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Author Topic: Beginning of the End or a New Phase?  (Read 424 times)
TelHill
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« on: November 16, 2019, 09:42:23 PM »

My bpd mom has been in bed since 11/5. She fell down the day before. Sometimes she has no pain and then she has pain. The pain moves throughout her body. She is complaining of deep depression. She is telling me she wants to die.  

She has never been in bed for longer than a day before, even if she had a bad flu. She's a hard worker around the house and very organized in this realm of her life. She's never not cared about doing housework.

I want to take her to the ER or one of her doctors. She says no. My brother says no - this will pass. My dad says no. He is afraid she will assault a staff member if she's admitted to an inpatient psychiatric ward. I've asked him if this has happened. He said no.

Can someone lose the will to live and pass away? I googled and found that traveling pain in the body is a symptom of deep depression. Meanwhile, mom is in the next room screaming. I want this limbo to end.

Has anyone had this kind of situation?

« Last Edit: November 16, 2019, 09:48:39 PM by TelHill » Logged
Kwamina
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« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2019, 09:55:19 PM »

Hi TelHill,

This situation with your mom does sound rather concerning. She has been in bed for quite some time now. Has she during this time still been eating and drinking well?

Whether it's purely physical, psychological or a combination of both, I too would say it would be good for a professional to assess your mother's situation.

You mention your mother screaming in the next room. What is she screaming about?

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« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2019, 10:17:20 PM »

 Hi Tellhill,

It certainly sounds like your mother is experiencing a lot of distress.  Is there any way to contact one of her doctors for advice without taking her to ER?

Did something happen to cause this deterioration in her wellbeing?

You mentioned that she fell down the day before this started.  Was it a bad fall?  If so, I would say she needs to see a doctor.  It sounds like your brother and your Dad are afraid of outside intervention. 

You could call 911 and EMS would assess her physical health, without necessarily taking her to the ER.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2019, 10:27:12 PM by Zabava » Logged
TelHill
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« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2019, 10:28:29 PM »

Hi Kwamina,

Yes, dad & I have been persuading her to eat. She won't each much though. All food is revolting. She must be size XXXS by now. She's so thin.  I have been lobbying and cajoling to get her to be seen by someone since after she fell.  

She's screaming that no one likes her - either I or dad hate her. She then screams she can't take it any more. I ask why. She is afraid to die.

I'm calling her psychiatrist tomorrow (she gets med management) that she's in a bad way and showing signs of dementia. Am sure my dad and brother think they are managing this well. She's out of control though.



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« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2019, 10:44:08 PM »

Well it's good that she's at least eating a little, yet that she's getting so thin is concerning.

Considering your mother's current state of mind and also her physical state, I think you are making the right move by calling her psychiatrist tomorrow. She clearly needs help, and it isn't the type of help you can provide, nor your dad and brother though they might think differently about it and believe they have everything covered.

The type of behavior she exhibits can really take quite a toll on you and also for that reason it is good to get her professional help.

How are you holding up yourself?

Take care Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
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TelHill
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« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2019, 10:58:05 PM »

Hi Tellhill,

It certainly sounds like your mother is experiencing a lot of distress.  Is there any way to contact one of her doctors for advice without taking her to ER?

Did something happen to cause this deterioration in her wellbeing?

You mentioned that she fell down the day before this started.  Was it a bad fall?  If so, I would say she needs to see a doctor.  It sounds like your brother and your Dad are afraid of outside intervention. 

You could call 911 and EMS would assess her physical health, without necessarily taking her to the ER.
Hi Zabava,

Her nephew passed away unexpectedly. He was six years younger than her. Her twin sister died in June. Another nephew died last year - he was also a lot older than me. She's the youngest of 9. She only has one sibling left.

Yes, they don't want outside intervention but it's needed. EMS sends a fire truck with loud alarms and then dispatches an ambulance with loud alarms. This is county procedure. I don't know why they need to be so noisy and attention grabbing. It must be different in your area where this is a lot less stressful. Thx for your suggestion though.

I'm hiding out in the family room. She came here twice. Once she was thirsty and said my dad was a troublemaker. I talked her into going to bed. She returned a few minutes later because the lights were on here and wondered who was here. No cane.

I feel bad for her. I had a cat who died 10 years ago. The last few months of her life she would not leave my lap. She would dig her claws into my clothing if I had to get up. My kitty must have felt sick and scared. She looked healthy so I didn't have an idea she was sick. My late cat's refusal to let go of me reminds me of my mom. I'll call her doctors tomorrow on my own.

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« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2019, 11:25:00 PM »

Of the situation is so out-of-the-ordinary ( and keep in mind we are talking about BPD "ordinary"), you would be well advised to call 911 when your mother is screaming. This is either medical or psychiatric -- you are not a professional, so you can't call it. Get the professionals out to make an assessment.
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"...what's past is prologue; what to come,
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TelHill
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« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2019, 11:25:43 PM »

Well it's good that she's at least eating a little, yet that she's getting so thin is concerning.

Considering your mother's current state of mind and also her physical state, I think you are making the right move by calling her psychiatrist tomorrow. She clearly needs help, and it isn't the type of help you can provide, nor your dad and brother though they might think differently about it and believe they have everything covered.

The type of behavior she exhibits can really take quite a toll on you and also for that reason it is good to get her professional help.

How are you holding up yourself?

Take care Virtual hug (click to insert in post)

I think it's a guy thing to handle it all on one's own, or it went away before and will again. It's not.

I am ok. I have heater & crooked contractor troubles that are concerning me. I've had no heat in my house since Feb. I have all state and city agencies on this guy's trail and am hoping this will be resolved soon. I also have neighbor troubles where their trees are knocking at my back fence. They're not interested in fixing it.  I dread going to the agency in my city because it's in the most crime-ridden part of town. Calling gets you into vm where no one returns your call.

Plus I still want my life back.  Friends, fun. I'm like Uber or Lyft. Driving everywhere but not getting out of the car much.

I'm glad you asked but it's not going well. I'm still hearing my mom crying. Not a great night here. I'm grateful that tomorrow will be coming and hoping it will be a better day.
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« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2019, 08:26:53 AM »

How is your day so far, Telhill? Thinking of you!

pj
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« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2019, 12:36:42 PM »

I am very concerned for you. If your mom were to pass away at home, you would likely be investigated for elder abuse in certain places or at least the cause of death would be thorougly investigated, depending on the laws and their level of enforcement where you live. My brother was in a similar situation with my mother with BPD, and after she went temporarily to a rehab center, I and also the staff, insisted my brother had to have outside help come to the house on a regular basis before mom returned home. My cousin's husband had diabetes, weighed around 400 pounds, was elderly, and died in an ambulance on the way to the hospital; my cousin was told that it was an in-home death and there would be an investigation if a certain doctor did not sign off on it. Can you call the local hospital and find out if your mom should be hospitalized ASAP and how to get an in-home evaluation of your mom's need for care?
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« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2019, 01:14:30 PM »

Excerpt
Can someone lose the will to live and pass away?
I think so, yes.

Telhill, were you able to get in touch with her doctor toady, a Sunday?  What happened?  We are all concerned and I think there is a fine line between handling things according to your moms wishes and doing what is best for her.  Notice I did not mention your dad or brother?  Follow your gut on this.  You are correct that 11 days in bed is not normal.  As has been said here, you are not equipped or qualified to deal with this or determine if it is a medical or psychiatric issue and if it requires action.

Check in with us when you can please. 
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TelHill
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« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2019, 04:09:21 PM »

Hello everyone,

I did reach her doctor today. We have an appointment tomorrow morning. I am concerned about deep depression & cognitive decline, including occasional delusions.  I know there’s medication for dementia.  Effexor & Remeron is what she takes for depression. Am not a professional so will leave it up to them. I am not sure what’s next to be honest- home health care or assisted living.

She’s calmer today due to my dad giving her Ativan. Not a good plan if she gets hooked on it. Has other bad side effects for seniors.

 I will keep you posted. This will be a tough thing to negotiate as we go forward.. My dad was fully on board last night; now he wants me to drive him to Walmart tomorrow.  I will keep pushing because she is vulnerable and very ill.

Thanks to all of you. You all got me out of a rough place. I am grateful to you, my bpd family.   <3 <3

« Last Edit: November 17, 2019, 04:20:15 PM by TelHill » Logged
GaGrl
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« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2019, 06:34:31 PM »

Your father is deflecting. I'm sure he doesn't want to hear negative news, but with the doc's help, your mom could do quite well with the right meds and care situation.

You are going to need to drive your parents to the appointment tomorrow. It's too critical to miss.
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"...what's past is prologue; what to come,
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TelHill
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« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2019, 07:21:19 PM »

GaGirl,

I intend to. My dad wanting to go to Walmart tomorrow was concerning. I told him we have to plan on keeping tomorrow open to follow doctor’s instructions for testing, etc. Walmart has to wait.

Deflecting is a good word. He acknowledged when I was a child that mommy is sick. There was no action then. I had to deal with it on my own as a kid. That’s the story of many of us.

My fear is that my dad will refuse treatment for her tomorrow. She won’t want it and he’ll go along. My brother never forces an issue.

I hope my dad does the right thing.  If those three don’t want care, I don’t want to stay here. I am afraid of being blamed for abusing her or being slandered a nasty daughter for refusing to be the sole caregiver.  She screamed an hour ago at my dad for not getting her an aspirin quickly.

These are all fears. Am hoping dad does the right thing.

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GaGrl
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« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2019, 08:05:01 PM »

If your father refuses treatment, that could be an indicator to the doctor that Social Services/Elder Care needs to be brought in to manage your mother's situation. And you may need to (as lovingly as possible) explain to your dad that you can't caregive in a situation that places you in legal jeopardy of being accused of elder abuse.I

If your mother is admitted to the hospital (which is a possibility), the hospital social workers are an amazing resource for making sure the home arrangements are appropriate for the patient's dismissal.
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"...what's past is prologue; what to come,
In yours and my discharge."
TelHill
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« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2019, 06:18:14 AM »

If your father refuses treatment, that could be an indicator to the doctor that Social Services/Elder Care needs to be brought in to manage your mother's situation. And you may need to (as lovingly as possible) explain to your dad that you can't caregive in a situation that places you in legal jeopardy of being accused of elder abuse.I

If your mother is admitted to the hospital (which is a possibility), the hospital social workers are an amazing resource for making sure the home arrangements are appropriate for the patient's dismissal.

I read the criteria of elder abuse at the APS site for my parents' county. I could easily be accused of that by my brother and blamed as being the cause for her screaming. People lie.

My dad's English listening skills are poor when he's under stress. I'll tell the whole story to the doctor as is the right thing to do. She was screaming last night but it's tempered even as the Ativan wore off. Believe she is playing calm to stay at home and keep me here with her.

My dad and brother want to keep the status quo. My father subscribes to the very old fashioned idea that the unmarried daughter, especially a widow, should stop her life completely to care for elderly parents. That was true 80 years ago when being a widow in their home country meant no means of a husband's support and there were no other resources for elderly parents than being at home. Doctors could do very little. Things are different these days by leaps and bounds.

When I complained a few months ago my brother does nothing to little to help & may be fabricating a busy schedule to see friends/have a normal life, my dad became angry. He accused me of physically attacking them in the middle of the night. I called my brother to get his help. He was deflecting and passive-aggressive. He goaded me into overreacting. He accused me of being a troublemaker and hung up on me.

I'm trying to remain level-headed and stay out of the Karpman drama triangle. No JADE-ing and only SET with my FOO. If my parents refuse to follow through with what the doctor says, I'm doing NC for the long term.  My father is considered legally competent and he is the next of kin for my mom according to state law. I’ll call APS to get confirmation of this.

« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 06:33:19 AM by TelHill » Logged
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« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2019, 11:13:26 AM »

Glad you are really looking at everything from many angles and now know the criteria for elder abuse in the county your parents live. You are so right that your brother might lie and blame you for your mother's screaming. You have a lot of integrity. You are figuring out what is right for you while taking the steps you need to so you will not be your mother's caretaker. When I read your posts, it reminds me of how different members of the same family can be. What are the strengths that you have that set you apart from your brother, mother, and father?
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« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2019, 11:52:34 AM »

I think another part of your conversation with the doctor is some info and insight to the cultural expectations.
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