Very Stressed, Confused, and Depleted

[So Stressed]

I believe that my mother has BPD, but she is undiagnosed because she doesn't think there is anything wrong with her.  I think that it was never obvious that Mom had a mental health issue because our father was an alcoholic, and his behavior was more obvious and Mom always told us that he was the cause of all family problems.  I went to alanon for many years to help heal myself from the family disease of alcoholism and I've had lots of therapy to deal with the effects of a dysfunctional family, but it is now apparent that Mom may have always been a big part of the family problem.

Since my father's death a few years ago, I have become the family scapegoat.  There is so much crazy making that I am struggling to cope. I am seeing a therapist to help me, but it isn't covered by my healthcare, and I can't really afford regular sessions, so I thought maybe a support group could help me to not feel so alone and so crazy.

As I try to set some boundaries and live my life, my family's anger at me is just escalating. Some days, I just wonder if I am the crazy one. Christmas was a disaster. My Mom and Brother both had meltdowns and then accused me of being the cause and of doing and saying all the things they did and said.  I am really trying to navigate this, but it is so dramatic and crazy-making that I don't know how.

Thank you.

[Couscous]

  Welcome!

It really sounds like you are at the end of your rope. I personally haven’t found therapy to be helpful for me when it comes to navigating my family’s dysfunction. If you could find a competent, systems trained family therapist you may find that useful, but if not, you might just want to save your money.

What has helped me the most are two books by Harriet Lerner: The Dance of Intimacy and The Dance of Anger. I would recommend that you start there. Going back to Al-Anon might also help too, especially if you think of your mother as a “dry” alcoholic.

[zachira]

You are not alone with many members on this site dealing with dysfunctional family members with BPD traits. People with BPD traits often blame others (especially close family members) for how emotionally dysregulated they are in any given moment, often with a sudden blowup that is way out of proportion to anything that could possibly explain the rage. You are also not alone in being treated worse and worse, as you set healthier boundaries.

[SaltyDawg]

Welcome to the [BPD] family.

Since you cannot afford therapy, this is a good place to be.

Additionally I would recommend two starter books on learning about the borderline.

Stop Walking on Eggshells by Randi Kreger this will tell you about BPD

Stop Caretaking the Borderline Or Narcissist: How to End the Drama and Get on with Life by Margalis Fjelstad this one will tell you how to manage them.

Also, if you are looking for in-person support groups, there aren't many, but CODA.org has a 12-step program similar to Al-anon for codependents, which a borderline naturally is.

[NarcsEverywhere]

I mean, it's not uncommon for them to pit other people against each other either. So I'm not surprised your brother had a similar response, he might be being manipulated too. I know it's rough.

There's not a lot you can control about them to be honest, you can manage them, but you can't control them, so it's best to control what you do, even if you have to make completely new choices, that remove you from situations or cause you to disengage. You can't really argue with people who aren't honest, you can't speak sense to a person who doesn't care if they make sense.

I bet it all really throws you for a loop and is hard. I'm kinda dealing with similar stuff myself.

[Methuen]

You sound worn down, exhausted, and depleted. You’ve been sucked into that black hole that we’re all trying desperately to stay out of. 

I pulled the following comment from you from another thread:

I am still working and my Mom interferes in my life so much, that sometimes I end up taking time off work just to stop her complaining and pressure to do things for her that are not urgent.

Can you tell us more about this? How is she interfering in your life so much that you have to take time off work?

[So Stressed]

My mom is elderly and she expects me to be her sole caregiver.  She is old, but still lives on her own and is quite healthy.  She doesn't drive anymore. So, I drive her to her appointments, take her to grocery shop, do things for her at home that she can't do. The only other help she has is a cleaning lady who comes every second week. I work from home, so my workday is not structured in the sense that I need to be in an office from 9 to 5.  So, if Mom needs to go to a dr. appointment, I can take her.  But, sometimes, she just gets it in her head that she needs to go to the shoemaker and it needs to be right now and she doesn't let it go. I try to set boundaries and if it's not urgent, then I just say something like, "Ok, I'll take you, but I'm busy so it will have to be next week."  Then, it becomes a subject of a call every day until I take her.  Sometimes, I just relent, and do it when I have more important work to do, and then I am behind and have to stay up half the night to complete my work.  This is one of the lesser problems I encounter with my Mom.  I can manage this, but she does wear me down.

What I find not manageable and really upsetting is that Mom rages at me and she accuses me of doing or saying things that I did not say or do.  She also tries to bait me into arguments.  On a good day, I can avoid the bait and go home, end the telephone conversation, or just not get into it. But, sometimes, she continues to bait me and try to suck me into an argument and I lose my temper and say something and end up in the argument and then she is angry at me for weeks or months and every time I try to talk to her, she screams, cries, or hangs up.  We are in one of those phases now.  And, even though she baits me into the argument in the first place by accusing me of something I didn't say or do, and then I defend myself, the argument is all my fault and it gets brought up forever.

Last week during Christmas, Mom was looking for an argument for a couple of days.  She brought up everything that she thinks I ever did wrong from 50 years ago or more, accused me of stealing from her, and lied. 

I have to be on guard every minute and I am not perfect and I do get sucked in every so often and then it is impossible to get out. I am now trying to dig out of a hole for having got angry and defended myself when she accused me of stealing papers from her desk (which I have not ever done and would not do). And, within 5 minutes of saying it, she then denied that she had accused me of stealing the papers from her desk.  Circular crazy gaslighting arguments.  So, I don't want to go on about this issue...it's done.  But now, this has given her the opportunity or rationale in her mind to attack me for every perceived fault that I have and everything I may or may not have done in life to date that she didn't like.  So, now when I call her, she yells and then hangs up.  It is terrible.  And, I am away from home right now, so I need to keep in touch to know how she is, since she is old, but she hangs up or doesn't answer the phone when I call.

She should have some homecare for when I am away, but she refuses.  She told me that the homecare would help me feel better about not being there for her, so she was not going to have it. It is also her way of trying to bully me into never being away.  She says that she doesn't need homecare because she has a daughter.

[Couscous]

She should have some homecare for when I am away, but she refuses.  She told me that the homecare would help me feel better about not being there for her, so she was not going to have it. It is also her way of trying to bully me into never being away.  She says that she doesn't need homecare because she has a daughter.

Oh wow, so it looks like your mother is dealing with some pretty extreme separation anxiety and is using some pretty major guilt tripping tactics. The good news is that guilt isn’t fatal. 

There are no quick fixes for this, but you definitely have more options than you may realize. In fact the book I mentioned, The Dance of Anger, addresses this exact issue and has a chapter about a woman dealing with an almost identical scenario with her father, who expected her to be his sole caretaker. You will probably be able to find a copy at the library.

If you can manage it, I would also recommend that you see a family therapist to help you navigate this situation.

[So Stressed]

Thank you. I will get the book and read it.  I may have read it before, but it would have been a long time ago when I was still thinking the main family problem was Dad's drinking. Someone posted above that Dad's drinking may have been his way of dealing with Mom, and it definitely may have been.  I always thought that Dad's drinking caused Mom's behavior.  Maybe not. I have read several books on BPD and how the family can cope (Loving Someone with Borderline Personality Disorder, Stop Walking on Eggshells, I Hate You - Don't Leave Me, and another one specifically about having a mother with BPD).

I have been getting therapy to help with this situation for the last 5 years, but the therapist is not covered by insurance and I can't afford to see her as often as I would like.  I have previously also had lots of therapy and I attended alanon for 30 years.  But, the family situation has escalated ... and, partly, my change has contributed to that. I set boundaries now, and live my life, and that is not going down well with my family.

I am aware that daughters of BPD mothers can also have this disorder, and since everyone in the family is blaming me, I have examined the idea and asked my therapist. No one seems to think that I have BPD.  I do think that I learned some bad coping skills from Mom and may have not always reacted appropriately in the past, but I have really worked on myself, and I don't think I am the problem and I know that I learned a lot of ways to deal with situations through therapy and alanon and reading. 

At the moment, I am trying to figure out how to reopen communication with my Mom, since she yelled and hung up on me a couple of days ago, and then sent a mean email to follow.  Any suggestions?

[Couscous]

At the moment, I am trying to figure out how to reopen communication with my Mom, since she yelled and hung up on me a couple of days ago, and then sent a mean email to follow.  Any suggestions?

I think that leaning into the discomfort of having your mother mad at you for a little while will help your amygdala to get the message that when your mom's mad it's not a threat to your life. Grounding exercises can be helpful during times like these. Then, when you no longer feel a sense of desperation about her silence, you could send an email to suggest that you go out to the movies or something along those lines, when she's feeling up for it, and don't talk about any heavy topics while you're out. How does that sound?

[So Stressed]

Well, it sounds difficult.  I find myself in a real state of discomfort...that little girl that knows she's in trouble and is going to catch "you know what" when she gets home, so I feel like I need to make it better and fast. I have already let her sit for about 3 days, I think.  It's really hard.

And, I think that if I don't communicate, the situation gets worse. Part of the problem is that I go south for the winter and have done so for many years. It has always been a problem for Mom when I go.  Even when she was younger and my Dad was still living. She got mad every year, and I almost felt like I had to ask her permission (even though I knew I didn't because I was an independent adult). So, I am south for a few months, and part of what blew up at Christmas is that Mom and my brother feel that I need to stay home and take care of Mom.  She is old and should have some care, but, as I mentioned in an earlier post, she will not have it because I am supposed to stay home and care for her.  She is not sick.  But, she is old and she does need help.  I found services that would provide the care she needs while I'm away, but no.

So, there's that.  And, therefore, we can't go to the movies until spring.

So, I am thinking of an email to break the ice and start communication again but I don't know what to say. I was phoning her every day to make sure she's okay and has what she needs because there is no other support.  Last year, my therapist encouraged me to continue to go south and said that Mom and my brother "would figure it out," but what they figured out was bullying me to try to make me go home.  That was it.  They just apply more anger until I cave and do what they want.  In the last year or more, I am not caving, and it is getting pretty ugly.  Violent raging anger at Christmas that was shocking and appalling.

[Couscous]

They just apply more anger until I cave and do what they want.  In the last year or more, I am not caving, and it is getting pretty ugly.  Violent raging anger at Christmas that was shocking and appalling.

They won't be able to keep it up forever. What they are doing is called an extinction burst. Eventually they will have to adjust, but they will fight you tooth and nail.

Your therapist is absolutely right, and your task is to hold your ground. Your brother is there to help her in a true emergency. 

I actually decided to get ahead of this myself, even though my mother is only 68. I sent an email earlier this week letting my all seven siblings know that even though in our family the eldest daughter has been the caretaker for elderly parents for generations, that I am going to be breaking with tradition, and that it was the responsibility of all of us to help with my mother's care in her old age. The response was a deafening silence -- but I felt like a huge weight that I didn't even know I was carrying had been lifted off of me. If they kick me out of the family for this heresy, then so be it.

Another book that might be of help right now is Emotional Blackmail. I literally would copy and paste from that book when communicating with my siblings at some point when things got really nasty last year. The book was a life saver. I used the mantra from the book: I CAN stand it. It helped me a lot. 

[Methuen]

Sostressed, your mom sounds exactly like my mom, except that my mom is probably older? (mine is 86) and less independent than yours sounds.  While mine still lives independently, she wouldn't survive 2 weeks if all the support she gets from friends and family was withdrawn.  She would implode.  She would only survive that long because she has enough food in her house to last that long.  She is essentially dependent like a child (maybe an 11 or 12 year old?), but stubborn and unreasonable like one would expect from a BPD 86 year old.  She hasn't driven in a year (or maybe 2? but that's another story). The rages you mention have been damaging.  I can't handle being around her much any more, so my H took over her grocery shopping and taking her to appointments such as Dr.  She is only mobile with a walker inside her house.  She isn't strong enough to do much more that a "lap" in her small house with her walker.  After that she rests.  She sleeps most of the day now.  She has a nightmare of a laundry list of medical things wrong with her.  I got her home care after every fall (broken bones with long recoveries), but she always cancels it after a spell.  Home care are the nicest and kindest people.  I met them all.  One would even sing for her.  She hates having people come into her house through a lock box to help her, because she doesn't like it that she needs help, so she cancels it. What she really wants is me to do everything.  I started down that road (which is where I see you are now) but I soon realized it wasn't sustainable.  She was going to destroy me, and my life with HER needs.  Even when home care was coming to give her eye drops to prevent loss of vision after a serious infection because she has bad Parkinson's disease and her "shaking" was too severe to self-administer her drops to her eye, she still cancelled the home care.  So now she is almost blind in that eye.  She doesn't care.  She only cares that she doesn't get home care.  I suspect this is because her friends don't need home care, and she doesn't like the "look" of needing home care.  I don't know.

Sostressed, you might not like what I'm about to say, but I feel the need to say it in the event it motivates you to make change, because I was like you, but I had to change to save myelf.

If you carry on with what you have described, she is going to get worse and worse.  As her health deteriorates, the abuse will worsen.  If you think that's not possible, I am going to suggest you are mistaken.  It will indeed get much worse.  You will be trapped with no way out.

This is your window now to make the necessary changes.  She isn't going to change.  You have to be the one to change.  

OK.  She is an adult right?  She has capacity to make her own decisions (including bad ones) right?  You are going to have to learn to tolerate your own distress from her bad decisions which lead to bad consequences.  A case in point?  My mother cancelling home care for her eye drops and then going blind in that eye.  Am I ok with that?  No.  Can I change my mom? No.  Therefore, I had to learn to be ok with letting her live with the consequences.  It was her choice.  

Notice I did not offer to put the drops in for her...

If I did that, there would be a million other things to do...she is a task master, and there is no end to the tasks...

The more I do for her, and the more contact we have, the worse she treats me.  It sounds to me like this is what you are experiencing.  You even stop your work, to take her to the shoemaker.  This is crazy.  She's pulling at your emotions to get attention.  I know all about this.  I've been through the wringer.  And I'm going to say that unless you put some boundaries in place, your mother will continue to use and abuse you, and it will keep getting worse as she ages.

Will she push back?

You bet she will.  It's called the extinction burst.  Her behavior will probably escalate as she becomes more desperate to get your attention once you set boundaries (whether it's the shoemaker or an emergency haircut or toenail trim).

Firstly, decide what you are willing to do.  Secondly, decide WHEN you are willing to do it.
Thirdly, decide what are your boundaries?  How will you communicate them to her?

Just because your mom expects you to be the sole caregiver doesn't mean you should be.  In fact you shouldn't be.  Your mother, as an adult with capacity, is capable of solving her own problems.  But as long as you keep doing things for her when she nags you long enough, she is learning that she has power over you, because you do them, even in your working hours.  Think about it.  Almost no parent would demand what yours is demanding because they respect that other people have working hours, other commitments and responsibilities you have, and your need for free time.  But our parents with BPD don't respect our needs, and they don't have boundaries.  We have to have the boundaries.  And we have to enforce our boundaries.

I try to set boundaries and if it's not urgent, then I just say something like, "Ok, I'll take you, but I'm busy so it will have to be next week."  Then, it becomes a subject of a call every day until I take her.  Sometimes, I just relent, and do it when I have more important work to do, and then I am behind and have to stay up half the night to complete my work.

The problem here is that you are not holding your boundary.  Another problem is that she will find these words invalidating.  What she will hear is that you are too busy to care about her, and you don't have time for her.  This will trigger her sense of abandonment.

So, decide when it works best for you to drive her.  Example: Wednesday afternoons.
How about something like:
"I can take you to appointments on Wednesday afternoons.  Please book them at that time, or I won't be available because I'm working, but you could always still find a friend to take you, or take a taxi or Handidart". Deliver this is a really friendly patient caring voice.

Then when she tells you she has an appointment on Tuesday that you have to take her to, gently remind her that you are available on Wednesday afternoons, and she can try to reschedule it, or find some other way to get there.  Leave it at that.  Rinse and repeat.  Do NOT defend yourself, explain, argue, or justify (called JADE).  This will result in a complete meltdown on her part.  Just state your boundary (that you are available on Wednesday afternoons and she can reschedule or she can find an alternate way to get there).  Remove yourself from the situation.  Have a nice epsom salt bath and do some self care.  It will feel awful in the beginning, but remind yourself that she is not respecting your boundaries, and you are entitled to a life.  Just don't ever tell her that.

What I find not manageable and really upsetting is that Mom rages at me and she accuses me of doing or saying things that I did not say or do.  She also tries to bait me into arguments.  On a good day, I can avoid the bait and go home, end the telephone conversation, or just not get into it. But, sometimes, she continues to bait me and try to suck me into an argument and I lose my temper and say something and end up in the argument and then she is angry at me for weeks or months and every time I try to talk to her, she screams, cries, or hangs up.  We are in one of those phases now.  And, even though she baits me into the argument in the first place by accusing me of something I didn't say or do, and then I defend myself, the argument is all my fault and it gets brought up forever.

Of course she's doing this, because it's working for her!  She gets you to lose your temper! She wants drama, she craves drama.  And you are taking the bait.

So how to stop taking the bait?  When she starts saying provocative things or throwing out those "darts" (this is what I always called them), say "I gotta go now".  Get off the phone.  Leave her house.

When those darts stop working for her, she will stops aiming them at you.  She will probably try something else, but...go back to boundaries, and think "what do I have to do to hold my boundary?"  

Essentially, we have to learn to treat our parents the way we raised our children.  We all probably tried to raise children (if we had them) with boundaries so that the house and relationships weren't chaos.  We have to employ the same strategy with our mother.  

Basically, a BPD mom is a child in an adult body.  It's not a reciprocal relationship.  We do the giving, they do the taking.  So we need boundaries to manage this.

She should have some homecare for when I am away, but she refuses.  She told me that the homecare would help me feel better about not being there for her, so she was not going to have it. It is also her way of trying to bully me into never being away.  She says that she doesn't need homecare because she has a daughter.

You should have seen my eye roll when I read this.  This is exactly what my mother said the first time I got her home care about 5 years ago.  

We have to learn to tolerate our feelings when they say those stupid emotionally abusive things.  Remind yourself that a loving healthy parent wouldn't say that.  Remind yourself that you are not her doormat, or her slave, and being her daughter doesn't entitle her to treat you either of those ways.  Again, don't tell her that.  Just think it (keep reminding yourself).
[/quote]

I struggled with my mom's intense physical and emotional needs, and her treatment of me.  She was pushing every boundary.  My response?  I went back to work out of retirement. Of course she screamed at me and accused me of unimaginable things.  Her words were horrible, and designed to hurt.  I held my boundary by going to work!  Suddenly, when I wasn't available, she found other ways to have her needs met.  Friends take her to appointments my H can't take her to, or get her groceries she needs if she didn't have them on H's list (he only goes on Wednesday mornings).  They DO DO DO find ways to have their needs met, when we hold our boundaries.

Sostressed, you already know what you've been doing isn't working for you.  So the next step is "how can you change what you've been doing?"

I hope this hasn't been too much, or too strong a message.

[Methuen]

The other thing I forgot to mention was that about 10 yearsago ( or more) my mom went on a campaign to move into our home so we could take care of her.

She was ruthless and even usd pressure tactics innpublc to embarrass or shame us.  She was relentless , but it strengthened our resolve, because who wants that inside the safe space of a home 24/7?  

Has your mom done this with you yet?  If not,  plan ahead and prepare.  She will.

[So Stressed]

Thank you so much, Methuen.  I did need to hear what you said.  I know that I need to set boundaries, stick to them, not take the bait, and try not to feel so uncomfortable when I set and follow the boundaries. I know that I deserve to lead my life.  I am fortunate that I have some really supportive friends, but I am glad that I have found this safe space because I don't want to ruin my friendships by being in angst all the time. Your story is my story, right down to the eye drops.

My brother told me last year that Mom is my responsibility because he took care of her for 30 years. I thought that was a bit odd, since my father was living and they were self sufficient.  However, I am now learning how much worse she can be than I ever knew because I lived further away.  My brother lived closer, and I think he had no boundaries.  I have always set boundaries, but it was easier when I lived further away.  I was always astonished that my brother just did whatever Mom told him to do and never said anything.  Maybe it was really terrible for him...probably was, but I don't think she ever gets angry at him, so they have a seemingly good relationship, since he does what she tells him and doesn't talk back.  As I said, he was just silently obedient, and now he is a raging angry maniac who called me every obcenity last week because I was going south for a couple of months.  I guess he does not have the tools to deal with her either, and he feels responsible to fill in while I am gone.

I have been living near Mom for the last 15 years, but she was busy blowing up her new partner's life for the first 10 of those years, and then he died, and I became the care giver and scapegoat.  She's 99, but competent, healthy considering her age, etc.  She quit driving 2 years ago. I found a government subsidized program that offers rides to appointments, grocery shopping, and other services and we tried it out. Mom was so angry that I contacted them without her permission and refuses to use them.

Anyway, thanks for the encouragement...I am trying to stick to my boundaries and will work harder on not taking the bait.  That information about the extinction burst is enlightening...had not heard that before.  

Oh yes...Mom has been subtly trying to get to move in with me (or my brother) but that will never happen...at least not with me.  I used to go and pick her up for lots of weekends and bring her to my place, but I rarely do that anymore because ... well, you know.

[Methuen]

Your mom is 99... holy.  I'm trying to imagine that with my mom... and I just can't.

It's remarkable that your mom is still relatively healthy (for her age), and competent.  Just, wow.  She doesn't sound like a total waif - yet.

My brother told me last year that Mom is my responsibility because he took care of her for 30 years. I thought that was a bit odd, since my father was living and they were self sufficient.  However, I am now learning how much worse she can be than I ever knew because I lived further away.  My brother lived closer, and I think he had no boundaries.  I have always set boundaries, but it was easier when I lived further away.  I was always astonished that my brother just did whatever Mom told him to do and never said anything.  Maybe it was really terrible for him...probably was, but I don't think she ever gets angry at him, so they have a seemingly good relationship, since he does what she tells him and doesn't talk back.  As I said, he was just silently obedient, and now he is a raging angry maniac who called me every obcenity last week because I was going south for a couple of months.  I guess he does not have the tools to deal with her either, and he feels responsible to fill in while I am gone.

To put some perspective to this, I have always lived in the same community as my mom.  My dad was present until he passed 18 years ago.  But I was still responsible for my mom because she trained me to be responsible for her.  Your brother may feel this too.  He may have tried very hard to have boundaries, but discovered that she had big reactions to that.  He may have come to believe that it was easier to do her bidding, than endure her rages.  I always tried to meet my  mom's expectations too, so I don't blame him for that.  In my experience and the experience of most of the people on this forum, the more time you spend with the pwBPD, and the more you do for them, the worse they treat you.  It's counterintuitive.  Could this have happened to him?  My friends, mom's friends, and anybody in the community who knew us would have thought we were the perfect family. So it doesn't surprise me that everything seemed "fine" to others including you.  Families tend to hide these problems. Nobody wants to talk about it and there's a lot of shame.  I am skeptical that she never got angry at him if she has BPD or any PD or dysfunction.  I would speculate that the reason he always did what she tells him and didn't talk back, is because that's how he avoided her rages.  It sounds like whatever happened, he endured it and never talked to you about it much.  If he is reacting strongly to your going south for a couple of months, it's probably because he doesn't want to have to deal with her alone again, and resents you leaving while he is stuck here caretaking her.  I think that is how it would feel to anyone with a BPD mom.  Is sounds like he had a very strong reaction.

Does it make any sense for you to reach out to him about this?  Search for common ground?  Could you share more stories about what it's been like for each of you? I don't know what your relationship with him is like.  But might help him a lot if another family member has an empathetic ear to his experience.  If he exploded on you, it sounds like he's been bottling a lot up for a long time, and it probably has a lot to do with what you mom has expected of him, and less about you.

I found a government subsidized program that offers rides to appointments, grocery shopping, and other services and we tried it out. Mom was so angry that I contacted them without her permission and refuses to use them.

She didn't see this as helping her, although that's how you would have seen it.  I've had the same experience, and been down similar roads. Instead, your mom saw it as you taking the control.  She was going to lose something right?  You driving her everywhere which gives her attention and plenty of proximity to you. A person with BPD always has to be in control (because inside they are so out of control).  So the challenge is to present her with possibilities and ideas in a non-threatening way, and then give her time to think about them and adjust to the possibilities on her own.  Not being available to drive her to every appointment would have made the subsidized ride program more attractive over time, but she has to come to that on her own, not because you get the information and suggest she use it.  That is going to trigger her abandonment feelings again, because suddenly you are suggesting she get rides elsewhere.  I can just imagine how that conversation went We've all been in similar places.

In my experience, it's best to set your boundaries using BIFF, and let them figure out their own solutions.  Someone on this forum once suggested using motivational interviewing techniques.  I looked it up, and discovered that I already do a lot of things from that theory, but there were also ideas I didn't know about, and thus room for improvement on my part as well.  You could google motivational interviewing and see what you think.

It's a steep learning curve.  Sometimes it feels like one step forward and two back. Sadly, the pwBPD doesn't make any changes, and it feels like us that has to do all the work, because it is.

[Notwendy]

I don't live near my BPD mother, and truthfully, I have learned that it's the distance that has been a boundary for me. When I do visit her, it's about doing her bidding while she is verbally and emotionally abusive. After visits, I find it difficult to sleep for a couple of weeks.

She has at times raised the idea of moving closer to me. I have had the difficult experience of telling her, and the social worker who is involved in her situation, that I do not want that. She's not going to move as it is, because if she did, it would need to be in assisted living and she refuses that. She wants complete control, which she would not have in assisted living. Fortunately, she enjoys hiring people to help her- so she doesn't resist that assistance, but she also gets into drama with them. Most of them don't stay working with her for long.

This is a difficult situation, because I think we here are empathetic people who would otherwise be helping our elderly parent. I assumed I would do that and when my father got ill, I did visit and try to help out. What I didn't expect to see was the extent of my BPD mother's behavior as I had not spent that much time alone with her in her house for a long time. Usually, we visited as a family.

I think we approach our BPD parent with an assumption of how people behave, and find something different. Deciding we have to have limits and boundaries goes against our ideas of what we think we should be doing, what we wish we could do but it seems to be a necessary decision to avoid an abusive situation. It's not easy. It goes against our nature, but we are dealing with someone who would exploit that. They don't seem to have boundaries or limits in how they treat us, so we need to decide on what these limits are for ourselves.

[Methuen]

I think we approach our BPD parent with an assumption of how people behave, and find something different. Deciding we have to have limits and boundaries goes against our ideas of what we think we should be doing, what we wish we could do but it seems to be a necessary decision to avoid an abusive situation. It's not easy. It goes against our nature, but we are dealing with someone who would exploit that. They don't seem to have boundaries or limits in how they treat us, so we need to decide on what these limits are for ourselves.

This perfectly articulates the situation.

[So Stressed]

Notwendy commented, "I think we here are empathetic people who would otherwise be helping our elderly parent."

I have always wondered why my friends' elderly parents wanted their adult children to help them as they aged and were appreciative of the help, yet my Mom wanted to fight and get angry and not appreciate or accept my help.  Now, I am getting it.  She is angry that she is losing control and seems to be angry that she is old and she wants to hold me hostage instead.  That's not like my friends' parents.

I am also getting it that I contribute to the conflict by the way that I respond to her demands.  Since she has such an extreme fear of abandonment and need to be catered to, I need to remember that in how I speak to her.

[Notwendy]

It's a change in the relationship and all changes have adjustments. The loss of control for an elderly person is difficult- there's a certain anger that comes with that. So while my friends navigated this relationship with their aging parents, there were some difficulties, but that was also within normal range.

But for my BPD mother, control is her #1 priority and she will fight for that, and do whatever she can to hold on to it, even if it isn't in her best interest and even if it involves being verbally and emotionally abusive.

What I found with this is that she thwarts attempts to help her, which makes them useless. Rather than feel appreciative, she feels angry. What she would wish would be for me to be an obedient servant, take orders, don't ask questions and have her order me around. You do not ask her, or tell her, to do anything. She will also find something to be critical about what you did.

Basically, she seems to set herself up as victim and you as the villain. No matter what your intentions are and how much you try.

It's not that I didn't wish to be of help to her. It's that I don't want to be the villain in her distorted thinking and that whatever I do seems to be ineffective.

[Methuen]

Notwendy commented, "I think we here are empathetic people who would otherwise be helping our elderly parent."

I have always wondered why my friends' elderly parents wanted their adult children to help them as they aged and were appreciative of the help, yet my Mom wanted to fight and get angry and not appreciate or accept my help.  Now, I am getting it.  She is angry that she is losing control and seems to be angry that she is old and she wants to hold me hostage instead.  That's not like my friends' parents.

I am also getting it that I contribute to the conflict by the way that I respond to her demands.  Since she has such an extreme fear of abandonment and need to be catered to, I need to remember that in how I speak to her.

Yes they fight losing control, which comes naturally to some extent with aging and old age. They even deny the undeniable that comes with aging.  For example, my mom saw two specialists who did complete histories and assessments and diagnosed Parkinson’s disease.  For over 5 years, she denied her Parkinson’s even as her shaking progressed to the point of almost not being able to feed herself soup. She would say “I don’t have Parkinson’s, I have essential tremor” ( self diagnosing since she’s more knowledgeable than 2 specialists…). Meanwhile she’s completely lost her sense of smell…Her logic was irrational.  Her logic was  that she didn’t want Parkinson’s therefore she didn’t have it.  Anyone who suggested otherwise (such as the Dr) was a bad, stupid or useless person.

You are right about not accepting.  In my experience my bpd mom can’t accept anything she doesn’t want to hear.  You are also right about not appreciating.  I think they either don’t feel gratitude or are unable to express it ( because of some distorted thinking on their part).  

It feels to us like they hold us hostage, but I think their actual intention is to have their needs met.  They are egocentric like a 3 year old.  Our purpose is to meet their needs, and that is our primary use as their child. They achieve this in various manipulative ways by hijacking our emotions and good intentions.  

It requires work on our part to untangle our emotions from their emotions, feel the confidence to be our own self, recognize they are an adult and are entitled to make their own bad decisions and let them assume responsibility for those bad decisions.  It is not our role to always rescue them, or we deny them the opportunity to learn from their mistakes.  

I no longer have the desire to play into tha drama and chaos.  I always tried to help or correct her faulty logic.  That is futile. I am done with that.  But techniques like motivational interviewing can make a positive difference.

You are absolutely right that this is not like other parents that your friends have.  A BPD parent needs to be navigated differently.  Us knowing and sticking to our own boundaries is key.  But don’t tell your mom ”this is my boundary” or it will backfire on you and not work.

[zachira]

My experiences with my BPD mother and what makes other family members extremely disordered is they do not have the capacity to care or understand how their negative behaviors affect others, especially the people they are most closely related to, however they do have the capacity for cognitive empathy which is used to manipulate others so they can be in control. In other words, they will say and do what works to be in control. When we set healthier boundaries with our disordered family members, they are given the message that they do not control us.

[Couscous]

She is angry that she is losing control and seems to be angry that she is old and she wants to hold me hostage instead.  That's not like my friends' parents.

I think you have nailed it. Our parents are not like other parents and they really do want to keep us as hostages, with the help of our siblings and even members of our extended family.

I think that fundamentally, it’s because they don’t really trust that we would voluntarily care for them in their old age, for a couple of possible reasons. One is that they may have a belief that people, including their kids, are out to get them, and two, they may realize deep down inside that they have failed to meet our childhood needs, and since you normally reap what you sow, they believe that they will reap abandonment, which is actually a very rational fear.

On the basis of these beliefs, their only option then is to maintain the upper hand in the relationship and their position of power and control.

[So Stressed]

I am so grateful for having found this site. Even though I have had alanon and therapy and worked very hard on my relationship with my Mom, I did not know how to communicate with her in an effective way and we so often end up in conflict.  It seemed like we are enemies instead of mother/daughter.  Things got so bad at Christmas that I could not believe that my family could end up in such a mess. My part in it was that I called out my Mom on her lying...guess now that was a bad idea.  However, she was lying to my brother about me.  Anyway, I have been sharing here about my situation, which is a better place for me to share than having my poor friends listen to me.  And, I have been learning about how to better communicate and there have been some really positive results in my Mom's and my relationship...just for today.  I know she is volatile and unpredictable, but, for now, I am communicating in a way that is not threatening to her. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[zachira]

Glad you are doing better and this site has been helpful. It is so hard to realize that most people don't get what it is like to have disordered family members, and that friends and other family members can be so hurtful when they don't validate our experiences with our disordered family members.
Do keep in touch. We are here to celebrate the good times, as those increase as we learn what works in communicating or not communicating (though silence and no contact can be considered forms of communication) with our disordered family members.

[Mommydoc]

I have been learning about how to better communicate and there have been some really positive results in my Mom's and my relationship...just for today.  I know she is volatile and unpredictable, but, for now, I am communicating in a way that is not threatening to her.

I am late to this thread, but really loved all the advice you received and want to congratulate you on your progress.  “Just for today” is such a great reflection. You are making changes and it works and makes your life better.  Your recognition that it may be temporary is probably the most important thing.  Even though you have changed how you communicate and interact, she likely hasn’t and she will continue to get triggered and become abusive no matter what you do.  And that is OK, because all you can be responsible for is you.  Wishing you continued success. 

[So Stressed]

Thanks. I am reading every day. It helps.  And, I am walking on eggshells around my Mom and when I perceive that she is going to lose it, I get off the phone and say I'll call back tomorrow.  So far, all is peaceful, but I know that there will likely be an eruption again.  And, sadly , my sibling seems to have gone off the deep end and we can probably never repair our relationship unless a miracle occurs.