I want to understand but I usually really don’t.

[riblet]

Hello! This is my first post! I’ve already looked at this site for years but just made my account. You all have helped so much and I appreciate you!

My partner has BPD and I’ve gotten way better at handling our conflicts. The thing I’m struggling with now is… Well, my current tactic that has been working pretty well it’s just completely let go of my ego and not JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain) at all and just try to listen and empathize and respond and be very patient. But I’m wondering, is it sustainable  to be such a pushover? My partner can tell that I don’t fully understand why they are upset, even though I try to validate what points I can. Our conflicts pretty much always start with him finding “inconsistencies” between two things I’ve said, and rather than actually ask me about it to clarify he usually just talks at me for X amount of time getting more and more upset and I feel like a helpless bystander. I try to validate and listen and understand, and any observer would see that I am doing 90% of the listening, but he still keeps telling me that I’m not listening and I don’t understand. when I do try to explain what I meant and how those two things that he sees as inconsistent make sense to me, it just gets much worse and he says that is not the point. So I am left wondering, what is the point? And he says he’s tired of explaining the same thing over and over and I still don’t understand.

I don’t want to be patronizing, I want to be supportive and say the right things while still being genuine. I want to open my mind and truly understand but I feel like there’s some kind of mental block and it’s hard for me to understand him. I’m supposed to write him a text right now responding to a situation that happened last night that I said I was too tired to discuss… It’s just hard.

I’ve never mentioned to him that I think this is BPD related because I read online that wouldn’t be a good idea and I can just see that being bad news, even though I really think that is the case.

Should I intervene and stop him when i see this pattern starting? Is this just something inevitable that we have to live with? i’m afraid that he might reach a breaking point if nothing changes in these exchanges. He wants more from me... he wants me to understand. I absolutely love my partner and I’m not considering ending the relationship at all. honestly, if anyone reads this and can relate any comments would be helpful!  thank you

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Football2000]

There is also the support-empathy-truth technique where at the end you still have to set your boundaries (the truth part). I think there is a fine line between not JADEing and being a pushover, and no, I don't think it is really sustainable...the pushover part that is.

In fact the validation part is just the first step. In my experience validation is rather easy and frustrating at the same time, and then you kind of have to figure out what to do next. Personally I find writing down what I need helps because if I just think of it in the moment it will probably be squashed.

[riblet]

There is also the support-empathy-truth technique where at the end you still have to set your boundaries (the truth part). I think there is a fine line between not JADEing and being a pushover, and no, I don't think it is really sustainable...the pushover part that is.

In fact the validation part is just the first step. In my experience validation is rather easy and frustrating at the same time, and then you kind of have to figure out what to do next. Personally I find writing down what I need helps because if I just think of it in the moment it will probably be squashed.

Football2000, thank you so much for your response. I will search for/read about this support-empathy-truth technique that you speak of. Writing it out helps me too! You're right I know I need to do more than just validate and I need to get in touch with my boundaries/needs a little more... i just stopped JADEing a few months ago (from advice from this site) and that has helped deescalate situations a lot but not so much with real resolution. yeah i guess this is the next thing to learn

QUESTION: can there be a real resolution in these situations and what does that look like?

We just talked and right now i am reading through our text conversation from last night because he says somewhere in there is the answer to why he is upset. It's hard for me to think about, feels foggy because I was so surprised/taken aback when this all happened (over something suuuper trivial but ofc it's about the communication and not the thing)  but I am trying. He has told me he needs to see more effort from me. So I am trying, trying & crying and I feel like a total idiot and asshole because I don't know the right thing to say.

Still haven't read all the articles on this site but i'm reading through them, thank you all so much

[RolandOfEld]

Hi riblet, congrats on your first post!

I'm going to approach your question from a different angle if that's ok. In my experience, in order to confront any emotionally-challenging situation, be it a work conflict, argument with a partner, etc, we need to make sure our own emotional tank is as full as possible. If we are drained and we try to take on someone else's pain, the result is likely to be exhaustion and, following that, anger or depression.

So how do we fill that tank? It's different for everyone, but I think the best thing we can do is talk with someone we know who loves us, such as a family member or close friend, and absorb those loving vibes. Hobbies are vital, as are things like music, meditation, whatever replenishes you.

May I ask about what you do for self care? And do you feel like you're getting enough time/space to do it in your current situation?

~ROE

[Football2000]

QUESTION: can there be a real resolution in these situations and what does that look like?

I think that is the question we all have on our minds at one time or another. There is a thread of success stories, and some people with BPD traits do have some of their traits recede over time.

However, no amount of data can really give you what you really want to know...the outcome of your own situation. At the minimum, the person needs to admit they have a problem and seek the correct help though.

Then even if you could know the outcome, you still need to do all the things for yourself like seek support from others and be kind to yourself to help you through the emotional turbulence.

[Kristacat91]

As I read your post, I felt my heart going out to you because I can see how hard you are trying in this relationship and it really reminds me of myself, early in my own relationship with my husband (married now over 25 years).  I was always thinking to myself that if there was just something I could do, if I could do what he wanted, then the problem would be solved. Only years later did I finally realize that it was NOTHING I was doing wrong. Sure, I could learn to respond differently to him and I could do all the things to ameliorate a rage from him, but in terms of me doing something wrong to cause his behavior? I wasn’t doing a darn thing wrong. I did not deserve that behavior. Neither do you.

One comment really stuck with me: “He has told me he needs to see more effort from me. So I am trying, trying, and crying...”  I’m so sorry you are going through this. I know exactly how it feels. But I feel that you HAVE already put forth tremendous effort, but you cannot take on all the responsibility for this relationship. If you continue down this path, know that it will never be enough and now is the time to start working on enforcing boundaries (and I’m terrible at doing this, so I’m a fine one to talk—but I do see the need for it. This is currently my own issue as well). 

This is a control tactic of his. No matter what you do, it will never be enough. You have to decide where to draw the line and what your boundaries are (I’ve been reading the resources on this site and also SWoE book, again, and I’m working on it. It’s certainly not easy). Then draw those boundaries, calmly and with love.

I guess I don’t have any real advice other than to make sure you know that you are NOT doing anything wrong in terms of not being able to understand him.  You never will.  Part of the trick to staying sane yourself in a relationship like this is to just accept that a lot of it won’t make sense.  But know that it’s not you.

As a P.S.: One reason our kids seem to have grown up without being too psychologically wounded by their father’s rages is that as soon as I realized that it was not anything I was doing, as soon as they could understand, I told them, “Hey, Daddy’s not mad at YOU...you did nothing wrong. He is just really upset with himself and he needs to practice how to control that.  Let’s go for a walk...” The most damaging thing about this is that it’s super easy to internalize the rages or anger or criticisms of the BPD person, even knowing all this. 

[JaneWrites]

Riblet, I identify with so much of what you are writing.

And wow, Kristacat91:

“Hey, Daddy’s not mad at YOU...you did nothing wrong. He is just really upset with himself and he needs to practice how to control that.  Let’s go for a walk...”

Even though my BPDh will probably never actually practice how to control that, I am totally using this quote as my go-to with the kids. Thank you!

[Gemsforeyes]

Dear Riblet (and others)

Good thoughts rolling through this thread, and it’s so amazing to see how everyone tries so hard to help one another, and how we struggle(d) to understand and love our partners; and to make them FEEL our love - through our words and actions.

Most of us here first arrive with very foggy and confused minds... broken hearts... hanging on by a thread.  When I arrived, I literally felt I’d lost my voice in the relationship with the man I loved deeply.  I cowered when he raged.  I studied and learned, tried all the communication tools... NOT JADING, SET, VALIDATION, DEARMAN.

I understood his black and white thinking.  I think that way sometimes, too.  I learned that to HIM, FEELINGS = FACTS.  He would literally CHANGE the narrative to match how he felt.  IN THE MOMENT.  PwBPD Do this.  And “changing the narrative” does mean lying (to an emotionally healthy person).  You find yourself explaining that telling the truth is OK... To a full grown person. 

They feel things in the moment.  And the next moment things change.  I could deal with the BPD elements of his personality.  I’d actually ask him for the FEELINGS behind what he needed.  Sometimes he could explain it, and sometimes I’d pay a steep price for the questions.

If you’re really dealing with a pwBPD, you’ve got to attempt to get at the FEELING behind the words.

Then there’s the manipulation, the deceit, the lying, the stealing... the narcissistic part.  In my case, this part RULED him (took me years to understand).  I made excuse after excuse for his behavior (just like I did for my husband before him).  And I had to ultimately leave because of certain things I learned he did.  Really questionable values that do NOT align with mine.

Riblet, when you say you’re reviewing a series of texts messages because he says:

“Somewhere in there is the answer to why he is upset”... I’m sorry, but No.  Just no.  You’re already upset.  Is it fair for him to send you on a scavenger hunt to understand his emotions?  I don’t think so. 

It would be helpful to establish a boundary around that.  You can let him know that although you’d love to understand his meaning, reading between the lines in a series of text messages likely won’t get you there.  And does his meaning of “effort” apply to actions or words?

I hope I’m not being too harsh...I’m a bit (maybe more than a bit) stressed right now... and still angry at myself.  The “pushover”:characterization of yourself.  I feel you, my friend.  Except I came to the proper realization that I had completely lost all self-respect.. a lingering feeling when I truly see how he treated me.  With complete disrespect.

And finally, the “growing out of it” supposition?  Maybe if a person with BPD traits is self-reflective, owns THEIR stuff and really works through their trauma and root causes in therapy.  But if the person is heavily weighted toward narcissism, don’t count on aging as a “cure”.   My exBPD/NPDbf is 62, incredibly handsome and he’s just becoming angrier and more hateful.

In the end, my end...  the relationship was a gift and a curse.  The intensity of these relationships FORCE of to take a good, hard look at ourselves.  And sometimes perhaps at why we don’t hold ourselves with high enough regard to expect MORE from our partners.

I want you to feel good about yourself.  You have every right to feel loved and honored and respected... and emotionally and physically SAFE.  So here’s my question, Riblet.  What do you expect... what do YOU want from your partner?

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes