Visitors

[Anonymous22]

During a big fight that my uBPDh and I had about 3 weeks ago, one of the many things that he said to me is that no one that is a part of any of our familys (that does not currently live in our house) is allowed in our house until we get a divorce...divorce is a big go to for him when we fight as he gets the reaction out of me that he wants when he mentions it.  Meaning...that 2 of my kid's grandparents couldn't come help them get ready for school, which is who I ask to come help when he says that he will not get "my" kids ready for school and I have to work and that my parents can't stay at our house even though we have already told them they can stay at our house...they arrive in 4 days.  He repeated that to me a couple of days later.  I told him that when he repeated that, that by his definition he is saying that his daughter, my step-daughter, then can't come over to our house...which he freaked out at.  I told him that just like it is ok that my step-daughter comes over, it is ok if my parents stay at our house.  He told me he will call the police if they come in our house.  He hasn't mentioned anything since...and I haven't said anything to him.  He has not responded to a single text my parents have sent...and his mood has been all over the place with me and all of the kids...with the exception of my step-daughter who he is bending over backwards for at every chance.  What do I do?  All of my kids are excited that my parents are coming to visit.  They are supposed to be staying at our house for a little over a week, but will be busy outside of our house for much of the time.  Instead of spending money on a hotel, they used the money to buy our kids new clothes.  My parents know all about my h's dysregulation.  They will treat him like a normal human being and be kind...involve him if he wants/stay out of his way if he would rather despite all that he has said to them and me.  I don't know what to do!  I was hoping that my h would initiate the conversation about them coming and say that of course it is fine...but I know that that is wishful thinking.  Part of me feels like he is using this as a control mechanism, and that I should ignore and continue with our original plans...though letting my parent's know about his statement prior to them coming.  Part of me thinks that he will just hide for most of the week, as he is probably embarrassed.  Any suggestions??   

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[kells76]

Part of me feels like he is using this as a control mechanism, and that I should ignore and continue with our original plans...though letting my parent's know about his statement prior to them coming.

Your instinct is right on, I believe. He may say all kinds of wacky and escalating things beforehand, but I think it's important not to give those utterances "real weight". He isn't doing or saying anything that indicates there's a real problem and he wants to work on a real solution.

Right now, it sounds like he's threatening "divorce", "police", etc, but if I'm tracking with you correctly, it's probably a lot of bluster.

It also seems smart to give your parents that heads up, without changing your plans.

My DH's kids' mom has many BPD type traits. We'd planned an overseas trip with the kids for a year in advance. She even had to come with DH and the kids to sign off on passports. So no aspect of the trip was a secret. It was with DH's mom and her husband, and the kids' mom loathes them.

So a month or so before the trip, the kids tell us "Mom doesn't think it's a good idea". Of course, she doesn't email or say anything to us. There is no specific safety concern she articulated to us in writing or out loud. Just venting to the kids, who then pass it along.

I had to talk DH down from engaging with it. She says all kinds of stuff probably to regulate her emotions in a low skill way. It was important not to affirm that there was anything wrong with us going on the trip, which would've happened if we'd engaged with what the kids told us.

She is an adult with email and a cell phone. If she has safety concerns, she knows how to tell us. Not our job to do her work for her.

DH and I also had to (privately, between ourselves) come to terms with the fact that she might manipulate the kids to such an extent that we would show up on the doorstep to get them for the trip, and they'd say "I don't really want to go any more" and Mom would not make them go. We had to be OK ahead of time with the plan of saying "Well, that's really sad, and we'll really miss you, and we'll see you when we get back" -- just to not put them in the middle.

So, all that to say, I get it -- hearing huge statements, like a 9 or 10 out of 10, over something that is like a 5 out of t10. I just recommend not doing the pwPD's work for them by engaging with those outbursts. Move forward with your plans "as if" the pwPD is being cooperative. It would be sad and weird if he actually called the police, but that's his problem, not yours or your parents.

...

Of course, if you are concerned that he would act unsafely towards your family, that's another issue.

[SaltyDawg]

While the circumstances and threats are different but similar enough to what I am experiencing.  I feel that kells76 is likely correct and won't add anything there; however, what hit home for me and was a tremendous eye opener for me is the following book which I feel will also help you a lot with your current situation:

Stop Caretaking the Borderline Or Narcissist: How to End the Drama and Get on with Life
Book by Margalis Fjelstad

This book also suggests that you "ignore and continue with our original plans" -- just do it.

For more information on police and divorce threats read section 1 of:

Stop Walking on Eggshells
Book by Paul T. Mason and Randi Kreger

[Anonymous22]

Thank you!  I am going to get that book and start reading it this week, as it has seemed to be a big help to a lot of people.  I wanted to report that my parents arrived on Friday.  My uBPDh was has interacted just fine with them...the police were not called!  He has done his usual splitting, and we have all just let him do so.  He has not mentioned a single thing about them not being welcome.  Same with my sister as she came over yesterday as well.  My h clung to my step daughter each time that he split when she was at our house.  I felt bad as she seems just blah when she is at our house, but I have decided that I can't do anything about that so it is not worth putting effort there! 

[SaltyDawg]

High functioning invisible borderlines will avoid conflict as they don't want to attract negative attention in order to maintain their perception of being in control.  Just be prepared after they leave for a possible confrontation.  Just don't JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, or Explain) if they are splitting/raging.  However, if he is baseline, use the SET-UP method when he is cool and calm (normal as it gets) examples can be found here:

https://medium.com/@fracturedlight/t-1585d9ef894#:~:text=%E2%80%9CSET%E2%80%9D%20%E2%80%94%20Support%2C%20Empathy,should%20invoke%20all%20three%20elements.

[Anonymous22]

Unfortunately, you were right!  A day after my parents left our house, my uBPDh split.  I have decided that while I keep saying that I don't want to support him during this time, etc, I still do.  It is less than good times, but I still do his laundry, put all of his clothes away, pick up after him, do his dishes, etc, while he does what he wants, which is not anything for anyone but himself and maybe one of "HIS" kids.  I am so burnt out.  I have decided that I need to do for me and "MY/OUR" kids.  His split has gone on for about a week so far.  I usually try to mend things by now, but not this time.  I have spent my time with the kids and as a result I feel closer to them.  I have encouraged the ones who want to be around him to do so and supported the ones who haven't wanted to do so.  I have walked away and hung out with the kids when he is screaming at me and swearing at me, telling me what a horrible person I am.  My poor 4 year old has asked his dad to stop trying to fight with mom twice this week...luckily he has listened.  I have invited friends over to our house without his "permission"...and he actually joined in and laughed with all of us for a small amount of time.  Fingers crossed that I can keep this up.  Though I know that I need to just leave the house a mess for any shot at getting him to actually help clean the house, but a messy house drives me crazy, so I am not sure I will be able to do that yet.   I am getting ME back...it feels good, but I know that I could lose it any moment, as the temptation of trying to get him back to his good mood is so strong...sometimes I feel like it is a game of "who can hold out the longest"!   

[Anonymous22]

Not much has changed in a couple of days, which is pretty much the norm since I am not attempting to make things better by initiating intimacy.  The first thing he said to me when I got home the other day is that I need to switch "my" kids and myself to my health insurance when open enrollment occurs soon (this is a repeating comment from him and last year when I went to switch he told me not to do so as it would cost us more in the long run).  All I said was, "ok".  I then said can you please put some money to our joint credit card, since I have been the only one paying it.  He told me that he does buy things with it, but they are always under $50...um ok...they do add up (since he likes to eat out) and when I buy things, I buy things for all 5 kids, not just 1 adult!  My 4 year old then told my husband to stop trying to fight with mom...and the conversation ended.  He later told me to pay for my kids and my health insurance and to take my kids to school in the mornings (he gets my kids up and off to school 2 days a week when I am at work)...I think meaning he was done doing so.  All I said was "ok".  After this I found him searching through my phone and he turned on the baby monitor (which is in our room) when he went downstairs at 4 am the other day.  The baby sleeps in with us, he clearly was not watching the baby.  He is pretty much ignoring me, except yesterday he thanked me for sending a picture of the kids playing to him...that he really appreciated all I do with the kids.  He also got my kids ready and off to school this morning.  He is super off though...waking up at 4 in the morning, forgetting a lot of schedule things (even when he is reminded of them a day or 2 before hand), smoking every night...signs that he does not feel right in his skin in my opinion.  I do feel like this is pretty much his normal for his bad times, maybe a little more over the top probably because I am not caving to him.  My plan is to continue to have my kids get ready at home (if he decides to not get them ready and off to school they are ok to do so on their own) and off to school...I was bringing them to work with me at 5 am (when he would yell that he wasn't dealing with my kids in the morning) and leaving work quickly to get them to school, but logically that seems over the top and not something I should do any more...plus I hate leaving the 4 year old at home but he is "ours" (according to my husband) so he will help him!  Because I am sick of the insurance comment, I am going to look into switching to my insurance...though I will switch all of the kids if I do so, not just "mine".  Hopefully he will be in a mood when I actually look for us to have a real conversation about if this switch makes sense or not.  UGH!           

[SaltyDawg]

Sorry for being away for a bit, I was dealing with a few Borderline crises myself; however, I do feel like there is progress being made; however, in which direction, I am uncertain -- I inadvertently did an unplanned intervention of sorts (not recommended at all by the books; however, there is a major shift happening, I need to see where it leads) -- she now sees a fraction of the damage that she is doing.  I am erecting firm boundaries with regards to abuse (physical 1st, emotional 2nd, and other types too, doing one at a time for now - if I go too fast it explodes - it's like walking on hand grenades, not eggshells).  I think we are going to be transitioning couples counselors (the current one had way too much countertransference [my wife manipulated her into thinking I was the bad guy, and when I agreed with my wife & counselor then the counselor exploded and disagreed more than my wife did - if you don't 'click' with a counselor, find another one, as most of them are in that field as they are likely dealing with their own emotional issues], which I am hoping is a good thing.

I am glad you are getting your "ME" back.  I know when I do it, it does feel "good."  However, it does take a lot of effort to keep it up and feeling tired/burnt out is part of the dynamic initially (it does gets better and easier with time). 

My individual therapist told me to think of the Borderline partner as an alcoholic and you need to treat them differently when they are drunk (splitting/raging/irrational) than when they are sober with or without a hangover (rational).  That is the easiest analogy, for me, to think of it.

One thing has me concerned, you mentioned that he has been splitting for over a week (for my wife usually splits [is irrational and cannot be reasoned with as she sees me as all bad (generally for the past 16 years), or all good (first five years)] for a few hours, typically 2-4, but can range from less than an hour to just over 7 ).  My son, is different, he splits only when mad, and his typically lasts 15-45 minutes when he is irrational - he too is starting to exhibit characteristics of a BPD, as BPD can be acquired by genetics and/or environmental variables, both of which are present in my family's dynamic.  According to the books, splitting rarely lasts for more than a few days for a Borderline and is usually minutes to hours; however, other potential mental health issues might be a different story if he is irrational for more than a week.

Your husband likely won't get to a 'good mood'; however, a 'rational mood' is something you can work with.  Remember, you are taking back your control [your perspective], and you are also taking away his control [his perspective - he probably won't like this and will be unhappy] -- so if he is rational, then he isn't splitting even if he is in a bad/somber mood he is likely that way since you are taking away his power of control.  Think how you would feel if the situation was reversed - use empathy wherever and whenever you can -- that is the love component when you set boundaries with love.  The trick is to go just far enough where you have enough control to maintain your sanity, but let him think that he is still in control even when he may not be.  Also, go very slowly - especially if he has dumped his romantic partners in his previous relationship(s) -- go too fast and he may run leaving you hanging.

Some of the tools from the books, I already figured out and have no problems doing, others require me to bite my tongue, be somewhat manipulative to maintain some semblance of sanity [these I find the hardest as they are totally out of character for me] and use every bit of effort not to JADE as I am one who likes being right, and also getting the last word in, just like my Borderline -- in that respect we are too much alike.  In some respects my wife and I are too much alike and I used to react quite negatively back (JADE) when she was raging at me upon the incorrect advise of our couple's counselor who didn't recognize the Borderline in my wife.

With regards to him doing any cleaning, don't expect him to work on that especially if has any narcissistic tendencies -- that may be one area that you have to sacrifice and learn to live with that -- you need to decide if you can accept that -- alternatively get the kids to help out, and eventually try to get him to help out (even if they are minimal mundane type chores, like take out the garbage - ask him to 'lead by example' for his/your children) - a counselor would be helpful strategizing here.  I personally used to be a neat freak years ago, but now I am the opposite, as long as it isn't harmful/negligent (example, letting food stay out too long to spoil) and concentrate on things I have a reasonable time to control over to maintain a safe but cluttered environment.

Your insurance issues, I am glad you have insurance.  Utilize the mental health counseling to the fullest, ask if they (the counselors) will waive your co-pay (some do) for no additional out of pocket expenses, especially if there is any kind of financial hardship and if they do 'sliding scale'.  It also sounds like he is shifting the financial burden to you -- you need to hold him accountable, especially since it sounds like you are caring for his children from a previous relationship.  A narcissist will likely pass as much of the burden off to you whether that is household chores (so he can control 'his' free time) and/or finances (so he can control 'his' money) -- be *very* careful here.

With regards to forgetting stuff with your spouse -- this happened on my end too.  I was a bit tech savvy and programmed a family calendar in all of our phones/tablets (mine, my wife's, daughter's, and son's [read only, so he can't mess with it as he is a bit young at 11]) so everyone knows the schedule, get reminders -- it mostly solved that issue in my family.  [create a family account, use that for your joint calendar, and disable the individual accounts, just for the calendar so everyone knows what is going on].  When one or both spouses are distracted with all of the drama it is easy to forget stuff, I am guilty of that too -- this is the work-a-round that I came up for my family, and it works for my situation -- it might work for you too.

You can try to have the 'conversation' you mentioned; however, if he gets mad immediately [triggering a rage], discontinue.  Take back control slowly, just has he has done to you since you have been together by taking it away from you.  If you go too fast, it will end badly.  Mention you are going to do something, wait a bit (the bigger the thing, the longer the wait), mention it again with more details (wait again), and then eventually just do it, so it doesn't come as a surprise, you are giving him time to pre-process what you are doing, so when he sees you doing it, it won't trigger him to freak out.

Going through your phone and using the baby monitor, indicates, he is very insecure.  If you have nothing to hide, let him do it, but make sure you indicate your displeasure by stating something along the lines of "I have nothing to hide and you can look through my phone; however, I feel really bad as though I am not trustworthy to you and as a result I am feeling unloved." add "I do love you and I do want you want to be with you" if appropriate.  Doing that will build a perception of trust for him, even though he just violated his trust in you - for this you need to coddle the insecure mind, otherwise he may likely go off the 'deep end' and think you are cheating on him.  If you love him, reassure him whenever, and wherever you can, without violating your integrity.  If you already have violated your integrity, you will need to regain that back very slowly, moving too fast and taking it back all at once is not good, especially if you have allowed him to walk all over you for the past xxx number of months/years.

BP/NP's are hyper-sensitive to change, he likely knows something is up, he senses the shift in your family dynamic, and he will be hyper vigilant to change.  If he perceives you as withholding anything, including physical intimacy, especially if you were the one initiating much of it previously -- that will be a major red flag to him and make it worse especially if he has [or you have] experienced infidelity in a previous relationship.  Maintain as much as intimacy YOU are comfortable with.  Avoid, going 'cold turkey' on him, unless you can't handle the emotional component.  If you want to preserve the relationship, do not go 'cold turkey'.  If you need to modify it, do it very slowly.

Don't agree to any major changes by saying "ok", tell him something a bit more vague like "I hear you"  and if he is receptive and has a valid point you could add ", and we can agree to talk about this when I am not as worked up/agitated/upset" (or whatever legitimate excuse you use).  Use "I" pronouns whenever you can, do not cast-out by affixing any blame to him as that will only add fuel to the fire of your disagreement.  If he is relentless, tell him you need to go 'potty', and stay on the porcelain throne for 10 minutes to let things cool down, or some other excuse like getting sick and can't think straight.

Hopefully some of my suggestions you will find helpful, as I am very slowly learning from my own mistakes and mistakes made with me can be a learning experience for someone else so they won't make those same mistakes.  Keep in mind every relationship is different, and there are different triggers for different people, and we each need to adapt and modify our own behaviors to be the best be suited for our own unique individual scenario.

[Anonymous22]

Thank you for your response SaltyDawg, it was very helpful!  Yes, getting my "me" back feels great, but it does take lots of effort to keep.  My 11s refuses to walk on eggshells, so I have tried to follow in his footsteps, though it is hard!  The alcoholic analogy makes great sense to me, but also makes me feel a little bit crazy as I try to get out all of the conversations that need to be had, etc in the little good times that we have.  Which I feel like since I have made the switch to focusing more on the kids and myself and not taking his bait as much, the good times are less than before, but the really bad times are as well...we pretty much live in a middle ground most of the time (where my uBPDh rarely interacts with me or my older 2 kids (his step kids) and does everything for "his" kids.  Not ideal, but at least the yelling is lower than before.)  Except the other day, my 11s had his best friend over.  He and his friend were up in his bedroom, after playing outside with my other kids (where my 4s punched my 11s in the eye really hard, though they had been wrestling so my guess is that he thought this was a part of his fight.)  The 4s still wanted to play with the 11s and his friend, so he followed them to my 11s's room and kept bothering him, I guess the 4s ended up throwing a shoe at the 11s.  My 11s told him that he is not allowed to play with them (I didn't hear it but it probably was not in nice words or tone) and my 4s started crying really hard.  My uBPDh then stomped up stairs and my 4s came running to him (he knows that he will always stand up for him no matter what) and my husband then screamed at my 11s, what did you do?  My 11s told the truth, then my husband started screaming at my 11s saying he was a complete lier, horrible person, that he knew that he tried to hurt his 4 brother, etc all while his friend was there.  My 4s said no daddy, he is telling the truth, I punched him and threw the shoe at him, but my husband still went with his own theory.  My 8d then started to cry.  I ran up to protect my 11s and then my husband started in on me...telling me he was filing for divorce right that night to which I said if thats what you want then you should follow what you want...mind you his friend could hear all of it.  I reminded him of that and he didn't care.  I went in and asked the friend if he was ok and he said yes.  I took my 2 daughters and stayed in my bedroom for a while and heard my husband telling my 4s not to worry because he won't have to deal with this in a couple of months, insinuating that he was following through with the divorce and moving out and taking my 4s with him.  I then went downstairs when the 11 year old's did as well to make sure that they were ok, they were going outside to play.  My husband then went in his office and closed the door saying I am going to sign this thing right now.  I did not reply.  My 2d went in to say hi to daddy and eventually he came out.  I have no idea what to do about this friend.  Do I say something to his mom?  I would not be surprised if he never wanted to play at our house again!  And if the mom knew, that she would never allow her son over to my house.  My son went to his house a couple of days later, but if it was me I would never go back.  A couple of days later my husband was all lovey dovey...though still kind of standoff-ish.  Also, since he has told me to clean up the guest room so he could move in there and I have, he has slept up in our room every night...he often sleeps on the couch or in the guest room when he is mad at me.  I think that I have been mis-using the term splitting.  Yes, his splits (outbursts) probably only last a couple of hours at the very most, but he holds on to his "angry" phase for close to a week or more lately (though he often seems depressed during this time as well...he does everything only for himself during this time...goes to the gym without telling me, etc.  I have the kids 24/7 during these times, but during his mean outbursts, he tells me what a horrible mom I am?  Why do you leave your kids with a horrible mom then?  As mentioned, I am guessing that this is because I am not breaking them any more by initiating intimacy as I have in the past.  To him, intimacy equals love.  I can probably text him during these times, but having a face to face conversation is still hard in these moments.  I guess I should start there with texts, though he has told me in the past that he wont respond to texts from me that he believes should be in person conversations.  I have to start somewhere I guess.  I have done a really good job at not JADEing him lately.  It has been my goal, since we had a big fight a couple of months ago to never go down that path again.  I need to start initiating validating.  I guess I tried to do that by going out of my way to say bye this morning and so that he could say bye to our daughter when I could have just left.  This is going to be a goal I start tonight when I get home from work.  For the insurance, I am assuming I should just switch to insurance through my work instead of trying to hold on to his.  It will cost us more but at least there can't be a fight over it any longer.  He used the baby monitor on me again last night.  Of course I was reading a news article on my phone when I saw the monitor go on.  I immediately put my phone down, though I wish that I hadn't.  I felt like I had been caught...yes caught reading a news article about a run away girl!  I have absolutely nothing to hide.  I have told him in the past to hire a detective to follow me, and I meant it, but I will say that it is hurtful to actually be spied on.  We have been together for a little over 5 years...and he walked all over me for the first 4 1/2 years.  So I am sure it will take some time to undo all of this.  My husband is super hypersensitive to change.  He realizes the littlest things that mean nothing to me and to him they mean that I am doing all sorts of shady things.  I stepped back on initiating intamacy because I couldn't do it mentally.  He often would try to resist me and I felt like a low life trying to get him out of his funk.  Mentally it took a toll on me.  So I did kind of go cold turkey, which I know isn't good...I am going to try to initiate cuddling more now, hopefully that will help bring some connection.  Thanks again for all of your advice, it is extremely helpful!  I hope all is semi ok with the crises you were going through!  I will always wish for healing energy to be sent to all that need it on this forum!           

[SaltyDawg]

A-22,

Be very careful, be very slow, but deliberate.  Just like you, I find that both the good times and bad times are much less.  So instead of going from a 0 to 11 on a scale of 1 to 10, it will be more in between 1 and 10.  My borderline wife, also does not interact with me on an emotional level other than to co-parent; however, I am now at three weeks being rage free, and have even had one day without her splitting *yeah* but she too hold grudges against me based on my interaction with her while splitting, and never lets it go.

Unlike you, I do not have a blended family; however, my brother-in-law does, and I see that 'blood' is treated differently than 'non-blood' by his parents, and that's bad - they should be treated equally, otherwise a major rift will likely occur - I've seen it in his blended family where he and his parents were estranged for over a decade - ironically it was my marriage to his sister that allowed the rift to be healed.

What you describe of your 4 yo with your 11 yo is natural for that age - discipline accordingly.  I also find, as I am less available for the verbal abuse, my borderline wife tries to shift her anger to our 11 yo son and lashes out there instead.  My son knows not to JADE when this happens.  He is in counseling, and counseling has shifted a couple months ago to account for BPD with great success.

You are changing your priorities to your kids - that's good.  You also called what *you think* is your husband's bluff on divorce.  From what you described, he might be half-serious and might be looking for an excuse to do just that.  Since he has invaded your privacy (more on the reasoning below), when he is not home, go into his office, go on the computer and look at his search history [ctrl-H], search for 'divorce', 'attorney', 'lawyer', 'marriage' and/or other relevant terms in the search box on top.  Delete any history that you might have created by individually checking the boxes that you see from the time you were on the machine, and press the delete key and confirm your choice.  Also check his e-mail, on what if anything was sent, use the same search terms if you can.  Leave everything as you found it, as you don't want to raise any suspicions.

Unfortunately, I do this with my wife [accidentally learned behavior from my previous relationship who actually cheated on me - after I fixed her computer of a computer virus - the incriminating e-mail popped up when I restored her e-mail.  This happened not once, but twice, and I dumped her the 2nd time it happened after setting up a boundary on the first time], when she makes a serious threat of divorce - fortunately, I have not found anything and I let things be.  However, if you are convinced of his threats, and find any evidence [search history, e-mail, phone calls, text] -- do not let him know that you know, take it seriously and start planning accordingly.

You tell me that "I have the kids 24/7 during these times, but during his mean outbursts, he tells me what a horrible mom I am?  Why do you leave your kids with a horrible mom then?"  He is lashing out at you.  Mentally unstable people will lash out at the ones they love the most - it is a bit of a conundrum.  My wife has done the same thing to me.

You also have observed "To him, intimacy equals love." -- being a man, who is likely codependent, I can definitely relate to that observation and understand how you aren't mentally there and it took a toll on you -- something similar probably happened to me with my wife [from her perspective] -- I am sharing the following quote I made, so you know how a co-dependent guy [myself] might perceive this action when the love of his life goes 'cold turkey' on both physical and emotional intimacy which happened to me after we got pregnant with our first child.   From what I understand "Generally, borderlines are codependent and find another codependent to merge with and to help them".  Source:  https://original.newsbreak.com/@darlene-lancer-lmft-1590535/2522029029793-the-anguish-and-hope-for-loved-ones-of-people-with-borderline-personality-disorder

I believe it is also how I became ensnared in my current relationship with an initial 'love bombing', in another message thread I wrote:

I won't tell you to walk away.  However, I will share the following from my situation:

Courtship - Love-bombing all of the time until 2 weeks after our honeymoon was finished - I was oversexed and totally seduced by her emotional and physical intensity towards me.
Marriage - Two weeks after our honeymoon ended, she threatened suicide, she wanted me to change to something I was not and suppressed [what she wanted from me] throughout our courtship.  I told her I felt "baited and switched" on the marriage - she reverted back to love bombing after she alluded to the fact I 'could leave if I wanted to'.  Well, the love-bombing was awesome at the time, so I didn't leave...
Pregnancy - two weeks after we found out we were pregnant, she changed again, and she knew I was committed with a child on the way, and it has been a devaluing hell ever since.

I know she has severe abandonment issues, a hallmark of BPD, and doesn't want to be alone as she has articulated that on several occasions explaining why she did the things she did.

Even though I knew something was wrong with the suicide threat and love bombing, I didn't leave, as I was blind to the attention I was getting.  Now that I am two decades older, and I would like to think wiser -- if I had known what I know now back then, this tragedy of this relationship might have been averted, even after being newlyweds.

This was being said to someone who was contemplating getting married and was currently engaged to a BPD, presumably without children - my advise is to run if there is no children [as it doesn't get better, but can be managed like we are doing]; however, if there are children [like in both of our cases], they need to be the priority in this situation and it makes things so much more complicated.  If things don't change in my relationship with my wife, I am fairly certain, I will be leaving, after the last child leaves the house.

You mention "hypersensitivity" to change.  I know that I am hypersensitive [from a previous relationship] but not as much as I suspect for my borderline wife, for my borderline wife that feeling is likely magnified many times over of what I am feeling, I can see how it [magnified feelings] has initiated, on more than one occasion, suicide attempts and/or threats of divorce - however, if she even remotely perceives that I will be accepting of it, she backs off to protect her own fear of abandonment -- from what you describe in your situation, that may not have happened - proceed with caution - invade his privacy just as he has done for you, and you gave him permission to do it [I am suggesting this because if he is indeed planning to divorce you, you need to know in order to take appropriate action].  I suspect he fears the same of you; hence, the reason why he is using the baby monitor on you, and searching your phone.  The next time he searches your phone, ask to do the same for him tell him that "I would like for you to feel the same way I do, and I feel that I am not being trusted" [avoid 'you,' and 'but' so you are being less offensive to him which is often a trigger for a Borderline] while reaching out for his phone.  If he doesn't let you do that immediately, that would be a red flag, especially if he deletes texts, and/or phone call records.  Often, but not always, people with BPD will transfer and/or project their negative behavior on to you that they cannot accept in themselves.  Be street smart, and see what he might be hiding from you with his behaviors of him thinking you are hiding something from him.  I know that this doesn't feel right to do this, and a normal person would not do this, but you aren't dealing with a normal person, and you need to look out for #1, which should be you - ask any divorced person that question, and they will answer the same way.  He definitely has 'trust' issues, and you need to figure out why.  Perhaps it is something with his ex [likely] that has been also projected on to you.  Couple's therapy is the best way to deal with this.

Now, I am not advocating this, and actually recommend against it, as it is not recommended at all -- but it is a very funny thought occurred to me [hopefully for you too]...  If I knew that I was being spied on with a baby monitor, I would be too tempted to 'prank' whomever was spying on me.  I would put on a racy movie on my phone or something even more obnoxious and preposterous, and leave it next to the microphone of the baby monitor just so that person can hear it -- just be prepared for potential irrational consequences or back-lash for that action if you were to do that.  [hopefully I made you laugh on that mischievous thought *wink* that you really should not do unless you know, without any doubt, that he would find this funny too - break the ice with humor]

Thank you for your well wishes and healing energy.  My wife and I are in the process of changing couple's therapists, the current one ghosted us after we started to get into the actual issues of BPD.  My wife has recommended a new one through her individual therapist, and I will be interviewing her to see if she can handle our 'high conflict' relationship which I am fairly certain BPD is present.

I will continue to pray for your situation as well, and hope that it improves.

[Anonymous22]

Thank you for your reply SD.  It is always good to hear advice from someone who understands my situation.  His "crap" (I can't think of any other word for it right now!) has exhausted me!  In all honesty, I have zero desire to know what he is searching on his computer, who he has contacted, etc (in the past I have asked for his phone and he has always given in to me...I don't want to look through it any more...if I can't trust him, then its not worth it to me).  First...he works in IT, so I am sure that his computer has password after password after password protection to access anything.  Second...I want to LIVE my life and not live in the shadow of his life, fearful of his every move...I already do that more than I want to!  I am sure that he has contacted divorce attorneys, he has brought home pamphlets from apartments to live in, he has told his best friend how horrible of a person I am, etc...BUT...I can't control that!  If he wants to get a divorce, while that's not what I want and it would be extremely hurtful and knock me down a million times, then eventually I have to realize that that is what is probably best for our situation as it proves that he will never be willing to get the help that is needed.  Again...not what I want at all but I can't control that.  I do believe that in the beginning of his split, he does want a divorce...his emotional dysregulation won't let him think of anything else.  I also believe that when he comes out of it, he thinks differently, as do I...but he doesn't want me to know that.  I am trying my best to live a "normal" life...realizing that I have to do most of it by myself.  Not what I want, but better than walking on eggshells.  I hate the no communication and realize that I probably shouldn't have gone "cold turkey" on intimacy, but that's what I did.  Life is not how I want it to be right now for me, my kids or my husband.  But I feel like right now...at this moment...as this could change in an hour!...I am like f-it...I can only do what I can do!  I have done NOTHING wrong...my kids have done NOTHING wrong...there is absolutely no reason why we live like we have or live like we are being punished for something.  I love him dearly and I do want to spend eternity with him, but I want to be me...the person who he fell in love with...not some broken up part of me...       

[Anonymous22]

Oh...I forgot...financially...I stopped paying the credit card...and all of a sudden it is getting paid...I am realizing that I do it all...he doesn't have to do anything!  Though, the second that I stop doing something, he does pick up the slack...I just need to have the faith that me "giving up control" on things won't mean that I am "worthless"!

[SaltyDawg]

Anon-22, I feel your pain.  If he works in IT, there is a very good chance if he doesn't want you to find something, he will have it well hidden or even on a jump drive not on the machine.

Since you have opened up a bit more here, my perception of your situation has changed, and it is not for the better.  There is a proverb from 1800's that states "prepare for the worst, and hope for the best" -- this will be the theme of this post.

Since you mentioned that some of the kids are step children of yours, indicating that your husband has an already previously failed marriage prior to yours [one of the symptoms of BPD].  You need to look at his previous relationship and how it ended for him, do this, so you can prepare for yourself for the worst.  Is he and his ex friendly or hostile to each other - this will determine how he will likely be with you?  Is she friendly or hostile to you when step children come over?  If friendly, pick her brain, as she has already 'been there/done that'.  Casually ask her to talk about it, 9 times out of 10 someone who wants to dump emotional baggage will -- if and when she does, take copious mental notes.  If you two are very friendly and feel as though you can confide in her, then you can ask more probative type questions.

If you are going through each other's phones, there is a "trust" issue, and that complicates things.  You also live in fear of Divorce, as he has repeatedly threatened that -- this also sucks.  My wife has also threatened; however, all but two of the times there were no physical 'signs' of it, except one time recently (and then I freaked out on it; however, these signs only lasted for a couple of weeks), I feel that my wife is not that serious about it, and reversed course on it, when I remotely suggested it.  Your husband has not, and that's an issue.  Bringing home pamphlets of apartments to live in shows that he has done some serious legwork on it, well beyond what splitting could account for. 

On the plus side, it would appear that he is planning to leave you with the place that you now live in.  He is also taking care of the finances [for now], that's a plus   You also stated "I do it all...he doesn't have to do anything!  Though, the second that I stop doing something, he does pick up the slack" -- you sound exactly like my wife with that statement and that could have just as easily have been directed at me!  It may seem that way, but you also indicate that he does pick up the slack.  I know my wife also thinks that she has done NOTHING wrong -- and that is her perspective, and she is entitled to have that perspective no matter how distorted I think it is.  The biggest thing is that you you feel as though you have NOTHING wrong as you state, and that really sucks.  You also realize that unless your husband wants to fix himself he won't. 

I am going to go out on a limb here, and describe what is going on in my relationship and suspect there might be a similar dynamic in your relationship [let me know if I am wrong / way off here], I know that I have to defend everything I say and do, and I must be right, but that "right" is different than my wife, and she does the same to me and she must be right -- the difference is that we are both right in our own ways, and perceive the other as wrong in their own ways and her version of compromise "my way" [BPD black/white thinking] is different than mine "somewhere in between" [dimmer switch to gray].

So, if you want to save your relationship -- go to his best friend.  As you are not a mind reader...  Ask his best friend on what your DH [dear husband] has complained to him about you.  Be prepared to hear a pile of crap -- don't let it get under your skin.  Also, explain that things aren't going well [since your DH has already bad mouthed you about you to him, so you can't do any more damage] and you want to go to counseling to fix what is wrong with "me" [do that so you can at least get him in the door of the counselor so he can fix you, and hopefully he will see what he is doing wrong and become self-aware to fix himself as well] and he needs to tell the counselor what is wrong with you - sounds counterintuitive, but think of it as a 'bait and switch'.  Also, do not admit to what is wrong with you, let him tell you what he thinks is wrong which could be something totally different than what you are thinking.  A good counselor, will challenge both of you to think of how you are treating the other, and that would be progress.

Right now my wife is aware that something is wrong herself, and something is wrong with me; however, neither of us is fully aware of what is wrong with ourselves.   This is where my wife and I are at right now, 3 years into serious counseling, shifting counselors to one that will hopefully work as the last one made it worse. 

If he accepts going, that will be a major step in the right direction.  If not, now I am going to ask you something hard, try to put yourself in his shoes, and think like a man, if you can't do that, ask his best friend and listen to what he says and how it might apply to you -- I suspect the 'cold turkey' aspect is an issue [it is for 2/3 of all men] and see if there are other issues as well.  No matter how much of an he might be, listen and try to see your husband's perspective and act accordingly, provided that you don't compromise your own standards.

Continued prayers for you.