if a pwBPD suffers from a fear of abandonment why would they leave?

[1hopefulhuman]

Hello, I'm going in-between boards. I first posted last week, when I still thought I wanted to reverse my spousal separation, but I feel different this week, I'm can't bear the abuse anymore and he wont get help.

But I have a LOT of questions as I am just now learning about BPD (I'm just starting to read books)

My BPDxh left me August 2018, 10 months ago. We've been together 9 years and share a 7 year old. The verbal abuse started when our son was born as my x was jealous of all the time I spent care taking care of our son a- he would lash out at me. I'm pretty certain this was very painful for him (he felt abandoned in an unusual way, he almost created the abandonment by opting out, not taking initative).

Cut to 7 years later, he would change his mind about how he felt about me, month to month, starting in the fall of 2016. Some months he loved me, others he decided he didn't. He was also experiencing odd identity crisis. Actually, I saw some of his 2013 emails - he didn't cheat on me but he came close and claims to other women he had not been in love for years... .can that be true? I sure as heck didnt feel that.

June of 2018 he splurged on fathers day and bought me 4-5 beautiful dresses (he never does that) and we had days that month where we were very much in love - cut to 1 month later I came home from a trip and he had declared he loved me but not in love with me, found another place to live in... .had a long laundry list of reasons why I was "wrong" ... .even "and for 1 month out of the month your moody!" , good luck finding a woman who doesnt have that quality!

So my question is, if a BPD person suffers from a core fear of abandonment - why would they leave the person closest to them?

He did come back to me in Dec and Feb saying he made a mistake - I told him if he went to therapy I would be open -he found a person but never went, we started dating and of course it was a horrific roller coaster worse than when we were together due to the added stress of dating others and suspicions.  It ended very badly the week of my bday... .and now its just done. he went too far  I dont even have the energy to explain at the moment.

[Cromwell]

being the one to leave is having control over the situation, it isnt "abandonment" if they are the ones discarding - this almost always is when there is another relationship lined up to move on to. abandonment and being the ones to discard, similar end result, but vitally important distinctions.

If not another r/s lined up, then it is constant pressure testing to see how loyal, how far will put up with the behaviour.

[1hopefulhuman]

If not another r/s lined up, then it is constant pressure testing to see how loyal, how far will put up with the behaviour.

Thanks for your response, unfortunately (and I am ashamed to admit) after he left, I had access to all my x's text messages and emails through our son's ipad until just recently... .so I could see exactly what he was up to. There was no other woman lined up... .he waited about 3 months after he left me before he started reaching out to old flames and about 4 months before he started dating. Then at xmass he tried to reconnect romantically and I said no. It wasnt until Feb, that I allowed him into my life romantically again - as we were both getting very jealous knowing we were seeing other people. he vowed to go to therapy but never did and things got really bad.

Why would he move out, put me and our son through all that drama and start seeing other people just to pressure test to see how loyal I am? baffled

Another odd piece of the puzzle is unfortunately he has let his body and looks go over the years (probably a reflection of his mental place), and on the flip side i have taken very good care of myself physically, and my nature is I'm outgoing, fun, lots and friends.  HE COULD NOT SEE THE REAL ME. he could only see a fog of blame, resentment and projection... .no real problems, no cancer no tragedy... .just his disorder clouding reality... .do they ever come out of the fog on their own?

[tlc232]

I had a lot of somewhat similar "I just don't get it" questions when after 14 years I had had enough (and then some) and tried to find some answers online.   Wasn't long to get to this site as my exBPDSO is textbook BPD.   Someone very wise once answered my question on why he would feel some way that I couldn't understand like this ---  it's because you are normal.   

There isn't a bottom line answer for all conditions and actions --- but reading through the info here will help you see the patterns and problems.  They don't think the same way and they don't act the same way -- it is a mental disorder.   Finding answers for challenging behavior is just that much harder, because there aren't many except "they are not right".   

I'm sorry for what you are going through and what your son has had to deal with.    I don't see much hope in long term relationships with true BPD partners other than getting away and healing.   You found the right spot for help here... .great people and info.

[Radcliff]

1hopefulhuman,

Welcome to bpdfamily!  Detaching is a difficult process.  Progress is not steady.  You may find that you take two steps forward and one step back.

Have you had a chance to look at the Detaching resources on the right sidebar?

What does your support system look like?  Do you have family and friends you can confide in?  Are you seeing a therapist?

WW

[Cromwell]

Thanks for your response, unfortunately (and I am ashamed to admit) after he left, I had access to all my x's text messages and emails through our son's ipad until just recently... .so I could see exactly what he was up to. There was no other woman lined up... .he waited about 3 months after he left me before he started reaching out to old flames and about 4 months before he started dating. Then at xmass he tried to reconnect romantically and I said no. It wasnt until Feb, that I allowed him into my life romantically again - as we were both getting very jealous knowing we were seeing other people. he vowed to go to therapy but never did and things got really bad.

Why would he move out, put me and our son through all that drama and start seeing other people just to pressure test to see how loyal I am? baffled

Another odd piece of the puzzle is unfortunately he has let his body and looks go over the years (probably a reflection of his mental place), and on the flip side i have taken very good care of myself physically, and my nature is I'm outgoing, fun, lots and friends.  HE COULD NOT SEE THE REAL ME. he could only see a fog of blame, resentment and projection... .no real problems, no cancer no tragedy... .just his disorder clouding reality... .do they ever come out of the fog on their own?

if it was his intention - it looks like it worked in the end?

He will realise himself his lack of options at mattress hopping. My ex is still young and attractive, she can and will cycle through relationships, but there will come a time where those options start decreasing. Who is going to tolerate the chaos? The only reason I did, to a very large extent, was because she was attractive, great company most of the time, I felt it was worth putting up with, until it got to breaking point. By which I mean, after every pressure test, she just made another more chaotic one to follow it.

You are attractive and have options, his are more limited, but do you really want to waste your opportunities being dragged down into mental despair for years forward, just for his main benefit of needing a personality to reflect a sense of his own identity from.

What about the duty you owe your 7yo son to keep and maintain your health so as to be able to look after him, not something to take for granted as the years of this can take their toll having to be surrogate parent to a competing adult for his needs.

There are tools on this site and advice aplenty of tolerating it and making the best of it, I found it difficult to detach from my ex and she was just a girlfriend that I had became enmeshed with emotionally to a very unhealthy level, so its not my place to say leave him when you have a child with him, I can just give you my perspective from not being emotionally involved, leaving my ex was the best thing yet at the time I couldnt see the wood for the trees, its not just a case of talking about the fog that your partner is living in, what about your own fog and confusion, your attempts to rationalise his behaviour. If you are finding some way to change him, its not going to happen, that is one certainty. He is therapy avoidant and even if he did engage, its nowhere near a guarantee of success, if he did engage and go through the hard work, the path is one that will take years of your life in the meantime, being a crutch. Like you already said, he doesnt want to change and that is the biggest hurdle.

Please dont take your current state of good health for granted or think youve not seen the worst of his behaviour yet. Your son is 7, there are years ahead to think about his long term development and being in a healthy environment - he has already witnessed the distress by it - was this also a factor in you accepting his dad back so easily besides the jealousy of him dating elsewhere? Not asking you to answer, but to think about it and along the lines of what I said as "pressure testing".

[Forearmed]

being the one to leave is having control over the situation, it isnt "abandonment" if they are the ones discarding - this almost always is when there is another relationship lined up to move on to. abandonment and being the ones to discard, similar end result, but vitally important distinctions.

If not another r/s lined up, then it is constant pressure testing to see how loyal, how far will put up with the behaviour.

GREAT response, Cromwell! 

[Turkish]

Fear of abandonment isn't a core feeling that is the cause of BPD. There are plenty of hermits. What lies deeper?

My feelings are inherently worthless, therefore I am inherently worthless and not worth loving.

[bananas2]

Perhaps an overly-simplistic answer, but an answer to your post question nonetheless:

If a person (BPD or not) fears abandonment, if he/she leaves the relationship, then he/she has alleviated the fear. You can't get abandoned if you leave first.

My STBXH was so terrified I might leave him (due to the damage/chaos he created), that one day, out of the blue, he told me he was leaving. No explanation. He packed up everything, and was gone the next day. In one fell swoop, his fear of me abandoning him was gone.

[1hopefulhuman]

My STBXH was so terrified I might leave him (due to the damage/chaos he created), that one day, out of the blue, he told me he was leaving.

Hi Bananas2, thank you for taking the time to respond. I'm sorry you had the same experience. It's helpful how you explained that he might be aware of the damage/chaos he created... .I never though they could have that level of reflection!  Do you have children? How long was your marriage?

[1hopefulhuman]

Fear of abandonment isn't a core feeling that is the cause of BPD.

Thank you Turkish, I read somewhere that fear of abandonment was at the root of BPD which is why I was confused when he left the closest person to him (me). 

[1hopefulhuman]

if it was his intention - it looks like it worked in the end?

Cromwell, wow yes this is a great response, thank you! After reading I really felt empowered by your words of encouragement.

Yes, I guess the pressure test worked in the end this time - but what's next?

I especially like how you pointed out my 7yr old sons long term development and need of a healthy environment. I know first hand how awful that can be as an adult child of an alcoholic. Yes, having our little family back together was DEFINITELY a factor in giving him another chance, along with our jealousy issues - it is tough to watch/know your partner of 9 years is now romantic with others.And like all marriages we have expectations for what the future was supposed to be, family vacations etc. 

Sometimes its just plain difficult for me to understand his unhappiness and I'm left baffled. Life is great! We have / had a beautiful house, child, friends, lifestyle, community, jobs... I see our life as privileged and amazing -we're not rollin in it if you know what I mean - but geez, he was/is dissatisfied with everything and almost everyone.

The enmeshment is interesting huh? Sometimes I wonder, does every couple do this to some degree? I could clearly see how bad it was when he left, i thought I would die inside the pain was so bad... .and then I almost didnt know who I was anymore. I was awesome before I met him, by the end, I felt like a shell of the person I once was. And all my attention was on HIM.

I need to read up on the pressure testing... .I want to learn how long it goes for, what to expect, why they keep doing it and what they are trying to gain from it.

You shared such valuable thoughts, I probably need to write another post after Ive digested it a bit more. thank you again

[1hopefulhuman]

Someone very wise once answered my question on why he would feel some way that I couldn't understand like this ---  it's because you are normal.   

Hi tlc232, so interesting you are the second person to say this to me and it is so simple yet makes so much sense. It's also hard to swallow with someone you have committed your life to  I have used this comment to help detach - I'm accepting who he is today and deciding, do i choose to be around this person? How much of my time and energy do I give them? Does it make me feel good in his presence?

Quick story: An old (now married) boyfriend sent me flowers for my bday. My BPDxh commented "I wouldnt send those if i was trying to court someone" - me: "what would you send?" BPDxh "I would send red roses" Me in my head: "(feeling anxious) My dream bouquet is a large variety of different exotic garden flowers... .but I don't DARE share this with BPDxh, he will interpret this as disagreeing with him and me wanting to cause drama, and his feelings will be hurt because he thinks I'm saying he's wrong - UGH". To realize I was in a relationship where I couldn't share my own likes and preferences without being emotionally abused really scared me and woke me up. I want a partner who WANTS to know those things about me!

[bananas2]

Hi Bananas2, thank you for taking the time to respond. I'm sorry you had the same experience. It's helpful how you explained that he might be aware of the damage/chaos he created... .I never though they could have that level of reflection!  Do you have children? How long was your marriage?

No children. Together 7 years. Married 5.

- I'm accepting who he is today and deciding, do i choose to be around this person? How much of my time and energy do I give them? Does it make me feel good in his presence?

Wonderful that you are asking yourself these questions. Very positive step you are taking by reflecting on your own self worth and remembering that you deserve to be happy & valued. Excellent emotional self-care! 

[toughday]

As an example of discard before you are abandoned. My exBPDDgf  posted on FB on NYE a pic of us together and that she was incredibly happy and in love and we were building a life together in our new home and can't wait for the future together. That night we had a row and i was a bit mean... nothing major but i wasn't a great boyfriend.

On Jan 5... 5 days later she asked me to leave. Her reason was she didn't believe i loved her. I tried to convince her i did (i really do love her) but you can't convince someone of something if they aren't willing to believe it. She discarded me before i had an opportunity to abandon her. According to her i had shown her my true colours. She still tells me that she believes i am the love of her life but she no longer trusts me. As someone said earlier its difficult to rationalise the thought process from a non BPD perspective.

[Skip]

Fear of abandonment would probably be better labeled as "fear of abandonment, fear of vulnerability". Many don't lock in on this latter aspect, but it very much explains the dichotomy in the behavior.

If you feel vulnerable to fire, how would you live life? Probably an all electric home, no fireplace, no candles, no BBQ, no gas cans in the garage. You would also have a fire alarm, fire extinguishers, maybe live near a fire department, buy a brick home, have a lightening rod.  You would be hyper about whether you left the stove on or a iron on. You would avoid certain venues.  If you were at a restaurant and a waiter knocked over a candle, you would likely exit the restaurant.

A person with BPD over emotes and tries very hard to be loved. With that comes great vulnerability. They are playing with fire. It's a tough combination - needing to over-emote your emotions and create vulnerability and being deathly afraid of vulnerability.

If a waiter knocked over a candle, they will likely exit the restaurant.

[1hopefulhuman]

She still tells me that she believes i am the love of her life but she no longer trusts me.

Sorry to hear that toughday, its very confusing behavior to be the love of someones life and be left... .I'm in the same exact boat and it's excruciating to try and understand.

During the period we tried to get back together feb-april, we started sharing self help videos with each other and his was about TRUST. He could remember a time in his childhood where his mother really did something quite mean to him and destroyed his trust as a child: Apparently with his dad (they were divorced) he got a spear-fishing tool - kinda dangerous buy probably super cool for an 8-10 year old! he was stoked! When he brought it home his mom said 'oh nice, lucky you' then next day it was gone - in the trash!  When I trigger him this feeling of mistrust from childhoosd comes up in him... .sad.

So I'd like to learn more about BPDs and their specific relationship with trust... .

[toughday]

So I'd like to learn more about BPDs and their specific relationship with trust... .

I am new to the whole BPD experience too so i am still feeling my way and trying to understand.

The thing that has helped me understand my ex's behaviour more than anything is a statement that i read on here, that for a BPD feelings = facts. This explained so much to me. There doesn't have to be any basis in reality for what they believe is true. If they feel it its true. Its very hard to rationalise that.

[1hopefulhuman]

BPD feelings = facts

I get it kinda sorta, difficult for me to grasp. I'll try to apply below:

The last blow-up and punishment came from him believing I slept with someone without any evidence or facts, I simply went out with a male friend he knows very well. He threatened to cancel family bills he was paying, ended up booking a trip to Hawaii with my son after I asked him not to  - to punish me, and said horrific abusive words.  Granted we were separated, but this was during our 'try to get back together phase' where we vowed to be monogamous. Turns out even though I kept to the bargain, he had asked out a woman on a yoga date.

If I were to apply his 'feelings = fact' to the above, would it look like?
- "I feel scared, angry, jealous when your out with other people = fact you are cheating on me"
- "I feel guilty that I asked out another woman while I vowed to be monogamous, I hate myself = fact (insert projection) If I'm cheating you must be too, I hate you"
- maybe its both?

All of his potential feelings ended with false fact that he can not trust me

[once removed]

All of his potential feelings ended with false fact that he can not trust me

feelings = facts is a simplification, if not overly so. what does it mean?

when we (anyone) are in a dysregulated state, emotions are overwhelming, its hard to read other people (empathy/understanding is impaired), and we tend to ascribe motives to them. fight or flight kicks in. "this person is trying to hurt me in some way". with BPD traits, that is often related to the fear of abandonment and/or engulfment.

this can happen to anyone, of course. it happened to me recently. a friend sent me a message that upset me, i was really angry and irritated. i sought some advice on what i might say, and in my state, i felt the person giving advice was taking my friends side, and telling me how they thought i really felt. it wasnt that at all. when i calmed down, i realized all they were doing was telling me how my proposed response might come off, and they were right. overwhelming emotions distort perspective.

we draw conclusions, often related to our fears (fight or flight). what often happens in these relationships is that when we defend ourselves against baseless accusations/conclusions, it only reinforces the other persons position, ie why are we so defensive if we arent guilty?

[Cromwell]

Projection was the recurring theme during my r/s.

There is a saying "a thief always believes others are trying to steal from them"

My ex cheated in every r/s she had, she was paranoid I was doing the same. Her words to me once were "one thing that will never happen to me is that I get cheated on first".

Isnt that just her way of justifying her own behaviour, taking a global outlook that most people cheat, so she may as well do it first?

egocentric?

its interesting that I got more of this type of insight - after - she got up to all her antics.

I can take the viewpoint that because ive felt hurt by my only experience with a borderline, therefore fact is I feel that any relationship with borderline will be hurtful. that feeling becomes fact, regardless of how realistic it is, but at its baseline is a defence mechanism to protect from further hurt. The ability to rationalise this though is my ability not to have feeling = fact, but as it has been said, for pwBPD this rationalisation doesnt happen, for them feeling = fact and actions are taken as a result.

[MeandThee29]

If not another r/s lined up, then it is constant pressure testing to see how loyal, how far will put up with the behaviour.

Well said.

If you fail the test, they have confirmed their low opinion of you and of themselves. It's manipulation with an eye towards destruction.

Makes zero sense to me, but there we are.

[tlc232]

Well said.

Makes zero sense to me, but there we are.

And that, folks, sums it up best!   

[tlc232]

On Jan 5... 5 days later she asked me to leave. Her reason was she didn't believe i loved her. I tried to convince her i did (i really do love her) but you can't convince someone of something if they aren't willing to believe it.

That HAS to be another common denominator... .  I would get that daily... .and this from a man!   "You don't love me... ." ... ."do you really love me?"... ." no you don't... .no you don't ... .no you don't" -- until it does become a self-fulfilling prophecy because you feel like you have to beg them that you truly do and he never in 14 years ever said thank you or he knew I did or appreciated.    Towards the end, I so much wanted to yell "who could love someone who is so needy; draining and difficult --- who?".    And then I actually would question "do I?" after being asked a million times and continually chastised.   

The bigger question --- why do we miss any of this?  That to me makes me worry that I have a disorder as who would?
   

[Wend1206]

Hi - I’m new to this site, and struggling with my relationship just ending as well... .
From all of my research and talking to people - and it’s been extensive! People with abandonment issues leave when they are convinced you don’t really love them and to protect themselves THEY do the leaving and pretty much blindside you. I left To run errands, mace home and my bf has taken all of his things and left my key in the lock. We were supposed to be moving in together within weeks. The next day he began texting begging me back, but I have been firm in my telling him no and have asked him to please get help. Usually he stops texting me for days after i say I want Him to get help