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Author Topic: Overwhelmed by Mom's Emotional Needs  (Read 445 times)
ov3rwh3lmed21

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« on: July 04, 2020, 06:16:57 PM »

Hi everyone,

I'm not sure whether this is even the right site to be posting on. From my reading my mom may have BPD traits but I'm hoping someone on here can point me in the right direction for resources because I am tired of feeling emotionally drained.

My father died when I was in my teens and since then my mom has leaned on me heavily for her emotional needs. It has varied during the years but has included times when she has called/texted multiple times per day. Her worries mostly stem from health problems. She will worry that even benign things on her body are something more sinister, and unfortunately she has passed that health anxiety down to me. She requires a lot of reassurance from me as unfortunately she doesn't trust doctors. Also unfortunately, one of her symptoms did turn out to be something cancerous about ten years ago (everything is totally fine now) but since then her anxiety has increased. She has been offered mental health resources various times but feels they make her "weak" if she uses them. Instead she prefers to download her worries onto me about life and death, doctor's visits, etc. She has a "partner," but I use that term loosely since it is a mostly a relationship of convenience and they don't get along very well. Many of her complaints to me are about him.

I've tried setting boundaries with her re: health worries since they are triggering for me also but that just set her off. She accused me of saying she was a bad mother, doing a bad job raising me since my father died, etc. The problem is, every time I disagree with her about anything (even very nicely) she takes it as a personal slight. I am currently redoing my basement and am terrified to tell her what flooring I've chosen because I know she will disagree and she won't let up until I "explain myself." It is mortifying to feel this way at 35 years old. I have a great husband, two great kids, etc. and yet I still seem to be so afraid of my mother. I've always felt like the "difficult child," the one who disagrees with her on everything even thought I also feel like i bend over backwards trying to make things ok for her.

Does this sound like BPD to you? I've seen a therapist who mentioned it sounds like I was codependent... I'm really looking for answers so I can start the healing process. Thanks for reading.
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Harri
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« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2020, 06:29:34 PM »

Hi and welcome.

You are in the right place to work on healing.  We get it here and many of us are in similar situations at least in terms of the emotional toll you describe. 

It is hard to say if your mom has BPD.  It certainly sounds like she has some of the traits that can be seen with BPD but are also present in other disorders as well.  Regardless, they are difficult to deal and cope with as a family member.  We can help you learn better ways of coping and interacting with her for sure.

What you describe with your mom about your floor tile is familiar.  I both cringed and smiled sadly when I read it. 

BTW, a lot of us here have co-dependent traits as well.  It would be unusual to come out of the childhoods we had without some dysfunction right?

If you had to pick one thing that is your biggest challenge, what would it be?  Can you share with us how you have tried to set boundaries?  Give us some I said, she said specifics if you can.  It makes it easier to get a feel for your situation.

In the meantime, I hope you settle in and read and post more.  Feel free to jump into other threads.  We are all learning together.  You are in good company.  and yes, things can get better for you.

Again, Welcome
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ov3rwh3lmed21

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« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2020, 08:44:30 PM »

Thanks for the reply. It really does help to have a place to talk about this.

One example of me trying to set a boundary: In her neverending quest to find out more about her health, she has done the genetic testing for ancestry. This is one area I did not feel comfortable discussing with her as I have my own hang-ups about genetics (complicated anxiety issue...I've talked to a therapist about this and am taking steps to remedy it). I explained very calmly that I didn't want to talk about it and could we please talk about something else? Typical for her is initially agreeing, dropping the issue, but then circling around back to it again and again with questions like, "but I just don't GET it...WHY don't you want to talk about it?" and making me "defend" my choice. This circling back happened many times over several different conversations on different days until I eventually felt so beaten down that I let her talk about the genetic results. I was made to feel I didn't have a good enough "excuse" to not talk about it. And of course I ended up feeling sick to my stomach for not standing my ground.

When I confronted my mom about this episode a few weeks later she denied it ever happened and said she immediately honored my request to stop talking about the subject. That made me feel like I was going crazy! Luckily my husband was able to reassure me that my recollection of the events was accurate.

Despite all this, I end up feeling extremely guilty if I am out of contact with her for more than a few days (which rarely happens). The guilt is the biggest issue right now. I feel guilty if I disagree with her on even the most minor issues since it seems to cause her so much grief. She has a pleasant but fairly distant relationship with my younger brother and as I mentioned a fairly volatile relationship with her partner so I feel like I have to be there for her, not matter what. I also admit I am emotionally dependent on her because I don't have a large circle of friends and despite everything I desperately still seem to want/need her approval.
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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2020, 05:26:44 PM »

Like Harri, I cringed a little when I got to the floor tile part. So relatable.

Excerpt
I have a great husband, two great kids, etc. and yet I still seem to be so afraid of my mother. I've always felt like the "difficult child," the one who disagrees with her on everything even thought I also feel like i bend over backwards trying to make things ok for her.
Aside from the two kids, this is exactly how I felt about my mom 10 months ago. Please know that you aren't crazy and that there's not something wrong with you.

Excerpt
That made me feel like I was going crazy! Luckily my husband was able to reassure me that my recollection of the events was accurate.
My mom makes me feel this way basically every time I talk to her. I've had to really work to hold on to my reality the last few months. Something I've started doing which might help is to write down your version of events exactly how you remember it. There's something very helpful for me about writing things out. I think it gives me more confidence in myself and my memory. And like you did, ask someone else who was involved, if possible. Your mom will probably never acknowledge that she might be wrong, but at least your can hold firm to what you know to be real.
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Nurse6

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« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2020, 10:38:37 AM »

Hi,

Thanks for posting. I often too feel overwhelmed by my Mother's emotional needs. When my mom feels that I am not meeting her emotional needs she tells me I am toxic and abusive, when I know that is not the case. It gets so overwhelming sometimes I actually start to believe I am abusive and toxic and then fear that I am toxic and abusive towards other relationships in my life. I have found placing boundaries has worked but still hurts me because I feel like I am pushing my mom away. I hope this site helps you find the advice you are looking for, and remember you are not alone! 
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Panda39
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« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2020, 11:46:48 AM »

Hi ov3rwh3lmed21,

Boundaries are tough particularly when you have been raised by someone that has likely taught you not to have any when it comes to them.  To me the key to boundaries are enforcing them consistently.

I frequently share this simple boundary analogy, I hope it helps.

Boundary...
Mom's value: I want to take good care of my child and that includes eating good healthy food.
Mom's boundary: Sweets are to be had at special occasions only
Mom's Action: Not buy sweets for her child while grocery shopping

We've all seen this at the grocery store...

A little kid asks mom for candy, mom says no so the kid pouts.  Little kid asks mom again for some candy, mom says no again so the kid whines.  Little kid asks mom again for some candy, mom says no for the third time, this time kid has a full on melt down screaming tantrum (what we call an Extinction Burst). What happens if mom gives in and gets the candy?  That little kid has just learned that having a screaming tantrum will get them what they want and if it gets them what they want once screaming in the grocery store will likely work again. What happens if mom doesn't give in? The kid learns that no means no and he gives up.

This does not mean however that the little kid won't ask again the next time mom and he go to the grocery store...the kid will test the boundary again and so will the person with BPD in your life.  The key here is to always be consistent with your boundary.

More on Boundaries...
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=61684.0
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=167368.0

The other thing I noticed in your post is what we call JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain).  We encourage people not to JADE because all it does is amp up the drama and conflict and create those miserable circular arguments that just go round and round.
More on Jade...
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=139972.0

One example of me trying to set a boundary: In her never ending quest to find out more about her health, she has done the genetic testing for ancestry. This is one area I did not feel comfortable discussing with her as I have my own hang-ups about genetics (complicated anxiety issue...I've talked to a therapist about this and am taking steps to remedy it). I explained very calmly that I didn't want to talk about it and could we please talk about something else? Typical for her is initially agreeing, dropping the issue, but then circling around back to it again and again with questions like, "but I just don't GET it...WHY don't you want to talk about it?" and making me "defend" my choice. This circling back happened many times over several different conversations on different days until I eventually felt so beaten down that I let her talk about the genetic results. I was made to feel I didn't have a good enough "excuse" to not talk about it. And of course I ended up feeling sick to my stomach for not standing my ground.

I feel you on the beat down that sucks but you don't have to JADE, "No" is a complete sentence. 

Mom: starts talking about health/genetics
You: I don't want to talk about health/gentics, lets talk about something else (suggest a topic)
Mom: Health...Genetics...Health...Genetics
You: I've said that don't want to talk about this.
Mom: Why? Health...Genetics...Health...Genetics
You: I'm not going to talk about health/genetics, if we can't talk about something else I'm going out for a walk (take a break)
Mom: FOG (Fear,Obligation, Guilt...you never want to talk Health/Genetics with me, a good Daughter would listen, I'm your mother you have to listen... Health... Genetics... Health...
You: I'm going for a walk I'll be back in a half hour.

I have found placing boundaries has worked but still hurts me because I feel like I am pushing my mom away.

This stood out to me. 

One of the issues with having a parent with BPD can be enmeshment, I know setting boundaries is hard and uncomfortable but creating your own space, privacy, relationships, independence, opinions, thoughts etc. are all healthy things. So maybe you are pushing your mom away a little to create that space for yourself and instead of seeing it as a bad thing, I challenge you to see it as a healthy thing.  Boundaries are a type of self-care.  Self-Care is not Selfish.  You are on the right track.

More on Emotional Incest/Enmeshment...
https://bpdfamily.com/content/was-part-your-childhood-deprived-emotional-incest
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=85049.0



Panda39
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"Have you ever looked fear in the face and just said, I just don't care" -Pink
Methuen
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« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2020, 01:31:21 AM »

Excerpt
she has called/texted multiple times per day. Her worries mostly stem from health problems. She will worry that even benign things on her body are something more sinister...She requires a lot of reassurance from me as unfortunately she doesn't trust doctors... her anxiety has increased. She has been offered mental health resources various times but feels they make her "weak" if she uses them. Instead she prefers to download her worries onto me about life and death, doctor's visits, etc.
 I really connected to this today.  You just perfectly described my mother.  I didn't even have my first foot across her doorstep today, and she was in full blown waif mode telling me about her pain and catastrophizing with statements that she must have some major health problem because something is so wrong with her legs.  So I handed her the phone and suggested she make a doctor's appointment.  She seemed a little stunned.  Then I asked her if she wanted to go to the doctor on her own (she's 84 and has driving and mobility issues), or if she would like me to go with her and advocate at her appt.  She just looked at me and didn't know what to say, because she doesn't want me at her doctor appts.  I know this from past experience.  As I was crossing her doorstep, and she started telling me about her pain and how something was wrong with her, she sounded so sadly pathetic.  I instantly recognized that she was trying to make me feel her emotions with her, and for her.  Instantly.  Looking back, I should have used SET.  I didn't think of it; my brain was racing and my blood pressure was rising, because experience tells me she doesn't really want to solve a problem.  She just needs to create them or imagine them because she always needs a crisis.  Crises bring her drama and attention.  Instead I reactively went straight to problem solving mode and gave her the phone to call her doctor.  That's when I also asked her if she wanted me to take her to the appointment.  Later tonight, our daughter 23 (who is visiting but leaving soon) called her to see if she could go visit her grandma tomorrow.  D23 reported to me after that grandma "didn't sound very good".  The last thing she said to D23 was "at least someone wants to see me".  That's after H and I spent 3 hours with her today visiting, mowing lawns, fixing problems around her house, and her Smartphone problems.  D23 wasn't impressed with her gramma's response to asking if she could come for a visit.  All this to say, I feel where you are coming from with a BPD mother who is emotionally needy, needs constant attention, doesn't trust doctors with her physical symptoms, has acute anxiety (my mom has one hand that "shakes" whenever it's at rest - nerve related), and has also refused mental health services.  
Excerpt
Instead she prefers to download her worries onto me about life and death
Ditto.  Like you, I find it draining.  Kind of sucks the life right out of you, and leaves a bunch of negativity in the void.  I think that's why today I went straight to problem solving mode by "calling her on it", and suggesting she make a doctors appt.  She once went about 5 years complaining to me about stomach problems and nausea and wore an anti-emetic patch constantly the whole time.  That didn't end until she started falling from frailty, which gave her a bigger more concrete problem to focus on (fractured bones led to temporary wheelchair restrictions until healing was complete).  Death stories too.  Oh my gosh, all her friends are dying, except they never do.

Excerpt
She accused me of saying she was a bad mother, doing a bad job raising me
Yep...I've been down this road a ton of times too.  Strangely, when she's not dysregulating and her mood is stable, if I do or say something genuine and nice, she doesn't say thank-you, she says "what a good mother she must have been".  Completely diametrically opposed emotions.  It can all be really confusing and distressing.

Excerpt
I am currently redoing my basement and am terrified to tell her what flooring I've chosen because I know she will disagree
 Yep, I get this too.  I once told my mom I was going to ferment my sauerkraut for 3 weeks, and she started screaming at me over the phone "don't talk to me like that" because she decided to process hers after only 1 week of fermentation.  She was in such a rage, that after she finished screaming at me she hung up on me.  All because I dared to ferment my sauerkraut differently than her.  BPD sucks for everyone.  I'm tempted to suggest not even telling your mom about which flooring you've chosen.  That way you can avoid another conflict with her.  Besides, it's your flooring.  You don't have to "check" it with her, right?  Once its in and she sees it, it doesn't matter what she thinks because it's not hers to live with.  

These are the problems, but how to move forward and heal, right?  So over the last year with my mom, I've been working on how to help myself, because she's not going to change.  In fact she's worse as she ages because she's more frail, she's closer to death than birth, and she's living in fear, which I can't fix.  I've set up a lot of boundaries, and less contact is one of them.  I see her about 2X per week.  My H sees her separately at least 1X per week.    If mom is dysregulating, one of our plans is for H to be with me when I see her, as she doesn't become abusive when someone else is around.  She also refused to go on an assisted living waiting list, so my boundary is to let her solve her own problems, and figure out on her own that she isn't able to cope with living independently any more.  She's always made it clear she wants to live with us.  That's another boundary - we need our own space to live our lives.

Excerpt
I have a great husband, two great kids, etc. and yet I still seem to be so afraid of my mother.
Ditto.  Like you, I'm so grateful for my H and our kids (S25, D23).  I feel so bad for my H to be stuck with a BPD MIL, and for my kids to have such a complicated grandma.  It does affect quality of life.  Like you, I am terrified of my mother when she's dysregulating.  

You are not alone ov3rwh3lmed21.  There are bad patches, and slightly better patches with my BPD mom.  I hope the bad patch for you ends soon.  In my case, the slightly better patch seems to be coming to an end, and the bad patch is just revving up (based on mom's recent behaviors).

I absolutely love the lesson on boundaries that Panda gave in this thread.  It's a timely refresher for me too.  The thing about my mom when she is dysregulating and her high emotional needs can't be met by me, is that she blames me for her problem of the day, and cries or screams that I don't love her.  Does your mom do this sort of thing too?

For anyone out there, does it ever make sense to tell a BPD, that you love them, but not their behavior at that moment?  I'm guessing the answer is to stick to SET, but gee whiz  Cursing - won't cause site restrictions at Starbucks (click to insert in post)  I remember my dad (bless his extraordinarily kind nature) telling my mom in exasperation to "shape up" or "snap out of it".  I was a kid, and just can't remember if it was effective or not.

In the end, I know our boundaries are what will keep us safe.  So as hard as it is to stick to them because of the guilt and obligation, we absolutely must, or we are lost.  The quote from Panda says it all:  "Love yourself enough to set boundaries..."

It's somehow comforting for me to know that there are others with similar experiences, and that we can all struggle and stumble through this journey to healing together.  We are not alone.

Thanks for starting this thread.  I hope tomorrow is a better day for you.








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GaGrl
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« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2020, 11:04:46 AM »

Methuen, my father had to deal with a uNPD/BPD MIL for many years. When she went too far, my dad's phrase was a sharp, "That's enough, Dorothy!"

And yes, it worked.
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In yours and my discharge."
Methuen
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« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2020, 12:41:23 PM »

GaGrl:  thank-you for that gift.  I've never tried that approach.  When the time is right, I will try it out.  Perhaps another tool in the tool box.

Panda:  I just re-read the two links on emotional incest you included.  I've read them several times before, but they never connected.  Perhaps the timing was right yesterday after the day's interactions with my mother, and maybe I've done enough "work" in the past year, but this time, for some reason, they were a "direct hit", kind of like a lightening bolt.

Not long ago, my mother actually turned to me one day, and in a 5yr old kind of voice, said to me, "I want you to be my mommy".  She's 84.  I instantly "reacted" with humour, and joked her that that she didn't need me because "she was a stubborn old lady that liked to do things her own way".  She took it as a compliment, thankfully, and laughed.  In the past, I would have instead tried to help her.

I am really grateful that you took the time to write out that lesson on boundaries and emotional enmeshment. 

Thank-you.
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ov3rwh3lmed21

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« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2020, 07:36:32 PM »

Methuen- Wow, such a heartfelt post. I really feel I can relate to your struggle with your mother. I've often wondered too whether many of my mom's health conditions are psychosomatic. She meets any suggestion that stress may be a trigger for her physically with a firm rebuttal, however.

I love how you called your mother out by suggesting immediately that she go to the doctor. It has actually never occurred to me to be that direct...isn't it strange how much enmeshment can cripple our ability to see things objectively? I am still at the very beginning of figuring out how to set boundaries. Guilt is my #1 enemy, especially since my father has passed on and my mom's current partner provides little to no emotional support. Since I was 15 I have been parentified and I feel like she has no one else. But hearing your story makes me feel less alone.

In the past I've taken pride in being able to meet my mom's emotional needs. But in the few instances I've had to take some time for myself, the reaction has been brutal. She once said that I had undone fifteen years of her being a strong, single parent, all because I needed some boundaries. I get the sense that you are confused by your mom's behavior and I share that feeling with my own. I get so many mixed messages. She says I ruin our vacations together with my "anger," but then excitedly sends me texts about planning our next trip together. It really is like there are two sides to her.

And yes, she often said when I was younger (teenaged) that I felt like a mother to her (or that I was her mother in a past life). I never knew whether to take that as a compliment or feel really weird about it. Mixed emotions again...
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ov3rwh3lmed21

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« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2020, 07:38:37 PM »

Panda- I have been eagerly clicking on all the links you shared. I'd never even heard of JADE before but thank you SO MUCH for taking the time to explain it to me with examples from my post. This community is so awesome and I am already learning so much.  With affection (click to insert in post)
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