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Author Topic: Is it really about looks, or something different?  (Read 370 times)
dindin
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« Reply #30 on: October 08, 2020, 08:20:46 AM »

In treatment of BPD, the therapists takes the place of the punitive parent and attempts to teach a little different, the second time around.


Is that the same for narc/codependents?

Did you see this abandonment in real time, or later on?

There was a 10 second delay before I knew what happened Smiling (click to insert in post)

You have mentioned (doubting yourself) these feeling in previous posts. Seeing them from a different perspective has caused a little confusion.

 You mean the feelings of attaching to the object other?
 If so then yeah, it was like observing an automatic process in what I thought was a completely indepedent brain. Like there are emotions present ready to jump on anyone who is in front of me, especially if it's a laaaady :D

You know what, just by accident I came across at a video on the internet that illustrates the point better than words:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apzXGEbZht0&feature=emb_title&ab_channel=UMassBoston

This video sums up all of my romantic relationship - as creepy as it sounds. Hahaha  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post), with an added feature that my ex BPD partners were doing this not as a part of the experiment :D

Im in the United States, you?

Europe.

Anyone I come in contact with, feels my energy.

Can you tell a bit more about that?
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FindingMe2011
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« Reply #31 on: October 08, 2020, 06:29:57 PM »

Anyone I come in contact with, feels my energy.

Can you tell a bit more about that?

I can only speak from my perspective. This term also appears to be loaded, and will mean different things to different people. it appears to me when all people converse in any form, the subconscious also speaks. ( i believe body language is subconscious run, unless studied and used as a weapon) It appears in a cryptic way. When Im involved its what I hear, in very close to real time. Others around appear oblivious. Most are, the rest arent paying attention. Similar to you noticing your abandonment fear, while in therapy and being able to name it. I seem to be able analyze it, through deductive reasoning rather quickly at times. Sometimes in real time, or usually fairly soon. Its funny, the ones that take the longest involve my romantic relationships. Its from an indifference standpoint, not good/bad, black/white, just is. It doesnt expect a result. Just observes and asks questions. These questions typically, ask the person to question their own truth. You would be amazed at how many people will have referred to this conversation, as an argument on a later date. Interesting to say the least. Truth is hard to let go. Until you learn to do this objectively. Then I found the bonus of a healthier lifestyle. Actually it was the only possible outcome, if done correctly.....This also took many tries. I didnt count or put any expectations on anything. I just searched. I find new things daily. An inquisitive mind has no time for fear.

In treatment of BPD, the therapists takes the place of the punitive parent and attempts to teach a little different, the second time around.


Is that the same for narc/codependents?


I had the same question. Looking back this was the experience for me, a calm nervousness, but a little bit different sense on how this was going to turn out. A liberating nakedness of sorts. Your posts also seem to echo this.

There was a 10 second delay before I knew what happened

Interesting.... Do this consistently and your perception will have no choice but to change. The conscious will have more control, you live. The subconscious can only survive, everybodys choice, no?

. Like there are emotions present ready to jump on anyone who is in front of me, especially if it's a laaaady :D

Even today I have to watch myself with this. I steer away from crowds and figure out ways to create one on ones, with the laaaaady...Laugh out loud (click to insert in post).  ANIMAL INSTINCTS... Where do they appear in all of this? Slim if not missing.... All women will tell you smells, hormones, first look into eyes (interesting) and other factors play a large role.

Im in the United States, you?

Europe.


I wonder how much cultures play in all of this ? Seems to be some sort of factor, interesting...........I wish you well, Peace

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« Reply #32 on: October 09, 2020, 02:51:23 AM »

Excerpt
Here goes: is there a physical type (looks, demeanor, etc. something that you sense or see even without saying a word to them, like first time you see them) of a man/woman who is more likely to be cluster B, toxic, or similar

no.

there is a stereotype (and i emphasize the word stereotype) of the young female with bpd: tattoos. piercings. wild hair. edgy.

in general, if anything, comeliness is not associated with clinical bpd; self destruction is.

Excerpt
I have a type, no question about it.

this is what it really comes down to.

Excerpt
Now, how in the **** does my subconscious pick these people? Is it really about looks, or something different?

you just have a strong association when it comes to who/what youre attracted to.

its kind of like when people say you cant just know who someone is from looking at someones social media. on the contrary, you can tell a lot. you can tell a lot about a person just looking at their prose. you cant tell everything, far from it, of course, but that isnt the point. you can find, or weed out, what youre looking for and are drawn to.

looks, body language, clothing, are no different. you can tell a lot from these things.

Excerpt
is that these people are easy to pick up because of their low self esteem or somethign, or chat up to, and I am no casanova in that regard, so I might somehow be aiming low in terms of effort when meeting people, and hence the effect.

youre probably onto something here.

heres the thing.

at this stage in your life, what you are attracted to is fairly set in place. you have a type, and by and large, you probably always will.

Excerpt
Someone said in this topic, that people usually pick other people that are similarly emotionally available,

we mate with people that are similar in terms of our emotional maturity. this is bowens family systems theory.

our emotional maturity is not fixed in place. it can grow. so while your attractions likely wont change much, what you are drawn to, and ultimately connect with, will very likely change.

that has tended to be the case for me. im still attracted to the same type of girl. some of them are toxic, some are not. the ones that are, im just as attracted to, but the sorts of things that at one time would have drawn me to them tend to repel me. im a different guy, who makes different choices, and is looking for something different.
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dindin
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« Reply #33 on: October 12, 2020, 02:41:00 PM »

once removed: thanks for your answer, it resonates a lot. especially the bits about my "type" being pretty much fixed at this point and having to work with what is given and not necessarily fight against it

Having spent the last week or more researching, meditating, doing things against my fear and the comfort zone of inaction, having read the books by pete walker, but mainly from talking with my T specifically about this -- my truth distilled into the realisation that I suffer from cptsd. Up to now, I was kinda stuck between the definitions of codependency and narcissism, but each of them, or even both of them together, weren't enough to explain some things. Not only intellectually, but also in terms of my own intuition. Whereas complext childhood ptsd due to emotional neglect seems like a fit. I understand that these are just words and concepts, but it helps me kinda come to terms with my own borderline traits as well - and it explains it better than any categorization that I came across so far.

Still, cptsd is not a recognised disorder that therapists work with where I live, but my T said that if it makes so much sense to me and to them as well we would try a different approach which is propsed for precisely this problem: a mix of cbt, psychodynamic and trauma healing. And I have been to cbt and psychodynamic separately and they didn't seem to do much for me, whereas even one session of these working in tandem seems to really make a difference for me.

Is anyone familiar with cptsd? Has anyone come to similar realisations? We so often talk here and on the internet in a dichotomy of codependency vs bpd, or codependency vs narcissism, that I was really surprised to see that some effort is being made to have a more inclusive view of all these in terms of trauma. Which on an intellectual and intuitive level really, really resonates with me. Any thoughts?

I also know that some people think of these are just labels, but to have it explained intellectually and also for it to resonate with me intuitively kinda is a big thing for me. And also frees me of this weird (tri-?)dychotomy of narcissism, bpd and codependency, which never felt right forme.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2020, 02:50:20 PM by dindin » Logged
FindingMe2011
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« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2020, 08:05:52 AM »

Having spent the last week or more researching, meditating, doing things against my fear and the comfort zone of inaction,

When meditating, does it become a breathing exercise or an out of body experience? Both are healthy, one helped me calm myself (healthy self soothe) the other showed me my fears.......... You cant fight your fears and expect a good outcome, they need to be understood.

having read the books by pete walker, but mainly from talking with my T specifically about this -- my truth distilled into the realization that I suffer from cptsd. Up to now, I was kinda stuck between the definitions of codependency and narcissism, but each of them, or even both of them together, weren't enough to explain some things. Not only intellectually, but also in terms of my own intuition. Whereas complex childhood ptsd due to emotional neglect seems like a fit. I understand that these are just words and concepts, but it helps me kinda come to terms with my own borderline traits as well - and it explains it better than any categorization that I came across so far.

I dont believe I have ever completely agreed with a persons literature on psychology. Ive studied many and seem to take something from many of them. Personally I think CPSTD could be related to almost all mental illnesses. Unfortunately the PC culture has also stagnated mental health, to create outs for the mentally ill (excuses) instead of genuinely helping................ At some point the intellect will do nothing more for you. It will become confusing and have you looking for outs. You need to learn how to feel your way through life. Thinking has gotten you this far. You raising your EQ not IQ is required. The only way to do this is experience them, know them by name, and gain an understanding with them. We only fear what we dont understand.

And I have been to cbt and psychodynamic separately and they didn't seem to do much for me, whereas even one session of these working in tandem seems to really make a difference for me.

It does come down to what you see. Anything that helps you move forward, should be exhausted. If you should become stuck again, try something new.

Is anyone familiar with cptsd? Has anyone come to similar realisations? We so often talk here and on the internet in a dichotomy of codependency vs bpd, or codependency vs narcissism, that I was really surprised to see that some effort is being made to have a more inclusive view of all these in terms of trauma. Which on an intellectual and intuitive level really, really resonates with me. Any thoughts?

For the most part, I believe trauma obtained early in brain development, is what people spend the rest of their lives experiencing.  Finding any just reason to project this trauma. The worse the trauma, the worse the projection. Everybody shows traits of everything, and all have a breaking point. Truly believing this allowed me to let go of labels. It appears to create more confusion by splitting hairs. I found it easier to deal with just INTIMACY/ABANDONMENT.  Nobody yet has convinced me differently. These are the roots and simplifying the origin (gaining the understanding of my past false perception, and why) helped me.

And also frees me of this weird (tri-?) dichotomy of narcissism, bpd and codependency, which never felt right for me.

Thats because they overlap just as all mental illnesses do. They dont work separately, its also a well oiled machine, created just so, to get through a day. .........................I remember pulling these cobwebs off, one at a time, sometimes exposing more of them.... .............. I wish you well, Peace

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