If I haven't heard from her in 48 hours does this mean we're broken up?

[crestfallen1972]

I know she's alive since I live across the lot from her.

I have texted her and asked if she was okay and she answered that she's fine so I'm just giving her space. I almost dread hearing from her because this is either the precursor to some dramatic escalation and breakup which I really don't feel like dealing with or she'll come in like nothing happened which is sort of the norm after a good devaluing from her

Is it wrong that I'm beginning to not give a sh*t? It's been 6 months. Frankly, I can't believe we even lasted this long.

Last I saw her she was pissed at me for some trivial reason because I woke her up after a long drive home from the city in the rain. She really doesn't bring anything to the table. We don't have sex (she's not interested so I stopped trying), No job, drinks and smokes too much, alienated from family, hostile and verbally abusive to me, never has money... .what she does have she pisses it away on cigarettes and shots of Bulliet.

Does this mean we're broken up? Should I contact her? Should I just let her contact me next? I know her period is coming up and she definitely goes off the rails right before so perhaps she's being nice and sparing me? (LOL doubtful, she's probably totally splitting right now) I'm still feeling heartbroken, angry, frustrated, anxious and paranoid. I love hugging her, I like her smell. I like falling asleep with her. Maybe being away from her for a little bit will be helpful to help quell those desires.

The post on the Silent Treatment by Briefcase was great, I never thought of it as a control thing or an attention-getting tactic. And damn right it IS verbal abuse. I'm going with response 5.0.

"we can unhitch the wagon of our feelings from the horse of their moods." Is a great takeaway line for me to really try to practice.

I'm trying to enjoy the silence for now. This site really helps because I just need to dump these thoughts so I can have a nice sleep.

Thank you all

I thought this was the central point of the excellent article posted by elphaba.  

I think it's the emotional enmeshment between a non and a BPD that gives the silent treatment its frightening power.  We should be able to tolerate our partners feeling strong "negative" emotions like anger, frustration, sadness, etc.  When they act out abusively on those emotions by silently raging (or loudly raging, for that matter) we need to take steps to protect ourselves.

So what should we do when the silence actually starts? Here are a few choices, listed in order of least helpful to most helpful:

Response 1.0: Beg for It.  Here we enter an immediate "must fix it" mode.  Something's wrong and we can't wait for them to just let us have it already.   ?   If they would just talk to us, at least we can talk about something and find a way to restore peace ASAP.  We've probably all tried this once or a hundred times (at least I have). We follow them around as they continue to ignore us or make mono-syllabic responses.  Its hard to keep your self respect this way and it actually rewards their bad behavior.  Not recommended.

Response 1.1: Suck Up, Buttercup.  Still trying to fix things right away here.  Now we can find ourselves apologizing for "whatever I did." We want to give hugs and kisses and profess our love. We make promises to change, or promises to buy/do things, in an effort to bargain our way to peace.  "Hey babe, that second baby you've been wanting, well I've been thinking and guess what . . . ."  .  Again, we are rewarding their silent treatment through these behaviors.  Not recommended.

Response 2.0: The Cold (Shoulder) War.  We've been around the block and been burned enough times with our 1.0 responses to know better.  Now, we're frightened AND angry so two can play this game.  You want to ignore me and chat up the dog, well take this: "Here Fido!  That's a boy! Who do I love? Who do I love?  You! That's who! I LOVE you, Fido!"     It's hard to be sure, but I don't think Fido even buys this.  We're now playing games on their level and still trying to control them.    Not recommended.

Response 2.1: F Bombs Away.  Hmmm, begging to talk, sucking up, a trying your hand at a little emotional blackmail didn't help?  Now, we're good and angry!  This is B.S. and has to stop so we let it rip.  We let them know how we really feel and boy did that feel GREAT, for a few minutes anyway.  We've given up the high road and become abusive ourselves.     Its not a pretty mess to clean up, enough said.  Not recommended.

Response 3.0: Suffer in Silence.  OK, we finally get it, we can't control them.  So no more begging, empty promises, manipulation, or power plays.  They want to be silent, that's fine by me.  Really, it's fine.  No, I mean it, I'm cool with being ignored.  See, I'm even reading a book.  No problemo.   :'(   Oh okay, this really hurts.  Here, we try to ignore their abusive silence, but it's killing us inside.  We're just outwardly pretending here but still absorbing the impact of the silent treatment because we haven't yet separated our emotional well-being from their feelings and emotions.  They're hurting and, therefore, so are we--as surely as 1 plus 1 equals 2.  We are just controlling our outward behavior better and not trying to control them.  Think purgatory, nobody wants to visit this place too long.

Response 4.0: No Trespassing.  Here we start communicating and enforcing boundaries.  Sure, what they are doing still hurts deeply, but we aren't passive or engaging in counterproductive actions anymore.  We verbally acknowledge what they are doing, let them know we don't find it acceptable, let them know how we feel, and then get distance (physical, temporal or emotional) to protect ourselves.  We go about our business as best we can and let them know we want to talk when they are ready. We're still enmeshed emotionally here, but taking some measure of control over ourselves and our actions.  We don't "enjoy" the silence here, but we can cope.  

Response 5.0:  Blessed Silence.  No matter what anyone says, I doubt anyone really every "enjoys" the silence of a silent rage, it is abusive behavior after all.  But, I think we can lovingly disengage enough that our day isn't completely ruined by it either.  After a while, with conscious effort and practice and good boundaries, we can unhitch the wagon of our feelings from the horse of their moods.     Would you lose sleep tonight if I announced, without explanation, that I was no longer going to post on any of your threads anymore.  No?  Why not?  Because your emotions are not enmeshed with mine.   It may not make your day, but you clearly understand that I have issues, not you.  Believe it or not, you can actually get to a place similar to that with your partner, and still love them.  You accept that you can't control them, and you are separate enough to not be controlled by them. You can accept that they feel angry, sad, whatever, and not feel responsible.  We are detached emotionally, and enforcing our boundaries.  I think this is as good as it gets, short of them getting treatment and ending the emotional abuse altogether.  

I am sure there are other "versions" of each response, these are the ones that occurred to me, please feel free to add.

BC

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[once removed]

what led to the silence, crestfallen? has she asked for space?

[crestfallen1972]

No idea. She just does this sometimes.

[once removed]

what were the last things spoken/done between the two of you?

was/is it this: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=330698.msg13018003#msg13018003

[crestfallen1972]

Yes

[once removed]

okay.

so you know shes in a huff, and you said good morning, and heard nothing back.

any plans as to next steps, or are you waiting this out?

[crestfallen1972]

I worked from home this afternoon and she called my phone. Hi I said, I was going to call you "Sure she said" snidely. Are you okay how have you been? I asked "I'm fine, Hey I want to come over in 20 minutes is that ok?" sure I said and we said goodbye.

Now by that time I broke into a sweat, keep in mind I'm trying to do actually work from home and not f it up and trying to collect my thoughts at the same time and keep my cool.

20 minutes go by and I see her walking up with a couple of bags of my stuff I had left at her place. -Oh, I see now how this is going to go, the break-up, the giving back of the commingled things-
I go to the door and open it for her, I immediately gave her a hug which wasn't really reciprocated.

She leaves her cigarette outside and takes off her shoes and comes in. I felt kind of good that she wasn't really amped up like she has been with me in the past which would include a very loud banging on the door and a dramatic entry. She seemed sort of calm. She definitely seemed sober.

"We need to stop talking about us in terms of having a relationship" she says.

I'm all calm, trying to maintain good eye contact and actively listening. Okay I say, but why?

Then this is when she unleashes. She yells at me for blowing her off, saying to me that it wasn't cool that my friend stopped by Monday night at the last minute when I knew we had plans to watch TV at her place. (Seeming to not remember how verbally nasty she was to me when she woke up in the car after the trip and glossing over that she stealthily came into my place that evening to "start some sh*t" and what if my friend hadn't stopped by, then what? It probably would have just been something else.
Background: I used to have a VERY brief sexual relationship with this friend back in the LATE 90s. Me and him are like siblings now. So after all this radio silence is -supposedly- about my friend and not about her needing space. I tell her I texted her Tuesday AM good morning and heard nothing and she denies this. I offer to show her on my phone the last few texts she and I exchanged as proof and she's all suddenly not interested in that topic anymore.

I tell her I'm disappointed she wants to end the relationship and that no matter what I'm always going to be here for her. I'm staying calm. I'm using Dr. Melfi voice form The Sopranos. Then she says wants romance and intimacy and that she's not getting that from me since my friends are always here but that she doesn't want to be that person who makes people not hang out with their friends. (um, yes I think she most certainly does) I tell her I'm sorry that D and I's friendship of over 25 years is a problem for her. The she gets abusive... ."you're stupid to even say that" mocking me, laughing in my face and talking to me like an idiot. I start getting upset. She uses the bathroom and I'm up in the kitchen and I just lose it. I started just crying like all get out, I'm telling her that I love her and I'm sorry she cannot trust me and I don't know what I can say that will make her believe me... .I'm sorry she doesn't love herself, I'm sorry she's in so much pain and that I just want to see her thrive... .  Now keep in mind it is that "time of the month" for me and I had an Aunt die this week so I guess this was just the catalyst for the sobbing. She quietly starts apologizing, takes me in her arms and tells me to not cry, I hug her and cry on her shoulder, apologizing like an idiot for crying when I know I should not apologize for that. I just held her and she held me for the longest time.

Then it was done, a guy from the energy company came to the door and rang the bell abruptly and it seems now we are back together. We had dinner out tonight and I watched My Brilliant Friend while she slept alongside me at her house. Now I'm back at my place to sleep and needed to type this all out before I forgot anything. I'm exhausted beyond belief.

After all of the drama of today I actually do feel better, but I know this is just going to repeat, the question is how and when?

Thanks again

[once removed]

it seems now we are back together.

okay. thats a positive development, and theres an opportunity here.

I know this is just going to repeat

the thing is, when we find ourselves caught in a cycle, there are usually things both parties are doing that fuel it.

now that you have some breathing room, lets look at it closer... .not to monday morning quarterback, but for the future.

taking into consideration the fight that led up to this, and the fight/making up that you wrote about here... .

which parts of her perspective are valid? which parts do you perhaps disagree with, but can understand? was there anything you did that looking back, contributed, or didnt help?

[crestfallen1972]

This isn't the first instance where my friend has come up. She has many male friends but the problem she seems to have with this one is that A. he and I used to be involved, B.he is at my house a lot because he's my best friend and has helped me fix my house up through the years (He's a handyman). We vacation together and are buddies.

The thing is sometimes she's around him and she is fine with him, then something triggers her and I feel like she uses him to justify her emotional dysregulation.

I truly thought I was doing the right thing by giving her space last week, so I just don't know if I did anything to inflame her mood.

I should have seen it coming. It seems like if she gets distant and sarcastic for a few days I a row then something is coming down the pike. Maybe she'll be set off that day, maybe that week. I just never know.

Now post-fight the last 4 days have been good. I won't say great because I feel like she's swinging to the idealization phase ... .telling me I'm perfect, saying I love you all the time which these things make me a bit uncomfortable. I don't like being idealized and being told that I'm perfect is just laughable. When she says that I always respond with "Nobody is perfect, we all have our flaws" The blame game/fault-finding missions have restarted. When she's not dumping on herself she's dumping on me or somebody else. She's back to texting me every morning and every night. I'm just going with the flow this week. I really do thank god I have an awesome group of friends who are going through their own assorted relationship difficulties to listen to my crap. I'm also thankful I have a job and many projects that keep me busy. I also am very grateful for this board.

Now with the holidays coming up the next few weeks may be rough. This is the first Christmas where she has been NC with her sister and parents. Each year my family has a Christmas Eve open house. My close friends are always invited. I'd like to invite my SO. However my family is in denial about me having relationships with women and how do I know that my close friends -including the one that she sometimes gets jealous of- isn't going to set her off and cause some trainwreck of an open-house? I have to admit the thought of that makes me very anxious. I want to introduce her to my parents because I do love her but I fear them judging her harshly for not having a job.

Also, as an aside I'm going to go to my General Practitioner and get a number for a psychiatrist. I have been on antidepressants since the 90s but find that the Xanax can be helpful intermittently. Going to just spit it out that I'm in a relationship with an UBPD and hopefully she (my GP) can guide me towards a professional in my network.

I have been reading so many posts here that I can relate to, It's nice to finally begin to understand BPD.

[once removed]

She has many male friends but the problem she seems to have with this one is that A. he and I used to be involved, B.he is at my house a lot because he's my best friend and has helped me fix my house up through the years (He's a handyman). We vacation together and are buddies.

so, theres some difference there, right? can you see why she might be insecure about that relationship?

The thing is sometimes she's around him and she is fine with him, then something triggers her and I feel like she uses him to justify her emotional dysregulation.

it might be the other way around. pwBPD traits dont do insecurity well. so whereas you or i might be a little insecure, everything becomes much bigger for her.

do you listen when this happens? what reasons does she give?

"Nobody is perfect, we all have our flaws"

this might be invalidating... .its kinda like if you said "i love you" and she said "love isnt real". this is how she expresses herself... .certainly you dont want to let it go to your head, but use those opportunities (happy times, calm times) to build on the foundation of your relationship.