next. Until you become familiar with that aspect, you will focus on the bits of narrative you have collected.

Parts of that narrative will matter and your lawyer will use it to play chess with the other lawyer, kind of like playing chicken.

Part of the narrative you have now will drop away, and your lawyer will develop a strategy to focus on tactics that are designed to draw dark behaviors to the surface where other people can see them. These newly documented behaviors, together with your evidence, will tell a story. It might not be the exact same story you are telling now, but it will be designed to match as closely as possible, using technical tactics that are used for people exactly like us.

There is a bit of a factory element here with family law. Our stories are deeply important to us, but this is not out of the ordinary for the family law industry. You've been in an abusive relationship for a while and that affects how you think. Once things start moving, you'll get a bit of distance, then some more, and your thinking will change, and you'll get stronger and stronger every day, even when he gets meaner and more dysregulated.

I'm so proud of you for caring about yourself and your son enough to gather up the strength to do this -- you deserve to be free, safe, and loved  

If your husband is like mine, he will have a hard time staying out of his own way. And what is covert behavior to you may be abundantly obvious to someone who sees through him.

I just want to pull the covers over my head and pretend it’s not happening. Please tell me it ends eventually. That the losses I’ll suffer won’t hurt that bad, and healing is possible? From what I’ve been reading here, it’s a long process, several years sometimes.

You have a whole peanut gallery here to help you through the maze  

There will be setbacks and losses, plus gains and surprising wins. The important thing is that you have taken steps to make a plan for yourself. When you are free, a whole world of clear thinking will open up. It won't solve everything, because court works at a glacial pace and things are expensive.

But being free will give you some new cognitive advantages that are a bit dormant right now.

My lawyer told me I would never get sole custody, and I did.

I did that while working full time, going to graduate school, raising a special needs child, and battling it out with a disordered former trial attorney. What you are doing can be done. It will hurt along the way, but if your experience is anything like mine, it will not be any more difficult than what you have already endured, just different.

Be careful and have a plan, of course, and above all, take really good care of yourself, including talking to yourself with respect for who you are, what you've accomplished, how strong you really are. He's already pretty mean to you, so don't be helping him in that department

 

[ForeverDad]

Some of his control/ultimatum threats won't match advice from a lawyer.  For example, his claim to shunt more money to his retirement contributions likely (ask a lawyer) can't be excluded to reduce spousal support or child support calculations.

A general rule of thumb is that you never believe what the acting-out person claims unless it is independently verified.  Don't let the other rent space in your head and especially not rent-free.

As for him trying to convince you're going crazy, watch "Gaslight" (1944, American version).  A more recent movie, if memory serves me, is "Pacific Heights" where a tenant terrorizes a landlord couple with authorities not believing the couple.

[Dignity&Strength]

Ah, thank you, LNL,
Your words are so comforting, like a hug. I am so grateful that you’ve been in my shoes before and to know that a strong woman can make it through. Even with grad school and a special needs child. Goodness. I think I remember interacting on the boards with you befor, because I remember these common elements. Thank you.

There are wonderful nuggets of truth in your post. Some comforting, encouraging, and others make my to do list. I have access to our calendars, with husbofd days, and maybe still his old time book, that lists exactly how much he works and is gone. I need to grab copi s of yhis while I have access to it.

The MMPI2, my last class was on assessment and evaluation. So I’ve seen several mock assessments recently. That’s comforting. What other kinds of pieces go in a parenting evaluation? I hav a friend who is still fighting through this, just finished the evaluations, but haven’t had final court yet. I can ask her too.

I also have a freshly unwrapped copy of the DSM-V, that arrived for my class that started yesterday. That does help shed light on what I’m dealing with. The anorexia and oppositional defiant qualifiers match nearly exactly. It’s the ODD way of thinking and speaking that I’m battling so hard with my S5. I don’t want him to lose his tender heart, but he is oppositional when his dad is around. It takes an hour or so after his dad is gone for work for him to return to himself. But the disagreeable attitude lingers more each time.

Thank goodness for the peanut gallery. What a lifeline. I understand how important  His is for someone like me, who is isolated, alone, and feels helpless. It’s a vehicle to remember my strength. When this is over for me, and I’m an LPC, I’d love to give back by helping people like me on the boards.

Thanks again. I’ll reread your post over and over, I imagine. I remember who I am, and self care is a high priority. He was gone tonight, so I ditched the low key “uniform” for personal choice clothes. That’s, no gray yoga pants and white t shirt, but actual jeans and a shirt with colors and flowers, . It’s amazing what sets him off and what keeps him at bay.
Dig.

[Radcliff]

Dig,

I loved livednlearned's idea to document his time away.  That is brilliant.  Can you pull together such documentation for past months?  :)o you have paper shift schedules?  Access to online information?  Even if not, a contemporaneous journal is powerful.  Get that safely to your lawyer's secretary!  The status quo is a very strong influence.  I also really liked her right of first refusal suggestion.

With the audio recordings, do you have a few gems saved off to the side so you don't have to hunt through years of recordings like Horton hunting through a massive field of clover?  When the time comes, you may be in rough shape.  If you haven't started, definitely save the file with gems in a separate folder.  I have submitted just four videos, and they make 80 pages of journal summaries that much more believable.  But you have to be able to find the gems.

You are in a tight spot, but you are doing amazingly well at using your intellect and grit and love for your son to hold up under this pressure.  You can do this!  We wish for you a life of peace and freedom at the end of all of this.

WW

[livednlearned]

actual jeans and a shirt with colors and flowers, .

I hope you draw strength from those jeans and colorful shirts.  

Have you read Why Does He Do That: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft?

Other things to consider while you prepare to file:

Get a notebook or piece of paper and create two columns, one for you and one for him. List any allegations he might make, then list evidence he might have to back it up, then list any concerns you have for your L. You may want to also have a column for leverage.

Leverage is stuff like what you shared earlier -- he does not want to file first because he will want to remarry in the church.

You might have two versions of this. One for if he files first in your state. The other if you wait things out.

I didn't like doing this kind of thing because it was so hard to think straight and keep my thoughts organized. But it did help me untangle some of his threats from what was real and true. I also never kept this kind of thing where my ex could find it. If you do this, it might be something you keep safely stored at your storage locker.

Another thing you can do with a custody evaluation. Ask around for the three best evaluators. Your clerk of court may be able to recommend the three most competent and reputable ones in your county. When it comes time for the custody evaluation, your L will then offer those three and let your ex pick one. He will want the control, but you (discreetly) will have created the parameters for how he exerts that control.

It may also be a good idea to set deadlines for everything, with consequences. For example, your L tells him he must choose the CE by day/date. If he doesn't by that time, then you get to choose. That's the consequence for him not complying with the deadline. By the same token, tell your L that you don't want him to agree to any extensions without your explicit permission. Sometimes Ls do this for collegial reasons, but extensions can become a tactic for stonewalling and obstruction, a form of negative engagement. If you get a favorable (so-called) temporary order, extensions might help you, but for the most part they don't.

For the custody evaluation, it is different depending on where you live. It could be that you have a psychologist administer the MMPI-2 to both of you, then visit separately in your two different locations, to see how you interact with your child, and how your husband interacts with him. Not all custody evaluations include the MMPI-2. It could just be home visits and interviews. Your county may also rely on guardian ad litems (GAL), who are supposed to represent the needs of the child. I'm not a big fan of using GALs, although I know there are some out there that are wonderful. In my county, a GAL is only required to have a high school education, which is fine. But then they get virtually no training which seems absurd given how much influence they can have in a case. If someone is going to have an opinion on the most personal aspects of my life, and have influence over the most important person in my life, then that person better know what they are doing and have an above average knowledge about personality disorders and child abuse.

This may be putting the cart before the horse -- you are a ways off from needing all this information. I just want you to know there are small tactics that can make a big difference, and even good Ls won't necessarily spot these moves, mostly because they don't feel the pain of our situations quite like we do, so they aren't motivated to curb the low-lying and insidious abusive behaviors that fly under the radar and slow our cases down to a crawl.

I also like Wentworth's suggestion to organize your recordings. You don't want to pay your L for things you can do, so perhaps when you have the time, try to make it easy for your L to find different kinds of abuse you want to call attention to. Maybe even transcribe the most hair-raising bits.

I had three-ring binders with emails that I sorted into four categories and labeled them. I flagged the emails that were the most troubling. My L took notes before a deposition we did, and referred to only a handful of emails. But she also brought the binders into the meeting and set them down on the table. That part is theater -- she wanted the opposing L to see that we had truck loads of evidence. My ex, the former trial attorney, came to the meeting with a yellow file folder with two pieces of paper in it. One was my son's medical records with vaccinations going back to his first birthday. I have no idea why, especially since he had never once been to the doctor with me and the records sort of brought attention to that fact. Who knows -- this is why I say disordered people can really get in their own way. Not to mention the binders of emails I had with me were sent by my attorney ex himself, who (you would think) would know better than to create a trail of evidence.  

Last thought for now. One of the things you are paying your L for is knowledge of the judge, and his or her tendencies, for lack of a better word. My judge was known to be an old school Southerner judge who expected gentlemanly behavior. My ex was fond of sending me one word name-calling emails (e.g. whore, slut, you can imagine the rest... .). Both in the deposition and in court, my L would read these emails out loud in court. For the ones that couldn't be said in polite company, she would say exactly that, "I cannot read the rest of these emails aloud in polite company, your honor. And frankly, I am not comfortable reading them, period."

That's the theater part.

I hope this isn't too much information   

I took comfort in knowing how things work, and information helped me settle some of the dread and anxiety I felt. If that isn't how things are for you, just say the word and I can dial things back 

[Radcliff]

One of the things I did that took a ton of work, but has been very impactful, is to summarize my journals.  I made a section heading for each tactic she used, such as assault, sabotaging my parenting, verbal abuse of me, verbal abuse of me in front of the children, denial of transportation, trapping me in a room, homicidal threats, other threats, etc.  Under each heading I had a bullet list of each thing, with the date it happened in parentheses.  You can also reorganize this list in another document by timeline, with a heading for each month.  It's helpful to show the tactics and that you have many examples for each one -- it makes it look like the broad attack on your liberties and parenting that it is.  It's helpful to have the timeline view because it will show that your experience was continuous and all-pervasive.  Your organized and articulate mind is a powerful weapon.  You won't likely get a judge to read all of this, but a thorough evaluator may.  It will also give you the foundation from which to make more brief summaries or powerful narratives of just a few pages that a judge will actually read.  It will give you the material and the confidence to write compelling narratives.  It will greatly multiply the chances that you'll be believed, and help reduce any anxiety you may feel abot not being believed.

Perhapse this is a project for when you are visiting your parents?  I will caution that this can be a gut-wrenching experience.  I was thrown for a loop when I saw in one place all that had happened.  It is a good thing to do when you have support nearby.  If you do it with him nearby, telltale signs of indignance or vulnerability on your part may cause trouble.

WW

[Dignity&Strength]

Hi everyone,

This is all very helpful, as you are shedding light into the unknown.  I am planning on putting together files of the gems. There is an audio file of those gems, and as of a couple of weeks ago, I need to glean through the recordings and export the most recent few.

I can put those together away from my husband. I do my best work at the coffee shop here, with headphones. It IS extremely disturbing emotionally to see it all at once. I’ve tried before... .it does make me vulnerable to panic attack sort of breathing almost.

I can do some at my parents. It’s a good place where I’m supported. Interestingly, I get overwhelmed just being there with them. The contrast of the safety of my childhood home and bedroom, with all of my childhood toys to what I’m living in is stark.  It’s like I don’t realize how bad it is until I’m truly safe.

I can make separate files, with incidents by topic and timeline. The power and control diagram I linked earlier, I am hoping to write a paper, with references to proof, divided by section by pie slice of that diagram. Also, there’s a significant distinction between proving he’s a danger to me verses our son. 2 separate notebooks there.
Ah he’s here!
Gotta run
Dig

[Dignity&Strength]

Really quickly,
 One last thing I’m struggling with, is detaching from my house, with all the built in cabinets I’ve made myself, in the garage, with my dad’s woodworking tools. This place is my dream. But he is a nightmare. I’m certain this is a topic for the detaching thread. But how do you detach from all the work you put into making the house of your dreams? As for the legal aspect of this problem I’m having with the house, has anybody been able to keep theirs as their own?
Dig

[Dignity&Strength]

Whew, that was close.

Thank you everyone,

Your posts are making my to do lists. I will go back and make sure I haven’t missed any suggestion. Timeline format, shows continuous and all pervasive. Yes. All of this is becoming clearer how to begin.  The 2 column idea of what allegations he might make, with any evidence he may have and a column with how I might refute it, and anything that might be leverage.

I’m climbing the learning curve with your help.
Bless you all,
Dig

[ForeverDad]

One last thing I’m struggling with, is detaching from my house, with all the built in cabinets I’ve made myself, in the garage, with my dad’s woodworking tools. This place is my dream. But he is a nightmare. I’m certain this is a topic for the detaching thread. But how do you detach from all the work you put into making the house of your dreams? As for the legal aspect of this problem I’m having with the house, has anybody been able to keep theirs as their own?

Let's split it into the legal and emotional aspects.

Legally... .Your state probably has laws that impact what is feasible and what is not.  Is the deed in his name or both names, then it can be a bit complicated.

How about the mortgage?  If you're on the mortgage, you can't risk letting him keep the house unless he refinances.  Imagine giving him a quit claim deed but he fails to refinance as the divorce settlement requires.  Sadly, courts are okay with making decisions or getting them put on paper but too often horrible on enforcing them.  Similarly, if you want the house (and can afford it) then he must sign over a quit claim deed if he currently is joint owner.  How to get him to comply?  Often in a divorce each spouse gets something from the other.  Make sure he doesn't get what he wants — that's your Leverage — until you or your lawyer have his quit claim deed.

Emotionally... .Sometimes you have to accept reality and Let Go.  Is the house one of those things to Let Go?  Only you can decide that, ponder the various factors.  If there is marital equity, can you afford to buy his equity out?  Can you afford a new mortgage?  Or would it be better for it to be sold and make a clean restart elsewhere?  You can always make new cabinets, right?

Many people in divorce feel a powerful urge to hold on to the home.  (And some of them years later regret holding on, too.)  Sometimes they think the child would do better not moving.  But children are so adaptable.  Home is where you and they live, not a particular building.  Many functional families move.  Moves occur millions of times every year across the world.  Life goes on.

[Radcliff]

Dig,

I was going to mention that I had two documents, one for stuff relevant to parenting, and the other for abuse just focused at me, but I was trying to keep my reply briefer.  I'm not surprised you did two documents as well!  I ended up handing both over to the evaluator, but I think it was very important to make her job easy so she could focus on the parenting document.  Including the other document in a respectful way (separately) almost makes it more likely that the evaluator will consider it as background info.

Regarding the house, I appreciated ForeverDad's thoughts.  Aren't you thinking it's most likely that you'll move back to your home state?  If so, then is it more of a grieving process for the house than a decision process?  Perhaps reframe your thoughts on the cabinets (no pun intended  ).  You built them for yourself, but most craftsmen let go of much of what they build when they sell or give it to others.  For these craftsmen, they are continually letting go.  As long as she has her tools, a craftsman can build again, and better!  Do you have tools you could bring with you to your parents' under the guise of returning/loaning tools to your father so he can do a project?  Get the most important/special tools to safety even if you have to leave the cabinets

WW

[Panda39]

I had three-ring binders with emails that I sorted into four categories and labeled them. I flagged the emails that were the most troubling. My L took notes before a deposition we did, and referred to only a handful of emails. But she also brought the binders into the meeting and set them down on the table. That part is theater -- she wanted the opposing L to see that we had truck loads of evidence. My ex, the former trial attorney, came to the meeting with a yellow file folder with two pieces of paper in it. One was my son's medical records with vaccinations going back to his first birthday. I have no idea why, especially since he had never once been to the doctor with me and the records sort of brought attention to that fact. Who knows -- this is why I say disordered people can really get in their own way. Not to mention the binders of emails I had with me were sent by my attorney ex himself, who (you would think) would know better than to create a trail of evidence.  

I just wanted to chime in. My SO ended up with a binder full of documentation that he took to his divorce trial. (he called it the "book of doom"  )  He broke it down into the things his ex was neglecting to do for their daughters each section had a summary sheet on top and documentation behind that. 

At the beginning of their separation his uBPDxw had primary custody of their daughters, my SO had every other weekend and Wednesday night dinner.

An example of what went into one of the tabs in his binder... .

At one point their younger daughter got a toothache mom scheduled a dentist appointment and failed to make it, she rescheduled and again missed the appointment, then she decided to go to a different dentist scheduled an appointment and you guessed it didn't show, then she rescheduled again and so it went.  All of this was in email communication along with my SO's offers to take his daughter. This went on for 3 months... .the poor kid had a toothache for 3 months!... .my SO finally found a dentist open on the weekend and got her seen.  Using the emails he was able to document neglect. This only one example he had a 3 inch binder! (By the way my SO came out of his divorce with Medical, Dental, and Education decision-making and over 50% custody of his daughters - M-F and one weekend a month... .your results might vary

I'm sure there are many ways to categorize things use what makes sense to you, but I think it does help to break things down so you can focus on smaller chunks and not get completely overwhelmed.

Take Care, 
Panda39

[Dignity&Strength]

Hi everyone,
I’ve been absent while things around me have escalated. I think I caught my s5’s ear infection and mono. So I’m tired. Really tired.

I think as long as the divorce isn’t final before my 10 year anniversary, I’ll get retirement alimony. There has been a collection of escalating incidents, that include significant risky parenting on his part. Tree climbing, playing in the ditch with snakes, climbing up in the attic in the heat of the day, AND, most recently, my S5 telling me he can’t play with out puppies because daddy told him he’d whip him if he did, when I wasn’t around to see it. I was wearing my recorder,  it I’ve got to download it and see if it is audible. Add to the list threats if I keep the puppies and the cat gone missing. I may have it recorded that he tells me he didn’t give me permission to bring that cat home, followed by my asking him if he had anything to do with it disappearing. Followed by him cussing at me. Add to that he prevented me from giving S5 his medicine one night with the ear infection.

So... with this recent collection of dangers, I can reasonably file for D due to domestic violence and child endangerment. If I leave for my parents in the morning, and stay until mid July, my husband will file first, citing irreconcilable differences.

The million dollar question. Is this the time fo file em and run? Clean the house out? Beat him to it? It’s happeniy eventually. Who goes first and why seems crucial.
Dig


So,

[Dignity&Strength]

Hey, Forever Dad,

I reread your advice about the house. You’re right about the emotional aspect l, spot on. The deed is written in both names, with the phrase, “asking as our lives are joined together” Or something like that. The mortgage is solely I. His name. I haven’t worked since we got married, 9 years and 3 months ago.
He pays all the bills out of a separate account that I don’t have access to. We still have enough to live on after that, but not enough for groceries, gas AND an apartment for him.

I wish I knew for certain that my lawyer could get me home to my parents. He just any guarantee it. It’s logical, but the judges around here tend to favor dads. Something about the Bible Belt and men being head of house, women being submissive.

I wish I knew if my lawyer could drag things out until the second week in March, letting me Teach the 10 year mark.

I wish I knew what things my husband says is scary threats and which ones he means.
The not knowing all the facts to make a decision is confusing.

Dig

[ForeverDad]

Wow, dictation typos or autocorrect are having a field day with you.  Don't worry, we get it okay.

Strange how we usually want the legal stuff over quickly and the other person is the one dragging things out.  You have a child to care for, it's okay to be the one wanting to reach that landmark but safely.

Typical things that happen leading up to a separation... .Mementos and other things that you care about can go missing.  It's smart to get them to a safe place.  Same for deeds, titles, birth certificates, passports, insurance details, retirement, bank & credit account numbers, etc.

General advice is that half of any joint accounts is yours.  If he works and you don't then you may choose to secure more than your half.  He may squawk but the worst to happen is that when the financial details are thrashed out, usually at the end of a divorce, the extra you took may need to be included in the marital financial split.  It may not even come up as an issue by then and especially if you can document the extra was used for your child's care.

[Panda39]

You might try talking to someone at your local domestic violence shelter regarding tips for a safe exit.  His comments to your son are concerning.

Panda39

[Dignity&Strength]

Wow, dictation typos or autocorrect are having a field day with you.  :)on't worry, we get it okay. hug-

Hi!
Goodness. Sorry about that! I’m glad you get it... .typing with thumbs on a phone in moments when he is out of the room for the moment!
Dig

[Dignity&Strength]

Hi Panda,
My friends at the shelter advise to be careful how I leave S5 alone with him. Also, that a recording of S5 repeating what daddy says to him when I’m not there, sounds like I coerced him into saying it while I recorded it; it doesn’t carry the significance of a recording of my husband actually saying it to him. So, things like that, I’m in trouble either way... .trouble if I leave due to those hearsay statements and potential trouble if I don’t, since I have a hint of danger. I’m in a state where spamming is legal though. I’d have to have photos of excessive spamming, after he had done it (which hasn’t happened). Geez. The system is very broken. So, I make sure I’m here to protect s5. We really could use a new bill, new legislation or something to help with tight spots like this, make it possible to exit safely and be believed.
Dig

[livednlearned]

I think as long as the divorce isn’t final before my 10 year anniversary, I’ll get retirement alimony.

This seems like a really important thing to know for certain.

Divorce is a process, marked by a series of legal procedures. Some things you may want to confirm:

Is the 10-year anniversary a fixed date, or is there a grace period.
Are there circumstances for which the 10-year anniversary date can be waived
If he files between now and the anniversary date, what will that mean financially for you (and legally)

Plus:

What parts of the divorce process matter in terms of the 10-year anniversary. Is it when you file? Or is it when the actual divorce decree is granted?

In my state, there is a one-year separation period before the divorce can be granted. That divorce decree is almost a formality in a high-conflict divorce because there are many other legal milestones, like filing the complaint, getting the temp order signed by a judge, getting the permanent order, and all kinds of other things that can drag a custody battle and financial settlement out for years.

Try to not negotiate with yourself about this stuff -- there is a technical aspect to law that can inform your strategy.

And I know it's really really hard, but try to see pros and cons of things that aren't borne out in fact. Yes, it might be a Bible Belt county where men are considered head of household, etc. But that might also mean a judge thinks it's H's responsibility to split his retirement alimony for life to support his child, or at least until you remarry. If there is wiggle room to the anniversary date, that's an important thing to know.

Feeling sick, being worried about your safety, your son's safety, being in graduate school, trying to live with a dangerous person -- it's hard to think straight about things that feel so high stakes, so my heart goes out to you. I remember well how it feels to be in your position, and we're here for you.

When is the next time you can talk to your L, and do you have questions you need answered before you can make a big decision?