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Author Topic: Relationship with family of origin  (Read 1284 times)
truthdevotee
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« Reply #90 on: February 28, 2021, 05:46:17 AM »

Argh... Terrible mistake. She was raging in front of children just now and she saw me switch on the video on my mobile for evidence. She kind of saw it, not fully but she noticed.

Perhaps this isn't a bad thing but I really didn't want that to happen. It was due to my anxiety not being careful enough.

Argh. I just stayed silent and didn't say yes I'm recording or no I'm not recording.

I'll use this for a positive thing, that's the only way forward. I'll just keep repeating no rage in front of the children.

I feel sad about the mistake with the video. However she's not 100% sure it happened. The benefit was she toned things down.

I see she has the potential for outright lying and false accusations towards me. She gave me the middle finger several times today.

I am getting the sense that an earlier than later departure to another flat is best for the kids. Things are getting to the point where i told my sons mummy is being naughty by shouting. She responded by saying something about me in her local language to him. It was sad to see him being in the middle. I cannot allow this pressure on his psyche.

The country is closing kindergartens tomorrow for 3 weeks. PwBDP refuses to look after them whilst I work home office, its too much stress for her.

I'm thinking now is the time, because I will suffer tremendously if we're in the same home AND I'm supposed to be working but getting nothing done. I might write to my boss about this and ask for approval for Airbnb for work purposes or just help and support.

To manage it with the boys AND work, I might spend money on a nanny.

This will allow me to work and also show the way things can go really quickly
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #91 on: February 28, 2021, 05:57:59 AM »

We are at a beautiful park now and the boys are having a great time. I feel much better than yesterday. I notice some lethargy in my older son but he's having fun on this adventure overall.

The only other option is for me to have time off and not work. Concerned about being in same four walls as pwBDP though
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khibomsis
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« Reply #92 on: February 28, 2021, 08:17:12 AM »

truthdevotee, you are doing OK. Hope you find some time for selfcare in the midst of all of this.

Look, at the heart of the conflict between you and your wife is power. By what I understand, she is unable to go visit her family without your help. Therefore she has to control you. BPD is at its heart an attachment disorder. If she doesn't control you, she won't trust you to fill her needs.

Meanwhile you are trying to ration your energies to cope with the day to day and resolve some deepseated FOO issues that are now playing out in your marriage.
Do I have all of this right?
The reason why I raise it is because when there is real conflict of interest the tools can help reduce it but not remove it.
I would suggest not getting distracted by fluff (what she has read on Kindle, etc) but to focus on the real issue. Offer a bargain like "Honey, when you are ready to talk without middle finger, names, we can discuss a good time to visit your family".
In the meantime, indeed, hope for the best and prepare for the worst. Explore options around finding alternative accommodation for the next few weeks. Either way, it looks to me as if you have only two choices: 1. Take off work while preschool is closed, or 2. Hire a nanny. It is up to you in what space you choose to exercise those options. But indeed you are, sadly, right.  I don't see you being able to get any work done while the kids are at home and wife is raging over a real issue that requires her to re-establish control over you.
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Notwendy
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« Reply #93 on: February 28, 2021, 08:43:12 AM »

I made this same suggestion on another thread-

If you need to get work done, you need a physical boundary. It's not possible to control your wife's behavior or the kids wanting your attention. The only way to have time for work is to have a designated space and hours for it.

This is understandable- if you don't work the family will not have money for food, clothing, shelter. Emotionally they may want you around to pay attention to them, but what good is this if the family is without their basic material needs?

I mentioned how my father coped. Babysitters, pre-school, school. Fortunately my BPD mother prefered that. This is something to negotiate with your wife. The types of day care available now were not common when I was a child. Your younger one could go to day care or a sitter's house while th older on is in a preschool, and later a sitter. You will need to be creative and consider options. A sitter with a calm temperment is a positive thing for your children.

You need a work space. This is a bit trickier in a pandemic, but is there a space or room you can go/rent?
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formflier
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« Reply #94 on: February 28, 2021, 08:55:42 AM »

A sitter with a calm temperament is a positive thing for your children.


Keep this in mind...massive point!!

Best,

FF
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #95 on: February 28, 2021, 09:43:32 AM »

Thank you all.

Forgive me if you're repeating things to me. I think due to being somewhat overwhelmed I'm not integrating learnings as I would do normally.

I will seek to establish a physical separate space today for my work. I'll ask my employer if there is any company-owned apartment space or if I can have a letter of approval affirming the need for Airbnb/Hotel accommodation for work purposes, which would allow me to book Airbnb/Hotel accommodation.

My pwBDP blames me for no emotional intimacy in the relationship. I'm able to be emotionally intimate and generally speaking I am with most people. My personal learning in the corporate world has actually been to not wear my heart on my sleeve so much. Kind of to become more rational and mindful about sharing certain things. But still my self-doubt comes up with my pwBDP. She says I'm incapable of emotional intimacy with her and this is the source of all of our problems. I'm worried it's true. Yet my experience is that I am never heard by her even though I make genuine attempts to listen, understand and reflect back my understanding of her feelings.
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #96 on: February 28, 2021, 09:46:01 AM »

I've wanted a nanny since my first son was born. Unfortunately my pwBDP doesn't allow anybody into "our" home (her father funded a lot of the house and I contributed only about 15%, yet all the rest of my money has been used over the years for everything else... Unfortunately the home ended up in my partner's and partner's father's ownership).

In order to benefit from a nanny I'll 100% need to rent an apartment. Looking into this now. My pwBDP just won't look after both the boys, so really this is my only choice. It feels wrong to go on sick leave for this, especially if I'd be stuck in the same four walls as pwBDP.
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Notwendy
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« Reply #97 on: February 28, 2021, 10:57:41 AM »

The only way I know to help with these accusations is to realize that anyone can think whatever they want and say it. Having healthy boundaries allows us to filter this information and decide if it is really true or not.

If we really have hurt someone or been hurtful- then we can decide to make ammends.

If the accusation isn't true then we don't have to defend it. In fact, defending it might be validating it.

She can think you are emotionally unavailable but you know what is true for you and what isn't.

Unfortunately control can be a form of managing anxiety. If she can control you, she may feel less anxious. Controlling you might not be her #1 goal but if it serves to manage anxiety than it isn't something she would readily give up. However, you also can't manage her anxiety for her by allowing this control if it is detrimental to your well being. In general, we can't manage someone else's feelings, just our own.

When you change your behavior, this can increase anxiety on both your parts, so keep that in mind but also people can adjust to these changes if they are important to you.
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #98 on: February 28, 2021, 11:03:39 AM »

The only way I know to help with these accusations is to realize that anyone can think whatever they want and say it. Having healthy boundaries allows us to filter this information and decide if it is really true or not.

If we really have hurt someone or been hurtful- then we can decide to make ammends.

If the accusation isn't true then we don't have to defend it. In fact, defending it might be validating it.

She can think you are emotionally unavailable but you know what is true for you and what isn't.

Unfortunately control can be a form of managing anxiety. If she can control you, she may feel less anxious. Controlling you might not be her #1 goal but if it serves to manage anxiety than it isn't something she would readily give up. However, you also can't manage her anxiety for her by allowing this control if it is detrimental to your well being. In general, we can't manage someone else's feelings, just our own.

When you change your behavior, this can increase anxiety on both your parts, so keep that in mind but also people can adjust to these changes if they are important to you.

Thank you, thanks. You've mentioned this to me before. I remember now... Thank you. I'm now coming into that inner directed confidence in my sense of reality. Need to trust myself and HP.

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formflier
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« Reply #99 on: February 28, 2021, 05:18:39 PM »


Having things repeated is a good thing.  Each time you learn and re-learn...you form "new healthy pathways".  It appears what you are saying is completely normal!!!

Do you have documentation of expenses and investment in the home?  If there is a split and divorce, I would think you could recover value, regardless of title of ownership.

Listen..sick leave might work for a time.  Don't take it off the table.  Even if on sick leave you can take kids other places.

Keep chasing the bottom line.  Calm atmosphere for you and children.  There are several ways to get there.

Best,

FF
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #100 on: March 01, 2021, 08:16:53 AM »

Having things repeated is a good thing.  Each time you learn and re-learn...you form "new healthy pathways".  It appears what you are saying is completely normal!!!


Thanks FF, that's a healing insight.

Excerpt

Do you have documentation of expenses and investment in the home?  If there is a split and divorce, I would think you could recover value, regardless of title of ownership..


I do have quite thorough documentation of expenses over the years. This is good to hear.

Excerpt

Listen..sick leave might work for a time.  Don't take it off the table.  Even if on sick leave you can take kids other places.

Keep chasing the bottom line.  Calm atmosphere for you and children.  There are several ways to get there.

Best,

FF

This struck me last night when I read it and has been in my mind since, not to take sick leave off the table. Thanks for mentioning that.

I got me and my son a covid test today. Still open what to do next 3 weeks depending on results. I have vacation days booked all next week but the place we planned to go closed due to heightened restrictions. PwBDP wants me to move the days to last week of the month when the restrictions may be loosened.

Need to get still and listen to my heart on this whole ordeal, or I'll be swayed unhealthily by her desires.
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khibomsis
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« Reply #101 on: March 01, 2021, 02:54:09 PM »

truthdevotee, thanks for checking in! Indeed, be still for a while, it is another day and you are still alive and breathing. Actually sometimes resting and doing nothing is the best option. You will know what is best for you.
Hope everything goes fine with the test!
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #102 on: March 27, 2021, 02:15:13 AM »

It's been almost a month since I reached out to my parents for the first time.

Beforehand, I let my pwBPD that the "contract" in which I agreed to her approval whenever I wanted to contact my family of origin, was not right for me anymore, and that I would be contacting them. Although I'd tried to make this step for several weeks beforehand, it was only when coming to this forum that I obtained the strength, focus and conviction to actually do what is right... part of my problem was not knowing what was right, and not right. Last night, I found this workshop which has taught me the distinction between core values and shared values:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=61684.0

pwBPD continues to go through strong mood swings, swinging every few hours back to the topic of my FOO and all the things I've done wrong. She says she doesn't mind that I have contact with them, she minds about the "way I did it." She feels I disrespected her by "breaking the contract" and by not gently discussing the change beforehand. I've validated her feelings about this and told her I'm sorry if I didn't do things in the perfect way... but the topic continues to arise, and it's personally confusing to me what the real issue is... I'm not sure if she knows either. She says she has major pain from this past month when I've ignored her (she really hates it when I walk away when name calling occurs).

I've been learning a lot of new skills over the past 6 weeks, and I'm re-calibrating to find a sweeter balance between boundary setting and validation. I've learned to walk away less, but only if I can remain in a state of neutrality and peace independent of my W's behavior. OMing internally and applying self-massage whilst she's talking (e.g. to head, ears, eyes, etc.) helps. Also avoiding direct eye contact helps a lot and looking at the very corner of her eyes helps a lot so it appears I'm with her but keeps me from absorbing too much negative energy. This enables me to still validate and support but not get pulled in. In general, I'm finding that walking away is to be used only in extreme circumstances as it feels abusive to her (even though she's completely unaware of her own consistent abusive behavior, even if I point it out to her)... it is also safer for my boys when I stay put... to help protect the boys from the negative energy I hold them in the peaceful space and ask Higher Power to hold them within the field of love that I intend to hold for us all.

I'm working through the tools on this forum and there's some good communication tools that I need to apply more consistently.


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formflier
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« Reply #103 on: March 27, 2021, 05:12:45 PM »

Good progress.

When she continues to bring it up I would suggest some of the following lines and ideas.

"I've observed something that seems incredibly important to you....   So..you seem to be suggesting there is a way I could accomplish this that you would have been happy with?  Do I have this right?"

(don't move on until you get a yes or no here)  Very important because in the future if she tries to backtrack...stay curious about her change of mind (don't try to suggest or buy into that she was "wrong before")

Anyway..this is part of "handing it back to her".  Let her show you what the right path looks like.

Best,

FF

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Four Winds

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« Reply #104 on: March 27, 2021, 09:22:37 PM »

Hello Truthdevotee, its going to be a hard road trying to convince her as she will continue to revert back to the default position which is to convince you that "..your FOO is bad, they are bad people and you must be punished mercilessly for disobeying her instructions NOT to talk them, ever again".  My brother's wife relentlessly accused him that he and his very bad FOO, were disrespecting her (when in fact the opposite was true) of not doing things the right way according to her specifications (whatever they were on the day, even though we all bent over backwards to accommodate her demands).  She then produced a long shopping list of grievances of all the things she perceived I had done wrong to her, stretching back more than 30 years. If I had to tell you what the list included you would laugh in amazement, it was that puzzling and confusing. 

So yes, it will be personally confusing to you as to what the real issue is, as it defies rational and logical behaviour.  Presumption here is that the real issue is to disrupt any of your further attempts to contact your family as total isolation from the people who love you and hold you dear is really her main goal.  She is not going to let up until she gets that contract out of you again.
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formflier
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« Reply #105 on: March 28, 2021, 09:26:46 PM »


It is less important that you convince her....than it is that you convince yourself.

Once you have convinced yourself...the let your actions follow your convictions...and stop engaging with your wife on this subject.  Especially if she doesn't appear to want to be convinced.

It takes two to argue...so...if one of you is convinced that is an unproductive argument...it can be ended for you and the realtionship.

Best,

FF
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truthdevotee
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« Reply #106 on: March 29, 2021, 01:56:05 PM »

Thank you FF & Four Winds, for your guidance and direction... it means the world to me. Keeps me on track, and focused.
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khibomsis
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« Reply #107 on: March 30, 2021, 02:47:34 AM »

Great to hear of your progress, TD. You've done a lot in only 6 weeks. Although of course the years of work in 12 step helped to prepare you for this

I also am learning to not get sucked in when my expwBPD dysregulates. I tell myself the key is for me not to get triggered, and chant under my breath, or put on calming music, or focus on how unhappy she looks. My mantra is mostly "you shall not have the power to trigger me".  It is hard because it is very easy for me to disassociate, so staying present but not in the mix is a balance that takes practice. The result is awesome, as I get better at this she is dysregulating less and less, and on her side learning to get ahold of herself in time. Much more peaceful all round.

Practice makes perfect. So I guess you could think of it as wonderful that your wife gives you so much opportunity to practice Smiling (click to insert in post)
 Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
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