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How to communicate after a contentious divorce... Following a contentious divorce and custody battle, there are often high emotion and tensions between the parents. Research shows that constant and chronic conflict between the parents negatively impacts the children. The children sense their parents anxiety in their voice, their body language and their parents behavior. Here are some suggestions from Dean Stacer on how to avoid conflict.
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Author Topic: Exhausted  (Read 429 times)
Geology404
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What is your sexual orientation: Gay, lesb
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Partnered
Posts: 1


« on: March 12, 2023, 08:17:08 AM »

My girlfriend and I have been in couple’s counseling for a few months. During a recent session, the therapist used the term “favorite person” when describing how my girlfriend feels about me. I wasn’t familiar with this term but my girlfriend told me it’s used when discussing people with BPD (a diagnosis that she doesn’t have and makes her very uncomfortable). I started reading about it and it does seem to describe so many of her behaviors (sometimes I’m amazing and other times I’m the worst person in the world; she has told me the thought of breaking up makes her want to kill herself; she scratches her arms until they’re bleeding sometimes when she’s upset with me; she screams at me for things like not kissing her quickly enough when I see her).

It’s a lot and I’m totally exhausted. We had been living together but I moved out a couple months ago because we were arguing so much that I couldn’t sleep. She would stay up in a fit of rage, refusing to stop arguing well into the night. I told her I needed to leave because the relationship was so unhealthy, but since I moved out, she blames me for everything going south—if I had been more attentive, if I hadn’t been stressed about work, if I would have just been more willing to take time to figure it all out, if only I had cared enough, I wouldn’t have left her alone in the house that we’d been sharing for about a year. She thinks that I have a responsibility to fix everything. I think that it would be impossible. If I moved back in tomorrow, she would continue to find things wrong with me.

I don’t know how to move forward. I see how much she’s hurting but I don’t feel equipped to help her. She’s been in therapy but currently has two therapists because she feels bad “breaking up with the first one”. “The first one” has told her that I may be a narcissist, I may have BPD myself, and that effectively, I am probably the root of the relationship problems between us. I’ve pondered this long and hard. I just don’t think it’s true. Narcissist? I don’t have super high self-esteem and I’m willing to honestly admit when I make mistakes. BPD? I’m not really afraid of her leaving me and my ability to self-regulate feels pretty solid. It was frustrating to be diagnosed by someone who had never met me. The second therapist, my girlfriend tells me, “isn’t smart enough to keep up” with her.

I don’t know whether to openly talk about the idea of BPD or not. My girlfriend *did* bring it up, but only to preempt me thinking she had it—only to critique our couple’s therapist.

How do people deal with this kind of situation? When no diagnosis has been made, but there’s clearly a problem, what does a helpful partner do? I can’t keep trying to accommodate my girlfriend’s never-ending expectations (e.g., “why didn’t you look at me in a kind way when we woke up”).  It’s too exhausting and it clearly isn’t working for me to take responsibly for what she perceives as invalidating facial expressions, slights, and indications that I’m “emotionally unavailable” or not present. I love her dearly, but I’m totally exhausted and I want to find a way of honestly talking with her about all of this.

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ForeverDad
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Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
Posts: 18071


You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2023, 04:01:45 PM »

Most of us never learned of a diagnosis.  Even a diagnosis doesn't clarify to what extent the relationship (and potential future parenting) would be impacted.  A child's exposure to disordered perceeptions and behavior is a serious matter.  So we do what family court would do... deal with the evident (or documented) behavior and its impact on yourself, possible children and others.  If it is too much for you, then it is too much for you.  It's okay to present that as your fact of life.  Do you think that would help you decide what to do and how to express it to her in a future session?

Whatever else you decide for the future, I strongly recommend you be the one in charge of birth control, you can't risk your future as parent with parental responsibilities while you have serious doubts of your ability to even continue the relationship, much less to prosper in it.  After all, you are in one sense already separated.
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Outdorenthusiast
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Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Married - uBPDw
Posts: 128


The road is narrow…


« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2023, 08:17:24 PM »

Welcome!   Welcome new member (click to insert in post)

What you describe is daunting and we feel your struggle.  Many people here have been married to it for decades and found out after we have had children which adds many layers of complications.  It is exhausting, but each person makes their own choices based upon their own pros and cons.  My advice is to read up on the resources here, and keep listening to your logical head and that little voice inside and what it is telling you - it usually isn’t wrong. 

Short term - keep yourself healthy, and love yourself first and foremost.   Have a good friend/family support group, get good sleep, eat well, get outside, and drink water.  You will be able to think much more clearly about your situation if you aren’t FOGed up.  Being in a relationship with someone volatile like this - you will ALWAYS need to be on the top of your emotional game.

Keep talking…
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kells76
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Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Posts: 3246



« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2023, 10:12:03 AM »

Hi Geology404, welcome to the group -- you're with people who really get it about what you're going through.

So much so, in fact, that when I read your experience here:

She’s been in therapy but currently has two therapists because she feels bad “breaking up with the first one”. “The first one” has told her that I may be a narcissist, I may have BPD myself, and that effectively, I am probably the root of the relationship problems between us. I’ve pondered this long and hard. I just don’t think it’s true. Narcissist? I don’t have super high self-esteem and I’m willing to honestly admit when I make mistakes. BPD? I’m not really afraid of her leaving me and my ability to self-regulate feels pretty solid. It was frustrating to be diagnosed by someone who had never met me. The second therapist, my girlfriend tells me, “isn’t smart enough to keep up” with her.

it reminded me of something I shared with another newer member recently (from this thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=355176.0):

Hi uncleflo, just want to add my Hello and Welcome to the other voices here.

This part of your post stood out to me:

Excerpt
About the therapy… after an epic meltdown where she threatened suicide and I took her to the hospital, we had a conversation about her getting back into therapy to get help with her BPD. She agreed and I thought we were making progress… but it now feels like the therapist is actively supporting her delusions, and when my wife started to see her is the same time when the wheels came off (again) in our relationship. For example, I had hoped the therapist would say, "Hey, maybe you should work on your relationship with your husband, who has stayed by your side this entire time," but she instead encouraged my wife to pursue the side relationship with her male best friend. Of course, I'm only seeing one side of the story but I've gotten pretty good at isolating when my wife is lying and when she is telling the truth.

Am I tracking with you, that your W is the one telling you "Hey, my T told me to go for this relationship"? I.e., you did not hear this directly from the T?

Many, many, many members here struggle with their loved one with BPD telling them "My therapist told me" and then just the craziest stuff: "My therapist told me that you're the problem", "my therapist told me that you're abusing the kids", etc.

A pwBPD can be very adept at taking a grain of truth and spinning it into something that comes across as emotionally believable... because they themselves believe it, even though it isn't true.

Unless you hear, directly from the therapist, that the therapist is encouraging your W to pursue a new relationship, I would strongly lean more towards:

your W has taken a grain of something from T (perhaps the T, encouraging rational thought, asked "What do you think would be better about this new relationship" and your W turned that into: The T thinks the new relationship would be better), and is using it to fortify her position.

I would strongly doubt that the T is recommending anything close.

Hope that helps;

kells76

That's my take on what's likely going on in your situation as well.

...

In terms of your overall question of

How do people deal with this kind of situation? When no diagnosis has been made, but there’s clearly a problem, what does a helpful partner do? I can’t keep trying to accommodate my girlfriend’s never-ending expectations (e.g., “why didn’t you look at me in a kind way when we woke up”).  It’s too exhausting and it clearly isn’t working for me to take responsibly for what she perceives as invalidating facial expressions, slights, and indications that I’m “emotionally unavailable” or not present. I love her dearly, but I’m totally exhausted and I want to find a way of honestly talking with her about all of this.

one thing that might be weirdly helpful to consider is that we don't need the person in our life to get an "official" diagnosis for us to find and learn new ways of coping. It's totally fine to say to yourself "whatever is going on, whatever this would or wouldn't be labeled, whatever this would or wouldn't be diagnosed as, the fact is -- it's hurtful and damaging, and the dynamic needs to change". In a way, it "doesn't matter" if your partner isn't diagnosed, if the tools and skills designed for coping with a pwBPD make things better in your relationship. Because that's the core issue bringing you here -- not the lack of label, but the deep hurt and unhealthy dynamic.

Members have had wide ranges of experiences with learning and trying different ways of communicating and interacting with their pwBPD. Some find that the tools and skills have taken the relationship from "barely tolerable" to essentially worthwhile (though still an "emotional special needs" relationship). Others find that they have tried their hardest, put in their best effort, and the relationship is not feasible. Those members can have some peace knowing they tried the best they could to improve things. So the outcome is uniquely dependent on who you both are as people, not "just" on "did I use the tools enough".

That being said, a good place to start is in our "tips" and "tools" sections (up top in the dark green menu bar). You can check out our article on What Does it Take to Be in a Relationship with a pwBPD -- let us know what you think about it. The parts about "preserving your emotional health" and "understanding why you want to be in the relationship" seemed like they might fit your situation.

Looking forward to hearing more;

kells76
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engiebpd
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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: married
Posts: 78


« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2023, 09:47:02 AM »



How do people deal with this kind of situation? When no diagnosis has been made, but there’s clearly a problem, what does a helpful partner do? I can’t keep trying to accommodate my girlfriend’s never-ending expectations (e.g., “why didn’t you look at me in a kind way when we woke up”).  It’s too exhausting and it clearly isn’t working for me to take responsibly for what she perceives as invalidating facial expressions, slights, and indications that I’m “emotionally unavailable” or not present. I love her dearly, but I’m totally exhausted and I want to find a way of honestly talking with her about all of this.



This happens to me on a daily basis and I also get the "emotionally unavailable".  From what I gather with my exwife, it's that she has an unexpectant amount of emotional needs.   And the more I put into it, she will still say that I am "emotionally unavailable".

This is the same with going out together with as a family,   I will go out exhaustively managing time with work and family duties.  At the end of the month, I get the general "we don't go out".  Not "we don't go out enough", simply she says "we don't go out".   And this can get extremely frustrating.

If your partner has true bpd, they'll likely be splitting when it comes to thinking about you being emotionally unavailable.  At that very moment, she's only seeing the times you were unemotional available.   If say you were emotionally available 6 days out of the week, she will only see that one day that you were unemotional available in her head and will tell you that you are emotionally unavailable.  Also, you will need her to clarify what she means as emotionally unavailable because my ex has a different defintion of it compared to the rest of the world.

My ex also has false perception of my facial expressions and it is truly exhausting when you have to explain it.   I brouught this up to our marriage counselor and she told my ex that she has to trust me if i say thats not what i mean.   My ex will accept this and agree to this but after some time (like a month), she will forget and we are back to the same ridiculous cycle. 

These are the daily bits that adds up to exhaust me.  After years of this, you will be very exhausted. 

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