The relationship is toxic and I can't let go - part 2

[RomanticFool]

Mod note:  Part 1 of this thread is here https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=339129.0;all

That’s an interesting point because she did disapprove heavily at the very beginning of the relationship and I told my wife that I had a crush on somebody before we slept together. I would have left my marriage there and then, especially when the ex invited me to live with her. I told her that was a perfect solution if she was sure but that it would be tricky and I would be upset for a while. She said, ‘Will you be upset for long?’  That seemed a bit of an odd thing to say and alarm bells rang in my head. Then she started saying that I could rent my flat out and that would enable me to pay her rent. I told her that I wasn’t sure how long that would take as I had to give my wife time to sort things out (at that point she had intimated moving to where she is now staying). When I said to the ex that it would also take time to get the flat in the right state to be rented out she said, ‘Well you can’t expect to live here for free.’ Bearing in mind this was in the early stages of the relationship and that I was countenancing making a huge life decision and I knew then and there that it wouldn’t work. Then a couple of weeks later I spilt some tea on her carpet and she went completely crazy and demanded that I hire a carpet shampoo machine (it was a tiny patch in the corner of the room) as the carpet would smell otherwise. I did so willingly and she was grumpy about the whole thing and said that I had ruined her carpet. She never relented until I built her IKEA wardrobe and that was the happiest and most sexual I had ever seen her. She groped me at every opportunity and threw me on the bed and seduced me. I was astounded at how a man building her a wardrobe aroused her to such a degree. I never had higher value in her mind than at that time. To think of how little regard she has for me now is truly confounding. It was clear that she was idealising me. Back then in her eyes I was perfect: tall, fit, intelligent, artistic, alpha (which aim not at all) and best of all a handyman (which I’m not at all) who could do all the jobs in her flat and look after her. I ended up doing most of the cooking too. I’m kind of surprised she doesn’t miss all of those things she saw in me then. Anyway, I didn’t leave my wife then because red flags were waving like banners over my head.

[ct21218]

Sounds like she wanted a sugar daddy.  Add the mood swings and drama and it's just not sustainable.
 

[gizmocasci]

Is the behaviour a result of mental illness for her, or is it fear based and does she want to ultimately want a relationship with me. Those are the issues and perhaps I need to ask her those questions.

i remember asking myself the same questions. is she healing from her past, or does she have a mental illness? i chose not to bring up the mental illness question, because honestly, i was seeing all the proof i needed to see.

in regards to your email, i felt like i was reading something similar that i had gone through. she would state her wishes of what she wanted in a relationship going forward, i would tell her i couldn't provide x,y,z for her, and it'd be best we just move on, and yet i would still get accussed of blowing the whole thing up. it was a complete and total mind F, and looking back, i'm gratefull i got out of it only after 8 months, even though it was the most intense relationship i've had too date.

she made her decision, now stick to yours as well. the quicker you go no contact and move one, the quicker you'll get to healing. easier said than done though. everyone has given you some great advice so far, so just take the pieces you need and keep moving forward. i know its hard.

best of luck

r

[RomanticFool]

You are right and I am so incredibly grateful for the advice. It did occur to me today that I’m possibly suffering from PTSD. I am in a terrible emotional state much of the time and probably need counselling as a matter or urgency. I live a bit of a hand to mouth existence at the best of times due to my work choice. If I could afford it I’d do some intense therapy at this point in my life. All of the talking and ruminating I have done on here comes from pain and an empty chasm where my soul should be. I feel I’m a hopeless case sometimes. How could I have been so naive as to hand my life and power over to somebody so obviously not well. I allowed a demon into my life and this is the result.

[gizmocasci]

How could I have been so naive as to hand my life and power over to somebody so obviously not well.

i feel your pain. i did a lot of work on myself the years prior to meeting my ex, and asked myself how and why did i attract this. well now i look at it as i attracted the good parts of her, the parts i wanted to see, the parts i have in me. my ultimate lesson though was to walk away from something that wasn't good for me. my past pattern would have seen me staying in this and fighting for eveything that it was. to just have accepted things for what they were. i flipped the script and walked away though. it was excruciating for me to do that, especially because i just want to help people, and i felt her hurt and pain, but i reiterate, we can't fix anyone and we can't save anyone. it's not selfish doing what's best for you.

keep at it, day by day.

r

[Skip]

That’s an interesting point because she did disapprove heavily at the very beginning of the relationship and I told my wife that I had a crush on somebody before we slept together.

Before? Sure about that?

I would have left my marriage there and then...

Keeping you honest, RF. Not leaving your marriage is on you and all on you. You can't tell someone you're dating that they need to make commitments to you for you to divorce your wife who who have had affairs on for 8 years.

... and then blame them for not doing what you said you would do.

Then she started saying that I could rent my flat out and that would enable me to pay her rent.  

Its normal to share expenses when living together.

I know this is an emotional time, but keep the narrative as balanced and fair as you can. It will help you see things more clearly and find real solutions.

[RomanticFool]

Before? Sure about that?

I think this was only two weeks into the r/s. We had fooled around but not slept together. I wanted to be honest at that point.

Keeping you honest, RF. Not leaving your marriage is on you and all on you. You can't tell someone you're dating that they need to make commitments to you for you to divorce your wife who who have had affairs on for 8 years.

... and then blame them for not doing what you said you would do.

No, you misunderstand me. There is no blame attached to my narrative. What I am saying is instinctively I felt something did not feel right at that time. I had only known the ex for two weeks at this point. It felt absurd to me to leave my marriage so soon. It is all on me and I did tell her repeatedly that I would leave my marriage and I ended up doing just that. The thing that wasn't right was the speed with which she wanted everything to happen. I also knew it would be a traumatic thing to split from my wife and I didn't think the new woman would be equipped to be as supportive as I would need at that time. That is not blaming her, but a reminder to myself why I didn't leave straight away. She has said to me that had I left then she would never have doubted my honesty. Well I'll take that comment with a pinch of salt now.

Its normal to share expenses when living together.

I know this is an emotional time, but keep the narrative as balanced and fair as you can. It will help you see things more clearly and find real solutions.

Of course it's normal to share expenses but when you've just invited somebody to live with you and they are about to leave their marriage for you, surely that's not the first thing that should be on your mind. I find it weird that she didn't mention it before she invited me to stay. It was an after thought. To me it's just more evidence that I was dealing with somebody who lacked consistency and was not dependable. Again, no criticism, just the facts as I saw them at the time.

[RomanticFool]

I feel your pain. i did a lot of work on myself the years prior to meeting my ex, and asked myself how and why did i attract this. well now i look at it as i attracted the good parts of her, the parts i wanted to see, the parts i have in me. my ultimate lesson though was to walk away from something that wasn't good for me. my past pattern would have seen me staying in this and fighting for everything that it was. to just have accepted things for what they were. i flipped the script and walked away though. it was excruciating for me to do that, especially because i just want to help people, and i felt her hurt and pain, but i reiterate, we can't fix anyone and we can't save anyone. it's not selfish doing what's best for you.

keep at it, day by day.

Walking away from a woman I pinned all of my hopes on is like something out of a Hieronymous Bosch nightmare. However, what is worse, is witnessing somebody who not so long ago adored me turn on me and paint me black, especially as I am now in a position to be with her. I guess that's the point isn't it. Perhaps she desired me so much previously because I wasn't available. Now I am she's bored or detached or whatever else.

I literally get on my knees every night and pray that the woman I loved will come back to me. I don't think she exists.

[RomanticFool]

Now I'm wondering if I shouldn't have just gone to the movies with her on Sunday and see what happened. What good is laying down a boundary with someone who is already out of the door? It may have been my last hope of reconnecting.

[ct21218]

A wise person once told me 'you can do whatever you want, provided you are willing to pay the emotional consequences.'

More pain or grow up?  Your choice.

[RomanticFool]

Trouble is I was on holiday with her just a month ago. Now she doesn’t want to know me. That isn’t normal an fit hurts like hell.

[Plucky1980]

Trouble is I was on holiday with her just a month ago. Now she doesn’t want to know me. That isn’t normal an fit hurts like hell.

Mate, mine broke up with me half an hour after we'd gotten back from a hotel stay for our 1 year anniversary, 24 hours after telling me how much she loved me, and how important I was to her and her children. 20 minutes after tearing my heart in two, she was singing and smiling along to a song on the radio. Multiple instances of breaking up and threatening to break up earlier in the relationship which basically destroyed my confidence and self esteem.

Nothing they do is 'normal'.

It hurt like hell. Still does, a bit. I'm still bitter and I still feel hurt and betrayed. That was 7 months ago and I'm ashamed at times that I'm still recovering. I miss her sometimes but you can't have a functional relationship with an inherently dysfunctional person.

Do yourself a favour and withdraw from her completely. Concentrate on yourself. You'll thank yourself one day.

[RomanticFool]

Mate, mine broke up with me half an hour after we'd gotten back from a hotel stay for our 1 year anniversary, 24 hours after telling me how much she loved me, and how important I was to her and her children. 20 minutes after tearing my heart in two, she was singing and smiling along to a song on the radio. Multiple instances of breaking up and threatening to break up earlier in the relationship which basically destroyed my confidence and self esteem.
Nothing they do is 'normal'.

I'm sorry that happened to you Plucky. I hope you are still plucky as you've obviously been suffering these last 7 months. My situation was complicated by the fact that I was married and I am now going through a divorce. I am very lucky that my soon to be ex wife is a decent and wonderful human being. Without that I could be screwed into the ground financially on top of everything else. My ex uBPDgf has moved on and I rebuffed her attempts at being friends. I don't know if I'm coming or going to be honest but for the first six months of the relationship she was desperate for me to me free from my marriage. Then when I was she seemed to lose interest. It is heartbreaking as I put alot of hope and emotional attachment into this relationship and now I am in deep deep emotional hell. I have to believe that one day it will all be better.

[Skip]

I don't know if I'm coming or going to be honest but for the first six months of the relationship she was desperate for me to me free from my marriage. Then when I was she seemed to lose interest. It is heartbreaking as I put a lot of hope and emotional attachment into this relationship and now I am in deep deep emotional hell. I have to believe that one day it will all be better.

RF, you are going to suffer as long as you are married and dating - healthy women and unhealthy women want no part of that. Everyone told you that before you met this gal - end the marriage - and be kind (not selfish), you have hurt wife pretty badly and she only knows a fraction of what has gone on.

You have admitted that it destroyed this relationship with the AA gal. She is paying the price. Your wife is paying the price. You are paying the price.

I think you have to face the fact that the trust is irreparably broken on all fronts.

In the last few weeks you are wanting to anything to rescue the AA relationship... yet you have made no effort to end you marriage and set both you and your wife free. Why are you holding on to the marriage? You don't see any future with your wife, you don't respect her, it's over.

Your point above (quote box) is that is some strange way, you feel that your marriage has been resolved and the new gal should be good with it... yet you haven't even filed for a divorce.

On the flip side, two weeks ago you referred to your marriage as a trial separation to your wife.

You operate in a constant state of lying and betrayal. People run from that. You have seen that in all aspects of your life and even with some members here.

When someone wants a serious partner, being married is worse than having Herpes. Being married is worse than having Syphilis. Being married is worse than having a felony. Harsh, I know. I'm trying to point out that the elephant in the room is the marriage - you can't buy enough roses to compensate for that.

Most women make little distinction between:

Married and living together Married and trial separation Married, divorce filed Divorce finalized, first post divorce relationship

Why, because men in any of those categories leave a path of destruction as they find themselves.

In one sense, it's not about you. It's about every married man who trampled on women before you. In another sense it is about you, no one wants to hook up with serial infidelity.

It's all caught up to you RF. This is hitting rock bottom. It's intervention time. I think you have to face it head on.

[RomanticFool]

Your behind the posts. My wife is coming over on Sunday to discuss divorce. She wants a divorce. We are moving on.

[RomanticFool]

Secondly, me being married has no bearing on the way the AA woman is behaving. She doesn’t care about me being married, it is about the way we argue. I think you are judging the AA woman’s attitude by a bogus standard. Yes, being married was the issue in the beginning. It no longer is now. She knows I’m getting divorced. She has already painted me black.

[Skip]

Secondly, me being married has no bearing on the way the AA woman is behaving. She doesn’t care about me being married, it is about the way we argue.

What have you argued about the most? The marriage. Right? More than 1/2 the relationship this has been a big issue. Know that the marriage cancer breeds other problems. I don't doubt that not resolving the marriage issue lead to real problems in the way you resolved everything.

In the end, everything is toxic. Now she has reacted badly and you have reacted badly.

Understand, RF, she has her own issues.  I'm not denying that.  What I'm saying is that this relationship is burned. It's best to walk away, clean up your own house, and start over clean...

You carried significant baggage from you marriage and your affair into this relationship... within the first week you were telling AA gal that you thought you had BPD.

The worst thing you could do now is carry the baggage from all three relationship in a fourth relationship.

[RomanticFool]

.  It's all caught up to you RF. This is hitting rock bottom. It's intervention time. I think you have to face it head on.    

Of course it has, but the issue here is whether a longer, more honest relationship with the AA woman would have made any difference at all. Let’s look at the evidence: she has physically attacked me four times and almost caused a car crash on the motorway when she spat at me and grabbed the steering wheel at 80mph. She shouted at me in the street frequently and called me a Narcissist on a daily basis. This was from early on in the relationship. She delivered ST on me on a regular basis, yet decided to come on a holiday at my expense and put her Hitler campaign against me on hold. Soon after we got back she cycled past me and refused to stop. When I left a tearful message on her answerphone she called me emotionally damaged and cut me off WhatsApp.

Frankly, I want no part of a relationship with somebody like that. I accept all of the bad karma coming my way from my actions. I should never have got married as the relationship was not right from the start. So yes, I’ve behaved abominably towards my wife and she deserves better. But we have both been complicit in allowing our relationship to become dysfunctional and lacking intimacy. Instead of having affairs I should have addressed the marriage as I am now doing. My wife wants out and wants to move on. I want to move on too. Yes it’s been a terribly painful time and I’m paying a heavy price for my actions but it will hopefully lead to me doing things much differently in the future.

I find your analogy to syphillis and herpes completely bizarre. I always told the AA woman the marriage would end and it is ending. The reason we are no longer together is less connected to me being married and more to do with the way I behave when she verbally attacks me, which directly led to her  physical  assaults on me. That is domestic violence and whether I was married or not has no place in any relationship. So by all means berate me as you have a wont to do about my poor character but don’t ignore the fact that I put up with a ton of appalling behaviour from a woman I loved dearly and who I wanted a life together with. I know in the following months and years I’ll feel better about dodging this bullet. In the meantime I’ll grieve, listen to your hyperbole around marriage and eventually I’ll find somebody wonderful and begin to love again healthily.

[RomanticFool]

. What have you argued about the most? The marriage. Right? More than 1/2 the relationship this has been a big issue. Know that the marriage cancer breeds other problems. I don't doubt that not resolving the marriage issue lead to real problems in the way you resolved everything.  

Yes this is true. She said herself at the beginning that everything would become toxic if we continued with me being married for too long. So I do not doubt for a second that it is a major factor. However, if I was dealing with a healthy adult and they knew that I had told my wife immediately that I had met someone else, a healthy person would give me time and space to deal with the situation. I’m not saying they would be happy, I’m not saying they would trust me, I’m not saying they would have felt any better, but they may have given me a chance to sort myself out if they were as keen as the AA lady was. I’m not questioning her disdain for my marriage, I’m questioning the extremity of her general behaviour and much of it had nothing to do with me being married but her wanting to win arguments and needy/unreasonable behaviour which she exhibited in a way that I did not at the beginning of rhe relationship. I gave her daily assurances that we would end up together and I was true to my word. So yes, the marriage affected the relationship but it would have happened anyway eventually because she is selfish and lacks empathy towards me. That has nothing to do with me being married and everything to do with her self absorbed personality. She is volatile, violent and in complete denial of playing any part in any argument. I was far more restrained with her than I’ve ever been with any gf partly because I knew she struggled with not seeing me enough and partly because I adored her. However, she is so reactive and explosive that what transpired between us was really a feature of her pathology rather than the affects of me being married. Yes, I would love to have seen what would have happened had I moved in with her after two weeks, but I suspect I’d either be in prison or dead by now.

[Skip]

What advice are you getting in SAA regarding this relationship?

Things have not gone well in more than half of the 12 months of this relationship, why are you holding on so tight?

No football team (USA) with a record below .500 has ever won a Superbowl. No great relationship ever started out this way and bounced back into a stable and loving place.

Why hold on? Yes, there was a dream at one point, but you guys don't get alone well.

[RomanticFool]

I haven’t seen her for five weeks. She told me never to contact her again when I declined to go to the cinema just as friends. I’m in the painful process of withdrawal from her.

The advice I’m getting is NC and block her on all channels. Move on and work on myself. I haven’t blocked her but it appears that she isn’t coming back.

My wife and I talked and we are getting divorced.

[RomanticFool]

.   Things have not gone well in more than half of the 12 months of this relationship, why are you holding on so tight?

Why hold on? Yes, there was a dream at one point, but you guys don't get alone well.

Only a person who has loved with all their heart can understand. This love wasn’t a choice anymore than I choose to love my mother or brother. It’s a fact of life. I don’t turn my back on people I love. If she wasn’t so angry and devaluing of me, I’d try and sit down and talk to her about it. I don’t want to be thinking of another human being as lacking empathy or devaluing me to the point where she has no respect for me. These are alien concepts to me. It is alien for me to stay away from somebody I love and cut them out of my life. I find this notion of a power dynamic in relationships confusing and sad. I don’t want to think of her as using my love against me to control and manipulate me. Her reaction to me finding it difficult to be platonic friends was strange to me. Anybody in their right mind would understand that having been making love every day for a week on holiday would mean that a few weeks later being platonic friends would be impossible. She wants to tune this into a pseudo feminist issue about power and control. It is self serving and bogus and riles me but it doesn’t make me love her any less. I’d go back to her in a heartbeat if she wasn’t trying to destroy me.

We have a lot of conversations on here and people tell me to look at my behaviour and not hers. My behaviour is that I have always tried to show love to her, I have reacted emotionally whenever she has been unreasonable and violent but I have always wanted her whatever the situation. My mistakes have been getting embroiled in WhatsApp arguments and engaging in push/pull  behaviours in reaction to hers. I should have been more consistently loving. However, faced with somebody calling you a narcissist every day and physically and emotionally abusing you, I defy any right thinking person to remain calm in the face of that. I love a damaged woman. My heart has been trampled on. I want her back because I love her. The hardest thing to deal with is her projection, recently she said that I have no remorse or compassion. When I asked her what I should have remorse for she said he way I’ve treated her. I told that I’ve always been loving towards her and only ever reacted badly when being treated badly. She got angry and called me an abuser but could cite one example of abuse. The truth is that she has no remorse for how she’s treated me or compassion for the emotional hell she’s put me through. Yet still I love her.

Does that answer your question?

[RomanticFool]

Feeling really panicky and awful today. My ex is clearly not going to contact me again. I miss her so badly I can barely speak. Everything I’ve ever read about this situation says don’t chase. When I invited her to the cinema she wanted to come but as friends. The boundary I put down seems to have antagonised her. Maybe I should have met her and tried to talk. Don’t know if I’m coming or going.

[Skip]

Does that answer your question?

I'm worried about you, RF. I think a lot of people are.

This hurts like hell right now, there is no questioning the sincerity of your emotional pain. You are plunged neck deep in grief/loss.

You also sound depressed... will you take this test and report back.
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=79772

This isn't going to provide any instant relief, but it is starting the process this idea will help you on your path out of this.

1. Know that in depression, our thinking is often clouded and distorted. We simply don't see things clearly and this amplifies the pain. This is not to diminish what you feel, its just to say that part if the pain is the amplification and you can address that and it will lesson the pain a little. 2. Know that the pain you are feeling is not about this relationship. It's culmination of pain from a number of sources. You have a failed marriage and you escaped that grief by getting into an affair.  You then had a failed affair, and you escaped that grief by getting involved with the AA women. Because you didn't have the chance to grieve these other losses, all that pain is coming to the forefront. Again, this is not to diminish what you feel, its just to say that part it's not one loss at play here, it's multiple losses.   3. You've talked in the past about fear of abandonment and an insecure attachment style which many here struggle with. This also amplifies the feelings of loss. You have had years of rejection, your wife, your affair partners, your mentioned some others (mentors, friends). There is not a lot you do about this right now other than to know that this is another external factor contributing to your emotional pain. 4. You are also grieving your loss of character. While your impulses have overruled you conscience many times, you feel the guilt of your actions. This is also amplifying your pain right now.

All of this is huge. The are huge wounds that are compounding.

Everyone's ability to shoulder loss varies. Some of us have very low thresholds of pain.  Some of us have very high thresholds of pain.  I suspect that you are in the lower threshold group and that why you work very hard to run from the pain. You mentioned withdrawing from you wife - that is pain dodging. The affair was more pain dodging. Getting involved with AA women.

If you are honest, if an attractive women shows up in your life, you will bounce of the AA women loss the same way she helped you bounce off the affair loss.

As I said earlier, none of this going to make you feel better right now, but it may help you find your way out of this volcano that has been on the verge of erupting for years.

1. Get to a prescribing mental health professional today. Go to the emergency room if need be. You have enough to deal with without having your brain amplifying the hurt. Get some relief so you can sleep and relax.

2. Stop the cycle of high risk, toxic partners . Let this be t of high risk relationship partners. No more addicts (recently recovered or not), not more personality disorders, not more chickens with broken wings.

3. Face the pain. Grieve.  Don't dive back into the AA relation, or another relationship to avoid the hurt. It's just going to set you up for a bigger fall later.

4. Do recovery work. Do it here. Enroll in a divorce recovery class. Heal your tortured soul. Volunteer to help people - maybe work a food kitchen.

5. Plan a life that has not rebound relationships... expect that it will be a year to 18 months before you will find a healthy partner with good life skills.

6. Learn how to be a healthy partner yourself. You have developed some unhealthy habits and no healthy women is going to work with it.

7. Build a relationship independent life. Take up a partnership sport (golf, cricket, etc) and build a life that is not 100% dependent on a lover. This will help significantly with #6 above and it will help with loneliness. Golfer's can a mass a ton of male friends in no time. Fill the void.

Are you hearing any of this at SAA? Are you ready to invest a year or two into turning your life around? What have I mentioned above that makes sense to you.

Go all the way back to your pre-marriage married girlfriend... that's was the start of 15 years of bad relationship partner choices and the development of really bad relationship skills. To have a good life, you have to unlearn a lot of bad habits and replace it with good habits.

[RomanticFool]

I’ve taken your concerns on board and I’d like to say thank you for caring. I know it’s been choppy waters for me on here but progress of a sort is being made. I can’t sedate myself at the moment as I am involved in a job that I need to be sharp for. The grief for my ex is the worst pain at the moment because I opened my heart and trusted her. It feels like a kick in the teeth. I’d like to sit down and talk to her and tell her that the unmarried version of me would be her dream man. I know that is ridiculous. I know she would have discarded me eventually whatever happened and I also know that had I moved in with her and she kicked me out I’d be in such deep grief I may have struggled to recover. I am more astounded by her lack of any feeling towards me whatsoever apart from utter contempt. She seems genuinely outraged that I wouldn’t accept being just friends with her. Unless it was some kind of test and I was supposed to try and woo her back. Anyway it all seems over and I feel bereft.

Many of your suggestions seem sound. My main problem is co-dependency I think. I made this woman my higher power and the idea of being without her is truly terrible. I think you’d be surprised if you knew how full my life is. I have lots of friends, I play soccer every Sunday. When I’m not working I watch my favourite team play twice a month. I always have lots of projects on the go. I attend AA and SLAA meetings and I call friends who are supportive and lovely. But none of this makes up for missing this beautiful exquisite creature who I fell in love with. I can’t believe how indifferent she is to me and it’s hurting me so badly. I keep hoping she’ll come back but I think she has found someone else. It’s truly awful to think I’ll never hug or kiss her again.

I’ll do the depression test when I get home from work tonight. The thought of my ex being with another man is causing me so much pain. I wish I had reconnected properly when she tried two weeks ago. All I’ve done by setting a boundary is confirming to her that I don’t care enough about her. I haven’t chased her because I don’t want to give her any more power and I suspect it’s too late anyway. I feel absolutely wretched.

[RomanticFool]

I think what has been keeping me going the last few weeks is the predictions from various sources that because she is most likely borderline that she will be back. But maybe she isn’t borderline at all. Maybe she is just an angry, insecure woman with bi polar who demonised me because she really believes I’ve been abusive and made the relationship toxic. I can’t cope with the thought that she’ll never contact me again. She has lost all interest and I never thought that would happen. I want her back. I love her.

[clvrnn]

I think what has been keeping me going the last few weeks is the predictions from various sources that because she is most likely borderline that she will be back. But maybe she isn’t borderline at all. Maybe she is just an angry, insecure woman with bi polar who demonised me because she really believes I’ve been abusive and made the relationship toxic. I can’t cope with the thought that she’ll never contact me again. She has lost all interest and I never thought that would happen. I want her back. I love her.

Hey RF,

It is difficult to process the thought of someone never engaging with us again, it really is. Regardless of the BPD, this person sounds deeply unhealthy and the longer you stay interacting with her, the more damage that will be done to you, and the longer it will take to heal and recover.

What if she didn't have BPD or bipolar, would it be easier to grieve the end of the relationship? Can you train your mind to ignore the possibilities of her coming back, and switch focus to your own feelings and moving on process?

[RomanticFool]

I told my ex that I am now getting divorced last Tuesday. Tonight (Sunday) she replied: "So sorry to hear that." I replied: "It's all very amicable." she replied: 'Fab"

Since she told me never to contact her again after I said I didn't want to go to the cinema as friends, I was surprised that she replied at all. A female friend of mine said that if she wasn't into somebody at all she wouldn't go to the cinema with them, friends or otherwise. My female friend thinks my ex is still interested.

I think she may be hedging her bets with me. I haven't seen her for going on six weeks. She knows I'm into her but I haven't contacted her since Tuesday. This appears to be the first possible sign of a thaw. It is also the first empathic response to me for months.

I am wondering if there is any chance at all now that I am single whether my ex and I could start over on a more amicable footing. You may all think I'm crazy (I probably am) but she is now over a year sober in AA. She doesn't want a volatile relationship and neither do I, could it be possible that we could start over? It would take some work to get her back onside but I suspect it is possible. I keep wondering what my post marriage future looks like and all I can see is that the kind of woman I would be looking for is essentially my ex. Why not try and make it work with her?

[ct21218]

Did you read anything Skip wrote?

[RomanticFool]

Read it all. It’s like heroin addiction coming off this woman. Only those who have experienced the emotional hell can understand. Those who find it easier to walk away can never comprehend the depths of despair more susceptible people plunge to. At least on here there are people who understand. Some, not all. Once the withdrawal process has been negotiated I will be able to think more clearly. I don’t understand how this woman could have moved on so quickly but she appears to have done just that.