Feeling like I’ve made progress...finally

[JNChell]

It will be a year at the end of October since the final break between S3’s mother and I. I was severely depressed, scorned, bitter, angry (some of this is still present) and very sad for what felt like a very long time. It felt that way because what I described can be condensed into one word. Dread. Emotional pain feels endless when in the throes of it, but it does get better. This has happened for me this week. I feel a bit elated, but mostly tired now.

I’m finally identifying reasons why I should stay as far away as I can, which is difficult with a child involved, but possible. Without going into drawn out details, I’ve recognized patterns. Not just in her, but in her family. I also realize and accept that she is deeply enmeshed in this dynamic and will never remove herself from it without a severe and tragic occurrence. Part of her mold is taught misandry. No man can compete with or overcome that.

If I’m correct in my feelings, I think that I’m actually coming out of the FOG. It’s a feeling of relaxation, stillness and simply feeling tired and worn out in a good way. My muscles have relaxed. Perhaps the adrenaline and cortisol are finally starting to reach normal functioning levels again.

I don’t feel the anxiety over her now. The thought of her sleeping with other men doesn’t feel the same anymore. That feeling is inching towards indifference. I worry about our Son and how many men he may potentially be exposed to, but I can’t control that. I can control who I am as a father for him.

Sitting here now and typing this makes me sit back and just say “WOW! It felt so personal for a while, which my situation is personal to me, but the similarities and how immersed in my own situation that I was.

We reach common ground here through arriving with our own personal experience, we talk through the similarities and try to help one another to move forward because we want that for all involved. Synergy.

I just wanted to say that it will and does get better. Stay the course. One foot in front of the other.

[Cromwell]

Hi JNChell

I get the same feeling nowadays, the fog becoming uplited and it is anxiety that has really been the biggest culprit in affecting the quality of choices I was able to make.

Im pleased to hear your in a better place and finding your energy coming back, that sort of fatigue feels like the smallest of tasks seem larger than life.

I can join in to say it does get better but it does take work, to bring about change.

It really helps inspire me to read positive stories here, there was a time when I was so deep in the fog, I saw no way out of it, ever, if anyone can relate to it, it feels real, Im glad to look back with relief that it wasnt so - I got better when I started to find solutions to these issues; and seeing them as issues and not fatalistic catastrophes. Taking back control and making the changes that seemed necessary.

Ive reached indifference to my ex JNChell, but I think the biggest cause of that is she is completely out of my life, I dont have any updates, there is zero contact or reason to. Out of sight out of mind is true for me to a big extent. Do I care who she is sleeping with? I dont know who, if anyone she is with at all; ignorance is not only bliss, in my case even if I did know - it doesnt matter to me; her life is completely irrelevant. The focus shifed away from her and to myself, it took time when all the drama fixates another into centre stage.

I know you have your son to consider about, and the interactions that go with it all, but overall when I read so many stories including my own ones - how much everything was still about the partner, their actions, their unpleasant behaviours and what to do about them. How little in comparison is there the impression given that, "actually I know im drawn in to all this BS but, actually I have a life to and id like a bit more quality to it then endlessly dealing with emotional intensive drama".

I guess ive just became happy if nothing more than to have some peace and quiet to have the luxury of entertaining my own thoughts, needs and desires again. Everything was about her and if it wasnt, it was orchestrated to be each time.

Yep one foot in front of another, lifes a marathon not a sprint. Bet it feels good to start seeing some progress though? pleased for you.

[JNChell]

Hey, Cromwell. Thanks for reaching out. I spend most of my time here on the PSI board now, but started out here. I read a lot of your posts. You really have a way with words and articulation. It’s like reading a page from a book. Just wanted to pass that along.

it is anxiety that has really been the biggest culprit in affecting the quality of choices I was able to make.

Same for me. I have a diagnosed anxiety disorder. Did you find that a lot of the choices that you speak of, i.e., with your ex were simply to diffuse the situation because of anxiety? Your’s and her’s. Or are you speaking about after the relationship was finally done? I imagine that the stalking had to be very unsettling.

I can join in to say it does get better but it does take work, to bring about change.

Thank you for reiterating this. It’s true. There are a lot of lurkers reading the content of this forum. We think of you all as well, lurkers. We know you’re out there.   I read for two months before I posted. I had to build up to it. Many of us that exit these relationships in one form or another feel like we’re Borderline at the end. After the stress hormones and the emotions settle we realize that we were emotionally hijacked.

there was a time when I was so deep in the fog, I saw no way out of it, ever, if anyone can relate to it,

I can relate. I felt like my life was pretty much over. I couldn’t see the positive in much. It’s like this. I saw myself as a 41 year old man with a 3 year old son. Not a negative, but a factor. I love my Son, and I wouldn’t hesitate to go to extreme measures for him. What I’m saying is that I’m no longer a desirable man to a woman my age. If I date again, it will be with women very close to my age. I’ve had a pattern of attracting younger women. I’m here, so that’s done. Anyway, women my age have already raised their kids. I’m not a prospect. I’m a liability. I’m slowly coming to terms with this and how I can effectively meet my needs. Do I become celibate? That’s not an option. My days are numbered, and I want to experience love and pleasure before my card is pulled.

seeing them as issues and not fatalistic catastrophes.

Thanks for sharing this. It felt like the end game. It wasn’t. It was a blessing.

I know you have your son to consider about, and the interactions that go with it all, but

There are no “buts” here. The only thing here is a son and his father.

I guess ive just became happy if nothing more than to have some peace and quiet to have the luxury of entertaining my own thoughts, needs and desires again. Everything was about her and if it wasnt, it was orchestrated to be each time.

You’re describing self care. Loving ourselves. I’m glad that you’re there again, Cromwell. Yeah, we weren’t allowed to have much mental and emotional space with them.

Did you open to your ex the way that you open up here? You know you’re good here, but I’m asking because, in my experiences, they come at our vulnerabilities with a fillet knife.

[Lostinthedesert]

I so appreciate reading both of your posts in terms of hope for the future and how slowly, every so slowly, it does get better!  I hit the three month mark and two months of NC with my ex.  I found that with the help of this forum and other written materials, counseling, and such supportive and loving friends I have accepted the fact that this relationship turned into something I would have never wanted to be involved in, so had to look hard at why I did get involved.  I have discovered that healing will not happen without turning the focus on myself and stopping the obsessive thinking about her.  While I am doing all the work, turning off the thoughts is the hard part.  I love reading that you no longer care who you ex is with or what she is doing!  That is the blessing, as mine has not reached back to me either and I have been so committed to maintaining the NC, so I don't really know either.  Anyway, I so want all of us here recovering to find that eventual peace of mind again, the knowledge we do deserve a healthy loving relationship with an adult, and that we will heal.  I hope everyone here can hold on to that hope as each of us slogs through the excruciating pain to the other side.

[BeagleGirl]

What I’m saying is that I’m no longer a desirable man to a woman my age. If I date again, it will be with women very close to my age. I’ve had a pattern of attracting younger women. I’m here, so that’s done. Anyway, women my age have already raised their kids. I’m not a prospect. I’m a liability.

JNChell,
I am so glad to hear that you are finally able to recognize the progress you’ve been making. I’ve had one of those weeks as well and can really relate to that peaceful exhaustion.

I have a few more things to say but limited time so I’ll just address your assumption quoted above. I’m going to encourage you to back away from that assumption and move towards a belief that the right woman will see your young child as a bonus and not a liability. Women like that are out there. I’m a 42 year old woman who is 3 years from being an “empty nester” but I would leap at the chance to step parent a toddler/child. You just need to catch a woman like me before her own kids start bringing home grandkids.
BG

[JNChell]

BG. Then where are the people like you?

[Cromwell]

Same for me. I have a diagnosed anxiety disorder. Did you find that a lot of the choices that you speak of, i.e., with your ex were simply to diffuse the situation because of anxiety? Your’s and her’s. Or are you speaking about after the relationship was finally done? I imagine that the stalking had to be very unsettling.

Its all attenuated  filtered out anxiety, coping mechanisms developed in ancient history. Your the sort of rare person ive found JNChell who I dont need to go into the fine details to believe that your someone who will understand. One therapist identified it  before I met my ex. The baseline is set way above what it should be - id carried anxiety for so long that I never exhibited the symptoms - I didnt see it as anxiety, dangerous, stressful jobs were "fun".

it was my ex didnt phase me - but should have, I didnt ever walk on eggshells as such - I didnt get embarrased at her public theatrics - the result was, "BPD Lite" - she stopped bothering. I was a good challenge for her misandry (well spotted btw) I suspected the same but shelved it.

I can join in to say it does get better but it does take work, to bring about change.

Thank you for reiterating this. It’s true. There are a lot of lurkers reading the content of this forum. We think of you all as well, lurkers. We know you’re out there.   I read for two months before I posted. I had to build up to it. Many of us that exit these relationships in one form or another feel like we’re Borderline at the end. After the stress hormones and the emotions settle we realize that we were emotionally hijacked.

I remember just seeing your guitar profile pic JNChell, reading the stuff on here, but my mind at that time was a complete brainwash.  I worked hard to learn as much as possible as the key towards removing all those fear based debilitating emotions; rooted in ignorance. We fear what we cant understand.

emotionally hijacked - its stuff like that which are like little gems that stick with me through the day. I dont think of the relationship anymore, its been replaced by a panoply of statements ive extracted overthat "override" those ruminations. They just rise up like a defensive smoke screen. It automated itself.

some mouth though, all that was missing was the head revolving around.

[BeagleGirl]

BG. Then where are the people like you?

I'm going to wax a bit eloquent on this.

Today I will be at church, sitting next to an elderly woman who lost her husband 4 years ago and her son 4 months ago.  She has no idea what it is to go through a divorce and I have no idea what it is to lose an adult child, but we understand eachother's pain and we know how precious it is to have someone hold on just a little bit longer when they hug you.

Up until recently, I would be the woman teaching children your son's age in Sunday school.  I intend to be doing that again soon, but for now I am the new woman in the adult Sunday school class listening not only for the wisdom of the scriptures, but also for the stories the other members share about their lives and who they are so that I can build connection.

I'm the woman wandering around the hardware store with head held high and a purposeful air and fragile confidence as I look for the parts and tools that dBPDxh would have been able to locate in his sleep.  I'm also the woman standing in her yard sweating over the stupid weed trimmer that won't seem to start no matter what position I set the choke at or how many times I pull the starter cord.  And I'm the woman who rebuilt the rock wall and tilled up all the weeds from a flowerbed dBPDxh allowed to go to seed while we were separated that is now spilling over with flowers. 

I'm the woman whose eyes gravitate to your son out in public, who can't help but smile at his antics, quiet concentration on a task, or even his tantrum. 

I'm the woman out jogging along the neighborhood streets or in a nice park, trying to keep my body strong and dissipate my own anxieties. 

I'm the woman sitting with her friends at a restaurant, unashamed of both laughter and tears in public.

I'm the woman who has a few pictures and a thoughtful but playful profile statement on a couple of dating sites.  I won't ever message you, and I don't respond to "Hey gorgeous" messages, but if you share a bit about yourself and ask a question that indicates you read my profile and can use proper punctuation, we might have a conversation starter.

I'm the woman who is quietly working to grieve the marriage I lost and the one I wanted but never had.  I'm in my T's office trying to figure out how to come out of this with greater discretion, resilience and compassion.  I'm in the waiting room of S15's T's office, hoping to help him build those qualities without suffering needless pain. 

Most relevant to your question... .I'm the woman spending time getting to know who she is and what she wants.  I'm working on knowing my value, so I can know if a man is undervaluing me.  I am looking at the unhealthy patterns I contributed to in my marriage so that I can recognize them in future relationships and avoid/correct them.  I'm surrounding myself with people whose love for me is great enough to tell me the truth when I'm blinded to my own flaws or the warning signs in a new relationship.  I'm taking time to grieve my losses and rejoice in rediscovered pleasures.  I'm nurturing my body, mind, and spirit with work, play, and silence. 

If you are doing the same things you are bound to meet someone who is right for you and your son.  The key is to know what you're looking for and not be distracted by what is more readily available but requires compromise.  This is going to sound a bit arrogant, but women like me are worth working and waiting for.  My philosophy is that it's better to be "hungry" a little longer than to spoil an amazing feast by eating candy. 

BG

[JNChell]

Hey there, Lostinthedesert. How are you? I’m glad that you’re joining us.

I have accepted the fact that this relationship turned into something I would have never wanted to be involved in

You really hit the nail on the head here. You know, retrospection is really something. For me personally, this makes me realize that I haven’t really known what I’ve been doing when it comes to relationships. I’ve had a couple of pleasant ones, but for the most part it’s been chaos, confusion and pain. Obviously, the focus has been on S3’s mom, but you’re right. Looking at it now, I want nothing to do with her. She told me in roundabout ways what I was in store for. The thing is, during the idealization, she made me feel like the exception. I also have to identify that I was unknowingly desperate for love and connection. I’m glad that you brought this into the conversation. It’s a real help.

turning off the thoughts is the hard part.

I couldn’t agree more. This is another aspect that has simply became exhausting. I’m to the point now that if I start to ruminate, I ask myself “why am I lending my mental and emotional real estate to one of my abusers?” I’m finding that helpful. This is a person that, for the sake of not feeling her own shame, provoked mine in disgusting ways. She doesn’t get a place inside. She’s locked out for good. She is the mother of our Son, but my respect stops there. That is my emotional boundary.

Anyway, I so want all of us here recovering to find that eventual peace of mind again, the knowledge we do deserve a healthy loving relationship with an adult, and that we will heal.  I hope everyone here can hold on to that hope as each of us slogs through the excruciating pain to the other side.

Thank you so much for expressing this. I’m adopting this as my feel good thought for the day. We want this for you as well, Lostinthedesert.

[JNChell]

Hi again, BG! I hope your day has been a good one so far.

You just need to catch a woman like me before her own kids start bringing home grandkids. Smiling (click to insert in post)

I will keep this in mind. Thanks for the encouragement.

I'm going to wax a bit eloquent on this.

Today I will be at church, sitting next to an elderly woman who lost her husband 4 years ago and her son 4 months ago.  She has no idea what it is to go through a divorce and I have no idea what it is to lose an adult child, but we understand eachother's pain and we know how precious it is to have someone hold on just a little bit longer when they hug you.

Up until recently, I would be the woman teaching children your son's age in Sunday school.  I intend to be doing that again soon, but for now I am the new woman in the adult Sunday school class listening not only for the wisdom of the scriptures, but also for the stories the other members share about their lives and who they are so that I can build connection.

I'm the woman wandering around the hardware store with head held high and a purposeful air and fragile confidence as I look for the parts and tools that dBPDxh would have been able to locate in his sleep.  I'm also the woman standing in her yard sweating over the stupid weed trimmer that won't seem to start no matter what position I set the choke at or how many times I pull the starter cord.  And I'm the woman who rebuilt the rock wall and tilled up all the weeds from a flowerbed dBPDxh allowed to go to seed while we were separated that is now spilling over with flowers. 

I'm the woman whose eyes gravitate to your son out in public, who can't help but smile at his antics, quiet concentration on a task, or even his tantrum. 

I'm the woman out jogging along the neighborhood streets or in a nice park, trying to keep my body strong and dissipate my own anxieties. 

I'm the woman sitting with her friends at a restaurant, unashamed of both laughter and tears in public.

I'm the woman who has a few pictures and a thoughtful but playful profile statement on a couple of dating sites.  I won't ever message you, and I don't respond to "Hey gorgeous" messages, but if you share a bit about yourself and ask a question that indicates you read my profile and can use proper punctuation, we might have a conversation starter.

I'm the woman who is quietly working to grieve the marriage I lost and the one I wanted but never had.  I'm in my T's office trying to figure out how to come out of this with greater discretion, resilience and compassion.  I'm in the waiting room of S15's T's office, hoping to help him build those qualities without suffering needless pain. 

Most relevant to your question... .I'm the woman spending time getting to know who she is and what she wants.  I'm working on knowing my value, so I can know if a man is undervaluing me.  I am looking at the unhealthy patterns I contributed to in my marriage so that I can recognize them in future relationships and avoid/correct them.  I'm surrounding myself with people whose love for me is great enough to tell me the truth when I'm blinded to my own flaws or the warning signs in a new relationship.  I'm taking time to grieve my losses and rejoice in rediscovered pleasures.  I'm nurturing my body, mind, and spirit with work, play, and silence. 

If you are doing the same things you are bound to meet someone who is right for you and your son.  The key is to know what you're looking for and not be distracted by what is more readily available but requires compromise.  This is going to sound a bit arrogant, but women like me are worth working and waiting for.  My philosophy is that it's better to be "hungry" a little longer than to spoil an amazing feast by eating candy. 

BG

BG, out of extreme concern, I strongly suggest that you drop what you’re doing immediately, pack a bag with necessities and immediately go into hiding! I feel that you have just exposed some highly classified information and that you may be in danger.

Thanks so much for this reply! It’s helped me to realize just how blindly I’ve been navigating the romance world. I also need to identify here that I haven’t been viewing myself in a healthy manner either, but that’s a subject for the PSI board.

My philosophy is that it's better to be "hungry" a little longer than to spoil an amazing feast by eating candy.

Love this!

[HopelessBroken]

JNChell, I know this isn’t what your post is about... .but I need to say, I’m a 41 year old successful, financially solid, educated, attractive woman with no kids and would see a man my age with a young child as a gift.

[JNChell]

Hey, Cromwell. I hope you’re having a good one.

The baseline is set way above what it should be - id carried anxiety for so long that I never exhibited the symptoms - I didnt see it as anxiety, dangerous, stressful jobs were "fun".

I don’t want to assume, but I think I get it. It has basically been your normal. Would that be accurate?

I was a good challenge for her misandry (well spotted btw) I suspected the same but shelved it.

One of the first  ’s that I can now identify was on our first date. These are her words. “All of the women in my family choose bad men.” The translation was, “you will eventually become a bad man.” Obviously, I shelved it as well. The few men that are/were a part of her family, looking back, are shut-ins. They didn’t really participate in the family dynamic as a whole collective. They didn’t attend family functions, etc. Again, being made to feel like the exception, and my rescuer mentality, I really put myself out there to be the “good” man. I was for a little while.

I remember just seeing your guitar profile pic JNChell, reading the stuff on here, but my mind at that time was a complete brainwash.  I worked hard to learn as much as possible as the key towards removing all those fear based debilitating emotions; rooted in ignorance. We fear what we cant understand.

Yeah, there is a special place in my heart for the Les Paul. I switched to Thomas because my Son is really into him for the time being.

I can empathize with the feelings of being brainwashed. In my personal situation, which I’m working through in therapy, I was being traumatized all over again.

I agree with what you say about ignorance. I’m sure you’ve seen Turkish sniffing around the boards. He has a very pragmatic and sensible saying. “We know what we know, and we don’t know what we don’t know.”

I dont think of the relationship anymore, its been replaced by a panoply of statements ive extracted overthat "override" those ruminations. They just rise up like a defensive smoke screen. It automated itself.

I do still think about the relationship. With our Son as part of it, it’s hard not to. I worry about him. I’ve read about the statistical risks involved for children from broken homes. I worry about her daughter often as well, but I have no control over that aspect. I miss her, but I’m letting go of her, just like I’ve had to let go of her mother.

I’m with you on the thought base that now overrides the relationship. The reasons why it will never be and never really was.

Thanks for engaging here, Cromwell. I’m getting a lot out of it.

[JNChell]

Hi HopelessBroken! Thank you for joining us.

JNChell, I know this isn’t what your post is about... .but I need to say, I’m a 41 year old successful, financially solid, educated, attractive woman with no kids and would see a man my age with a young child as a gift. Smiling

Thanks so much for this. It has me feeling a bit of hope. Thanks for helping to brighten my day. I hope that your’s is going well.