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Author Topic: Currently Separated & Hoping to Avoid Divorce  (Read 557 times)
Formula209

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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
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« on: March 06, 2019, 10:27:30 PM »

Hey, all!  It's nice to find a board with such supportive people. I originally posted this on another site, but I was directed here by one of your members.  Thanks for welcoming me here!

My wife of 12 years, partner of 16 years, and mother of our two children, told me last June that she wanted a divorce. This was not the first time that this had happened. In 2016, she told me that she wanted a divorce and confessed that she'd had multiple affairs over the last few months. This was extremely out of character for her, and didn't seem to match any behavior that she'd exhibited during our relationship. She agreed to go to counseling and to see her own personal therapist. She was diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder, and I was encouraged to give her another chance, as the condition can lead to behavior like hers. As she expressed remorse for her actions, our Marriage Counselor urged me to give her another chance, as now that she knew of her condition, she could seek out therapy and prevent it from happening again. I agreed, and things began to seem much better.



We started going out on actual dates again. We attended concerts, went on day trips, got romantic hotel rooms without the kids, and generally started reconnecting in all of the ways we hadn't in a long time. I was extremely happy during that time.



Then, in June of 2018, she told me again that she wanted a divorce. She said that she felt "trapped" in our marriage, and that she needed a chance to be single and see what else was out there. She moved out of our house and left me with most of our possessions and custody of the kids most of the time. She immediately started dating a guy who was far, far younger than her, who lived with his parents and worked out about 6 hours a day. He, of course, dumped her after about 3 months.  Her sister has told me that my wife has been going out on lots of dates with new men, sometimes not coming home until the next day.



Truthfully, I haven't been able to date during her absence. I've talked to several women online, but I could never bring myself to meet up with any of them. I still find myself to be in love with my wife and want more than anything to try to win her back. Am I being foolish? My friends and family say they only want to see me happy, and that they support any decision that I make. Her family wants to see us back together, but my wife, despite professing to be lonely and depressed now, has made no overtures toward coming back. I feel like everyone close to me has some sort of personal bias, so I'm curious as to what an unbiased audience might think. Deep down, I would be very happy if she returned, but she's made no moves in that direction and I'm scared that if I say something, it might upset the currently cordial relationship we have.
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This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2019, 11:33:15 PM »

Welcome

We're sorry for the difficult times you're facing, but are glad you've found us.  Every situation is different, so it would help if we could learn more about yours.  What was life like in the time before your wife's affairs?  Were you able to communicate well with her?  Where there lots of arguments, mood swings, and other things often associated with BPD?  Did the clinicians helping her explain to you why they felt she had BPD?

RC
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Formula209

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« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2019, 03:08:07 PM »

At first, communication was great.  We talked a lot about what we wanted in life, what made us happy, and what upset us.  Our love life was fantastic as well.  She'd been diagnosed with depression as a teen and had tried to take her life on more than one occasion before we met, but it had been a while since the last episode when we started dating.  She also informed me that she'd had a period of hyper-sexuality during her first year of college, where she'd slept with about 10 different guys in a very short period of time, but told me that she attributed that to her low self-esteem coupled with depression.  It had been better for awhile, she assured me.

Unfortunately, about 5 years into our marriage, I began to suffer from depression.  I'd never dealt with depression before, and failed to recognize what was going on.  I became moody, withdrawn, and just didn't want to do anything.  She suffered through my moodiness for a long time, but never figured that I was the one with the problem.  She says she assumed that I wasn't happy with her, and blamed herself for my withdrawn nature.

In early 2016, I developed a rare fungal infection in my digestive tract, and was given a powerful anti-fungal medication, which caused bizarre hallucinations and suicidal thoughts and I was taken off of the medication after a short time.  Oddly, my entire perspective on life changed.  My moodiness went away, I started feeling happy and affectionate again, and I started enjoying life for the first time in years. (My doctor later told me that there is evidence linking gut bacteria with depression, and that it was likely that the anti-fungal medication "fixed" whatever was going on with me.)

Unfortunately, as I suddenly started feeling better, I noticed that my wife had become withdrawn and secretive.  She had enrolled in evening college classes, and suddenly was gone to study almost every night.  She started locking her phone for the first time ever, and said it was because her new job duties required it.  She confessed to having had an affair with a guy who was a temporary worker at our site and who had already left.  She said she was disgusted by her actions and proceeded to have several more one-night stands in an attempt to make sure that I'd never want her again.  (She said it made sense in her head, as I'd likely forgive her for a one-time thing.)

When she confessed, she told me that she wanted a divorce, as she said that she'd broken our marriage beyond repair.  I convinced her to go to Marriage Counseling with me and asked her to tell her therapist about her actions.  (She said she'd been playing "good patient" for years and hadn't been telling her therapist about her real thoughts and actions for a long time.)  Our Marriage Counselor asked for her to request a BPD test, which she did.  Her therapist was surprised to hear about all of the things she'd done, and agreed that she did suffer from BPD.  (I don't know, specifically, what test was used.)

She started going to therapy, but quit attending after a couple of months, saying that she seemed to be "so much better functioning" than the other people in her group.  Unfortunately, a year-and-a-half later we were back in the same spot.  This time, she actually moved out of our house, and now lives with her sister.  She keeps the kids about 2 days per week.  She makes many posts on social media, which she doesn't know I see, that she's lonely and depressed.  She's friendly with me, and we occasionally do things with the kids, but she's made no overtures about coming back.  Honestly, I would work with her if she wanted to return, but I don't know how to go about suggesting it or even if I should.
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Purplex
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« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2019, 04:34:30 PM »

Hi Formula 209, i'd like to join Radcliff and welcome you to the family  Welcome new member (click to insert in post)

Excerpt
She said she was disgusted by her actions and proceeded to have several more one-night stands in an attempt to make sure that I'd never want her again.
When she confessed, she told me that she wanted a divorce, as she said that she'd broken our marriage beyond repair.
Do you think she might still be in deep shame and guilt about what happened?
It sounds like you forgave her, but it doesn't sound like she was able to forgive herself.
Could this be the reason why she can't reconnect with you?
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Formula209

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« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2019, 05:03:37 PM »

It's possible? She briefly seemed angry with me for not getting my own head together faster. She said she wished I'd figured things out before she took a wrecking ball to things.
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Purplex
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« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2019, 05:45:58 PM »

This must have been an incredibly difficult situation for both of you. Depression can be crippling and turn the most energetic and loving person into a lifeless ghost. It is a test for most relationships, even more so if the other partner is struggling with mental health issues as well. Nobody can change what happend and she seems to think the damage is done and the relationship can't be repaired. The question is, what was damaged and why can't it be repaired?

What is the answer from your perspective? I assumed you did forgive her. Did you really?
And from her perspective?

I think if you can find out what kind of hurt was caused for both of you, you might get a step closer to understanding if or how it can be fixed.
     
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Formula209

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« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2019, 08:18:09 PM »

I truly did forgive her.  She was skeptical that I could avoid bringing it up, but from when she told me to when she left, I never brought it up once.  I told her that I was going to trust her, and I did.

In January of this year, we took a short weekend trip with the kids.  We slept in separate beds, but shared a hotel room with the little ones.  Everyone seemed to have fun, and honestly, it felt like old times.  The following week I asked her if she'd consider trying to work on our marriage again.  She said she needed time to think about it.  The following week, we met for dinner with the kids.  She said that she was still considering my proposal.  The week after that, she said that she was going to decline my request.  She said that although there was a part of her that wanted badly to make things work again, she was afraid that it wouldn't be enough for her and that she'd eventually want to flee again.  She didn't want to get anyone's hopes up, so she thought it was better to avoid coming back.

I feel like I'd be happy with having her back in the house, although I don't know what I'd like that to look like right now.  She's (supposedly) going to her DBT twice weekly, and hasn't missed many of her sessions.  I miss her as a wife, but I also just miss her as a friend.  We still get along well and have a lot of fun when we're out with the kids.  It's just painful when I start to instinctively reach for her hand, and realize that it wouldn't be welcomed.  I'm not sure exactly what I want right now, but I know that I still love her and that I miss our marriage terribly.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2019, 12:07:45 AM »

You are in an interesting situation.  You seem to be split up, but have continued contact, and that contact appears to be peaceful and accepted by you both, with its limitations.  She has a lot of work to do on herself, and the idea of managing that work while at the same time rebuilding a marriage may feel like too much for her.  It's great that she's regularly attending DBT.  Your best bet is to support and encourage her with that, while maintaining as much "demand free" contact as seems reasonable -- be warm and friendly, but don't overdo it or make her feel any pressure.  If she starts to feel more confident, you'll be there in case she feels ready to return to the marriage.

I'm sorry that you miss your marriage so much.  That's terribly difficult.  Do you have a feel for how long you would be willing to wait for her to re-engage in your relationship?

RC
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Formula209

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« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2019, 09:46:15 AM »

I don't mean to sound cliche, but I'd probably wait as long as it takes. She told me not to wait and encouraged me to go on dates with new women, but so far, nobody's really caught my interest. It hurts that she has continued to date while she's living at her sister's.

Her sister has told me privately that she really wants to see us back together, and that she really believes that I'm the best possible fit for my wife. Unfortunately, her sister says that my wife may need to date around before she comes to that realization.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2019, 01:22:38 AM »

It must be tremendously painful that your wife is dating.  I'm sorry for that.

You mentioned that nobody has caught your interest.  If someone did, would you date her?

RC
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Formula209

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« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2019, 11:56:12 AM »

I don't know. Maybe? It's kind of like when you aren't hungry and someone offers you food. I know I should want to eat, but I'm just not interested right now.
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Sandb2015
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Relationship status: Living apart, kicked out on 12/19 after meeting 3/19/2015
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« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2019, 12:22:46 PM »

Hello Formula209,

"I don't know. Maybe? It's kind of like when you aren't hungry and someone offers you food. I know I should want to eat, but I'm just not interested right now".

Thanks for this quote, I'm thinking about this and kind of lightens the mood for me, thank you.

I feel like I should be doing the same even though I'm not sure my girl is dating (she insists, I suspect) driving me crazy just thinking about it. I could and it would be so unfair to some unsuspecting woman I meet.  I guess an unfairness to a "date" and the not hungry mix is the point to me...
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Just because you think it, doesn't make it true.
Formula209

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« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2019, 10:29:41 PM »

Spent most of the day with my wife and her family.  (She had family in town & they wanted to see the girls.)  We talked a lot about our situation.  I told her that I really wanted for her to move back into our house and work on our marriage.  She said she needed time to think about it.  She also said that she might want the freedom to occasionally go out on her own and possibly talk to other guys.  I'm not sure what I think about that, but I agreed to at least discuss it with her when she returns from her business trip later this week.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2019, 01:00:21 AM »

It seems like you both are awash in ambiguity about your marriage.  You are married to each other.  Yet you might be willing to date someone else.  And she might want to talk to other guys.  This lack of a firm commitment is not a recipe for success in a marriage.  What are your thoughts on that?

RC
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Formula209

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« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2019, 10:37:29 AM »

To clarify, I do not want to date anyone else.  I spent the last eight months completely single while she went on dates.

This "request" of hers is new, and it's something I've been asked to consider.  I'm not sure how to feel about it.  On the one hand, I'd be thrilled to have her back in my life, but on the other, I'm sure I'd feel terribly hurt if/when she went out.  I'm not sure if this is the safety net she needs to come back, or if this is some weird experiment she wants to try.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2019, 02:03:04 AM »

The way you've posed this, it seems like you feel a burden to either agree to her idea to date, in the hopes she comes back, or disagree and drive her away.  You're taking on a burden for how she acts, which is not fair to you, and makes it really tough to figure out what to do.  If you agree, that's terribly invalidating to you (and I would guess damaging) and if you disagree, you may feel like you are reducing the chances of things working out in the long run.

One of the most fundamental things members need to realize is that they cannot control their partner, nor are they responsible for them.  Another thing they need to learn is to not invalidate themselves or compromise their values in an attempt to cope with their BPD partner.

If it's against your values for your wife to date other men while married to you, tell her that.  You could say something like, "I can't control what you do, but I love you and believe in us, and I don't think that seeing other men is the best way to strengthen our marriage."  Choose whatever words or feelings are right for you -- the important thing is to not bend on expressing your principles, but to do it in a way that emphasizes the positive and is not controlling.

I'm curious to hear what other members think.  This is a tough situation, and I may have missed some angles.

RC
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Formula209

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« Reply #16 on: March 13, 2019, 02:51:30 PM »

This is exactly what it feels like.  My sister-in-law (who very much wants to see my wife and I get back together) came by yesterday to talk.  She thinks that I should engage my wife in further talks about her "open marriage" idea.  Her reasoning is that the chances of us reconciling if my wife isn't living here are virtually zero.  She thinks that although it will be difficult for me, that my best chance of winning my wife back will be to have her here and showing her that I still love and support her.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2019, 12:43:26 AM »

Another person might say that if you follow the sister-in-law's advice, your wife could have her cake and eat it too, enjoying the excitement of new relationships while also the benefits of living with you.  She would be shielded from the natural consequences of her actions, which prevents growth and positive change. 

This is scary stuff.  I'm sorry you're in such a tough spot.  I know that I and many other members have avoided following our values for fear of losing the relationship.  Re-finding our own inner voice and acting on our values is tough when we've been reacting to and appeasing others for years.

Nobody can come up with the answer but you.  Not us, not your sister-in-law -- only you will have to live with the consequences of your decisions.  My best advice would be to take the time to think about your values, think about your needs, and think about the potential consequences of various choices.  Then make choices where you can live with the consequences.

RC
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Formula209

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« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2019, 10:32:50 PM »

An update of sorts:
Last week, my wife called and asked if I was interested in attending a concert with her.  Her friend had to cancel at the last minute, and she didn't want to go alone.  I agreed and we dropped the kids off with family for the night.
The concert was a lot of fun, but by the time it was over it was very late.  I asked her if she wanted to stay at my place, so she wouldn't have to go back home late and wake everyone up.  She agreed, but wanted to sleep on the couch, which was fine with me.
In the morning, I took a chance and asked her if I could lay next to her for awhile, and she agreed.  One thing lead to another, and we wound up being intimate for the first time in almost nine months.  However, she hasn't wanted to talk about it since.  It was nice to be with her again, but it seems like it might have been a one-time thing.
For what it's worth, she's still making posts on social media asking if anyone has any "hot guy friends" that they can set her up with.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2019, 01:56:49 AM »

Thanks for the update.  Don't be a stranger around here -- these relationships are tough.  You'll do better in the long run with regular support.  What are your thoughts on next steps?

RC
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