Conflicted. Big change after incident of physical aggression.

[Rainbow1215]

I have been in an on and off relationship with someone who meets all the criteria for BPD for a couple of years now. Recently, I had to make a big change as he had an incidence of physical aggression and I felt the need to distance myself physically. Since then, we have been communicating via phone and online. I know I cannot control whether he gets help for the struggle he is facing with BPD but I am conflicted as to whether it is time to let this go and walk away. He has continued to mention that he wants a relationship with me and I want to offer him support, but every time I try to take care of myself he "punishes" me by ignoring me or trying to "ghost" me.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Harri]

Hi and welcome to the board.  We get it here so I am glad you posted.

Can you tell us more about the situation that caused you to, rightly so, pull away from him?  How often do you talk with him?  When you say you want to offer him support, what does that look like to you?

[Panda39]

I'll be honest and say I'm concerned for your safety if you return.  Past behavior is usually a pretty good indicator of future behavior.  I would pay attention to what he says vs what he does... .do they line up?

Panda39

[Rainbow1215]

I apologize for the lack of explanation. Recently before the incident I had started setting up more deliberate boundaries between myself and my ex and when another (what I would call) "rage" occurred, he became physically aggressive for the first time. I could tell that an argument would occur that day due to the stress of him going on a trip he was uncomfortable about. This happened right before he left and I removed myself immediately and have not seen him in person since. Initially, I spoke to him very rarely but the conversations started occurring more frequently in the past couple of weeks because things were going much more smoothly. Unfortunately, the holidays created another stressor for him.
Because of the aggression that happened, I know that I can't be around him unless he begins getting the help he needs from someone who is trained as I don't want to go back into the same, or a worse, situation so until then (if that ends up happening) it is just phone calls and online messaging. Which is where the "ghosting" comes in.

[Harri]

No need to apologize.  Do you think implementing boundaries on top of al the usual stress caused his escalation in behavior?  Panda is right to express concern and I am even more glad that you reached out here.
 

Because of the aggression that happened, I know that I can't be around him unless he begins getting the help he needs from someone who is trained as I don't want to go back into the same, or a worse, situation so until then (if that ends up happening) it is just phone calls and online messaging. Which is where the "ghosting" comes in.

Sometimes it takes a long time for there to be significant changes in behavior even after therapy is started.  I am not trying to discourage you, I just want you to have realistic expectations.  Once the abuse escalates to physical violence, even aggression, it tends to get worse if not addressed.

Where are you hoping your relationship will be in 3 months?  6 months?

[Rainbow1215]

Thank you both for reaching out to me  I have definitely heard that violence, unless addressed, gets worse. It was a huge shock to me that it had even happened. In what ways can this be effectively addressed (other than aforementioned therapy)? I am hoping that in 3 to 6 months he will start moving forward into therapy and I am taking many more self-care precautions than I did before the incident including getting therapy myself. I am hoping that he, since he keep stalking about restarting a relationship, begins to seek this help. I think it is equally likely that he will run the other way, as therapy in itself can be stressful (talking to unknown people, opening old wounds, etc.).

[Harri]

The only way I know of is through therapy and a willingness for him to work on his own issues, whatever they may be.   Physical violence changes the landscape of everything.  Boundaries become more like rules and ultimatums:  If you do ____ I will leave, walk away, etc.  IMO that is not a bad thing when violence is involved but, without long term help, I am not hopeful for change. 

I think getting therapy for yourself is important.  Not because I think there is anything wrong with you though.      We all have issues we can work on especially when trying to navigate a relationship with a personality disorder or traits of one.

Therapy is hard to do and it takes a real commitment.  It is even harder to stick with it once you start getting into the hard stuff.  I went through trauma therapy and it was eye opening.  Therapy, to put it bluntly, sucks.  I walked out of sessions feeling worse but determined to work my way through it.  So it gave me a good idea of how hard it is for someone with BPD to go.

How often are you talking and texting?

[Rainbow1215]

I completely agree, without a desire for change it will not happen. Although it sounds like the desire is there, it will take the actions and the effort as well which I'm hoping I will see. I hope that his anxiety in the situation doesn't prevent the healthy changes from happening. Initially after removing myself from the situation we did not really talk, now we are talking maybe once or twice a week, depending. Since most of it is online communication it's a little harder to distinguish the exact amount.

[Radcliff]

You are right that physical aggression tends to escalate, and the best hope for a relationship is to nip it in the bud at the first sign of trouble.  If a pattern establishes itself, the outlook for getting the relationship to a healthy, safe place is not good.

In order to better advise you on your situation, it's important for us to know the details of the aggression.  Can you describe how the situation started, what exactly he did, and how you reacted?  It can be uncomfortable to talk about these details, but many members here have been on the receiving end of physical aggression, so you are not alone.

RC

[Rainbow1215]

It is very uncomfortable to talk about, but if it helps I can give details regarding the situation. Our relationship has been on-and-off for quite some time due to arguments and what, to me, feel like attempts to push me away (abandon me before I abandon him). When I took a trip to visit family for a couple weeks there was an episode (on the phone). I decided to set a boundary and not reply to certain messages which made him send more. After this, I felt the dynamic of our relationship begin to change because I started putting more boundaries into place, not to upset him but because I felt the need for more space. A few weeks later, he had to go on a work trip and I could tell that morning that he was very stressed about it. I started driving him to the airport but he began to get quite heated in the car (we had to discuss some money issues that needed to be dealt with before he left but had been put off for a while). I let him know that I couldn't safely drive all that way in a heated argument and tried to end it, but it got worse so I ended up asking him to get someone else who was available to drive him (this is when he told me he no longer wanted me to stay at the house, which is something he has said a few times during arguments but I was supposed to watch the house for him while he was on his trip). By this time I had no idea how to deescalate the argument and he was so upset over our conversation and his trip that he showed physical aggression. It wasn't a lot but I took it seriously and left and have physically stayed away since then although we have spoken.

[Radcliff]

Thank you, that info on the situation leading up to the aggression is helpful.  Can you tell us exactly what his physical aggression looked like?  What did he do?

RC

[Rainbow1215]

It was a slap,  it wasn't very hard and I wasn't hurt at all but I am aware of the way relationships can go if that is allowed to become a pattern so I left immediately.

[Radcliff]

It was a slap,  it wasn't very hard and I wasn't hurt at all but I am aware of the way relationships can go if that is allowed to become a pattern so I left immediately.

Thank you for telling us.  We understand that even a single incident can have a profound effect, destroying feelings of trust and safety.

You are holding him at a longer distance now.  Some members report that a separation has given them more room to reflect on the relationship and other parts of their lives.  What has your experience been?  As you interact with him, what things are you looking for or observing that make you feel more or less safe?

RC

[Rainbow1215]

I definitely feel like I have been having more time to reflect on myself recently and begin to make some needed changes in my life. I definitely appreciate the time and space to reflect on my own growth which is great. There are still definitely things that I miss about the relationship; I am at the point where I know changes need to happen in order for this to be successful on both ends of the relationship, not just mine. I am definitely looking for not only a willingness to change the relationship dynamic but actual actions taken that prove he's putting in the effort. I am seeing that he has a growing interest in mindfulness and controlling impulsive behaviors, I just feel like all I can do now is just wait and see if things go anywhere from here and just learn from the experience. I am sure it's exceedingly hard for him to think about making these types of changes.

[Radcliff]

That's great to hear that he has an interest in mindfulness and controlling impulsive behaviors.  Hopefully that will bear fruit.

What about observable behaviors, signs of the current state of things?  I know your interactions may be limited, but are you noticing any unhealthy behaviors or interactions, or any healthy ones?  Are there opportunities to practice tools like boundaries or validation in your interactions with him?

RC

[Rainbow1215]

It definitely seems like our interactions are getting healthier, but there are still some of the same old behaviors. Ignoring me, not listening, but they are seeming to lessen. I read the book "walking on eggshells" and am trying to take to heart some of the approaches I read about. There are still definitely times when I feel like I can place a boundary and I attempt to, these are the times that I get ignored or "ghosted" like I talked about in my initial post. This is the main thing that has been happening lately when things don't seem to go the way he would like. I feel like I'm at a loss at this point. Are conversations are getting better and better because of my boundaries, but those interactions don't seem healthy, it seems like an attempt at punishing me. One of the boundaries I set was telling him that when I conversation gets too heated and I don't think it's going anywhere I will walk away from it and we can come back when we are calmer. Since then, our conversations have been much calmer.

[Radcliff]

I don't completely understand.  I think you said that you've been placing a boundary on heated conversations, and walking away until a calmer time, and that you've notice an improvement in how calm your conversations are.  This is excellent progress!    You said that sometimes he ghosts or ignores you.  I wasn't sure in response to what boundary.  Is this sometimes in response to the calm conversation boundary?  You talked about interactions not feeling healthy.  Were you talking about the ghosting and ignoring?

RC

[Rainbow1215]

I'm sorry, this is confusing to me too, so I may not be explaining it well. An example is a recent conversation we had. Due to the complicated nature of our relationship after I got a new phone I did not immediately give him my new number due to the amount and the nature of texts he's sent me in the past. Because he has been ghosting me (deleting me and then trying to re-add me on various accounts when he feels like it) I haven't felt ready yet. Before this happened I let him know that we can see how things go and until then we can keep in contact on social media. Recently he insisted, without asking me, that I call him and would not speak to me any other way. It was more of a demand, not a request. It made me uncomfortable and I took a break, then came back to the conversation saying that I appreciate that he is apologized for upsetting me, but he blamed me for not calling, even though he told me he would contact me and I mentioned that we hadn't discussed whether I was ready to give him the number. Which I only decided not to do in the first place because of the previous name-calling, sending hundreds of texts at once, and then completely ignoring me.

[Radcliff]

It sounds like he wanted to have your phone number, and forced the issue.  Did you give him the phone number?

In the past he has blown up your phone with texts and calls.  This is a very common problem in BPD relationships.  How did you respond when he did that in the past?

RC

[Rainbow1215]

No, he doesn't have the number yet. And yes, that used to happen a lot, the problem being when he started name calling, breaking up with me to try to get back together the next day, things that I definitely considered trying to push me away. And yes, these seem to be really common sorts of issues here. In the past I used to try to explain myself, in the past few months I have learned that the way I should handle it is by stepping away from the conversation. For a time that just made him send more texts, now he he ignores me when I set boundaries or when I "step away" from a negative conversation. I feel like I am just learning how to handle all these issues more constructively. At the same time, there are definitely times when I feel like I have no idea how to handle some situations, like when he demands I call him

[Bnonymous]

Hi Rainbow1215,

It's great to hear that you've been making so much progress and feel like you're learning to handle things more constructively. I hope that makes the situation feel a bit less overwhelming for you.

Regarding his demands for you to call him, stick to what you feel comfortable with and remember that he cannot make you call him, no matter how much he demands it. I would say something like "I don't feel comfortable talking on the phone just yet, but I'm happy to continue our conversation by email or on social media". I would say it once only (so he can't drag you in to circular arguments) and then ignore any further demands he makes and just carry on answering his other points by email/social media - if he doesn't want to engage with you through that mode, he can simply not reply, that's his choice but it doesn't force you into moving to the medium he prefers (phone) either.

I completely understand why you have felt reluctant to give him your new number. I have experienced the nasty text-bombing thing from my pwBPD too.  I have reached a point where I have said that I will put a temporary block on his number on my mobile when he sends multiple abusive text messages. I have been clear that I am doing it to protect myself from these messages only (i.e. I'm not withdrawing from him altogether and it's not meant to be a punishing move) and I have reassured him that I will take the block off again as soon as we have talked constructively on my landline and I know that the abusive messages have stopped. It's not something I'm entirely comfortable with, but I've reluctantly accepted that it's necessary for us sometimes.

One thing though, when we talked about this, my boyfriend said that being blocked would make him feel fearful. I tried to validate this feeling (without backing down on this being something I needed to be prepared to do) and also emphasised that it's partly up to him whether or not he gets temporarily blocked, because, if he doesn't send abusive texts, then I won't need a block to protect me from them.

What I'm wondering now is whether your pwBPD feels fearful about not having your number? Do you know what his feelings are about it and if there is any way you can provide validation and reassurance to him without giving in to his demands or allowing yourself to be pressured into doing something you're not presently comfortable with?

[Rainbow1215]

Thank you all so much for reaching out! It has been a relief for me to find others who can understand and offer their perspectives on this site.
I don't know his feelings on the situation, he hasn't mentioned any feelings at all about not having my number. After this happened he didn't respond for about a week and a half after telling me he wanted to call me the next day.
Today he  responded without acknowledging that he ignored my message, or letting me know why he did it. I am having trouble knowing how to approach these issues, or talk about either of our emotions because every time I try I get ignored. It almost feels like this ignoring and ghosting is trying to be made into a battle for control.
I am unsure of how to lovingly disengage from this battle, or open up room to talk about improving the situation.

[Bnonymous]

Hi Rainbow1215,

Being ignored or "ghosted" can feel pretty hurtful. 

I think the best way to handle it when he does that is to let him know you're there and then just step back and leave the ball in his court. If he discovers that ignoring you doesn't get a reaction and just leaves him waiting for contact too, then he'll probably drop (or, at least, reduce) this tactic fairly quickly.

When he drops contact, try to look at it as an opportunity for you to have a break, practice self-care, and focus on other things in your life. He'll reach out when he's ready and when he realises that you're not going to "chase" him for responses.

As to getting ignored when you try to talk about your emotions, part of the solution may involve picking your timing. If he's already ignoring you, then he won't break that to listen to your feelings. Similarly, if he's either raging or withdrawing, he won't be receptive to such conversations. Does he have better days when he is more able and willing to listen? If so, seize these to gently introduce the topics you need to talk about.

[Radcliff]

I think the best way to handle it when he does that is to let him know you're there and then just step back and leave the ball in his court. If he discovers that ignoring you doesn't get a reaction and just leaves him waiting for contact too, then he'll probably drop (or, at least, reduce) this tactic fairly quickly.

When he drops contact, try to look at it as an opportunity for you to have a break, practice self-care, and focus on other things in your life. He'll reach out when he's ready and when he realises that you're not going to "chase" him for responses.

Exactly.  Bnonymous is spot on here.  So many times we see members chase their pwBPD who are giving the silent treatment, which rewards the pwBPD for pulling away.

RC