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Skills we were never taught
98
A 3 Minute Lesson
on Ending Conflict
Communication Skills-
Don't Be Invalidating
Listen with Empathy -
A Powerful Life Skill
Setting Boundaries
and Setting Limits
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Author Topic: Merry go round once again  (Read 404 times)
Lisasomar

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Mother
Posts: 7


« on: February 23, 2020, 01:17:48 PM »

My 19yr old d with PTSD and BPD told me she wanted to cut me out of her life about three weeks ago which she has done before but never for more than a couple of days. I tried to reach out to her but she denied wanting to meet or talk. Last Sunday she called me telling me she didn’t feel well and I suggested she go to the hospital. I knew she was hoping I would offer however after her abusive texts weeks prior and telling me she no longer wanted me in her life, I was trying to set boundaries. Later this week her symptoms worsened and I offered to take her to the ER. I have told her that I will be here fore her so long as she doesn’t call me names, bring up the past etc. She says that is me not taking responsibility for things and she thinks that I also have a personality disorder because I lie and manipulate her all the time. She is so broken and so unaware of how the BPD causes her to misinterpret and project everything. She says that I project, etc. So here we are again with her wanting nothing to do with me. I am okay with not having contact with her as it is so draining and has affected my own health, however how as a Mom, do I think about how her mind thinks that her own mother is manipulating her and trying to hurt her? It kills me to think that she is going through this in her mind. I am reading all the books on how to support her however she refuses to acknowledge her BPD and blames everything on her PTSD. She is a victim through and through and will not see that she needs to learn the skills through DBT to get better. On the contrary. She states that she and I should go to family counseling so that I can learn to validate her more. My counsellor is telling me that I need to stop validating something that happened six years ago that was not even under my control. I am at a loss of what do do next.
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
wavewatcher
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Tentative, day by day.
Posts: 55



« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2020, 06:10:32 PM »

Hi Lisasomar,
It is such a painful place to be, where you are, and most of us here can totally relate to what you are going through.

My dd25 has for years said the same things to me as your d and for a long time I believed her, that I was to blame. She would say I was the one who needed counseling (I've had my own T for years) to work on my part in why we have a difficult relationship. I did that but it was never enough because I didn't take full responsibility for how she is. I came to realize that this is one of the hallmarks of the BPD brain, blaming others for everything because it is too painful to accept their own shadow side.

The more I read about other parents' experiences with their own BPD adult children on this site the more I am committed to taking care of myself, doing my best not to trigger her (she lives with us), not enabling her, walk away when she's verbally abusive and accepting that this is her journey, not mine. I have to stay healthy and my role as her Mom is to love her but not allow her to destroy me. It was her violence toward me that landed her in a psych hospital where she got the BPD/BP2 dx.  She can no longer blame me for everything.

Maybe a good family counselor can help with her perceptions of you. Be prepared for her to walk out if she doesn't like what she hears and then blame the counselor as well as you. Take care of yourself.
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Blind1

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Living with them
Posts: 24



« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2020, 12:51:57 PM »

This conversation is exactly what I needed to see right now.

I had a "conversation" with my DD18 last night. The first one in probably weeks. She lives with us, but is never home and when she is she is locked up in her room. It started out good, but then of course went down hill. She was upset she didn't get a job she just interviewed for and couldn't understand why they would wait two weeks to call with a decision. Of course no amount of me trying to explain to her how it normally works was doing any good. I have done a lot of reading about BPD (she is newly diagnosed) and was trying to be very validating and asking her if she needed/wanted my help, but when she got too frustrated, I just kind of ended it saying if you would like to brainstorm more later about possible other jobs let me know.

Then she went on to needing a cat. And of course because I didn't immediately say yes she was frustrated. Her therapist said it would be a good idea, give her something to look forward to that needs her. Long story short, we are still discussing the cat thing.

My real issue is that since she never wants to talk to me, won't talk on the phone, doesn't open the door to her room or commit to a time later, I feel I have to take any opportunity to talk with her about my boundaries. Of course it didn't go well and I was not entitled to my opinions or feelings because they are stupid ones and how dare I even try to set this boundary when she is the one suffering. I'm sure that wasn't the best time to bring it up, but when is? Do I try and force her to talk to me other times? I normally lay low and only talk to her if she has talked to me first.

In the end, I just felt bad for her. I knew she was saying those things because of her BPD and I didn't take it personally (I told her I loved her and be careful, because she was leaving), but it is so difficult to watch. I am reading a book about loving someone with BPD, but when they don't want anything to do with you and as soon as you try to talk to them, or even try to set a limit they "take offense" and turn it around on you. It is just do discouraging. 
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FaithHopeLove
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Shaky
Posts: 1606



« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2020, 01:54:12 PM »

Excerpt
. I am at a loss of what do do next.

There is an old gospel song that goes " after you've done all you can just stand. " Maybe we don't always need to be doing so much. We all do our best but the truth is we can't fix this. We can and should learn all we can about BPD particularly the communication skills and improve our relationships where we can but there comes a point where all we can do is love our children and take care of ourselves.
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java919

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Relationship status: live apart
Posts: 16


« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2020, 10:41:49 PM »

hi lisomar

get what u r saying about being blamed  told we are the one who caused the problem,
and things are rewritten to paint different picture than what really happened

whether its a defense mechanism, denial, or even just their frustration/anger at whats going on inside that they cant control
being the one who is lashed out at over and over can lead to total burnout

took me a long time and lots of backslides to get to a point to say to my adult daughter
i am going to have to end this conversation, i am not hanging up on u but am saying goodbye
and then follow through and disconnect

or if we were in the same space to say i am not doing this i am choosing to leave
if this is how u are treating me right now
and then take off for a little while

like i said did a lot of backsliding,  thinking well if i stay on phone or sit  talk more thats what she needs,
would think  i have to b endlessly patient supportive because kept thinking that a little bit more wil turn the tide

but finally learned sometimes u have to say no more
taking this doesnt help them, and hurts us

theres still blaming at times, arguing, hurt but am not afraid to remove myself
when things get too hurtful and that has made a difference in my mental health

give urself as much patience and love  as u give ur child



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PeaceMom
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Posts: 546


« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2020, 07:02:52 AM »

Needed to read this today just to have a clearer picture of boundaries. My DD20 somehow got a short term apartment lease and we ended up paying month 1 rent, getting a uhaul and moving her there a few day ago. As relieved as I was to have her gone, the extreme neediness has begun. Some of this is due to poor planning, not understanding adult things and not having skills.

She’s called maybe 20 times, sent 50 texts, is in full panic mode about whatever. There has already been a huge fight w/exBF, a frantic change of her phone number, etc. I’m absolutely exhausted and feel pretty physically bad. I read again how often extreme caregivers become very susceptible to deadly illnesses.

I told her yesterday after getting pulled into helping her with her phone service for an hour, that I would no longer answer the phone- that she needed to text me first. If I desired to help, then I would. (I think I’m finally realizing that every single time she texts, calls or even hollers my name from another room, it’s to tell me she needs or wants something-PERIOD) .

She also said that she was so upset over the ex-BF that she was suicidal. I simply told her, help was available, things can get better. She said “it’s up to me only if I do IT or not”.  I said “yes, that’s true, but there is help”. I then sent her the Crisis test link and number 741741 and told her users give it a very high satisfaction rate.

Maybe I’m finally realizing that if I just don’t make things worse, I can move forward with no FOG. It’s  becoming more clear that I don’t have the power to make things better so I need to stop trying to help her. Her need never ends so what is the point offering advice, time, etc? With each need met it opens up a new need. Similar to unlocking the next level of a video game and her dad and I become the need -fulfillers.

Thanks for being here as I feel fearful for what the day will bring...
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wavewatcher
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Tentative, day by day.
Posts: 55



« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2020, 10:19:58 AM »

What you all are saying is so, so true. Our adult BPD children are bottomless pits. I wonder if they will ever be able to feel their emotions less intensely or actually put someone else's needs and feelings before their own.

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java919

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Relationship status: live apart
Posts: 16


« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2020, 02:37:14 PM »

hi peace mom
i so hear what u are saying about phone issues the non stopness of it
all hrs sometimes just wanting contact, sometimes, to rant at me, or tell me how terrible everything in life was and we are awful

used to dread the fone ringing, would take it off the hook even at nite bcz calls at all hrs
as my parents got older couldnt do that
id even get calls at work all day when she wasnt working or busy and wanted to constantly fill her time or hear another voice to the pt it was humiliating

it has gotten better the older she gets, but wknds when shes not at work it trends up, and now due to covid 19 her job ended and while the calls arent hostile or middle of nite theyre escalating in number and am having to set boundaries saying ok we are done for today

i hear u ...the constant being hammered u are left with a ptsd type reaction to the fone whether it rings, buzzes whatever
try ur best ..mute ur fone hr at a time world wont end and u can always chk messages after
and learn to not see fone as extension of u that has to b monitored non stop
ive learned to say sorry fone was on mute was busy, or it was downstairs charging
or just plain wasnt in a talking mood needed space
took loong time but u can get there..really! Smiling (click to insert in post)
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PeaceMom
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Posts: 546


« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2020, 09:56:27 PM »

Java,
Thanks for this input. My new m.o. w/DD20 is texting her at 9:00 pm saying “turning phone totally off, I will not respond if you text of call. Goodnight”.  My T said that I was choosing to stay in victim mode by answering those texts or calls after my reasonable hours. And that victims are people without choices.
So I made a choice to start doing this even though she said she was suicidal. Things have gotten a bit bettter bc she’s not in a full blown crisis currently. What I’ve noticed though is that even without a crisis, her communication is still very typical BPD. No empathy, contacting us to ask for XY and Z, calling to complain about how she was wronged, etc. What a very sad, shallow existence for her. No true, deep human connection.
I did want to share that it’s been just wonderful having her living in her own apartment. I’d probably spend my entire retirement savings to pay for her rent bc I feel physically better than I have in years!
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java919

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: live apart
Posts: 16


« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2020, 11:15:40 PM »


thats great to read peace mom..making that little zone of peace
for yourself is a great step

like i wrote before took me long time to learn how to disengage and not feel like
i had to be on call 24/7 to hold things together bcz everything is on me
found if i could stand strong my daughter somehow would manage me saying goodnite thats its am going to bed, or i need to take some space now am stepping back

absolutely there were times of true crisis, when i was scared for her and did have to step in help her find resources telling her to hang in and knew i couldnt check out

but rest of time when it was just about her wanting someone to complain to about life work friends who were never good enough, talk about self endlessly and she would have this sense of entitlement as if i was only here as a bit player in her life and wasnt really a person

i had to learn to stop checking my phone all the time, or e mail, and stop responding immediatley
and learn i was partially responsible for the anxiety i was feeling because i couldnt separate myself
so good for you shutting fone down...hope u can stick to doing what you need to do to help urself do some healing
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java919

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: live apart
Posts: 16


« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2020, 07:26:57 AM »

peace mom...needed to add a ps
what u said about spending your retirement for your daughter to be living on her own
i totally understand and support you on that

my daughter has been living out of the house since her early 20s there were periods of
landing  back here if she had lost a job a relationship ended badly ...mostly not full time
but she would turn up every fri afternoon to stay for the wknd so as not to be alone
and to basically pick on everything here, what we did was wrong ...what we said was wrong, her life was awful why arent we taking her here or there etc
giving us no downtime even affecting my health

i have always kicked in to rent whatever i could bcz her having own place did change the dynamic, and she felt more in control when in her own space like her safe zone
she lives alone and is lonely at times cause relationships are hard but its still better in the big picture
most visits are on her turf i found her being here sets her back tremendously dredges up behavior, memories and is a huge trigger..like she regresses to teen yrs
so its great that u realize her being out of house is a game changer and being willing to contribute if u can is well worth the extra moments of peace
be well, treat urself with compassion
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
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