Mother trying to suppress or alter childhood memories

[daughter86]

My mother and I have always had a roller coaster type of relationship. When I was younger I would try and pacify her and meet all of her expectation, be the good kid. As I have gotten older and become a mother myself I can see how unhealthy our relationship has been and all the damage it has caused me. I started seeing a therapist two years ago and a psychiatrist and they have both suggested that my mother has BPD. I'm sure much like all of you, when you start researching what BPD is and how it affects family members you feel a sense of relief that you can finally put your finger on where all the pain and frustration in dealing with that family member is coming from but also still feel at a loss for how to change it. We used to be "close" in her mind, meaning I just did whatever she wanted so she wouldn't scream, call me names, or throw things at me. I never developed a sense of personal identity. She was and is very impulsive and my parents divorced when I was young. She made it very difficult for my dad to see us and then dated a string of very unsafe men that she would leave me alone with. She ended up remarrying a man that was in a cult and I was abused in that cult. I have tried to talk to her about what I experienced and how her choices affected the trajectory of my life and could never understand how she always came out the victim of my own trauma. Sometimes I felt the need to apologize for upsetting her after sharing what  I had been through. It's scary to think how much time I wasted and how much energy I put into trying to maintain that kind of crazy making relationship. I have reconciled with my father and we are becoming a lot closer and through that relationship I am learning a lot of what I heard from my mother about my father or what happened in my childhood is fabricated. She would do something and then I would confront her when I was a child and she would deny it ever happened. Does anyone else ever feel crazy? I feel like with all the lies and manipulation and the way she used me and set me up to be more of a need gratifying object than a child that need emotional investment and guidance, I cannot trust my own memories or mind at times. I have recovered some suppressed memories as a teen through college and into adulthood and before I knew how unhealthy she was I would try and share those with her. She would try and twist my recollection or say I was wrong or get upset and throw a fit and say she did the best she could and I can't keep making her feel guilty for all the bad things that happened to me. I always internalized anything bad that ever happened to me assuming it had to my fault, or my father's, or someone else's because I was taught it could never be my mother's. I have a lot of anger and it is difficult to work through because she is so persistent and aggressive. She, like most people with BPD, is extremely sensitive to when I am trying to get some space and she feels abandoned and behaves irrationally. I just read about FOG for the first time today and realized that so much of what I have felt for her or around her is fear. I could identify the sense of guilt and obligation I felt but I never before called it fear. Now I know that it is that fear that keeps me from saying the things I need to say and maintaining my boundaries. It's so easy for my mind to play tricks on me and feel crazy because I feel like she has played with my mind and memories for such a long time. Does anyone else have any experience with trying to process trauma and having a parent with BPD try to tell you things didn't happen, not take responsibility, or try to become the victim of trauma they caused? And has anyone experienced feeling like they can't trust their own mind and memories? She is so combative and will argue if someone was wearing blue or purple 10 years ago when something happened and if you remember the color wrong then she throws the entire memory out as false. It's very frustrating to try and regain memories that have been twisted and manipulated. It's very upsetting to realize how often I had to be the one to suffer the consequences of her erratic and impulsive behavior. It's almost like she is the one stabbing me and then telling me and trying to convince it's really the person in the other room doing it. Or she is the one stabbing me and she is somehow in more pain because of it than I should be. My childhood was very difficult and I need to maintain strong boundaries with her so I can heal and be the mother my son deserves and the wife my husband deserves without her constant interference and aggressive confrontations when she is not getting her way. I have purchased and begun reading Surviving a Borderline Parent and three pages in I was crying and realizing I finally have an answer. But I know I have a long journey ahead of me and need support to learn how to deal with my mother and how to get my voice back and protect myself by maintaining my boundaries.

[Tregonsee]

I'm sorry for all you have gone through, how awful for you.  Your mom sounds just like my BPD sis.  Dealing with BPD sis felt like brainwashing,  if you didn't agree with her version of reality the punishment (rages and threats) was swift and severe. So yes to all your questions:  yes I know how it is to have someone with BPD tell me things that didn't happen, were outright lies, and also by the way made her the "victim" so of course she should get all the sympathy in the world.  Yes I often felt absolutely crazy like I couldn't trust my own mind, eyes, ears, and memories. I was so confused until I finally figured out just how sick and manipulative my BPD sis was and is.  Finally cut off all contact and life was much better for a long while.
Years ago when I was first starting to understand what BPD is I found the online forum like this helpful - allowed me to vent and to know I am not alone.  So I am glad you are here, there are a lot of helpful and sympathetic people here who really understand what you are going through.  Lots of interesting articles and survivors guide also.  I wish you all the best.

[Star0009]

Hi
yes very similar. I was abused by both parents. My mother kept me from having friends, a voice, taught me to please everyone else. When I rebelled at 12 the physical abuse and manipulation got worse bc I was no longer her little doll she could just silence and tell all of her adult problems to. Anytime I have brought up the fact she used tp sit on me and smoother my mouth then call the cops on me or drag me by the hair as a pre-teen she says "your father snuck into your room at night and whispered that into your ear." she also goes crazy and lays on the guilt trip and says things like don''t call me again, look at all the good things I can do. When I first learned of her BPD ten years ago like you it was a life saver bc I could know when I was right and wrong. There is a name for this madness. Her madness will continue and i have gotten used to the patterns and are am no longer hurt or angry at her patterns as deeply as before I just know now she is messed up and this has given me tools to handle it. Mute mostly and low contact while she puts on a show and I can only say positive things then I get smoothered in what a loving daughter I am. In person she still pushes your buttons and has big crazy meltdowns. You have to be manipulative back in a way with them which is the most fustrating for an honest real person like yrself I'm sure. You cant have a real heart to heart and I know with my mom when I do tell her anything personal it comes back to bite me in the ass. This is the hardest thing now at the end of the day not having a mom you can honestly talk to or one who honestly really wants whats best for you always. I feel for you because I understand. I suggest the book Stop Walking On Eggshells. I'm at the point now where her being BPD has given me great clarity that I was really never in the wrong and if i am I know how to apologize with her. I know how to handle her. These boards helped a ton too at first because you can see its a pattern of their behavior and not you. My biggest problem now is like you mentioned how to build boundaries for myself and make my self-esteem that was never built and often crushed strong. I'm not totally sure how to do this yet. I'm sorry yr suffering and have suffered but understanding BPD will prob. be a blessing in your life.

[daughter86]

Thank you all for sharing with me. It makes me feel a lot better to know I am not alone in feeling this way. I totally get what you mean when you say you almost have to manipulate back. You can't be transparent and you have to be avoidant in a way and it's very frustrating when it feels like in any other circumstance that would be the wrong thing to do. My therapist said you can sometimes tell when someone has BPD because after a session with them you feel like you've been punched in the gut. Now imagine growing up with someone like this and how many times we have been metaphorically punched in the gut! So I imagine it will be a long process of healing but I am glad to have found a resource to find some information and get some support. Thanks!

[Star0009]

Tregonsee a therapist thought my sister is also BPD. I don;t know bc she talks to me for hours and we have fun talking but she refuses to tells me anything about her life while I'm an open book. She acts like she is mentally healthy and never apologizes. I'm always the one apologizing. I know she loves me but in person she is constantly acting like she has this secret better life. Last time I saw her she told me I was too old looking now to have long hair. I think I was only 36 at the time and my hair was to my shoulder. She has very  long hair and is only 4 years younger than me but is constantly talking about "my generation" as if she comes from a totally different generation. She then spent the whole time taking selfies while we were out together and sending them to her bf of the month but acting like her life was so much better and secret and I couldn't know anything about it. She is constantly posturing and smirking to herself. This was actually better than most visits. I later got mad and blew up on her in a text after she left that my hair looks fine and I look fine. In a nice way but i was angry. She then sent it to my brother common theme who said 'how mean I am to her'. After I texted her that I apologized  for getting upset multiple times but she cut me off without speaking to me for over a year leaving me in lots of pain. She started talking to me again as if nothing happened.  I enjoy talking to her on the phone somewhat but with her its all about looks and how her age group is lost in life (again shes only 4 years younger).   When I told her my Mom had BPD she thinks she has NPD as well and I agree. Just last night I think she is trying to imply I have BPD I think because she keeps telling me every conversation that there is a range of BPD like everything and that they are actually nice people and I should look up anger. This is bc like my mom she pokes at every button on me, competes with me, put me down until I explode and yell at her and then she runs off even in tears sometimes usually to my other brother who comes to me asking why I'm so mean. I end up apologizing but she sits there giving me the silent treatment. I fear now even being around her in person bc I feel like crap about myself. My Mom would physically attack me or push my buttons as a very shy kid until I would explode in anger and  then drive to her work place and run inside crying and they would come up to the car and scold me for being a bad daughter. Its the same pattern. I can't say if my sister is BPD bc she keeps her whole life secret. Maybe these patterns she just repeats with me but I don't know. Its hard to walk away bc she is my younger sister and my parents made me like a mother to her I know she loves me and we can have fun conversations on the phone but she is very secretive, always kind of comparing herself as better and trying to fit me in a box and dismissive of people who abuse me in my life. Even laughing at me when I said people hazed me and got sarcastic saying "I'm not gonna talk to you if you use the word hazing". Writing this out now I can see this is not ok but I do know she loves me but she also is incapable I think of having a healthy relationship with me and I don't have the heart to walk away

[Star0009]

oh I like the punched in the gut thing. Thats a pretty easy way to sum up yr in bad company if the person has BPD or not

[2horribleparents]

Apologies for the long response... .

I feel like I could have written all of these posts... .
I had a rollercoaster relationship with my mother also. Basically, you're heading up if you are conforming and she feels like she is in control but you come crashing down the moment you have a differing opinion, question her or refuse to go along with her lies.
There are times now even as an adult where I do or say something or behave a certain way which is purely to pacify her. My therapist said that when I leave her and I feel angry at her that I am really angry at myself for not standing up for myself and letting myself be pushed around. But I have always lived by the saying 'never argue with an idiot they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience' also I think I am emotionally exhausted and you just need to pick your battles. When she is pissed she is out to get you and will go to all lengths to make sure you feel pain and punishment it is just not worth the consequences when she can never be wrong and somehow she is always the victim of everybody else. She even enlists my dad and especially my sister to act on her behalf.
Whenever I went to question my parents behaviour when I was younger I would very quickly stop myself and feel guilty for questioning whether they loved me 'my parents have done so much for me, my education, my first car, holidays etc' I realise now that was my mother teaching me not to question their behaviour and to accept the emotional abuse.
It was when I became a mother myself I realised the degree and extent of how hurtful and abusive both of my parents were because I knew that there was no way that i would ever want my child to feel the way that I felt or that I would say the things to them that were said to me.
My mum also has stated many times how close we 'used' to be. It frustrates me because I feared her as a child. I had no choice or options back then and did what I had to do to 'survive' in the household with 2 personality disordered parents.
I too never developed a sense of identity as everything always revolved around my parents and keeping them happy and meeting their expectations or trying to protect them from their 'problems' (Which I now understand how wrong it is to burden a child with adult problems). I am trying to find myself now but I realise I am still very lost especially without any healthy role models.

Thats great you are having a chance to reconnect with your father though it is unfair and selfish of your mother to have robbed you both of that time. You are lucky to have at least one healthy parent. I hope he offers you support and the unconditional love that everyone should grow up feeling from their parents.

I do feel crazy at times, it really does your head in. These are people that you don't question when you are little because it is perfectly natural for little children to believe that all parents, teachers, police officers, doctors and nurses are trustworthy. Part of the abuse has also been them manipulating us through their behaviours since we were young so that they could have things how they wanted it, to suit them and remain in control because everything should revolve around them.

My parents are both complete gaslighters. They can have witnessed the other say/do something to you and deny, deny, deny that it ever happened. My sister I am starting to think has BPD too (she is just a mini mum) and she will join in with my parents and they will say 'I don't remember' or 'I am not getting involved'. When I have 3 people ganging up on me, denying things, telling me 'you have a very distorted version of the truth' or 'poor you' I definitely do question myself and I think it has to do with low self esteem that is a result of the emotional abuse. I have even questioned if all 3 of them are normal and that I am the one with the personality disorder... .because how could I be normal and have the other 3 people in my family all agreeing with each other that I am bad, I am doing wrong by them etc!

I also had tried approaching my mum when I was younger about things that she did and said and talk to her about how that made me feel thinking if I spoke to her about it she might be more mindful. This was obviously before I had any clue that she had a personality disorder and that I couldn't trust her with my feelings or to be truthful etc it was always met with 'oh poor you, you've had such a hard life' or 'I am such a bad mother I can't do anything right' or 'well I don't remember but if I did that you must have done something to upset me' and a rage and it would always come back to bite me.

It's always about them and what they feel and how it affects them, they can never be wrong or take responsibility its everybody elses fault and they are the victim of you or their behaviour is 100% justified (according to them).

I do have experience with trying to process and heal from trauma and it being all about my mum.
I was sexually abused, it started when I was 3-4yrs and went for approximately 10yrs. The first time my older cousin abused me I walked straight up to my mum and said 'Mummy, ***** just showed me his willy' my mum turned to my aunt (who had been sitting next to her the whole time) and said 'he wouldn't do that would he?' my aunt said 'no' and my mum proceeded to tell me not to fib and go back and play with him, needless to say he then knew he could get away with blue murder and he started threatening me not to say anything. I then from 3-4yrs old had to start dealing with this and the trauma of it on my own until finally I said something 20yrs later... .it was all about how hurt mum was. 'I know you hate me and blame me for it'... .in those few words it became about me now consoling mum because she feels sad and it affects her. She has never given me the chance to talk about how it affected me etc as recently as a few months ago she said to me 'I don't think you realise how much you being abused affected me and how much pain it has caused me' I should also add that my grandparents, Aunt and Uncle did not standby me. When my mum started telling my extended family about what had happened and how the rest of the family had reacted my extended family were very supportive and had empathetic responses about what I had been through (I never went in to detail to anyone) then because people were being compassionate towards me to much focus was on me and... .my mum all of the sudden had a supposed memory out of nowhere and decided she too was sexually abused when she was young! So she needed to seek counselling and when we no longer spoke with her parents or sibling it was 'her family that had abandoned her' and not 'our family who had abandoned us'.
They twist and manipulate the facts to make themselves look good, look right and appear to be the victim or for attention.

I am sorry that you had to go through this and wish you strength in your recovery  
 

[Woolspinner2000]

Hi daughter86, 

Does anyone else have any experience with trying to process trauma and having a parent with BPD try to tell you things didn't happen, not take responsibility, or try to become the victim of trauma they caused? And has anyone experienced feeling like they can't trust their own mind and memories?

Oh yes! I would add to this that I have learned to also not trust my feelings. These are the things that are the building blocks for our struggle as adult survivors of a pwBPD. One of my favorite books is the one you mentioned reading, Surviving a Borderline parent. I am so glad that you are beginning to find validation within the pages. Have you had a chance to take a look at our list to the right hand side of the board? ---->>  Anything you click on opens up into a larger window. I am glad to hear that you have a T walking alongside you as you travel this journey. Now you have us as well. 

And to 2horribleparents, Welcome to the board!

 
Wools

[Star0009]

2horribleparents
Your post resonated with me as well. Sounds like my Mom. I'm so sorry for your abuse. At 13 years old I told my Mom I walked in on a babysitter with his penis out and my younger siblings touching it. He asked if I wanted to touch it. I put one finger on it and ran away to tell my friends. I was prob about 6 when it happened. My Mom gasped and said "Don't make up such crazy things". Then like ten years later she insisted her only friend from high school who was from a part of town like an hour away and a whole different social area and age range knew this babysitter out of nowhere taking me off guard. I just ignored her when she said this because it was so outlandish and she was trying to get me upset. Who knows if they know each other. I will never know the truth and don't want to know she will only use it to hurt me more. I still don't think my younger siblings know this happened. They were so young and I pray I saw the worst of it. I'm so sorry you had to go through that and I understand the added pain of your Mom's abuse of what happened to you.

[daughter86]

It's pretty crazy making when someone is able to take your trauma or something that happened to you while you were a child and they were an adult and somehow convince you it was more traumatic for them than it was for you. Right now I am a ball of anxiety because my mom would not stop texting me yesterday about why I have been distant. She is saying things like if you dont want to be around me you can or should just tell me that. I told her I was sick (which I am) and would get back to her later but she just kept texting me so I ignored her texts after that. I have verbally asked for space before and said I was working on things in therapy and needed some space to sort through all of it and it did not go well, as you can imagine. She becomes really hostile and aggressive and tries to use my son, her grandson, as a bargaining chip. She will throw a tantrum and say I am keeping him from her and she wants to pick him up and take him somewhere. Even though she doesn't make much effort outside of when she is having a tantrum, it all of the sudden becomes an emergency and she has to see my son. I have sometimes said no you can't see him either and sometimes I have said yes you can take him to lunch or something and then bring him back. The issue I am having right now is I  know that there is no way I can communicate that I do in fact need space without it becoming a major emotional altercation. I have answered her texts when I felt it necessary and i have been pleasant but she obviously can sense, and correctly, that I am entering another period of needing space from her. Does anyone have any experience that went even MILDLY NOT TERRIBLE when telling a parent with BPD they need some space? I have put her texts on mute for the first time in my 32 years on this earth and I feel both empowered but also terribly anxious and guilty. What do you do when they keep confronting you? I don't want to be a liar and say no everything is fine I am just busy that's why I say no every single time you ask me to do something. I don't want it to become about what I am going through and sharing personal things with her. I don't know if I should say, actually I don't think that I can just tell you when I need space and have that be ok since she is saying that I can just tell her. For a person that usually has really strong gut instincts on how to deal with people and difficult people especially pretty well, I always feel at a loss with her. What would seem logical, understandable, fair, and normal is not realistic when it comes to a parent with BPD. And realizing now how much I fear her and the anxiety that comes with that I'm struggle knowing what to say and what not to say to do what I need to do to take care of myself. I don't want to get into emotional upheaval with her or pour my heart out to her because she is unsafe. And when she feels abandoned she fights dirty so I am very afraid for what is coming my way with each hour that passes that I am ignoring her. Any advice? I'm going to post this in a new topic too just to try and get some more support or input on this one. Thanks! It's nice to know I am not alone on this crazy making journey.

[DaughterOfHera]

DAUGHTER86... .Boy, do I recognize what you're describing.  Yes, that's my mother too, and her sister.  One of my counsillors turned me onto information regarding GASLIGHTING.  I found this to be helpful to a certain extent.  For me, at least the mental awareness is now there regarding my mother's and aunt's deflecting and twisting, though the emotional and psychological trauma that this has caused me has not gone away... .in fact I feel it's worsened for me with age.

It's wonderful that you are recognizing it!  Think back to the time before you were able.  Now you are further ahead.  There's still a healing journey to go through, but at least now you have a place to start. Do you have exercises that you can practice to help you sort what was reality and what was fantasy / denial / deflecting? 

I still don't know what to do about the trust issue, particular self trust.  I wish you ease and healing with this.  So far, I've tried writing down my memories (even joined a memoir writing group) and then putting them away for a bit.  When I come back, I ask myself if I still have these memories or have they changed.  If I still have the exact same memory, I add it to a list of "likely true" memories.  I try comparing them to my mother's stories about the same times, and then see how I feel.  For me, the most compelling truths are when I can state for sure that know I am right (and don't believe my mother's versions) is if there are indisputable factors, other people who were present and can validate, or if my memories remain exact.  It can be tough to learn to trust your own mind again.  I'm glad that you are accessing therapy with professionals that can guide you through your healing journey.  I send you understanding.

[2horribleparents]

Woolspinner2000... .Thank you

Star0009... .Much appreciated. When you mentioned that your mum caught you off guard when she brought up the babysitter, my mum does that type of thing too.
I have started to notice a pattern... It is usually something that I have previously tried to discuss with her that I experienced or was looking for validation/support from her and upset about at the time of trying to turn to her (basically expecting my mother to be loving and supportive like a normal mother... .silly me) at the time of me turning to her about it she would strip me emotionally raw and get all of the information and then be dismissive and invalidating and say things like 'what did you do to make them treat you like that?' 'You must have done something' or start talking about her and her pain. The pattern I have noticed is when I start to distance or assert myself/take control of my own life it is like she senses loosing her control and she randomly brings up that 'something' that I had tried to turn to her about to either use it against me or bring that hurt up to the surface and leave me feeling raw. Have you heard of the term emotional vampire?


daughter86... .I completely get your anxiety, you are not alone. My mum does the same thing.
If I try to distance myself its like she senses it and it enrages her because she feels she is loosing her control. It is always about her and how she feels and it's like she knows exactly which buttons to press to keep you in her control. It feels like a catch 22 doesn't it? On one hand you know whats right for you is to have space and on the other the drama and the rage makes you wonder if its worth it. You are probably feeling emotionally exhausted after all of these years

I understand. It's one thing for your mum to say if you don't want to be around me thats fine you can tell me but you know your mum and her patterns and I imagine that is why you are feeling sick and anxious because you know there are consequences if you do not tell her what she wants to hear or do what she would like done. They have ruled us by the fear of the unpredictability of their moods since we were babes.
I know if my mum was to say that to me I would not feel safe or ok to tell her the truth and do what is best for me. She does not want the truth, she would just be looking for a way to start preaching 'poor me, after all I have done for you' and to tell her friends and the extended family how hurt she is by me and she 'doesn't know what she has done to deserve this', essentially she would just be trying to gain sympathy and attention and she does always like to feel she has an army assembled incase she decides to go to war. She would keep going until she was satisfied that I owed her an apology because she was so hurt.

My mother is very possessive of my daughter, to be honest I just think she wants narcissistic supply from the poor child. I also don't trust the dialogue she uses with her as it is not a child's job to make an adult feel better nor should they be burdened with adult problems. I try to limit her alone time with her because at the end of the day I do not trust that women. My therapist has also reminded me that I am not obliged to have my daughter spend time with anyone if I do not feel it is in her best interests or safety and no one gets to dictate to me about what I do with our child. She has two parents that love her unconditionally and that is what matters most. People that don't understand the level of emotional abuse my mum has put me through are only focused on 'thats her granddaughter' but if she was a normal healthy mother/grandmother you wouldn't hesitate to have a positive role model around your child.

My experience in getting space from my mother... .with the encouragement of my therapist we moved overseas for my husbands career and so we could be together as a family and he wasn't traveling back and forth and so we could get away from the negativity of our families. There was no discussion about I need space just a 'we are moving for his job so we can be together as a family' most people responded with 'how exciting' and 'thats nice you will all be together because it would be hard being apart so much' well... .apparently if you are my mother that is not an acceptable reason and how dare we make a life decision without consulting her so she has made it in to a big drama that she is a victim of us because we left and that there was more to it then just that. My father never said goodbye and hasn't spoken to me since we moved no merry christmas not even to my daughter and not even a happy birthday. Mum has contacted my therapist and went to see her in the hope that she would get information, she has tried to talk to anyone she knows that I was close with and tell them fabricated stories about how we hurt her when we left. I have heard back from some of the people and when she came to visit earlier this year I was transferring photos on to her phone and saw some extremely hurtful text messages about me between her and her cousin who is BPD also. I felt very betrayed when I read the untruthful things that were being said about me because I had distanced myself, I had not done anything to hurt anyone. It is great being in a different country and having distance though she is now talking about coming to visit so I am riddled with anxiety also. When she came last time I actually got my husband to take some time off work to avoid me having to be alone with her because she is especially horrible to me when there are no witnesses. I literally fear her.

Its not very brave of me but I find when she keeps confronting me I avoid her. There is no reasoning with her.

I also have very strong instincts about people and how to deal with them. My therapist said this is because I had to learn to read people from a young age to navigate and survive in my household because of both of my parents unpredictable moods and behaviour.

I completely understand your feelings of fear and anxiety, just remember you are the normal one and it is your mother who is irrational and has abnormal behviour. I wish you peace and strength on your journey.