Parental Alienation Resources

[BigOof]

Any suggestions on resources to read about violent parental alienation?

I'm not after run-of-the-mill, "your daddy doesn't love you" parental alienation, but rampaging, violent, BPD style parental alienation.

Thanks, BigOff

[kells76]

Can you describe the violence in more detail?

To whom or what is the violence directed?

[BigOof]

Stalking, throwing things in public, assaulting third parties, calling the police for bogus reasons, espionage, and endangering the child.

The usual BPD stuff.

[kells76]

And just to make sure I understand the connection between the violence and the alienation, is it something like this:

stalking you to "prove" you do bad dad stuff
throwing things at you in public to inhibit your parenting
calling the police for a bogus reason on you to deny you parenting time
espionage vs you to "prove" you're an unfit parent

or is it more like:

stalking other people and telling the child you made her do it
throwing things at other people in public, in front of the child, and saying "because you made her so mad"
assaulting 3rd parties for same reason as above
bogus police calls about random stuff, in front of the child, and saying "because he makes me afraid because he's such a bad dad"
endangering the child, for example, reckless driving "because she has to get away from you and your bad parenting"

Basically, describe more to me the specific connection between the violence and the inappropriate parental stuff?

Asking all these questions in order to get a better idea of specific resources to help out, because as you mention, you are less interested in resources re: "dad doesn't love you" statements.

[BigOof]

Good questions, kells76. Right, things like:

- Stalking me around the streets to prove I'm a bad parent
- Having me arrested to prove I'm abusing (only for me to exonerate myself)
- Making false claims of DV and sexual abuse to withhold
- Putting listening devices into the child's diaper bag to prove I'm a bad parent
- Putting tracking devices into the child's diaper bag to prove I'm a bad parent
- Calling the police to deny parenting time

These are very violent actions. I've read throw the research and it doesn't cover such extreme cases. Is that because it is covered by criminal law?

[GaGrl]

I do think some of her actions fall under criminal law.

What does your lawyer say?

What does her lawyer say when contacted by your lawyer regarding a "cease and desist"?

[kells76]

Agreed; that's extreme.

What has your lawyer thought about getting a restraining order (among other things, as GaGrl mentions, such as C&D)?

[BigOof]

Cease and desist letters do nothing. We tried those. Her dysregulations care about a strongly worded letter.

Getting a restraining ordering? That's a path to criminal charges if she violates it, but we've already got her on camera breaking laws and no prosecutor will take it up. So I don't know what a restraining order gets me except bills. Further, it would make pick-ups and drop-offs harder.

I wish she would just stab me, already.

[zachira]

"Divorce Poison" is a wonderful resource book on how to deal with parent alienation.

[kells76]

Can you please remind me if you have an active custody case in/going to court?

Wondering if enough "smaller" things like ignoring C&D letter, violations of an RO, etc, would build up to something together that they don't individually.

I don't know what a restraining order gets me except bills.

Maybe where a pros/cons list could help. Do the potential benefits of an RO outweigh the drawbacks. +/- may depend on if you have an active case, how pickups/dropoffs work, if proving she violated the RO "means more" than getting her on tape violating "something else", etc.

Are pick ups/drop offs happening at her house? Your house? You mention a diaper bag, so your kid is in the 1-2 year old range? Any daycare involved?

I think ROs can be constructed in a way that child pickups and dropoffs can still happen, for what that's worth. If she's this far gone, then is it really the worst thing in the world for an RO to indicate exchanges at the police department. IDK. Food for thought.

I get the feeling of "just stab me already" so there's SOMETHING to point to. All the "almost actionable" stuff is crazymaking.

I would look at "bundling" as much stuff for her to violate as possible, as a possible strategy. Just pile it all on -- ROs, C&Ds, video, audio, email, make a huge, huge package of stuff that she has violated, don't hold back. Huge binders of stuff. She seems to tend towards breaking every boundary, so maybe use that to your advantage, and "create" a bunch more for her to violate to make that huge binder of evidence.

In a weird way, it could be "good" for you that the C&D letters "don't matter to her" and that she would just violate an RO.

I say all this from my perspective on the other side of this screen, so take whatever seems to help, ditch the rest, and run it past your lawyer. I get that the way I see things will differ from what you're experiencing.

[BigOof]

kells76, no custody due to a temporary custody order (extortion). Preparing for trial.

zachira, thanks for the recommendation. I'll read it.

[ForeverDad]

Wondering if enough "smaller" things like ignoring C&D letter, violations of an RO, etc, would build up to something together that they don't individually.

My understanding of family law, from the outside looking in, is that each incident you report will likely be addressed separately whether it reaches the bar of being "actionable".  Most will get dismissed.

However, if you can use them together as kells76 wonders, along with other incidents typically too old to include (legal term: stale), to establish a PATTERN of behaviors then maybe that approach might work.

[BigOof]

My understanding of family law, from the outside looking in, is that each incident you report will likely be addressed separately whether it reaches the bar of being "actionable".  Most will get dismissed.

That's been my experience, too.

In a weird way, it could be "good" for you that the C&D letters "don't matter to her" and that she would just violate an RO.

That's a good point.

[BigOof]

"Divorce Poison" is the most depressing book I've ever read.

[kells76]

Info on child exchanges with active RO/PO:

https://www.beckman-steen.com/visitation-work-order-protection-place/

In divorce, if things are getting heated, often temporary protection orders will be put in place. During this time, the courts may not make exceptions for visitation time. This means you might not be able to see your children for this time, but temporary protection orders are just that, temporary. This means that the order may eventually lapse, and you can resume visits.

However, if it is deemed that a more permanent protection order is needed, you will have to address visitation with the courts. A judge will set a visitation schedule up, and if a permanent protection order is put in place after the visitation is set, the parents will need to return to court. Do not, under any circumstances, ignore the protection order and seek visitation time anyway. An order of protection will always trump your parental rights.

When returning to court to seek visitation despite an order of protection, the process is fairly simple. If it is deemed that you are not a threat to your children, the judge will amend the visitation schedule. This may mean supervised visits, and most often it will dictate that exchanges in custody of the children will have to happen at a set place. For example, instead of picking your children up at their mother’s home, you may have to meet her at her place of work or some other public place in order to take your children for your scheduled parenting time. While coming in close proximity may violate that order of protection, a public place assures a certain amount of safety. If the meeting place and date are set by the court, it is not a violation. However, if you were to meet any other place than the scheduled area for custody exchanges on the scheduled days, you will still be in violation. Violating the order will result in arrest and potential punishment.

and also this, in CA:

https://www.talkovlaw.com/restraining-order-california/

Tips for the Restrained Party to a Domestic Violence Restraining Order

...

Be Careful About “Brief and Peaceful Contact” for Child Custody Exchanges. This “exception” to the restraining order is frequently the source of violations and false claims of violations. During the exchanges themselves, consider having a witness present or asking someone else to conduct the exchange. Also, consider exchanging at a neutral and public location, preferably with active surveillance cameras. Starbucks are often considered good exchange locations because they offer restrooms, cameras, and a time-stamped receipt in the event there is a disagreement about when a party arrived. Also consider avoiding exchanges by having them take place at schools. If you must be at the exchange, you could stay in the car and let the children walk to the other parent’s car. If there is a problem during the exchange, you can contact the police to keep the peace.

So that seems to indicate that "exceptions" to ROs exist to facilitate parenting schedules.

Finally, this link, which suggests that whether the RO or PP came first is important:

https://dadsdivorce.com/articles/parenting-time-when-a-restraining-order-prevents-you-from-contacting-ex/

Hope those help you decide what you want to do re: RO...

kells76