[First Post] She only showed me 20%

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Buckle up, y'all, this will be a novella.

I've been with C for 2.5 years next week, since I was 38 and she was 43, and we've definitely had our ups and downs.  She disclosed her (self-)diagnosis early, on date #2 (more on that in a bit).  One of the things that got her to message me was that we were both comic dorks; it's pretty hard to tell a woman that the original Ant-Man is your favorite superhero and not talk about your own history of depression disorder and self-destructive behavior (I have never been on either side of domestic violence, but flushed a full scholarship to a major U because of undiagnosed chronic depression right before the late-90s rehab of the character and identified strongly with him).  She laughed a little, and disclosed that she had BPD and bipolar 2, and most of the date ended up being conversation about our struggles.  I'm legally blind and awkward as hell, didn't have more than 2 dates in a year til I was 35 and my longest relationship was 4mo, so someone actually being excited to be with me was a huge deal.

I told my therapist, and he told me to be very careful, and I was.  She did a lot of idealizing behavior early on but I kind of brushed past it; she told me she loved me six weeks into our dating, the second time we had sex.  She called me the best thing that had happened to her and said I made it easier not to self-harm. 

She was a lot more self-aware and in-control than other PWBPD I had known, to the point that I thought her self-diagnosis (the BP2 is pro diagnosed, the BPD is not) might be wrong; she had developed coping mechanisms for the risk behavior (she literally will not leave a store until she logs anything she spends on her spreadsheet because she had to fight her way out of $75k in debt in her early 30s), she did DBT in front of me when she caught herself losing it, she told me that she wasn't emotionally capable of monogamy but didn't expect it from me, and that her long-standing friend with benefits helped her avoid sexual risk behavior. (I say I don't know if I can do that but I'll try and consider it m fault if I can't, not hers. I learn quickly that monogamy is take-or-leave for me. I can, but don't need it.) Aside from the standard new-romance euphoria, I never saw her split me or anyone else.  And when I researched, I made the mistake of looking at a Reddit forum populated entirely by people who were victims of horrible abuse by PWBPD, who talked about their exes and family members as though they were subhuman.  I walked away, didn't look anything else up.

This lasted for a long time; the highs were high, the lows were more obviously about self-loathing than my failings, and the average was pretty good aside from her highly cyclical sex drive.  That was the first real problem; after about 9 months of dating, she went into a state of frequent depression and dissociation. I'd try to get her to bed, she'd push back because she wasn't in the mood, rinse and repeat.  After six weeks I stopped trying, and she decided I had lost interest and started to resent me.  She said she needed me to proactively show desire and she shouldn't have to start. It complicated things that I have to take ED meds; she felt pressured if we planned sex, and I didn't want to take pills that cost $40/dose without being assured that she wasn't going to push me away after 30 seconds of kissing and say it just wasn't working and get crabby.  This lasted about three months; she came out of it in the spring and I could barely keep up for a while.  I never took advantage of the open nature of our relationship; when she'd go away with #2 to a con a couple times a year I'd get on Tinder or okcupid as a time killer, but when she came home, I'd drop it. Since I wasn't willing to put in the work to find a stable secondary partner, nothing ever came of it.

The two things that really bothered me were her angry driving and the way that, if I triggered her, she'd go radio silent for days.  When I went to Dragon Con 2016 by myself, I promised her a phone call and it slipped my mind until about 20 minutes before her bed time.  She stopped reading my Google Hangouts texts entirely for 48 hours. There were 3-4 more incidents of that over 2 years, most lasted a day. The angry driving was almost background radiation; it wasn't "get out of the car and start a fight with people" road rage, but every car that didn't do one hundred percent what she wanted would start a tirade.  Every woman driver was the gender slur that starts with C, every man was a stupid (insert your favorite combination of animal and sex act, and a word for poo, here).  A few times she handed me her phone with a route mapped, and asked me to give her turn directions; she stopped when she realized my disability made that unfeasible and she was screaming at ME.  So Google voice directions from then on.

One thing that was weird but didn't bother me at the time was the way she dealt with her lack of identity.  She doesn't have dissociative identity disorder, but she does treat all her fragmented sub-selves as individuals orbiting a null space, collaborating to be the person in front of me.  (This will be important later)  A few  have names, most don't.  When traits she doesn't like were presenting, later she'd say things like "I hate her and I hate it when she tries to talk to you."  She didn't really mirror (though I noticed she was a lot less interested in Doctor Who after we'd been dating for 6mo), but she embraced the fact that she wasn't the same person day to day.

Things continued this way for a long time.  The only real aberration was Dragon Con 2017, which she attended with me.  She really wanted to go, but when we got there it felt like she wasn't having any fun.  The crowds freaked her out, most of the stuff I was most excited about interested her way less than tabletop gaming (which didn't interest me), and getting lost gave her panic attacks.  For those who don't know anything about Dragon Con, it's not held in a traditional convention center.  It's spread out over 5 hotels in downtown Atlanta. It's one of the few events that attracts Hollywood people, comic book people, literary sci-fi legends and people from tabletop and video games.  It's MASSIVE and for probably half of the people it's less a traditional science fiction con than a 4-day drunken bender with cosplay, Goth bands and autographs. 

Constantly running from one hotel to another meant a lot of trying to remember where we needed to turn, and my usual method of navigation in a place with overloaded cell towers is "When I see landmark X I need to turn around or try to connect to Google Maps" whereas she'd have an anxiety attack if I took us around 4 sides of a building.  We'd never really traveled together before, and this was a trial by fire.  It didn't help that because she didn't decide she wanted to come with me until all the con hotels were sold out, and she refused to share a suite with the 4 friends I'd been camping with for a decade, we had to stay a 30-minute train ride away. 

Saturday morning, I tried to initiate foreplay and she said "I'm sorry, I guess this isn't gonna be that kind of vacation."  Saturday night, we got pretty blitzed in my friends' suite at the Sheraton and left to catch the last train to the hotel.  It was very dark, and on the way she tripped. She caught herself on her hands and was fine, but the physical jolt was enough to flip a switch in her. Immediately she started berating me in a voice I'd never heard before, talking about how a good boyfriend would keep her safe, a good boyfriend would never hear this voice, how miserable and small I was to let her get hurt.  I was terrified and drunk, so I started screaming back at her as we walked. When we got to the train the screaming stopped. I tried to get her a seat on the train by gently explaining that I'm disabled and entitled to ask someone else to move. They did, but she refused to take the seat... .so I did too. It was humiliating, and she whispered the same insults in my ear the whole trip back.  As soon as we got to our room, they stopped.  She was safe, and so she was fine.  The next day she apologized for mistreating me. The rest of the weekend was reasonably fun if uneventful; a couple days later she asked me why we had 4 nights in a hotel and no sex. I reminded her of what she'd said.

We had another cycle of "I don't want to be touched why don't you want sex anymore are you going to dump me?" In the meantime, I actually had someone who wanted to meet me off Tinder but she was looking for a same-day date and possible sex, which wasn't happening.  I told T about it a week or so later because when it happened she was out of pocket and I forgot, and she seemed surprised and betrayed.  I'd told her I was playing with it like a slot machine, I'd told her stories about bots trying to catfish me onto scam sites. I didn't understand why this required newer, upfront disclosure and she didn't understand how I could keep this secret. 

We fell into low-level sexual dysfunction but reached a pact that I would try to rev her every time and save meds for overnights, so we could at least make out if she was up. On our 2nd anniversary she said she didn't believe me as proactive, I was making moves like someone who didn't care about her as long as I got laid. It made her not want me. Her solution was to put her in charge. But heavy roleplay stuff. I had to call her godess, ask before masturbating, be total sub. Not my scene but I'm switch enough to try it.  Worked great for 3 months, then another dry spell. She's dissociating and every kiss feels gross. But now ED med is $3/dose instead of $40 and not to be hoarded. So I take it every time we see each other, and start poking at online dating again.  I tell her.

Meanwhile friends intro me to L. L is older than me but not C, a single mom, a teacher as I almost was. She lives in my neighborhood (C doesn't, and doesn't want to cohab after an abusive marriage) and gives me rides to friend-group parties when C is with her #2. We have good convo, I crush on her a little but interpret her complaints about dating to mean she is not someone I should ask out.  C is Suicide Girl Hot, L is Cheerleader Hot. I'm a big fan of both looks, but C has lots of self-image issues and so L set off her Spider-Sense. We only hang out 3-4 times in six months, but comment on each other's facebook.

May 5. C is doing an RPG con (not my thing) with her #2. My dad's supposed to come but cancels last min. I accept an invite for dinner and karaoke with a group including L (who knows I'm seeing someone but not that we're non-mono and has never met C), who drives me. She takes a pic of us that looks like a Date Selfie, and C's jealousy and abandonment go into overdrive.  She decides L is trying to take me away and doesn't respect boundaries and it's all she can talk about for days.  She requests promise to tell her before I initiate convo with an online match, tell her within 24h of any unexpected happenings.  The next day I tell her a Tinder match from weeks ago finally responded to my overture. She's 40, open marriage, plus size, Asian. Non-threatening to C's stated issues.  She tells me she's not 100% on board but is rounding up.  She makes it very clear that any romantic or sex activity with anyone else needs to be cleared in advance and she won't fight another woman over me or anyone. (meanwhile, she gets mad at me for rounding up to yes for "are you okay?" at a ren fair that was overwhelming me and saying 'yes' instead of 'not now but I will be in 10min'.

The night before my date with K, I get invited to L's last-min birthday thing.

THIS IS WHERE YOU STOP LIKING ME

C has already told me she's sick and staying in that night. I ask if, should my date with K go short, it's ok to see friends including L. Cuz I'm dumb I don't say "L's bday." She asks if she can come, I say sure, but she doesn't. Date with K is clearly a courtesy date; it's obv within 15m she's not interested and she leaves after 2 drinks with vague promises of talking Mon. I go to the party, and L promptly tags me (alone as she'd prev tagged the other ppl) and C shuts down as I try to make her laugh.  L gets gigadrunk and tries to make out with me, I push her off and say we're both too drunk. It's scary. I learn later someone'd told the group I was on a date and that my LTR was non-mono (about half had known before). I want to make very clear that I have no defense for this. I really did betray her trust.

Next day I see C. She asks me about K date, I tell her in detail. She asks about party, I tell her. She gets mad, then gets over it, then escalates in loop.  Tells me I can't take care of anyone but me, tells me I acted almost specifically to spike paranoia/FoA. Accuses me of other lies I didn't tell, of having settled and making plans to run away as soon as "my type" was on the table, of having betrayed her for a fantasy I knew would be bad for me. I offer to leave, she laughs at me. Compares me to overtly emotionally abusive ex-husband who riled her to fuel his martyr complex. And then the really brutal bombs:

I can adult just fine if it's only me but freak out if asked to shepherd anyone else

I never really loved her and just wanted sex, I would never have msgd her first, I don't value her

I am a gaslighting abuser just like exh

She FB stalked L and anyone who has so many posts set public is an attention whore

Girls who look like that get anything they want and so they don't think rules and boundaries apply

BPD paranoia and an artist's imagination mean her brain's been an endless theater of me cheating on her

The BIG one: My tone and facial language are incredibly hurtful at least once every time we are together, and has left her afraid to show the faces I haven't already seen.  "How can you say you love me when I've only ever shown you 15% of me? You'll lash out at the rest like you lash out at the easy parts." Previously she's pushed back on tone when she was already upset about something else, but never given any inkling that I was inadvertantly sharp if we weren't already fighting.  And I'm that way with everyone, but most people aren't PWBPD who are so deeply wounded. I try to do better but often need to be told because I don't realize how I look or sound.

Over 5 hours, we fight and make up probably 3 times.  Now, I'm as lost and broken as her. I've wounded her every time we've spoken for this long and she NEVER told me? I've destroyed her trust thru my selfishness, sent her into a self-harm cycle for 1st time since we started dating, why the heck would she say "love isn't enough to stay together" and then insist she wants to give me another chance?

She works from home 3 days a week so aside from work yesterday, she hasn't had to leave the house. She cancelled all her social obligations, didn't bathe, and when we gamed after work today L was still the only thing she could discuss. (I haven't spoken to L since the party; she kind of freaked me out. Having your 'safe' friend wordlessly turn to you, grab you and try to stick her tongue down your throat at 1am is not hot to me).  I feel like a monster, both because I betrayed her and because the result was her being so socially and emotionally paralyzed that she cancelled on once-in-a-lifetime events rather than leave the house.

I'm still in love with her, the bad parts and the good. But I'm scared that if she's really locked down her BPD so much in the past that the "bad parts" were this hidden, and they've shaken me this badly, we might be toxic to each other.  Scared that one day she'll show me her REAL Black Bug Room, and I'll chicken out and break her for good.  I don't know what's kinder for her or for me.

[Spaceweasel]

Buckle up, y'all, this will be a novella.

I've been with C for 2.5 years next week, since I was 38 and she was 43, and we've definitely had our ups and downs.  She disclosed her (self-)diagnosis early, on date #2 (more on that in a bit).  One of the things that got her to message me was that we were both comic dorks; it's pretty hard to tell a woman that the original Ant-Man is your favorite superhero and not talk about your own history of depression disorder and self-destructive behavior (I have never been on either side of domestic violence, but flushed a full scholarship to a major U because of undiagnosed chronic depression right before the late-90s rehab of the character and identified strongly with him).  She laughed a little, and disclosed that she had BPD and bipolar 2, and most of the date ended up being conversation about our struggles.  I'm legally blind and awkward as hell, didn't have more than 2 dates in a year til I was 35 and my longest relationship was 4mo, so someone actually being excited to be with me was a huge deal.

I told my therapist, and he told me to be very careful, and I was.  She did a lot of idealizing behavior early on but I kind of brushed past it; she told me she loved me six weeks into our dating, the second time we had sex.  She called me the best thing that had happened to her and said I made it easier not to self-harm. 

She was a lot more self-aware and in-control than other PWBPD I had known, to the point that I thought her self-diagnosis (the BP2 is pro diagnosed, the BPD is not) might be wrong; she had developed coping mechanisms for the risk behavior (she literally will not leave a store until she logs anything she spends on her spreadsheet because she had to fight her way out of $75k in debt in her early 30s), she did DBT in front of me when she caught herself losing it, she told me that she wasn't emotionally capable of monogamy but didn't expect it from me, and that her long-standing friend with benefits helped her avoid sexual risk behavior. (I say I don't know if I can do that but I'll try and consider it m fault if I can't, not hers. I learn quickly that monogamy is take-or-leave for me. I can, but don't need it.) Aside from the standard new-romance euphoria, I never saw her split me or anyone else.  And when I researched, I made the mistake of looking at a Reddit forum populated entirely by people who were victims of horrible abuse by PWBPD, who talked about their exes and family members as though they were subhuman.  I walked away, didn't look anything else up.

This lasted for a long time; the highs were high, the lows were more obviously about self-loathing than my failings, and the average was pretty good aside from her highly cyclical sex drive.  That was the first real problem; after about 9 months of dating, she went into a state of frequent depression and dissociation. I'd try to get her to bed, she'd push back because she wasn't in the mood, rinse and repeat.  After six weeks I stopped trying, and she decided I had lost interest and started to resent me.  She said she needed me to proactively show desire and she shouldn't have to start. It complicated things that I have to take ED meds; she felt pressured if we planned sex, and I didn't want to take pills that cost $40/dose without being assured that she wasn't going to push me away after 30 seconds of kissing and say it just wasn't working and get crabby.  This lasted about three months; she came out of it in the spring and I could barely keep up for a while.  I never took advantage of the open nature of our relationship; when she'd go away with #2 to a con a couple times a year I'd get on Tinder or okcupid as a time killer, but when she came home, I'd drop it. Since I wasn't willing to put in the work to find a stable secondary partner, nothing ever came of it.

The two things that really bothered me were her angry driving and the way that, if I triggered her, she'd go radio silent for days.  When I went to Dragon Con 2016 by myself, I promised her a phone call and it slipped my mind until about 20 minutes before her bed time.  She stopped reading my Google Hangouts texts entirely for 48 hours. There were 3-4 more incidents of that over 2 years, most lasted a day. The angry driving was almost background radiation; it wasn't "get out of the car and start a fight with people" road rage, but every car that didn't do one hundred percent what she wanted would start a tirade.  Every woman driver was the gender slur that starts with C, every man was a stupid (insert your favorite combination of animal and sex act, and a word for poo, here).  A few times she handed me her phone with a route mapped, and asked me to give her turn directions; she stopped when she realized my disability made that unfeasible and she was screaming at ME.  So Google voice directions from then on.

One thing that was weird but didn't bother me at the time was the way she dealt with her lack of identity.  She doesn't have dissociative identity disorder, but she does treat all her fragmented sub-selves as individuals orbiting a null space, collaborating to be the person in front of me.  (This will be important later)  A few  have names, most don't.  When traits she doesn't like were presenting, later she'd say things like "I hate her and I hate it when she tries to talk to you."  She didn't really mirror (though I noticed she was a lot less interested in Doctor Who after we'd been dating for 6mo), but she embraced the fact that she wasn't the same person day to day.

Things continued this way for a long time.  The only real aberration was Dragon Con 2017, which she attended with me.  She really wanted to go, but when we got there it felt like she wasn't having any fun.  The crowds freaked her out, most of the stuff I was most excited about interested her way less than tabletop gaming (which didn't interest me), and getting lost gave her panic attacks.  For those who don't know anything about Dragon Con, it's not held in a traditional convention center.  It's spread out over 5 hotels in downtown Atlanta. It's one of the few events that attracts Hollywood people, comic book people, literary sci-fi legends and people from tabletop and video games.  It's MASSIVE and for probably half of the people it's less a traditional science fiction con than a 4-day drunken bender with cosplay, Goth bands and autographs. 

Constantly running from one hotel to another meant a lot of trying to remember where we needed to turn, and my usual method of navigation in a place with overloaded cell towers is "When I see landmark X I need to turn around or try to connect to Google Maps" whereas she'd have an anxiety attack if I took us around 4 sides of a building.  We'd never really traveled together before, and this was a trial by fire.  It didn't help that because she didn't decide she wanted to come with me until all the con hotels were sold out, and she refused to share a suite with the 4 friends I'd been camping with for a decade, we had to stay a 30-minute train ride away. 

Saturday morning, I tried to initiate foreplay and she said "I'm sorry, I guess this isn't gonna be that kind of vacation."  Saturday night, we got pretty blitzed in my friends' suite at the Sheraton and left to catch the last train to the hotel.  It was very dark, and on the way she tripped. She caught herself on her hands and was fine, but the physical jolt was enough to flip a switch in her. Immediately she started berating me in a voice I'd never heard before, talking about how a good boyfriend would keep her safe, a good boyfriend would never hear this voice, how miserable and small I was to let her get hurt.  I was terrified and drunk, so I started screaming back at her as we walked. When we got to the train the screaming stopped. I tried to get her a seat on the train by gently explaining that I'm disabled and entitled to ask someone else to move. They did, but she refused to take the seat... .so I did too. It was humiliating, and she whispered the same insults in my ear the whole trip back.  As soon as we got to our room, they stopped.  She was safe, and so she was fine.  The next day she apologized for mistreating me. The rest of the weekend was reasonably fun if uneventful; a couple days later she asked me why we had 4 nights in a hotel and no sex. I reminded her of what she'd said.

We had another cycle of "I don't want to be touched why don't you want sex anymore are you going to dump me?" In the meantime, I actually had someone who wanted to meet me off Tinder but she was looking for a same-day date and possible sex, which wasn't happening.  I told T about it a week or so later because when it happened she was out of pocket and I forgot, and she seemed surprised and betrayed.  I'd told her I was playing with it like a slot machine, I'd told her stories about bots trying to catfish me onto scam sites. I didn't understand why this required newer, upfront disclosure and she didn't understand how I could keep this secret. 

We fell into low-level sexual dysfunction but reached a pact that I would try to rev her every time and save meds for overnights, so we could at least make out if she was up. On our 2nd anniversary she said she didn't believe me as proactive, I was making moves like someone who didn't care about her as long as I got laid. It made her not want me. Her solution was to put her in charge. But heavy roleplay stuff. I had to call her godess, ask before masturbating, be total sub. Not my scene but I'm switch enough to try it.  Worked great for 3 months, then another dry spell. She's dissociating and every kiss feels gross. But now ED med is $3/dose instead of $40 and not to be hoarded. So I take it every time we see each other, and start poking at online dating again.  I tell her.

Meanwhile friends intro me to L. L is older than me but not C, a single mom, a teacher as I almost was. She lives in my neighborhood (C doesn't, and doesn't want to cohab after an abusive marriage) and gives me rides to friend-group parties when C is with her #2. We have good convo, I crush on her a little but interpret her complaints about dating to mean she is not someone I should ask out.  C is Suicide Girl Hot, L is Cheerleader Hot. I'm a big fan of both looks, but C has lots of self-image issues and so L set off her Spider-Sense. We only hang out 3-4 times in six months, but comment on each other's facebook.

May 5. C is doing an RPG con (not my thing) with her #2. My dad's supposed to come but cancels last min. I accept an invite for dinner and karaoke with a group including L (who knows I'm seeing someone but not that we're non-mono and has never met C), who drives me. She takes a pic of us that looks like a Date Selfie, and C's jealousy and abandonment go into overdrive.  She decides L is trying to take me away and doesn't respect boundaries and it's all she can talk about for days.  She requests promise to tell her before I initiate convo with an online match, tell her within 24h of any unexpected happenings.  The next day I tell her a Tinder match from weeks ago finally responded to my overture. She's 40, open marriage, plus size, Asian. Non-threatening to C's stated issues.  She tells me she's not 100% on board but is rounding up.  She makes it very clear that any romantic or sex activity with anyone else needs to be cleared in advance and she won't fight another woman over me or anyone. (meanwhile, she gets mad at me for rounding up to yes for "are you okay?" at a ren fair that was overwhelming me and saying 'yes' instead of 'not now but I will be in 10min'.

The night before my date with K, I get invited to L's last-min birthday thing.

THIS IS WHERE YOU STOP LIKING ME

C has already told me she's sick and staying in that night. I ask if, should my date with K go short, it's ok to see friends including L. Cuz I'm dumb I don't say "L's bday." She asks if she can come, I say sure, but she doesn't. Date with K is clearly a courtesy date; it's obv within 15m she's not interested and she leaves after 2 drinks with vague promises of talking Mon. I go to the party, and L promptly tags me (alone as she'd prev tagged the other ppl) and C shuts down as I try to make her laugh.  L gets gigadrunk and tries to make out with me, I push her off and say we're both too drunk. It's scary. I learn later someone'd told the group I was on a date and that my LTR was non-mono (about half had known before). I want to make very clear that I have no defense for this. I really did betray her trust.

Next day I see C. She asks me about K date, I tell her in detail. She asks about party, I tell her. She gets mad, then gets over it, then escalates in loop.  Tells me I can't take care of anyone but me, tells me I acted almost specifically to spike paranoia/FoA. Accuses me of other lies I didn't tell, of having settled and making plans to run away as soon as "my type" was on the table, of having betrayed her for a fantasy I knew would be bad for me. I offer to leave, she laughs at me. Compares me to overtly emotionally abusive ex-husband who riled her to fuel his martyr complex. And then the really brutal bombs:

I can adult just fine if it's only me but freak out if asked to shepherd anyone else

I never really loved her and just wanted sex, I would never have msgd her first, I don't value her

I am a gaslighting abuser just like exh

She FB stalked L and anyone who has so many posts set public is an attention whore

Girls who look like that get anything they want and so they don't think rules and boundaries apply

BPD paranoia and an artist's imagination mean her brain's been an endless theater of me cheating on her

The BIG one: My tone and facial language are incredibly hurtful at least once every time we are together, and has left her afraid to show the faces I haven't already seen.  "How can you say you love me when I've only ever shown you 15% of me? You'll lash out at the rest like you lash out at the easy parts." Previously she's pushed back on tone when she was already upset about something else, but never given any inkling that I was inadvertantly sharp if we weren't already fighting.  And I'm that way with everyone, but most people aren't PWBPD who are so deeply wounded. I try to do better but often need to be told because I don't realize how I look or sound.

Over 5 hours, we fight and make up probably 3 times.  Now, I'm as lost and broken as her. I've wounded her every time we've spoken for this long and she NEVER told me? I've destroyed her trust thru my selfishness, sent her into a self-harm cycle for 1st time since we started dating, why the heck would she say "love isn't enough to stay together" and then insist she wants to give me another chance?

She works from home 3 days a week so aside from work yesterday, she hasn't had to leave the house. She cancelled all her social obligations, didn't bathe, and when we gamed after work today L was still the only thing she could discuss. (I haven't spoken to L since the party; she kind of freaked me out. Having your 'safe' friend wordlessly turn to you, grab you and try to stick her tongue down your throat at 1am is not hot to me).  I feel like a monster, both because I betrayed her and because the result was her being so socially and emotionally paralyzed that she cancelled on once-in-a-lifetime events rather than leave the house.

I'm still in love with her, the bad parts and the good. But I'm scared that if she's really locked down her BPD so much in the past that the "bad parts" were this hidden, and they've shaken me this badly, we might be toxic to each other.  Scared that one day she'll show me her REAL Black Bug Room, and I'll chicken out and break her for good.  I don't know what's kinder for her or for me.

[pearlsw]

Hi Spaceweasel,

That was quite a ride! So, you have three women on your plate? I didn't stop liking you by the way, just trying to keep the characters in your life straight.

C = 2.5 yr. relationship that became open, or always was on her end.
L = is a woman C is jealous about because she fears L is taking you away

and

K = another woman you found online, saw, but this was considered outside of the agreement with C?

Has C broken up with you? What are hoping for? To find a way to get along better with C? To cut down, expand or maintain your current grouping of ladies?

wishing you peace, pearl.

[pearlsw]

What does "she only showed me 20%" mean by the way?

~pearl.

[Spaceweasel]

Hi Spaceweasel,

That was quite a ride! So, you have three women on your plate? I didn't stop liking you by the way, just trying to keep the characters in your life straight.


K = another woman you found online, saw, but this was considered outside of the agreement with C?

Has C broken up with you? What are hoping for? To find a way to get along better with C? To cut down, expand or maintain your current grouping of ladies?

wishing you peace, pearl.

K was entirely within the agreed upon scope of the relationship, which was open on day one but which I didn't pursue other relationships for 2 years.

C was not entirely okay with me seeing her because of her fear of abandonment, but I did everything C asked me to in setting up the unsuccessful date.

C has not broken up with me.

 And L is out of picture now. Even if she wasn't going to be a massive problem for C, after Friday I am no longer interested. Sorry for not being clearer. 

As for what I want, I don't know. I want to be able to make things work with C, but (a) I'm afraid our behavior issues are mutually toxic and may drag us both down and (b) to make this work, I feel that I need to find a more stable secondary partner, so I can have the support she has from hers. Tall order I know.

 I don't want to juggle 3 women, I don't even want to juggle 2. I want to find one other partner, preferably someone who already has a primary partner, and find a way to cope with C and be better for her... .or I want to go. I am not on the edge of dumping her, but I'm also having a hard time finding a future where we don't make each other miserable.  Does that make more sense?

And as for the "20 percent" question, during our Saturday mega fight over me not telling her it was L's birthday party I was going to, she said she's terrified to show me more than the most positive 20 percent of her personality because I'll just lash out at it. That terrifies me.

[Spaceweasel]

The last two days have been pretty nuts.  My dad was in town; C (my high-functioning PWBPD) was going to get dinner with us.  We took a short walk and had a good chat, she said she'd told boyfriend#2 the whole story and his response was "Weasel screwed up but he's good for you, and it's gonna be okay."  I thought we were having a great night; at the very end, as I walked her to her car to go home, she confided that #2 had laughed hysterically at the story of L (the girl I was crushing on a little until she grabbed me for a kiss without talking, of whom C is jealous and paranoid even after I pushed L away) getting hammered and trying to kiss me. C had gotten upset, saying this was traumatic to her, and #2 said "but she's such a stereotype trainwreck. Does she have 3 baby daddies?" I chuckled and said no, she'd been married for 15 years.  C got PISSED.  "You feel sorry for her!" I admitted I did. We talked a little more and had a quick goodbye kiss, I said I was looking forward to more of her on Sunday, she said "Maybe."  Then, after getting into the car, she texted:

"I should have kept my mouth shut. Just feel sorry for whoever the f*** you feel sorry for."  When she got home, she had decided that

1) I am not over L as evidenced by the fact that I'm treating her surprise kiss, an intrusion on my boundaries differently than I would if I were a woman and L were a man (it was enough to make me not want to be around L anymore)

2) I am sad, rather than angry, because I still want to sleep with L (nope)

3) The fact that C asked me out, said she loved me first, pushed the relationship forward fast, etc. means that I never wanted her and only stuck around because I'd rather get laid regularly, and I would leave her the instant a cheerleader-type woman without L's level of baggage asked for a monogamous commitment

I pushed back a little, said I was still processing what happened with L but the fact that I wasn't angry enough to trash her didn't mean I was still into her and I was mostly mourning my dumb childish fantasy of L.  We part on rough terms but with "I love yous" and go to bed.  At 4am C starts tweeting about insomnia.

Yesterday, a lot of my time was taken up with Dad. We went to his favorite restaurants here in Big City, watched a movie, played cards and talked a little about my situation. He did not previously know she was (self-diagnosed) BPD.  I told him most of the story, but not that C and I were supposed to be non-mono or that she has a married secondary partner.  He suggested the Mars and Venus books, which are not in my future.  (I read the first one and feel like it probably was helpful to straight-laced people of my parents' generation when it was written, but bears very little resemblance to anything I've seen in the real world.) C and I texted a little during the day, and she was good, still looking forward to seeing me today for dancing (there's a club we like that attracts an older crowd on Sunday nights for new wave and other 80s music) and staying over, and brunch with a couple of friends in the morning.  Then, after about 8:30 pm, she starts down the exact same road as Friday. "You never wanted me and it's important to be wanted", "I never should have said I love you until you did", "you just want to screw the same little blondes with big boobs that every man wants."  I'm pretty sure she'd been drinking, but she didn't say. 

Finally, "It's okay, I'll get used to it. I always do, I've settled for worse."  That pretty much broke me.  She was bouncing between apologies and rage, telling me if I was still processing the L incident I didn't know what I wanted enough to be able to tell her I wanted most to stay with her.  She offered to get herself a hotel room downtown tonight so we could still go dancing but I wouldn't have to deal with her afterward.  "Are you sure you want me in your apartment tomorrow night?"  I said yes and we said our I love yous and goodnights. 

She also said that since I told her I wanted to see all of her, not just the best 20 percent, this is what ishe was really like. 

Today we've barely talked; she's coming over in about 4 hours and we've confirmed the time.  My dad just left, which is why I'm putting all this down now.

I'm still in the same conflicted position I was on Thursday; I want to find a future where I don't have to leave her, but I don't want to end up with the same kind of emotional trauma my little brother had from his engagement to a lower-functioning PWBPD.

[pearlsw]

Hi Spaceweasel,

Okay, I think I'm getting this down. In the future, to get more folks to come by you might want a shorter summary, but I was glad to read all of this and start to get to know you!

Okay, so, at its most basic you want to figure out how to better communicate with C? You are deciding about whether there might be a future together? I hear that you'd like to have someone who has a primary partner. Would C get in the way of that? Or are you only going for that option if C is out of the picture?

I wish we had full fake names so it was easier to follow!

take care friend! ~ pearl.

p.s. i will be away soon, for 10 days or so, so if i don't reply don't take it personally! just keep posting on others posts so people get to know you and keep posting about your issues. we're here and we want to support! these relationships aren't easy!

[Spaceweasel]

Hi Spaceweasel,

Okay, I think I'm getting this down. In the future, to get more folks to come by you might want a shorter summary, but I was glad to read all of this and start to get to know you!

Thanks.  I was trying to tell the whole story to avoid a ton of questions I could explain up front, but it clearly backfired. :D i will be more careful about that in future.

Okay, so, at its most basic you want to figure out how to better communicate with C? You are deciding about whether there might be a future together? I hear that you'd like to have someone who has a primary partner. Would C get in the way of that? Or are you only going for that option if C is out of the picture?

I want to figure out whether I can stay with Carol at all or not.  Communication is part of the problem, and I want to be better at that.  However, just improving my comm won't make staying possible.  I think we need other things too, like both of us going back to therapy.  Getting her to a DBT specialist is going to be difficult.

And I am only interested in people with primary partners if Carol is *in* the picture; I want a #2 to give me the things Carol can't, and this hypothetical #2 having a #1 would probably make that easier for both of us.  If Carol and I don't last, I don't know if I will do the non-mono thing in the future. It doesn't bother me in the least, but I don't NEED it like some people do.  But I know myself well enough to know I will not be happy being somebody's #2 if I don't already have a #1. 

I wish we had full fake names so it was easier to follow!

I will correct this oversight and edit the other posts, turning C into Carol, L into Laura and K into Kim.

take care friend! ~ pearl.

p.s. i will be away soon, for 10 days or so, so if i don't reply don't take it personally! just keep posting on others posts so people get to know you and keep posting about your issues. we're here and we want to support! these relationships aren't easy!

I hope the absence is a good and fun thing for you.  Thanks for listening; I'm going to start being more proactive about responding to others, it's been a tough week at work and home.

[pearlsw]

Hi Spaceweasel,

Thanks for sharing! And I appreciate you helping me to follow! I have a good friend who is polyamorous, well I first knew him when he was just dating one woman at time, more or less.  We haven't been as close in the last years since I am overseas, but I think in some ways being polyamorous worked well for him. He seems pretty happy. I admire the flexibility and creativity with numbers!

So, okay, sounds like it might be good to focus on Carol! You can do a lot with communication tools, and it might have some affect, even if she is not in therapy, but I hear ya, I wish my SO had some support. If we stay together I wouldn't mind doing my share and a little extra to support him, but his mood swings and heightened emotions are a bit much for me with no support in life really outside of this site!

Can you tell us all more about Carol's behaviors? Does she have all the traits?  Some?

wishing you peace, pearl.

[Spaceweasel]

Hi Spaceweasel,


Can you tell us all more about Carol's behaviors? Does she have all the traits?  Some?

wishing you peace, pearl.

Carol is super high-functioning, and so she has more of the traits than I realized when we started dating.  If she splits, she does it subtly enough that I don't really notice, and she's developed solid coping mechanisms for risk behaviors like spending and sex.  (She will not leave a place she's spent money until she logs how much she spent in a spreadsheet on her phone, for instance)  But she definitely has the paranoia and fear of abandonment, the lack of consistent sense of self, she cuts (but went nearly 2 years without until our big fight), the mood swings, the dissociation and the anger (which mostly manifests as road rage, directed at me once or twice before she stopped asking me to navigate because of my blindness).  She used to do DBT but decided she had taken everything from it that she needed and has been hostile to the idea of regular talk therapy for its own sake. 

Also, it looks like this site doesn't allow editing of old posts.  I understand why, but it prevents me from editing Carol, Kim and Laura's names into the original post for clarity.

[pearlsw]

Hey Spaceweasel,

No worries about the edits! Anyone reading the thread will see what ya did. And I hope you don't think me pushy about it! I just wanted to make it easier for folks to connect to the story!

Going forward you could always put a little note that says [fake names] so no one worries about the privacy angle!

Oh hey, yes, I hear ya! When someone is so high functioning it can be very hard to spot these issues! Whew!

Are you at a deciding stage in the relationship over whether to be together or not... .or just sort of rolling along dealing with eruptions from time to time?

take care, pearl.