I think my uNPD mum trained me to ruminate.

[Our abuse recovery guide]

 
Leenlou posted a thread recently on rumination — and why we as recipients of abusive behavior seem to get sucked into ruminating loops.

I spent months ruminating about my situation with my uBPDsis.  Everyone who I talked to about the situation asked me "Why are you spending so much energy and thought about her?"

I think my uNPD mum trained me to ruminate. I was the oldest and I was expected to rescue, solve problems and provide. Sometimes I was rewarded for good solutions. This intermittent validation kept me hooked. My self worth was born—my existence was to serve others and sacrifice my “self”.

Harri mentioned vigilance. Around the time I was 9 or 10 I started planning escape routes for my sibs and I. Dad was violent. There were guns and fights between mum and dad all the time. We witnessed him beat her and us. She also beat us. She also instigated most of the drama. We saw Christmas gifts smashed, him throwing her out in the snow and throwing a pot of boiling water on her. She slept with his best friend. She got pregnant to that guy... .things got much worse.

Vigilance was rewarded in my military life. I have become hyper vigilant. I constantly analyze situations and scenarios for escape routes and provisions for my family.

Anyway... .there have been lots of breakthroughs this week for the little girl inside who has refused to cry and grieve for 50 years (give or take). Riding my new fat tire bicycle and health issues with my pup have brought many buried memories to the surface. This is painful stuff but I am beginning to trust that I AM WORTHY of my own hard work and happiness. Baby steps every day... .and then some days I crawl again.

Sometimes when the memories come it causes sleeplessness. I wake up and feel the adrenaline surge trying to remember where I am and if it’s safe. I think it was No-One who posted this link on another thread a while back:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/evolution-the-self/200807/parent-pleasing-people-pleasing-part-1-3

It took me a while to really read all 3 parts. It was deeply triggering and enlightening. It was part of a series of events that were the catalyst to me beginning to realize that I allow myself to experience success (in problem solving, rescuing and fixing) for everyone BUT me.  That is not to say I was always successful in my attempts for others, but at least I didn’t self-sabotage when I was doing it FOR THEM.

[Learning2Thrive]

 
Leenlou posted a thread recently on rumination — and why we as recipients of abusive behavior seem to get sucked into ruminating loops.

I spent months ruminating about my situation with my uBPDsis.  Everyone who I talked to about the situation asked me "Why are you spending so much energy and thought about her?"

I think my uNPD mum trained me to ruminate. I was the oldest and I was expected to rescue, solve problems and provide. Sometimes I was rewarded for good solutions. This intermittent validation kept me hooked. My self worth was born—my existence was to serve others and sacrifice my “self”.

Harri mentioned vigilance. Around the time I was 9 or 10 I started planning escape routes for my sibs and I. Dad was violent. There were guns and fights between mum and dad all the time. We witnessed him beat her and us. She also beat us. She also instigated most of the drama. We saw Christmas gifts smashed, him throwing her out in the snow and throwing a pot of boiling water on her. She slept with his best friend. She got pregnant to that guy... .things got much worse.

Vigilance was rewarded in my military life. I have become hyper vigilant. I constantly analyze situations and scenarios for escape routes and provisions for my family.

Anyway... .there have been lots of breakthroughs this week for the little girl inside who has refused to cry and grieve for 50 years (give or take). Riding my new fat tire bicycle and health issues with my pup have brought many buried memories to the surface. This is painful stuff but I am beginning to trust that I AM WORTHY of my own hard work and happiness. Baby steps every day... .and then some days I crawl again.

Sometimes when the memories come it causes sleeplessness. I wake up and feel the adrenaline surge trying to remember where I am and if it’s safe. I think it was No-One who posted this link on another thread a while back:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/evolution-the-self/200807/parent-pleasing-people-pleasing-part-1-3

It took me a while to really read all 3 parts. It was deeply triggering and enlightening. It was part of a series of events that were the catalyst to me beginning to realize that I allow myself to experience success (in problem solving, rescuing and fixing) for everyone BUT me.  That is not to say I was always successful in my attempts for others, but at least I didn’t self-sabotage when I was doing it FOR THEM.

[Learning2Thrive]

So, I guess I am curious if anyone else has noticed a connection between rumination and early childhood intermittent validation by primary caregiver, i.e, mother with BPD or NPD or other manipulative tendencies?

I’m also curious, how do others experience vigilance?

I welcome constructive comments and feedback. Yes, I have been in therapy over the years but am not at this time due to several factors mostly related to Insurance and availability of local qualified professionals with experience dealing with cPTSD related to being raised by PD parent(s).

[Harri]

Hi Learning2Thirive!   

This intermittent validation kept me hooked.

Yes, that is a powerful hook and how a response gets deeply ingrained.

Around the time I was 9 or 10 I started planning escape routes for my sibs and I.

This made my eyes fill with tears when I first read it... .and even now imagining you trying to take care of yourself and your younger sibs.  Too much pressure and responsibility at such a young age.  So much to deal with growing up leaves its mark.

Anyway... .there have been lots of breakthroughs this week for the little girl inside who has refused to cry and grieve for 50 years (give or take). Riding my new fat tire bicycle and health issues with my pup have brought many buried memories to the surface. This is painful stuff but I am beginning to trust that I AM WORTHY of my own hard work and happiness. Baby steps every day... .and then some days I crawl again.

  I am sorry about your puppy, but i am thrilled for you about the fat tire bike.  I remember you talking about it. 

You are worthy.  And we are here and are right beside you.  I know that sounds trite but it is true. 

It took me a while to really read all 3 parts. It was deeply triggering and enlightening. It was part of a series of events that were the catalyst to me beginning to realize that I allow myself to experience success (in problem solving, rescuing and fixing) for everyone BUT me.  That is not to say I was always successful in my attempts for others, but at least I didn’t self-sabotage when I was doing it FOR THEM.

I am slow with things that trigger me.  The last couple of days has been hard which is why my posting has been so limited.  It happens and I have to be okay with that. 

The memories that you are having and the triggers are, I think, positive in that it means something is going on deep inside and we are ready to explore and tune into old behaviors like hypervigilance and how we respond to dreams and other triggers.  Still a pain in the butt to deal with tho.       

You are worth the effort and the work it will take to heal yourself.  Keep building on learning to trust yourself (on your bike or otherwise!)  and keep posting even when you feel like you are crawling.  Someone today told me that sometimes when you feel like other people have to hold your hand to get through, what is actually happening is you are dragging them up and helping them.  You have done that for me so keep letting us try to help you along too.  I don't mind getting dirty.

I have not made the connection between rumination and intermittent reinforcement I don't think... .but as I type that I think maybe I have.  There were times when I did let my guard down and bad things happened.  When I let myself hope and trust only to have my mother abuse me and or my father abandon me.  So yeah.  I do see a connection.  thank you!  Sorry for thinking out loud in your thread but real time insights like these are why I process while writing.  It works for me.

About therapy, L2T, I can tell you that i often feel like I get as much and sometimes more benefit from posting here than I do in T... .and my t is awesome.  It is different.  this board is not a venting board, though we can vent and get support, but it truly is a place to work on us and make big and small changes that will help us function better. 

Okay, enough about me.  Can't help it though.  I like chatting with you all.

 

[Learning2Thrive]

Hi   Harri!

Thank you for your reply and feedback.  You have no idea how much it means (oh wait!  I bet you do!) just to feel heard and still feel accepted. I am sorry you've been having some rough days and if any of the things I shared were part of triggering for you. That is never my intention; although, I do understand because much of what I read here triggers me. I don't believe anyone who shares here intentionally tries to trigger anyone else but we have all suffered so it happens, of course. I'm learning to take it slow, give myself time to digest and process. 

Quote from Harri:

I am sorry about your puppy, but i am thrilled for you about the fat tire bike.  I remember you talking about it.

Thank you.  He's doing OK -- for now.  Perhaps better at the moment because we now have him on some appropriate pain meds that help him manage better.

I adopted (rescued) him 2 years ago.  He's not quite 3 years old. He's been diagnosed with congenital bilateral hip dysplaisia and extremely shallow hip sockets. He is medium build mixed dog that is otherwise in excellent health. The odds were not in his favor as this problem is more common in large breed dogs (but can happen with any breed or size). Though in cases where it's not a large breed or pure bred, it's most often due to poor breeder habits (keeping puppies caged/confined and unable to run or develop properly OR poor genetics on the pup's parents).  Needless to say, his diagnosis and the probable circumstances that caused his problems are very triggering for me  .

The pup's doc says he should have about 5 decent years before his hips give out completely.  Not much we can do unless we want to drop $10K+ on a total hip replacement. Even if I had that kind of money (I don't), I couldn't do that to him.  His breed and his personality make him VERY active.  It would make him insane to be caged for the recovery time after such a surgery. He goes from 0 to 100 in about 3 seconds so... .yeah... .no, hip replacement is not an option. I am committed to accepting him as he is and giving him the best life he can possibly have (meds, diet, exercise, love and companionship) for as long as possible. On many levels, this parallels my feelings toward myself. 

Quote from Harri:

You are worth the effort and the work it will take to heal yourself.  Keep building on learning to trust yourself (on your bike or otherwise!)  and keep posting even when you feel like you are crawling.  Someone today told me that sometimes when you feel like other people have to hold your hand to get through, what is actually happening is you are dragging them up and helping them.  You have done that for me so keep letting us try to help you along too.  I don't mind getting dirty.

Thank you again, so much, Harri!  Getting dirty is a new theme for me, especially now that I'm riding my fat tire bike and trying purposely to find as much dirt as possible to ride through.

One of the things I read for mountain bike techniques is also helping me deal with these triggers.  In the context of suddenly coming up on/facing an obstacle that scares you, if you are moving too fast and unable to alter your course to avoid said obstacle, you focus on the other side, stay light on the bars and heavy on the pedals, trust your bike and yourself, breathe and just pedal through. I have to say that every time I've used this technique on my bicycle it has worked brilliantly. I guess it's time to start using it more on this emotional stuff that's been stuffed down for so long.   

I hope your afternoon is delightful and you feel my deep gratitude for your kindness. You are awesome! 

[Harri]

Hi.  Yes, I know the feeling very well.  Getting replies, being heard and understood, it is what we all do here and why I stuck around for so long.  I can remember sharing certain parts of my history, feeling so much shame and being scared that people would say I don't belong or they would keep me at arms length because of certain details.  None of that ever happened.  Even people who never experienced what I did reached out to say hey, I hear you.  Mind blowing, isn't it? 

Nothing you said triggered me but thank you for caring.  We are all responsible for dealing with our triggers and hopefully learn to use being triggered as an opportunity not just to explore but also to work on getting better at self care.  I think you are doing a great job with all of that.     On top of all that you add a message of hope that things can get better for us.  (so right back atcha for being awesome!)

What a tough situation with your pup.  It is hard though isn't it?  Accepting, staying steady in your devotion and care in spite of the fear and grief and living in the moment with him.  I hope you and he have much joy together.  Yes, it is good that you see the parallels with your own work.  Learning to love through puppies! 

And... .cycling through fear to self love!  You could start a whole new therapy group based on that!   

I hope you too have a delightful afternoon!  I am all comfy in the nice cool AC of my home with a great view of the grounds.  Ahhhh... .peace.

 

[Woolspinner2000]

Hey L2T, 

I think there's some mighty fine ruminating going on here between you and Harri. 

I'm sorry for the triggering you are going through. Those memories are hard to walk through. I've done so much of it during my recent years of T, and like you and Harri, there are so many triggering moments. It's just darn stinky stuff. Yet how often I tell others who are on a similar journey, "I had to go back in order to go forward."

If it's any comfort, the length of time after the trigger does get less the longer you've been on the journey. You begin to recognize them sooner, and hopefully like with my experience, you rest with them and they let go more quickly. As Pete Walker says about cPTSD and triggers, they're opportunities to work through the things we have yet to work through. Have you read any of his work?

Extra hugs for you!   
Wools

[Learning2Thrive]

  Hi Wools!

If it's any comfort, the length of time after the trigger does get less the longer you've been on the journey. You begin to recognize them sooner, and hopefully like with my experience, you rest with them and they let go more quickly. As Pete Walker says about cPTSD and triggers, they're opportunities to work through the things we have yet to work through. Have you read any of his work?

Thank you, that is comforting. No, I haven’t read any of Pete Walker’s work yet. It’s on my summer reading list. What would you recommend first?

Thank you for the extra hugs. It feels good to have family who understand.   

[Learning2Thrive]

I had another thought on this while I was out riding my bike (her name is Pug). I’ve had this thought a few times before re rumination. For me it’s like working on a gigantic, multidimensional puzzle, constantly  analyzing where something went wrong and always searching for just the right missing piece or magic words. I used to use all that as a process to berate myself (mum’s voice pounding in my brain).

These days when I notice the rumination loop starting, instead of circling round and round, I TRY to stop and breathe and see if the situation is reminding me of something that happened to me as a child. Most often it does and once I can process the old emotions attached to the time when I had no control (as a child), then I can face the current situation and handle it more objectively and gracefully. I have had a couple small but significant successes with this recently.

I really appreciate the sharing and supportive caring here. Thanks bpdfamily.