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Author Topic: Challenges with BPD Sister  (Read 431 times)
NBPDSister

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« on: November 05, 2018, 04:19:41 PM »

I find my sister really difficult to be around and I have diagnosed her (personally) as having BPD.
I’ve been scared to stand up to her or even just be honest with her ever since I was little. Part of this is that she has an insane temper but also she’s always in crisis and emotionally turbulent so even though she’s very confrontational I’ve been we felt strong enough to be confrontational back even if she’s saying or doing dangerous or irrational things.
In the last few years I have tried to speak out more as I think keeping quiet for fear of pushing her over the edge is just enabling her. It’s also completely false - a lot of the time she’s driving me insane, I don’t want to be around her and I’m just covering all that up with fake ness. It makes me despise myself as well as her.

My reaction to this whole episode was not normal I mainly just felt really angry at her and could not think of one thing to say that wouldn’t involve anger or blaming or making her feel guilty. The truth is that I can’t stand the dramatics the crisis the pity she feels for herself and her situation and the chaos of her life. My desire for a calm and peaceful life is completely discarded. The frustration I feel is unreal. On top of that I feel intense guilt because she’s the type of person that will go so over the top to help if you need it she can be completely and utterly selfless at times and very caring. I feel bad that I don’t have that same capacity but most of the time I just feel judgemental and anxious and tense around her. I’m reading ‘stop walking on eggshells’ and it’s dissipated my anger a bit. I understand that she doesn’t think the same way as I do and that she sees the world through a distorted lense and can’t help the way she acts. and that what I see as manipulative is her way of coping with her feelings of abandonment. I still feel so frustrated though that I can’t ever say how I feel without there either starting a war or her threatening to hurt herself.
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Harri
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« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2018, 05:36:56 PM »

Hi.  I am glad you posted.  That is a lot to deal with and a sister threatening/attempting suicide sounds awful. 

Excerpt
In the last few years I have tried to speak out more as I think keeping quiet for fear of pushing her over the edge is just enabling her. It’s also completely false - a lot of the time she’s driving me insane, I don’t want to be around her and I’m just covering all that up with fake ness. It makes me despise myself as well as her.
I used to do that with my mother.  It was an awful feeling.  I agree that not speaking up is enabling.  pwBPD (people with BPD) process emotions and situations differently, sometimes what we say, even when we're not upset, is taken the wrong way, often coming across as invalidating even when we try our best. 

What sort of relationship do you wish to have with your sister?  I ask because we have different tools that can help you but your choice will sort of direct which ones you should start with.  Is she ever physically abusive?    How old is her daughter?  Does she have more kids?  What about you?

Sorry for all the questions!     It helps if we have a better picture of your relationship.

Anyway, again, I am glad you posted.  We are a peer based support group but with more... .we focus on healing and taking care of the only thing we can control:  us.

Please feel free to jump into other posts.  Everyone here is supportive and has something to offer.   Welcome new member (click to insert in post)
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  "What is to give light must endure burning." ~Viktor Frankl
NBPDSister

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« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2018, 02:11:12 AM »

Hi Harri!
Thanks for the quick response!
Actually thinking about the kind of relationship I’d like to have is a really interesting and complicated question.  
The issue I have is that spending time around her can be quite tense for example she’ll scream at the dog or the kids (which she knows I hate) but she would never not do that just in order to make me feel comfortable. So here’s the issue as her response (as on Friday night) is always that that’s my problem and she wants to be accepted the way she is (I agree but then my only options are to suck it up and be uncomfortable or don’t spend time with her). Because of the kids I want to go there. Also from reading the book I don’t yet understand how I can set boundaries without making her feel bad.

It’s diffic to spend time with her because she doesn’t have any capacity for being uncomfortable or not liking things so you end up hanging my experience on her shoulders and hoping we’re in for a good rather than a bad ride. There are times also where she is the life and soul of the party she makes everything more fun and lively and amazing it’s just that the switch is never far away so I can’t trust it.
Finally, besides the drama - being around her can involve listening while she embellishes problems, feels that the whole world is against her and that she can’t do anything to improve the situation in times like these I just want to make her see the truth or suggest ways she can make things better but she’s not interested in that so I’m left just nodding along internally I am one person and externally another which feels awful and inauthentic.
Many thanks for reading my long and rambly message!
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Harri
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« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2018, 01:04:58 PM »

 
Excerpt
Also from reading the book I don’t yet understand how I can set boundaries without making her feel bad.

Hi.  The above is a big statement.  You can't control her emotions or her behaviors.  We say that over and over agin but seriously, you can't control her emotions or her behaviors.    

Boundaries are almost guaranteed to stir things up especially when they are new.  There are ways of saying things and making suggestions that are hardline or you can soften them up some or a lot but how the person responds is up to them.

So when you say you don't know how to set boundaries without making her feel bad, is it about hurting her feelings or is it about  her going into a rage or acting out?

I would start small(er).  Our Panda here said that boundaries can be as big or as small as we want them to be.  So, instead of focusing on something big like Christmas (when so many people are on edge), lets talk about the weekends when you want to visit. 
Excerpt
but she would never not do that just in order to make me feel comfortable.
You can ask her not to do something but yes, there is no guarantee she will listen.  So, it is important that you make your boundary about what *you* will do when she, for example, yells at the kids.  You can leave the room by excusing yourself (lots of people use the bathroom as an excuse   ), you can say I am uncomfortable with yelling so i am going in the next room.  You can say I find the yelling very upsetting so I am going home.  You can pretend you forgot to do something and leave... .the point is, it is not about getting her to stop or change her behavior.   It is about you changing yours. 

Boundaries are what we do to protect ourselves and live our values, by defining our own behavior.  They are not about controlling others' behavior.  In fact, in doing that, we violate their boundaries. Boundaries that rely only on our behavior are ones we can implement on our own.  They are much more successful with much less conflict than trying to control someone else.

Does that make sense?
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NBPDSister

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« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2018, 03:52:42 PM »

Yes that does make sense! And it also feels quite relieving that actually I just have to worry about myself and my own actions and behaviours. Do you think it would help to tell her that this is what I’m going to be working on or is that a bad idea?
Usually if I’m over there and she is shouting at the dog I might say ‘aww don’t shout at him’ but here I am telling her to stop doing something while trying to sound friendly and not offend her or make her feel like a bad person . It never works. So in the future I’ll say ‘I don’t enjoy seeing the dog being shouted at so I’m going to go outside’ that would feel so strange to me! Not taking responsibility for how my sister reacts is an almost impossible concept to think of but I will give it a try!
You asked what it is that I’m worried about and it is not the rage although that isn’t pleasant I can deal with that by walking away, raging back (not good I know but it’s an option!) the worse reaction than rage is the victim reaction such as Friday night/Saturday morning suicide threatening. She can seem so fragile all the time literally I don’t want to break the eggshells so I tread lightly. Regardless of how she’s acted at times, things she’s said my conviction to stand up for myself or the kids usually ends up in my feeling so guilty for adding to her pain that I question my conviction and cave in.
I have been in contact by text since Saturday but I haven’t rallied round, I have not been very sympathetic I’ve just said I’m
here if she needs me but I’ve kept my distance. That sounds really harsh but my instinct is telling me not to run. To the rescue (god knows what I’d do if my instinct was wrong!) today she text me and asked to meet me on Thursday. For her to come all the way to my work I’m guessing means she wants to talk - it’s not like her to want to discuss anything that’s caused a problem so I’m half expecting her to say she wants nothing more to do with me. Or she may want to discuss what happened. In that case do you think it would be useful for me to tell her that I want to work on setting boundaries/limits? I was thinking of saying to her that I want to have as peaceful and harmonious life as I can possibly have and that for us to have a relationship when I feel that there’s more drama than I am comfortable with I will remove myself from the situation. What do you think of that? Many many thanks I really appreciate your help!
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Harri
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« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2018, 05:01:33 PM »

Excerpt
Do you think it would help to tell her that this is what I’m going to be working on or is that a bad idea?
I would keep that info to myself for sure.  It could be used against you or distorted.  Many people have tried to explain they are doing stuff to hep and support the pwBPD but it almost never goes well.
Excerpt
So in the future I’ll say ‘I don’t enjoy seeing the dog being shouted at so I’m going to go outside’ that would feel so strange to me! Not taking responsibility for how my sister reacts is an almost impossible concept to think of but I will give it a try!
Yes, it will feel strange and that is okay.  It will feel wrong and awkward and bad but do it and keep doing it.  Do not be surprised if she gets upset or amps up her behavior.  That is a part of the whole process.  You will see extinction bursts where the bad behavior will increase when you begin to set boundaries... .stand firm and do not apologize or cave as that will only reinforce the worse behavior.

Boundaries take time and practice.  Start small, like with the dog, and then build your confidence and set the 'new' tone with your sister.

Excerpt
Regardless of how she’s acted at times, things she’s said my conviction to stand up for myself or the kids usually ends up in my feeling so guilty for adding to her pain that I question my conviction and cave in.
Feeling guilt is something that can improve over time.  Caving in only increases the bad behavior.  Suicide threats are tough.  What we recommend here is to say: 
"I really care about you. I just don't have the skills to help you when you feel like killing yourself. If you say you are going to kill yourself, I will take you take you to the emergency  department"

"I really care about you. I just don't have the skills to help you when you feel like killing yourself. If you say you are going to kill yourself, I will call an ambulance."

This shows care and love and is truthful right?  Has caving to her suicide threats worked so far?  Think about it.  With the above sueggstions you get to set boundaries that are in agreement with your personal values and show her compassion and truth.   

Excerpt
In that case do you think it would be useful for me to tell her that I want to work on setting boundaries/limits? I was thinking of saying to her that I want to have as peaceful and harmonious life as I can possibly have and that for us to have a relationship when I feel that there’s more drama than I am comfortable with I will remove myself from the situation. What do you think of that? Many many thanks I really appreciate your help!
I am not sure to be honest.  I think I would stay away from using words like boundaries and drama as it can sound like psych speak (boundaries) and can be taken very negatively (drama--- if you are ever with me and I am upset, use the word drama... .I dare you!    Same with trigger... .don't tell me I am triggered!)  Seriously though, that is me.  Lets see what others think too  I will be interested to hear their take.

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  "What is to give light must endure burning." ~Viktor Frankl
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« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2018, 11:48:30 PM »

I agree with Harri that telling her what you are working on would provide a target,  and it may be intentionally invalidating.

Did you talk to your niece about the event? What is her take on her mother and that situation? That certainly sounds scary.

Have you seen the validation tools here? They might help reduce the drama when you interact with her. I'm an only child but I have two kids,  and I can imagine it might be hard to adjust a communication style you've been used to your whole life. 

https://bpdfamily.com/content/communication-skills-dont-be-invalidating
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NBPDSister

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« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2018, 04:11:49 AM »

Thanks Turkish and Harri,
I’ve been reading the invalidation/validating tips and trying to put them into practice (over text) with my sister. For example if I ask how something went and she replies ‘Terrible because of x,y,z’ my usual reaction is to tryand find some poisitive instead but this I now understand is invalidating!

I think this could be really helpful but also very difficult because of my own personality traits it actually offends my worldview when I feel that she is not seeing any of the good in her life. But I will practice. She’s not happy with the support she’s getting from the mental health team so I asked her if she would consider going to the GP to discuss medication for now as she will most likely have to wait until she can see a therapist. She doesn’t want to take medication so I just dropped that subject. Usually I would push the issue as to me it makes no sense to not do everything you can to try and make yourself feel better. Then I remind myself we see the world very differently and her world doesn’t have to make sense to me.

Anyway I think things have calmed a lot - my sister has asked me to stop texting her and asking questions as it’s too much pressure and she wants to be in isolation. This is actually fine by me as it will give me time to keep reading and trying to wrap my head round everything and the advice from you all. I’ll make sure the kids know where I am and keep in touch with family who live closer to her.
Thanks again for the advice I’m happy to find this forum!
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Harri
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« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2018, 06:17:16 PM »

Excerpt
Then I remind myself we see the world very differently and her world doesn’t have to make sense to me.
Yes.  This separation of you and her (or anyone) is so important and so hard to remember. 

Does you niece know that you think her mom has BPD?  She might benefit from some of the techniques we offer here.

How old are her other kid(s)?

Giving your sister space to self soothe is a very good thing, especially when she asks for it.  When pwBPD dysregulate, there is little point in trying to communicate.  Prior to full dysregulation?  Sure, there are things you can try.  I'm glad to hear you will be taking the time to take care of you as well.
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« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2018, 12:18:28 PM »

NBPD sister wow, your story hit home here.  I feel my situation is similar, older sister whom bullied me as a child.  Became friends when she married and I was 13 she is 7 years older.  I thought all was great but until I was 30, she betrayed all my secrets, telling my parents and family every little secret I shared with her (that she encouraged) and she embellished the stories and in some cases lied.  I went NC with her for 7 years.  We tried on and off to be friends or civil but to no avail.  I found out she had been in psychiatric hospitals several times and probably has BPD/NPD thus the reason for all her drama.  Everything has always been about her.  She said the same stuff, except her how she is which means excepting lies are truth etc... .I really tried to tip toe around her this past year to remain in touch.  We even made rules.  In true fashion with a disordered individual, she broke all our well planned rules and she cut me off almost a year ago sending text after text and then blocking me so I could not reply... .again another red flag with disordered individuals.  My best advice to you as Harri mentioned practice grey rock if you must interact.  It can be learned and does get easier.  Also, you may just need to spend less time with her.  Trust me, PD's don't get better as people get older.  My sister sees psychiatrists or doctors and she still lies and causes trouble everywhere, even with her own kids with one having nothing to do with her.  Good luck and keep us posted!
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