what does progress look like?

[FirstSteps]

I'm wondering if anyone can share what it was like on the way to a more stable relationship.

My wife is currently ignoring me over a minor problem yesterday. 

However, before that, we had a good week.  And it wasn't just "normal."  She explicitly talked about building new pathways in her brain.  She expressed her needs in new ways.  She actually asked for me to send her the family "To Do" list and checked off boxes.

Even today, I know secondhand that she's coping with the dysregulation in a healthier way than normal.

Yet I'm also very aware that I can't count on her to change.  I am aware that I need to be changing for my own sake (and the kids).

I'm in a messy place because I'm sort of building up to a separation.  But I also very much don't want to break up the family if there is a chance she and I are both changing for the better.

But what is real change and what is just a performance?  It's very possible she is saying all this in response to my life changes and that the underlying issues remain as strong as ever. 

Just would like to get a reference point of some kind.  Thanks!

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Kaufmann]

What is love? To me, love is not just a profession of desire, not a string of words. Rather, love is action. Love is doing what's in the best interest of others even when it's not convenient for you. I think that a stable relationship is a relationship characterized by love over a period of time.

[thankful person]

My relationship has had an incredible transformation over the past six months and every moment of it was supported and documented on here. My wife was diagnosed bpd and did dbt before we met. She managed to beat an eating disorder and stopped self harming. She considers herself cured, all of the changes to her behaviour during the past six months have been in response to my choices and actions of changing my own behaviour. The reason this forum has been such a godsend to me is that I knew deep down that she would never just decide to change herself for the better. She does not have the capacity to see how badly she has treated me over the years, or the effect her behaviour had on the children. Feel free to look at my posts and ask me questions if you like. I was very unhappy through our relationship for seven years before I found bpd family. I do consider mine to be a success story, where my wife’s behaviour and control over me was pretty extreme and yet now things are much calmer.

[FirstSteps]

Thank you to both!

Brokenperson - that is inspiring.  I've been feeling like I need to at least give that a try - to really change myself and see if that created a better foundation for us.  Will read your posts!

[DogMom2019]

What is love? To me, love is not just a profession of desire, not a string of words. Rather, love is action. Love is doing what's in the best interest of others even when it's not convenient for you. I think that a stable relationship is a relationship characterized by love over a period of time.

I was just asking myself this today... I have no idea what healthy love looks like. Thank you for your comment.

[who_knows11]

But what is real change and what is just a performance?  It's very possible she is saying all this in response to my life changes and that the underlying issues remain as strong as ever. 

I struggle with this idea as well.  It almost seems as if the only way to mitigate the issues is to put on a performance.  This seems to coincide with the statements I'm reading in which people say they felt as if they lost themselves while trying to "handle" the conflicts. Admittedly, I still have lots to learn about this, and as I do I'm sure the difference in performance and change will become more clear.

[who_knows11]

What is love? To me, love is not just a profession of desire, not a string of words. Rather, love is action. Love is doing what's in the best interest of others even when it's not convenient for you. I think that a stable relationship is a relationship characterized by love over a period of time.

This has to be true at the most fundamental level.  The problem is the pwBPD lives on emotion, but "love as an action" is not an emotion.  I deal with this in every argument.  My BPDw does not accept my view of love because it's not connected enough to emotion.  This is double trouble for me because I am a minister and she accuses me of being hypocritical because I preach on love but don't have it for her in our marriage.  When you add to this that the modern view of love in western society is based in Romanticism you have a recipe for an impossible dilemma.  This is especially true when you add in the fact that what is in the best interest for the other person is sometimes not something that they will agree is in their best interest

[Cat Familiar]

Check out the characteristics of healthy relationships

Yet I'm also very aware that I can't count on her to change.  I am aware that I need to be changing for my own sake (and the kids).

Absolutely correct.

But what is real change and what is just a performance?  It's very possible she is saying all this in response to my life changes and that the underlying issues remain as strong as ever. 

It’s very possible that she is affecting these superficial changes in order to convince you not to leave. Time will tell if they are permanent.

In the meantime, have you looked at the Tools at the top of this page?

[FirstSteps]

Cat - thanks!  I have looked at some of the tools and now I've done more.  Each time I do, I get down.  As I've tried many of these techniques for at least some extended time with no luck.  I come out as moderately depressed.

My T today basically finally straight out told me today she thinks I'm being emotionally abused.  I assume this isn't true for everyone in a BPD relationship - that some aren't as persistent as my W (she is not violent but does not split back to "good" easily) and that others aren't as vulnerable to it as I am.  I get fixated on the chance it could still work - but just am not sure I can stay in this situation long enough to truly see if she'd change once I changed. 

[thankful person]

My T today basically finally straight out told me today she thinks I'm being emotionally abused.  I assume this isn't true for everyone in a BPD relationship - that some aren't as persistent as my W (she is not violent but does not split back to "good" easily) and that others aren't as vulnerable to it as I am.  I get fixated on the chance it could still work - but just am not sure I can stay in this situation long enough to truly see if she'd change once I changed. 

Not all therapists are good at dealing with someone with bpd or a spouse who has it (just a thought). It is my impression from this forum that everyone who has moderate-severe bpd is extremely likely to emotionally abuse their partner. And that all of us are vulnerable to it, that’s why we end up in such an unhealthy relationship. My wife certainly was emotionally abusing me with rules such as, “don’t take photos of our children. Don’t send them to your mum. If I decide I don’t like you cuddling and reading to our daughter then I will screech until you put her down.” One day I refused at the suggestion of someone on here. And she snatched the child off me and threw me out the door.
I think it’s important to remember that bpd can be different to other emotional abuse in that the person with bpd feels so threatened and only sees their own needs like a small child. My wife is one of the less self aware and appears to have no clue most of it is wrong behaviour and hurts others, especially the children.
What I found really helpful was clearly documenting on here incidents between my wife and me and exactly what was said and how it quickly descended into hell. These kind and amazing people here were so helpful and supportive giving me ideas as to what I could do differently. Don’t give up just yet. We are here to help you get thought it and if you decide to leave too.

[Notwendy]

I get fixated on the chance it could still work - but just am not sure I can stay in this situation long enough to truly see if she'd change once I changed.

BPD is a spectrum disorder, so one person's situation may not be the same as someone else's. One reason for the rule on not posting "leave" comments ( or "stay" ones ) is that the decision to stay or leave is very individual and each person has other circumstances to consider as well.

The focus on change is not on the pwBPD but an individual focus. Yes, there is the possibility that change in you can change the dynamics between two people- and she would either have to adjust or not. That's not something that can be predicted or guaranteed. However, considering that divorce is a difficult process as well, working on personal change is a good first step.

It's also a good step in other ways. The dynamics involve both people. It is said that if someone leaves a dysfunctional relationship and gets into another one without doing the self work on their part- they risk recreating similar dynamics with someone else. Keep in mind- you are not learning new relationship skills for the goal of changing her. You are learning them for you. The goal is not to loose yourself and be compliant but to gain better boundaries and better emotional regulation so you are not as reactive to her changing emotions.

You will see the progress in you when you gain these skills. How your wife responds is something you can assess over time.

[Cat Familiar]

Changing your part in the dynamic will change the relationship. How much she changes, or in what way she changes in response, is impossible to predict, but she will change since you will not be participating in the same ways as previously.